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Let's lay out the differences between XBOne and Steam, shall we?

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L

Lupin the Third

Member
We're seeing a lot of posts in Xbox One threads comparing its DRM to Steam as if it's one-to-one. It's been debunked numerous times, but I think it's important enough to warrant a thread comparing the two.


(** asumptions based on info we have)

Steam: No fee for social connectivity services or online play, monthly or annually.
XBOne: Monthly or annual fee, cheapest @ $60/year**

Steam: Game prices frequently and steeply discounted from retail, though not all titles at all times.
XBOne: Gears of War 1 is still $29.99 on XBox 360 Marketplace, XBOne expected to be similar pricing.**

Steam: Cannot resell games, end of story.
XBOne: Allows limited resale of licenses, through specific "participating" retailers only.

Steam: Once set up, Offline Mode allows for offline play of Steam-DRM-only games indefinitely.
XBOne: Requires near-constant internet connection, a minimum of once every 24 hours.

Steam: Offline mode does not limit your playtime on Steam-DRM-only games nor does it limit what you can do offline with your computer.
XBOne: Once offline for more than 24 hours, the XBOne can ONLY be used for DVD/Blu-ray Disc playback, or using the HDMI pass-through for TV features. Game playback is disabled.

Steam: Sharing games is prohibited, as it requires multiple PCs logging into the same account.
XBOne: Allows game sharing among family members, most flexibly when running on the same home console.

Steam: Exists on open platforms, where non-Steam games and other applications can co-exist peacefully. Effectively, Steam is entirely optional.
XBOne: All games are limited ENTIRELY to those available in the Xbox Marketplace and require online registration to play.

Steam: DLC can made available by game publishers at no cost to the consumer without limitations.
XBOne: MS limits what DLC and patches can be made available and institutes price floors (based on X360's Marketplace history).**


I know there are other differences. Anyone care to contribute their own or correct mine?
 
J

JakkuFurosu

Member
i can play my steam games that were made for old hardware.
competition (origin,gmg,amazon etc).
can gift/trade games.

HATS!!!1!!11
 
D

Deleted member 10571

Unconfirmed Member
Steam: Not mandatory, Users choose to install and use it (or games that support it).
XBox One: Well about that..
 
H

Hero_of_the_Day

Member
JakkuFurosu said:
i can play my steam games that were made for old hardware.
Click to expand...

This is the biggest thing for me. I wish they'd go above and beyond as far as getting old games running the way they were meant like GoG does. But, I have faith in Valve that 15 years from now I will still have and be able to use all of my games. There isn't going to be a Steam Two where I lose my collection, or servers that shutdown leaving me unable to use the games I have bought.
 
BibiMaghoo

BibiMaghoo

Member
Why compare hardware to software?

That is surely beyond apples and oranges?

Everyone knows it is completely different. It is just being used as a crutch to lessen the blow from Xbox news.

They are not comparable, because you are forced to use MS software on Xbox. You are not forced to use Steam on PC.

Options are key. The problem with Xbox is there are no options.
 
theDeeDubs

theDeeDubs

Member
My issue with this whole thing is:

If you are treating this as a moral and consumer rights issue you better own it. You can't halfass taking a moral highground. If you say I oppose XB1 due to its infringements on my consumer rights but then love steam well then your morals can be bought at a price. And that's the point I have to question your morals. Now, if you take it from the perspective purely on price then we coo.
 
D

Deleted member 752119

Unconfirmed Member
The pricing difference is the only thing I care about.

I'd happily go fully digital if console game prices followed the Steam model. But we know that's not going to happen--at least this generation, given where digital game prices currently are on 360 and PS3 and 3DS and Wii U.

I don't care about online requirements, no resell, etc. if prices were like Steam. I'd happily give up resell rights if games were cheaper as I hate hassling with selling things anyway and only do it because games are $60. If I could by most games for $10-40 within six months to a year of launch, I'd happily not bother reselling and would love the instant gratification of digital downloads.

But it will probably take them trying to keep prices up with DRM added this gen and causing a crash, or near crash, for them to every get close to the Steam model.
 
M

mattiewheels

And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
Just the fact that Steam is a choice amongst many is enough to destroy the argument.
 
Sentenza

Sentenza

Member
Steam: one single service among many *competing* ones on an open platform.
XB ONE: Ehr... "Please Microsoft, abuse of us as you like"? It's not like there is a choice.
 
J

jtb

Banned
look, the comparison to steam is simple.

they both don't have resale rights. and they both have DRM.

so if people are going to bitch about xbone (which they're more than entitled to), bitch about things that logically make sense, don't bitch about the retail rights. don't whine "oh my consumer rights!" instead, say "oh, they're not offering me enough money/incentives to give up my so-called-rights that I happily gave up with steam." (and iOS)

it's not about pro- or anti-microsoft. it's anti-idiotic-and-illogical arguments. either right-to-resale is a sacred principle or it isn't. and if you're fine with steam, then it clearly isn't.
 
O

oVerde

Banned
theDeeDubs said:
My issue with this whole thing is:

If you are treating this as a moral and consumer rights issue you better own it. You can't halfass taking a moral highground. If you say I oppose XB1 due to its infringements on my consumer rights but then love steam well then your morals can be bought at a price. And that's the point I have to question your morals. Now, if you take it from the perspective purely a price then we coo.
Click to expand...

dmaul1114 said:
The pricing difference is the only thing I care about.

I'd happily go fully digital if console game prices followed the Steam model. But we know that's not going to happen--at least this generation, given where digital game prices currently are on 360 and PS3 and 3DS and Wii U.

I don't care about online requirements, no resell, etc. if prices were like Steam. I'd happily give up resell rights if games were cheaper as I hate hassling with selling things anyway and only do it because games are $60. If I could by most games for $10-40 within six months to a year of launch, I'd happily not bother reselling and would love the instant gratification of digital downloads.

But it will probably take them trying to keep prices up with DRM added this gen and causing a crash, or near crash, for them to every get close to the Steam model.
Click to expand...

Not for everyone, but is a hell recurrent reason for people.
 
T

tatotiburon

Member
Steam: Game prices frequently and steeply discounted from retail, though not all titles at all times.
XBOne: Gears of War 1 is still $29.99 on XBox 360 Marketplace, XBOne expected to be similar pricing.**


any source about that? and we're talking about xbox one marketplace, forget 360. is that a fact or we're just supposing?
 
A

Azih

Member
BibiMaghoo said:
Why compare hardware to software?

That is surely beyond apples and oranges?

Everyone knows it is completely different. It is just being used as a crutch to lessen the blow from Xbox news.

They are not comparable, because you are forced to use MS software on Xbox. You are not forced to use Steam on PC.

Options are key. The problem with Xbox is there are no options.
Click to expand...

But you are forced to use Steam for Steam only games. I'd say it's somewhat comparable. If you want to play the game you gotta lock into the system (Steam or Bone). The hardware isn't as relevant as the content.
 
M

Morokh

Member
Lupin the Third said:
Steam: Cannot resell games, end of story.
XBOne: Allows limited resale of licenses, through specific "participating" retailers only.
Click to expand...

There is more to it than that really.

- Buying what they call an AAA game new under 10 bucks will gladly make up for the non possibility to re-sell games.

- In most cases it's a digital product, not an actual DVD/Bluray

And even if they had an option to re-sell games how would you even be able to sell it when so many other websites run deals all year long where people can get the same game NEW (with all kind of bonuses) for the same price or cheaper ?



What you can add to your list is Always-On retro compatibility for Steam !
 
B

Brannon

Member
Steam: Mods all over the place, Steam Workshop, all free, hey you want a prettier Jill in your Revelations GO RIGHT AHEAD AND HERE'S LEON TOO AND ASHLEY HOLY SHIT SUPERMAN WITH A GUN!!!!

XBone: No. None of that. You should be ashamed to want... that
 
AgentP

AgentP

Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
Steam: $5 games on hardware of my choice.
XB1: $60 DRM fest on proprietary under-powered hardware.
 
R

RK9039

Member
Brannon said:
Steam: Mods all over the place, Steam Workshop, all free, hey you want a prettier Jill in your Revelations GO RIGHT AHEAD AND HERE'S LEON TOO AND ASHLEY HOLY SHIT SUPERMAN WITH A GUN!!!!

XBone: No. None of that. You should be ashamed to want... that
Click to expand...

Steam: YOU WANTS CHICKEN CANNON IN SKYRIM FOR FREE? Okay.

X1: What?
 
G

Graphics Horse

Member
Some of these arguments are just PC vs Console arguments. I can choose not to use steam, but I can also choose not to buy an Xbox, thankfully.

Main differences are Xbox has an upfront fee followed by an online game fee, and Steam doesn't have either. Oh and the timed checkup thing of course.
 
D

dave is ok

aztek is ok
Steam: Run by a private company, not beholden to shareholder interests.

Xbox One: Run by a publicly traded company, known for despicable business practices (unable to remove CC info from Xbox 360, unable to cancel auto-renew easily, etc.)
 
O

Origami Superman

Member
Correct if I'm wrong,

If Steam goes bust / servers shut down: Valve will apparently release a patch to allow you to access your games.

If Xbone servers are shut down at the end of the gen: Your games could very possibly all be inaccessible.
 
Danny Dudekisser

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Most of these are terrible comparisons based on incomplete information.



Origami Superman said:
Correct if I'm wrong,

If Steam goes bust / servers shut down: Valve will apparently release a patch to allow you to access your games.

If Xbone servers are shut down at the end of the gen: Your games could very possibly all be inaccessible.
Click to expand...

Why do people keep insisting that Valve is going to do this? If Steam goes bust, Valve employees are going to show up to work, and find a sign on the door telling them to go home. There's no magic switch. There's no altruistic desire to put together a safeguard in case of this event. In this situation, you might as well be Xboned.
 
F

Felix Lighter

Member
I think this post from Stumpokapow, in the Xbox One Policy thread, is an excellent, balanced starting point for this discussion:

Stumpokapow said:
I think all of the policies they announced are logical extensions of the fact that this is a digital-only console. The "retail" titles, such as they are, are like Steamworks games. It's not a retail+digital console, it's a digital-only console. I mean, imagine if a competitor to Steam popped up that had all of these policies. It'd be fairly standard--in some respect forward-thinking (being able to transfer a game you own to a friend, even once, is better than what Steam has right now; being able to trade in at select retailers is better than what Steam has now for both the retailer and the customer), in other respects a little behind the curve (offline mode being a 24 hour limit) I don't personally have a problem with digital only, I've got 600 games on Steam. And I'm generally a pretty future-proof kind of guy, none of my computers have optical drives anymore. I use Dropbox for everything. I love tablets I'm not someone who typically needs to be encouraged to adopt new tech or who worries about trading off the stability of current options for the cutting edge of new options.

But here are the problems:
1) No one views these policies as an advantage in any digital-only platform. They're a necessary evil. And they're one that's overcome with sweeteners. One sweetener is pricing. In Steam that's manifested in a few ways--frequent and steep sales on the whole catalogue, and the ability for developers to produce unlimited keys for free (and thus for third party resellers to sacrifice margin for volume and offer discounts). Will Xbox One games be $35 to pre-order? Will they drop to $5 within 6 months? I doubt it.

2) Digital-only PC platforms emerged in response to the decline of retail. Retail has not declined for consoles. It's still there. The Xbox One's direct competitors will have retail space. And the direct competitors will not necessarily have these policies. Maybe Microsoft ends up correctly predicting the future and riding the wave in advance, but it seems like Microsoft's competitors are healthy enough that this is too much too soon.

3) There exists no digital-only platform that requires an ongoing membership fee (or that encourages an ongoing membership fee). Ongoing membership fees tend to be for unlimited, all-access type services like Netflix--or even in the more limited form, Playstation Plus, or discount programs like Amazon Prime or Costco membership. It's true that Gold exists today, but today there's a platform that doesn't necessarily need the kind of sweeteners that the One will need.

So, I guess my conclusion is that given that we now know that Xbox One is a digital-only, not digital-first system, the policies are fairly unremarkable and the next question becomes how Microsoft will blunt these inherent limitations of digital-only systems and show advantages.
Click to expand...
 
N

Nafai1123

Banned
theDeeDubs said:
My issue with this whole thing is:

If you are treating this as a moral and consumer rights issue you better own it. You can't halfass taking a moral highground. If you say I oppose XB1 due to its infringements on my consumer rights but then love steam well then your morals can be bought at a price. And that's the point I have to question your morals. Now, if you take it from the perspective purely a price then we coo.
Click to expand...

On PC I have a choice. If I want to give up my rights to reseller/trade/whatever and buy off Steam I can willlingly decide to do that. If I want to buy games through other distribution models I can do that too. MS is taking away that choice for anyone that buys a Xbone. The only choice I have is not to buy it.
 
Yoda

Yoda

Member
tatotiburon said:
Steam: Game prices frequently and steeply discounted from retail, though not all titles at all times.
XBOne: Gears of War 1 is still $29.99 on XBox 360 Marketplace, XBOne expected to be similar pricing.**


any source about that? and we're talking about xbox one marketplace, forget 360. is that a fact or we're just supposing?
Click to expand...

What is stopping them from lowering the price right now?
 
C

Cmagus

Member
For me its all about the prices. I don't care that I can't resell my games on Steam when they are costing me much less. If Microsoft can have competitive pricing like Steam then I wouldn't see a problem with that at all but I'll be damned if I am spending 60+ on a game knowing that the chances of it going down in price are slim. Its the same reason I dislike Origin they aren't competitive enough. That and I won't pay to play online as well. If Sony takes the same approach they can get lost as well.
 
C

CaptNink

Member
Has it been confirmed somewhere that you have to have a paid Gold subscription to download digital copies of games? I had just assumed that feature was "free"...
 
B

BigDug13

Member
theDeeDubs said:
My issue with this whole thing is:

If you are treating this as a moral and consumer rights issue you better own it. You can't halfass taking a moral highground. If you say I oppose XB1 due to its infringements on my consumer rights but then love steam well then your morals can be bought at a price. And that's the point I have to question your morals. Now, if you take it from the perspective purely on price then we coo.
Click to expand...

My issue with XBO is its infringement of my rights to play games offline. That is all. Steam lets me play offline, older consoles let me play offline, and I've done both while deployed to the Persian Gulf onboard ships. XBO is not a game system that a US Navy sailor can purchase and expect to use on their ship while Steam can.

Therefore Microsoft can go to hell.
 
B

bigbaldwolf86

Banned
Xbox on twitter a few minutes ago

xboxuk: Which Xbox games do you want to see more of at #E3?

My response: Used games

I haven't had a response yet :p
 
G

Graphics Horse

Member
CaptNink said:
Has it been confirmed somewhere that you have to have a paid Gold subscription to download digital copies of games? I had just assumed that feature was "free"...
Click to expand...

Nothing has been confirmed as far as subscriptions are concerned. I wouldn't be surprised if subscription is mandatory now it's using the infinite power of the cloud.
 
BibiMaghoo

BibiMaghoo

Member
jtb said:
look, the comparison to steam is simple.

they both don't have resale rights. and they both have DRM.

so if people are going to bitch about xbone (which they're more than entitled to), bitch about things that logically make sense, don't bitch about the retail rights. don't whine "oh my consumer rights!" instead, say "oh, they're not offering me enough money/incentives to give up my so-called-rights that I happily gave up with steam." (and iOS)

it's not about pro- or anti-microsoft. it's anti-idiotic-and-illogical arguments. either right-to-resale is a sacred principle or it isn't. and if you're fine with steam, then it clearly isn't.
Click to expand...

While I agree in principle, the difference is this:

Most will forget that negative if given a reason too. People don't like to lose rights, but will do so for a benefit instead. In the case of steam, people get cheaper games, considerably so in some cases. So they are effectively trading a right for a benefit, a bit like we can do with redundancy payments. I can give up my right to fight a redundancy, in exchange for 6 months extra pay, as an example.

The problem here is there is no incentive. People that are not happy with that exchange on steam have an alternative. They can continue to play PC games through other services, or from retail discs. The new Xbox offers no incentive, but removes the right.

People have not given something up freely for something else of benefit. They have simply had something taken from them for nothing.

Azih said:
But you are forced to use Steam for Steam only games. I'd say it's somewhat comparable. If you want to play the game you gotta lock into the system (Steam or Bone). The hardware isn't as relevant as the content.
Click to expand...

Sure, but I can avoid the Steam ecosystem by choice on PC hardware. I cannot avoid MS's on Xbox hardware. Options are key. One is forcing, the other is not.

If someone asks you to do something, if you would like to do it, that is always less bothersome than if someone tells you to do it, would you agree?
 
M

mattiewheels

And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
I guess the only place where the "Steam is a choice" argument falters is when a game is Steamworks-enabled, and forces you to use Steam to play it. So many huge games are going this way, that it could be a problem for people opposed to using Steam.
 
H

Htown

STOP SHITTING ON MY MOTHER'S HEADSTONE
1. Steam exists on an open hardware platform, XBone is a closed hardware platform.

Any developer can make a game on PC hardware that does not require Steam. Any user can buy games that run on their hardware that do not require Steam. On Xbone, everything goes through Microsoft.

2. Steam exists in a marketplace where physical distribution is nearly dead due to other factors, not because Valve explicitly killed it to increase their bottom line.

There is an inherent difference between physical and digital distribution of games. Physical distribution on PC is nearly dead, at least in the Americas, and Steam is credited in some ways with resurrecting interest in the platform. Microsoft, on the other hand, is attempting to put a bullet into the living retail market in order to increase their cut.

3. Steam exists on a platform where there is continuous downward price pressure from piracy and other DD stores, due to the platform's open nature.

4. Steam has continually added free features and value to its service to offset what consumers are losing by tying themselves to a Steam account. Microsoft's new system is almost exclusively worse for consumers than its predecessor.
 
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