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Spainish government approves restrictive abortion law
- Thread starter Acorn
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Sir_Crocodile
Member
ugh
Do they have a majority in parliment?
Do they have a majority in parliment?
Shameful. What conservative politicians refuse to recognize is that this will lead to an increase in unwanted children and, by extension, more crime and disorder.
In the modern developed world, teenage girls are by and large not fit to be mothers. Forcing such roles on them is inhumane.
In the modern developed world, teenage girls are by and large not fit to be mothers. Forcing such roles on them is inhumane.
Even worse it can lead to pushing abortions being made underground in less safe environments.
Pretty much how it was when it was outlawed...
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Good luck turning that economy around when you'll get an increase in criminality as a result of the new abortion restrictions, Spain.
Shameful, absolutely shameful.
Shameful, absolutely shameful.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
This Spanish government sucks
Letting private security firms arrest people
Restricting Protests
Limiting worker rights
More austerity
now limiting women's reproductive rights
yes, absolute too
Letting private security firms arrest people
Restricting Protests
Limiting worker rights
More austerity
now limiting women's reproductive rights
yes, absolute too
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
A massive one. They've been tearing the country to pieces since the previous administration fucked up so bad most of the left didn't even bother to vote.
I hope those numbnuts learnt what happens when you allow Opus Dei conservatives to rule a country without facing an actual oposition.
For the record, EVERYBODY but the Catholic fringe hates the new abortion law. Polls show that the draft was rejected by around 70% of the population, but conservatives have become so massively unpopular since they came to power they are now trying to retain the favour of the cave dwelling electorate.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
Spain has to have one of the lousiest political systems in the world.
There are no good choices that are viable. That and the population is in my experience VERY partisan and still fighting the civil war.
Makes republican vs. democrats look like a bunch of people singing Kumbaya
There are no good choices that are viable. That and the population is in my experience VERY partisan and still fighting the civil war.
Makes republican vs. democrats look like a bunch of people singing Kumbaya
Chezzymann
Member
Can't they just put their child up for adoption if they don't want to be the mother?
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
That piece from The Guardian is leaving the most nefarious bit aside, BTW: deformities and damages will need to be accredited with TWO different reports issued by different doctors. This obviously well researched decission has two incredibly nasty implications:
Anybody who voted for the PP in the last election can go fuck himself. Extrahard in the case of women. This is on you.
- Conservative doctors may deny an abortion even if the mother is at risk.
- Waiting lists are now incredibly long due to the PP's warring against the public healthcare system, so plenty of mothers won't be able to have an accrediting report in time.
Anybody who voted for the PP in the last election can go fuck himself. Extrahard in the case of women. This is on you.
I'll add it to the OP.
Ugh. Abortion restriction is so fucking disgusting. It's misogynistic, it's inhumane, and it is an obvious net harm to society.
Of course, but the mother still has to go through the trauma of pregnancy and childbirth, and the majority of teen mothers opt to keep their babies.
Lets see how this turns out. I did not expect this from Spain.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Spain is a on a downwards path into even deeper despair.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
It's not exactly "Spain". It's the government all by themselves. I expect a storm of demonstrations and shitkicking.
I'd like to point out again that the current government is supported by just a small fraction of the population. They didn't achieve their rolling supermajority because the voters love them, but because Spain's political system is a de facto duocracy and the second biggest political party outright imploded, which created a massive power vacuum in the left that couldn't be filled in time for the elections.
I believe you are American, so allow me the comparison: Try to imagine what could have happened in the United States if just one year before the 2012 presidential election the Democratic party lost most of its support.
There's literally no reasons to outright ban abortions except if you're a sick fuck who like people suffering.
Even it's not rape or some kind of shit, you'll always have a demand for abortions for various personal reasons.
Those that have the means to do it will (even if that involve a costy trip overseas or something) and the others can get into harms way doing it.
The consequences can be downright horrific and can even lead to the death of the pregnant woman in horrible pains.
Oh yes. I can see that, and it will most likely be reversed in time, but abortion has a far larger affect on society so for research purposes, this is a unique way to be able to study that affect on society for however long it takes for this to be repealed. Thanks for explaining.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
El País has a good summary in its English edition: Government approves most restrictive abortion laws since return of democracy
NYCmetsfan
Banned
Wow, this is pretty much the GOP's dream bill. They're are not constitutional provisions stopping this?
ClassyPenguin
Banned
That's sickening. These people have no morals.
I see that Mr. Rajoy can also play the "let's put our society into civil war mode so they don't mind about our pillage" game that Zapatero mastered. This is a blatant smoke bomb for our electricity bill spike, and perhaps, for even worse things to come. Second bank rescue? UE intervention? New corruption scandal! Stay tuned!
As for the law itself, if I have understood it correctly, it is more or less the same status that abortion had on pre-Zapatero days, but with the "double doctor check" addition. Fuck you, Rajoy, fuck you. This wasn't even in your ellectoral program. But you need this debate to happen at this specific moment, don't you?
As for the law itself, if I have understood it correctly, it is more or less the same status that abortion had on pre-Zapatero days, but with the "double doctor check" addition. Fuck you, Rajoy, fuck you. This wasn't even in your ellectoral program. But you need this debate to happen at this specific moment, don't you?
If you're a 14-year-old girl in rural Andalucia, good luck.
Well back to an angel maker for you in that case :/
....with a high risk of death too -_-'
That's really depressing
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
No. And if they were, they'd try to ammend the constitution by themselves or enact it anyway and leave it be until the Constitutional Court shut it down. Because the PP doesn't. Give. A. Fuck.
They know they lost the majority of the voters a long time ago, so seducing the ultracatholic fringe and waiting for another four years of leftist confusion is their best bet. And so far it's working.
Unfortunately, with current technology a woman has two options: end the pregnancy or carry it to term. Both are difficult choices that can cause emotional and physical trauma, but the former is almost always a less long-lasting decision. Even if a woman gives up a baby for adoption, for her entire life she will be a mother. Even if she wants to get married and have children later in life, that child will always stay with her, whether she would like it to or not. If she decides to end the pregnancy, that doesn't happen.
It's possible that in the future we would be able to extract an embryo from a woman and let it grow in some kind of incubator, but at the moment that is not feasible.
If a 14 year old girl can do it without lasting risk I'd be surprised.
What is this confusion anyway?
ComputerMKII
Banned
Of course it had to happen just before Christmas.
~Devil Trigger~
In favor of setting Muslim women on fire
I blame Portugal
AlteredBeast
Fork 'em, Sparky!
I know I am in the minority here, but GOOD!
You like teenagers having to resort to unsafe life threatening procedures instead of going to a hospital for an abortion?
Abortions won't stop because its made illegal, just makes it more unsafe.
Pretty sure the idea of no abortion means sex is now more meaningfully determined by both parties. To think men and women are unchanged by this action just wouldn't be seeing the full picture. Lets see what Altered says as to why it's "GOOD!" though.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
The whole "extract an embryo and put it in the incubator"-solution/compromise isn't worth it, as some fetuses are better worth being destroyed rather than allowed to continue developing.
Is it really right to bring forth a life into this world without parents wanting it?
The fetus doesn't care, because it lacks a mind, and society might care either way but will be negatively impacted by an increase of unwanted children.
Sickening. Really, I'm quite furious something like this happens in 2013. We should know better.
Also it's a good reminder that the European right wing isn't really on the left (like people have joked around here for ages), when given the opportunity they can show their proper right wing feathers. It's a sad thing that the left has been so incompetent and visionless around Europe lately that they've given just that opportunity to them on a silver platter.
More people should participate in politics again. Our society's too important to be run by politicians and commerce alone.
Also it's a good reminder that the European right wing isn't really on the left (like people have joked around here for ages), when given the opportunity they can show their proper right wing feathers. It's a sad thing that the left has been so incompetent and visionless around Europe lately that they've given just that opportunity to them on a silver platter.
More people should participate in politics again. Our society's too important to be run by politicians and commerce alone.
What do you mean by this?
ClassyPenguin
Banned
And this is empirically proven but anti-choice people do not believe in empirical evidence.
and thank goodness you are in the minority. Being forced to go through pregnancy and raise unwanted babies is not a good thing for society.
Actually you don't even need any more evidence for that other than looking at the death rate of women.
Death by abortions usually fall like harder than prices during sales.
It leads to unnecessary deaths that could be avoided
Don't Laugh
Banned
wtf really?
Yeah, no. The American states with the least access to abortion and contraception have the highest teen pregnancy rates in the country. Making sex dangerous doesn't make it less popular.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
http://elpais.com/elpais/2013/12/10/inenglish/1386703278_423081.html
'Social Importance' I can't help but think means protests and dovetails nicely to this other new law
http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/14/world/europe/madrid-protest/
Abortion not being there will make sex less available, making the view of sex more responsible, which in turn allows it to be better controlled in society.
The biggest complaint about abortion hasn't just been about life, though it is a valid complaint, but about the affects it has had on propelling the sexual revolution and how that has led to things we did not plan - a massive rise in teen pregnancies, more broken families because of lack of responsible view of sex, and sex now being able to be fully explored and exploited, leading to further objectification of women (to the point where what was once considered liberation is now considered harmful). These are all valid and researched complaints against this, which is why the fighting is as big as it is.
But this sort of view is very hardly shown and understood. I remember the pope saying "condoms spreads aids/pregnancies worse" and people just thinking he's stupid but people ignore the social affect contraceptive methods have on society as a whole on the view of sex. It surprises even researchers now that just teaching monogamy and responsible sex without support from condoms and such actually slows the spread of pregnancies and AIDS. I suppose that's because we live in the product of he sexual revolution and it's hard to separate ourselves from that.
That said, I just want to make clear that this is not me fighting in favor of this view. I'm good with whatever others want to do, but I like to have all the options understood by people. It makes for interesting discourse. The biggest complaint to stopping abortion now is that sex is still promoted because of the social affect of other surrounding groups. They just get swept in by this and ultimately harmed.
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