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Is Sega claiming my Youtube vids, or is someone fraudulently doing so in their name?

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Yesterday, I started to receive copyright notices from Youtube on some of my Genesis videos. They're all filed by the same party: "Streammer"

youtube1.png


Who is Streammer? Well, their website confusingly gives me an authorization error when trying to access it, so let's do a brief search:

http://www.crunchbase.com/organization/watunes

Founded: May 26, 2014

Streammer is the world's first streaming distribution service that helps people sell music online to leading digital streaming services including Spotify, Deezer, YouTube, Rdio, Sony Unlimited, and more! Users can upload and submit their music using INTRANET, the world's first intelligent distribution technology.

And that's pretty much all I've found. So, they're one of those content management companies that specifically handles the rights and monetization of various musicians' works on the Internet.

But here's the problem: I have no way to confirm that they're claiming my videos on Sega's behalf.

This is actually an infuriatingly frequent issue with Youtube's content ID system that I've run into several times in the past. Let me show you how this usually goes.

First, some asshole decides to record some video game music in an emulator and sell it on iTunes:

youtube2.png


Next, whatever company that ends up handling the rights for this asshole (in the specific case above: "VidZone") gets his "work" entered into their database, and I start getting hit with copyright notices:

youtube3.png


At this point, I do some bare minimum detective work that I shouldn't even have to trouble myself with, figure out what's going on, file a dispute with Youtube stating that this asshole doesn't even have the right to claim this content, and in a day or two or twelve, the claim gets released and things go back to normal.

That didn't happen this time, though.

youtube4.png


(Notice that this isn't even the first time that this particular video has been hit.)

I filed my dispute as usual, stating that I want confirmation that Streammer is authorized by the rights holder, Sega, to claim the disputed music. I received no answer to my request, just a notice that Streammer has reinstated their claim and that I'll need to file an appeal and risk my Youtube account to continue fighting this.

So, what do I do? If Sega is really having these guys handle their stuff like this, then that would suck and probably still be worth bitching about, but it's within their rights and I don't really care enough about it to bother. But if it's another case of some asshole and his scummy content management company abusing Youtube's broken content ID system for their monetary benefit at the expense of users, then I'm kind of pissed and want to know what could be done about it.

Anyone know who I could contact at Sega for a straight answer on this, at least? Streammer certainly isn't any help, and Youtube is just a pain to deal with.

I've certainly given up hope that Youtube will ever fix the mess that is their content ID system.
 

Rapstah

Member
If you put your account on the line, how are you supposed to know if the deciding factor is if "Streammer" owns the music or if you don't have the rights to the music?
 
iTunes is really bad for letting people sell things that they have no right to.

Recently both Marina and the Diamonds and Iggy Azealia had people upload unreleased tracks from them onto iTunes and sell them under their names - just not on the official artist page.
 

Venfayth

Member
Just do it for the love man, not the money.

Love is great, but there are a lot of people in the game industry who need to be able to make a living off games if we want the industry to continue to grow. That includes people who want to produce content on Youtube.
 

SoundLad

Member
The fact that someone can record video game music and sell it on iTunes that in return triggers the content ID check on Youtube is absurd.
 

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
If you put your account on the line, how are you supposed to know if the deciding factor is if "Streammer" owns the music or if you don't have the rights to the music?
I dunno. This is what you get when you say you want to file an appeal and is where I've stopped for the moment:

youtube5.png


So it's basically a gamble to move forward from here. What if these guys actually are handling Sega's material, or what if they're crazy enough to throw lawyers at this issue regardless of the actual circumstances? I dunno if I'd want to bother messing with it further in either case.

Just do it for the love man, not the money.
I honestly don't care about the literal pennies of ad revenue that I get from the currently disputed videos in question. It's the idea that someone else could be fraudulently abusing the system that really gets under my skin, and I don't think I should be the one to have to sit back and take it in the event that that's what's happening (again).

Besides, when people put out a claim like this, they end up running ads on the disputed videos themselves anyway.
 
D

Deleted member 74300

Unconfirmed Member
Oh hell no. It was bad enough they removed most of the Shining The Holy Ark music on Youtube. Not all the other Sega game music also.
Overreacting just a bit but I wouldn't be surprised if it comes to that.
 

KyleCross

Member
I uploaded a Yakuza: Dead Souls playthrough on my channel about a year ago. It was instantly claimed by SEGA and blocked from viewing worldwide. It was not monetized. The cutscenes triggered the contentID system and having the video blocked worldwide is what they had in place.

I appealed it saying that it was fair use, I wasn't even making money off of it.

SEGA denied the appeal and the judgement was to delete the video and slap my account with a 6-month copyright strike. I had to go through copyright school to even use my YouTube account again and several of my features (like videos longer than 15 minutes) were shut off for the entire duration of the 6-months.

Same thing happened when I uploaded a one-minute clip of Hajime no Ippo set to Rules of Nature from Metal Gear Rising. Except I didn't even appeal, Nippon Television hit me with an instant copyright strike which hit my channel the same way.
 
I would have said get in touch with RubyEclipse but he no longer works for SEGA.

Maybe posting on SEGA community forums (if these still exist) but I don't know how much employees read those. IIRC that is what people did with the whole everything Shining Force removal thing.

However that assumes the SEGA employee reading knows or can find out who Streammer are. At the moment it seems Streammer has all the power here (there is nothing stopping them from lying or as you mentioned being an ignorant manager of content that wasn't owned by the person who uploaded to iTunes), what I don't like about the contentID is copyright trolls can just come back whenever they like with no penalty (they siphon/get ad revenue as soon as they claim...would make more sense to put it into a pool until the claim is proved/disproved) and it seems the uploader bears the burden of proof.

It would be odd for SEGA to have a separate company manage music when they do/did takedown notices themselves on youtube (when I used to do SEGA's PR job for them* they tended to to eventually take down trailers of anything they published but didn't develop e.g. Let's tap and Shiren the Wanderer). But SEGA has changed a lot since then.

*-Take WMV trailers, uploaded to youtube, strategically time a news tip to blogs. They have official youtube channels now so no need to bother.
 

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Thanks, looking over it now.

I uploaded a Yakuza: Dead Souls playthrough on my channel about a year ago. It was instantly claimed by SEGA and blocked from viewing worldwide. It was not monetized. The cutscenes triggered the contentID system and having the video blocked worldwide is what they had in place.
That sucks, but at least Sega themselves is handling that dispute. If I could just get a confirmation or denial that they're actually claiming the music on these random Genesis Youtube videos, then I'd at least know whether I should leave it alone at that point or not. Nintendo has an iron grip on all of my Mario videos, but at least there's no ambiguity that they're the responsible party for all of those claims.
 

KyleCross

Member
The contentID system is broken. YouTube isn't much help either. We have publishers outright telling us "We're not doing a thing, we don't claim videos." yet it's happening, half the time by their name and half the time by some random nonsense company you've never heard of.

But almost always YouTube favors the claimant (invalid or not) unless you're a popular channel. YouTube is based on double standards, like how more popular channels can upload a sex scene from God of War which will get another smaller channel banned.

I wish you luck in your appeal, I hope it works out for you.
 

lazygecko

Member
It's the whole ecosystem of rights management working on a first come, first serve basis which makes it inherently incompatible with Content ID systems. That's what makes claims appear from companies that have explicitly stated that they're not doing it. There are so, so many different situations that can result in false positives or even malicious, exploitative claims that it becomes clear this whole thing is far from ready to actually be used.
 
I uploaded a Yakuza: Dead Souls playthrough on my channel about a year ago. It was instantly claimed by SEGA and blocked from viewing worldwide. It was not monetized. The cutscenes triggered the contentID system and having the video blocked worldwide is what they had in place.

I appealed it saying that it was fair use, I wasn't even making money off of it.

SEGA denied the appeal and the judgement was to delete the video and slap my account with a 6-month copyright strike. I had to go through copyright school to even use my YouTube account again and several of my features (like videos longer than 15 minutes) were shut off for the entire duration of the 6-months.

Same thing happened when I uploaded a one-minute clip of Hajime no Ippo set to Rules of Nature from Metal Gear Rising. Except I didn't even appeal, Nippon Television hit me with an instant copyright strike which hit my channel the same way.

That's pretty absurd. Do these publishers not understand that having people market their game for free on YouTube is a good thing more than a bad thing?!

Fucking copyright system on YouTube, man.
 

Mendrox

Member
I uploaded a Yakuza: Dead Souls playthrough on my channel about a year ago. It was instantly claimed by SEGA and blocked from viewing worldwide. It was not monetized. The cutscenes triggered the contentID system and having the video blocked worldwide is what they had in place.

I appealed it saying that it was fair use, I wasn't even making money off of it.

SEGA denied the appeal and the judgement was to delete the video and slap my account with a 6-month copyright strike. I had to go through copyright school to even use my YouTube account again and several of my features (like videos longer than 15 minutes) were shut off for the entire duration of the 6-months.

Same thing happened when I uploaded a one-minute clip of Hajime no Ippo set to Rules of Nature from Metal Gear Rising. Except I didn't even appeal, Nippon Television hit me with an instant copyright strike which hit my channel the same way.

So in the end there isn't any way anymore to have fun by uploading videos or playthroughs.. too much of a hassle. Sad world we live in.
 

lazygecko

Member
Sega of Japan in particular has been rather notorious about this stuff. There was also that incident where they went on a takedown spree against a ton of Shining Force videos on Youtube, because they thought the popularity of the videos would obstruct the search results for their official marketing of a new game in the series. It seems that since Japanese developers in general are so culturally and socially disconnected from their international fanbase, they don't really see how much value Youtube coverage from fans can bring.

You'd think after seeing trends like this (or even when their own official videos are affected thanks to this messed up system), publishers/developers ought to take more of a direct interest in fighting for reform on this crap.
 
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