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[Exterminieren]

The point is that his presence wouldn't make or break the movie either way. There is a very vocal group of posters who come into Ant-Man threads solely to express the sentiment that they don't give a shit about Ant-Man and that the only or primary reason they ever payed any attention to this movie was because Wright was involved. Now that he's gone they instead come into Ant-Man threads and talk about how unenthusiastic they feel about it, how the movie is destined to suck, how Marvel fucked up by not giving such a highly esteemed filmmaker the creative freedom to blah blah blah.

These people are just as annoying as the so-called MCU fanboys they dismiss as generally having terrible taste in movies.

I can understand how this can be frustrating as someone who is genuinely interested in the property, and I think shitting up every thread on the movie with how uninteresting they find the movie now is entirely pointless.

However, this thread was seemingly started in reaction to some of the discussions going on in the trailer thread, and I think discussions of how Wright's film would have looked in comparison are totally valid there. Wright's greatest strengths are modulations of tone and striking visuals, both of which are totally lacking in the trailer we saw. Pointing that out is not unfair, and some of the reflexive dismissal of these points absolutely is.

I do find it mildly disconcerting how some fans of the MCU are totally opposed to any hint of directoral style that deviates in any way from the Marvel house guide, and instead are willing to put their faith for the entire series in Feige's hands. I like the MCU just fine, but I'd welcome some more stylistic variety.
.

As someone who loves the MCU, the way I see it is: bunch of marvel stans refusing to let anything stand in the way of someone criticizing their precious corporation because marvel is unstoppable right now so STFU hater

It does often seem to be like this, yeah.

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Is there any validity to the wife beating allegations?

He doesn't have a wife.

 

[Boem]

Is there any validity to the wife beating allegations?

I assume you're making a joke, but just in case you aren't: people saying that are just making a joke in reference to Antman (in the comics the character beat his wife).

 

[Sobriquet]

As someone who loves the MCU, the way I see it is: bunch of marvel stans refusing to let anything stand in the way of someone criticizing their precious corporation because marvel is unstoppable right now so STFU hater

Neoxon'd

 

[E the Shaggy]

Hey, I was more than open to whoever Marvel got to take Edgar Wright's place, but that Ant Man teaser was hot shit, so now I'll keep thinking more about what could have been.

They might as well have stamped, "From the director of Bring It On" at the end of it.

 

[Rabbi_Vole]

I assume you're making a joke, but just in case you aren't: people saying that are just making a joke in reference to Antman (in the comics the character beat his wife).

Well shit. I read it on GAF yesterday and told pretty much everyone I know.

 

[guek]

Well shit. I read it on GAF yesterday and told pretty much everyone I know.

You done fucked up!

 

[MattKeil]

I think he's somewhat overrated, but I've never seen an Edgar Wright movie I didn't enjoy. Trouble is with the people who seem to think Wright was the key to Ant-Man is that all indications are that his idea for the film just wasn't in line with the rest of the MCU. Given how well the MCU has gone so far, I'm willing to give Marvel the benefit of the doubt in terms of their vision for the film, and I'm willing to give Wright the benefit of the doubt when he says he left the project because it was what was best for him and for the project.

Do I expect Ant-Man to be the best MCU movie ever? Absolutely not. Do I think Wright's departure from it means it'll be bad? Also absolutely not. These things happen in creative work. It's actually better that both parties realized it wasn't going to work out and parted ways rather than sticking to it and turning out a conflicted and disjointed film.

 

[Raptor]

This comparison is depressing as hell.

I need to go soak my head.

I am simply baffled to how you draw this comparison.

As a filmmaker, Wright has a strong and easily-identifiable visual and tonal style. I cannot imagine liking Shaun or Hot Fuzz without at least having an appreciation of that. Ratner, by contrast, simply fades into the background- any of his movies could have been directed by anyone, to no noticeable effect. He's a hack in the purest sense of the word.


Nick Frost had absolutely nothing to do with Run Fatboy Run.

Considering I liked Rush Hour and Family Men Im one of teh few that dont consider Brett a total failure of a director, I made the comparison for me because thats how I see those kind of directors, they are not up there with the greats nor are down there with the worst, just there, I dont remember any tonal directing, nor directing style that can call their own of any of this two directors.

I can instantly call out a malick movie or influence, cant say the same for Wright nor Ratner, etc.

 

[J10]

I can understand how this can be frustrating as someone who is genuinely interested in the property, and I think shitting up every thread on the movie with how uninteresting they find the movie now is entirely pointless.

However, this thread was seemingly started in reaction to some of the discussions going on in the trailer thread, and I think discussions of how Wright's film would have looked in comparison are totally valid there. Wright's greatest strengths are modulations of tone and striking visuals, both of which are totally lacking in the trailer we saw. Pointing that out is not unfair, and some of the reflexive dismissal of these points absolutely is
.


It does often seem to be like this, yeah.

The shit on Edgar Wright movement seems like a direct response to the shit on Ant-Man (or anything MCU related, for that matter) movement. This is what happens when you got the same people coming into Marvel threads over and over constantly reminding you that the thing you're really into is garbage. It's not merely an issue of rallying against dissenting opinions. Like, I think Star Wars is lame, but I don't go into Star Wars threads asking Star Wars fans why they're into that garbage because they'd just call me an asshole - and they'd be right. Who honestly wants to be that guy?

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

Still sad he didn't get Trek after Orci got the boot.

 

[StoopKid]

Hey, I was more than open to whoever Marvel got to take Edgar Wright's place, but that Ant Man teaser was hot shit, so now I'll keep thinking more about what could have been.

They might as well have stamped, "From the director of Bring It On" at the end of it.

Just because someone made a bad film doesn't mean their a bad director/writer.

Go look at some of the shit james gunn put out.

 

[Exterminieren]

I can instantly call out a malick movie or influence, cant say the same for Wright nor Ratner, etc.

The use of close-ups? The use of sound effects as a statement of character or mood? The zooms? The use of editing to provide humour where none else exists? I'm no student of film, but I can recognise a Wright movie from a mile off. It helps that he's scripted all of his own movies, too.

No one's claiming that Wright is on Malick's level, but he's got some very easily recognisable traits in his filmmaking. Ratner doesn't have anything like that.

The shit on Edgar Wright movement seems like a direct response to the shit on Ant-Man (or anything MCU related, for that matter) movement. This is what happens when you got the same people coming into Marvel threads over and over constantly reminding you that the thing you're really into is garbage. It's not merely an issue of rallying against dissenting opinions. Like, I think Star Wars is lame, but I don't go into Star Wars threads asking Star Wars fans why they're into that garbage because they'd just call me an asshole - and they'd be right. Who honestly wants to be that guy?

You are aware that I'm agreeing with you, right?

I'm specifically talking about the ridiculous defensiveness that went on in the trailer thread. People were literally replying to people saying that they would have preferred to see Wright's style with kneejerk bullshit about him not breaking the world box office with his small-scale British comedies or offbeat indie comic adaptations, as if that meant anything at all.

 

[Nesotenso]

I like his work a lot, especially how he directs and choreographs action scenes. Would have loved to see that in Ant man.

I still wonder what the disagreement was between Feige and Wright when they were working on the script for so long.

 

[SamVimes]

Considering I liked Rush Hour and Family Men Im one of teh few that dont consider Brett a total failure of a director, I made the comparison for me because thats how I see those kind of directors, they are not up there with the greats nor are down there with the worst, just there, I dont remember any tonal directing, nor directing style that can call their own of any of this two directors.

I can instantly call out a malick movie or influence, cant say the same for Wright nor Ratner, etc.

Are you serious? You can easily recognize an Edgar Wright movie in like 2 seconds or at the first cut.

 

[GreenRobot]

Edgar is easily one of the best living directors on this planet. Very skilled indeed.

He is too good for Marvel. As Kevin Kunt Fiege himself said, they find the movies in edit. I think GOTG is an exception. But they heavily use reshoots and rewrites to get their shitty scripts to become decent movies.

Edgar, like all the great directors, don't shoot coverage, they sure as shit don't find movies in the edit, they know exactly what they want. The have a vision.

This Antman movie will be decent I am sure, because it will have Edgars action scenes as he visualized it, and they will have stolen all his best bits from the scripts. But, I guess this is stating the obvious, whatever the movie is, it will be a turd to what Edgar would've made. Edgars movie would've been something special.

Worlds End is my favorite movie of his yet.

 

[ElectricKaibutsu]

Hot Fuzz is definitely in my top five favorite comedies. Probably number one, actually. It's the world's most perfect movie to me. I'm a big fan of Scott Pilgrim and Shawn of the Dead was great too.

I didn't think The World's End was that good though. It was all about the main character who was a crappy human being that I didn't care about. And speaking of caring, it was hard to care about the characters when none of the other characters reacted when someone died. I guess I feel like there was no emotional grounding in the film.

 

[kiguel182]

Yeah, people hating on him on that thread was a bit weird but it was kind of a backlash for people saying the movie would be better with Wright.

I love Edgar Wright so yeah, I'm bitter than he isn't directing the movie. The fact that the trailer looked dull as hell doesn't help so it's not a stretch to connect the two and comment on it.

Wright is a great director and writer that was attached to this project for a while so it's natural that there are going to be comparisons. For fans it's hard to watch this and not think how it would be with him behind it.

 

[Messofanego]

I was not at all aware that liking Edgar Wright movies is considered snobbish by some lol. Maybe that's a strawman, but I either don't want to know movie tastes of such people or am genuinely curious for their reason that his stuff is somehow above it all. Thanks to the fast pace of the filmmaking, it's hard to understand where snobbery comes into it that's more correlated with long take or elaborate cinematography kind of stuff.

I think it's just a prickly time right now since people feel the need to be in one camp or the other. Once people stop giving a shit about sides and realise what's done is done, maybe a better judgment can be made. I was only interested in Ant Man because of his involvement so I won't bother checking out the trailer or coverage until reviews hit and give me a verdict of whether it's worth watching or be mediocre enough to make people long for Wright's cancelled version.

 

[-tetsuo-]

I like his movies.

Does that mean I think he is a very good director? not at all.

No different than someone like Brett Ratner.

No. What? No.

 

[Coolsambob]

Like his films and he chatted to me about Eighties Matchbox B-Line Disaster in HMV once. So I'm a fan.

 

[GreenRobot]

I like his work a lot, especially how he directs and choreographs action scenes. Would have loved to see that in Ant man.

I still wonder what the disagreement was between Feige and Wright when they were working on the script for so long.

There weren't many disagreements, Edgar ceded to all his demands, and created a script that everyone loved.

But at the last moment, Feige had two screenwriters drastically rewrite key sections of the movie, apparently these screenwriters suck and one is an inhouse writer. Mind you, this is right before principal photography. The script was incredibly shit, and Edgar had zero time to even fix any of this.

There was speculation, that Feige purposefully created a super shitty script to drive Edgar off the script, as this is a technique that studios have been known to use, to kick people off a project, without having to kick them off. Its possible that this isn;t the case, since Marvel is infamous for starting a movie with a piece of a shit of a script. But, Peyton Reed and McCay did get to rewrite, so perhaps it was a despicable and cowardly ploy after-all.

Its also important to remember, Edgar actually could've made the film in 2011, but he wanted to do Worlds End first, and Feige agreed that he would do it right after. So obviously Feige was pleased, but after a few years, he has become brainwashed with making all the movies interconnected pieces of shits.

 

[Exterminieren]

Edgar is easily one of the best living directors on this planet. Very skilled indeed.

He is too good for Marvel. As Kevin Kunt Fiege himself said, they find the movies in edit. I think GOTG is an exception. But they heavily use reshoots and rewrites to get their shitty scripts to become decent movies.

Edgar, like all the great directors, don't shoot coverage, they sure as shit don't find movies in the edit, they know exactly what they want. The have a vision.

This Antman movie will be decent I am sure, because it will have Edgars action scenes as he visualized it, and they will have stolen all his best bits from the scripts. But, I guess this is stating the obvious, whatever the movie is, it will be a turd to what Edgar would've made. Edgars movie would've been something special.

Worlds End is my favorite movie of his yet.

Christ, don't.

I enjoy his movies a great deal, but there's no need to be hyperbolic and dickish about it. This level of childishness and petulance is exactly why people who enjoy these movies get pissed off.

 

[J10]

You are aware that I'm agreeing with you, right?

I'm specifically talking about the ridiculous defensiveness that went on in the trailer thread. People were literally replying to people saying that they would have preferred to see Wright's style with kneejerk bullshit about him not breaking the world box office with his small-scale British comedies or offbeat indie comic adaptations, as if that meant anything at all.

Yeah, I'm aware. I was just elaborating on where the defensiveness comes from. Honestly, it wouldn't even be there if the Wrightboys didn't feel compelled to constantly remind people what might have been in the first place.

 

[anaron]

There weren't many disagreements, Edgar ceded to all his demands, and created a script that everyone loved.

But at the last moment, Feige had two screenwriters drastically rewrite key sections of the movie, apparently these screenwriters suck and one is an inhouse writer. Mind you, this is right before principal photography.

There was speculation, that Feige purposefully created a super shitty script to drive Edgar off the script, as this is a technique that studios have been known to use, to kick people off a project, without having to kick them off.

Its also important to remember, Edgar actually could've made the film in 2011, but he wanted to do Worlds End first, and Feige agreed that he would do it right after. So obviously Feige was pleased, but after a few years, he has become brainwashed with making all the movies interconnected pieces of shits.

"Um Lord Feige-San knows what's good for the marvel universe above all (even though Ant man was only ever greenlit because of Edgar Wright) and GotG just grossed nearly a billion and you will all eat crow!!"

 

[Nesotenso]

So obviously Feige was pleased, but after a few years, he has become brainwashed with making all the movies interconnected pieces of shits.

I don't agree with this sentiment. And Wright probably knew that his project was going to be piece of a larger whole.

 

[GreenRobot]

Christ, don't.

I enjoy his movies a great deal, but there's no need to be hyperbolic and dickish about it. This level of childishness and petulance is exactly why people who enjoy these movies get pissed off.

People who enjoy his movies get pissed off at what?

If you have a point to make, try and make it. Its exactly this level of stupidly and in-articulation that pisses people with brains off.

 

[Raptor]

Are you serious? You can easily recognize an Edgar Wright movie in like 2 seconds or at the first cut.

I don't recognize his style at all, in fact his style in Scott pilgrim was pure garbage IMO.

 

[Discotheque]

"Um Lord Feige-San knows what's good for the marvel universe above all (even though Ant man was only ever greenlit because of Edgar Wright) and GotG just grossed nearly a billion and you will all eat crow!!"

Yeah it's pretty wack how I've seen a few MCU fans on gaf actually outright say the directors shouldn't matter as much as feige's say in the film's

That's some scust-tier opinion.

 

[guek]

Watch yourself, Exterminieren! You're talking with someone who's got brains!

 

[daxy]

Don't know anything about the Ant Man situation. This is all very subjective of course, but I think Edgar Wright is among the most talented directors currently working. Like Wes Anderson, he has a very specific style that not everyone may enjoy. Even if you don't like his movies, I think it speaks to his abilities and is worth respecting that in the current cinema climate he manages to put out movies with a distinctly personal and unique style, rather than going for the big bucks common denominator type of flick.

 

[GreenRobot]

I don't agree with this sentiment. And Wright probably knew that his project was going to be piece of a larger whole.

That is what happened. Something changed with Feige. In 2011, Edgar could've made the movie.

in 2013, Feige completely rewrote key sections right before filming. Favreau has spoken of how he was forced to shoot IM2 without a finished script, and that he fought for extra time, and did not want all the Shield stuff in it, he fought and lost.

Patty Jenkins similarly fought and lost against Marvel over the crappy script.

Kenneth Branagh declined to return for Thor 2 with similar complaints.

The eventual director of Thor 2 talked about how incredibly stressful and difficult it was to shoot with changing script!

The Marvel method in those two years coalesced into something terrible.

Oh, and Edgars movie was indeed already part of the MCU.

 

[crimsonspider89]

People who enjoy his movies get pissed off at what?

If you have a point to make, try and make it. Its exactly this level of stupidly and in-articulation that pisses people with brains off.

At people being childish like you were. And the script rewrite didn't happen till after Weight left and then Petton threw that away and modified Wright's script. And Lily in an interview implied that Wright left due to not wanting it to be connected.

 

[Doctor Decimate]

The point is that his presence wouldn't make or break the movie either way. There is a very vocal group of posters who come into Ant-Man threads solely to express the sentiment that they don't give a shit about Ant-Man and that the only or primary reason they ever payed any attention to this movie was because Wright was involved. Now that he's gone they instead come into Ant-Man threads and talk about how unenthusiastic they feel about it, how the movie is destined to suck, how Marvel fucked up by not giving such a highly esteemed filmmaker the creative freedom to blah blah blah.

These people are just as annoying as the so-called MCU fanboys they dismiss as generally having terrible taste in movies.

While yeah, it is definitely obnoxious to see people go in thread after thread saying the same thing, it is at least a valid concern. "This movie would have been awesome with Edgar Wright, but now I don't think it will be with Peyton Reed" is a very valid concern.

I find it kind of hard to be sympathetic when the common response has been this: "The general public doesn't care who Edgar Wright is." "Edgar Wright didn't guarantee box office success." Nobody said the general public cared. Nobody said he was what would make it financially successful. There's very little "wait and see" anymore, there's just this straw man nonsense. And it makes it hard to take the odd "Edgar Wright was never good" seriously because it just seems like it comes from the same place as those other arguments. There is no legitimate discussion to be had about this anymore.

 

[Exterminieren]

Yeah, I'm aware. I was just elaborating on where the defensiveness comes from. Honestly, it wouldn't even be there if the Wrightboys didn't feel compelled to constantly remind people what might have been in the first place.

Ugh, "Wrightboys". Hate this tribalism, as if it's impossible to enjoy the films of the MCU while still thinking that Ant-Man would be better if Wright were still on board.

Mind you, along comes someone to make me sympathise...

People who enjoy his movies get pissed off at what?

Your brand of stupid, holier than thou faux-intellectualism, as if Wright is an unimpeachable genius who was brightening up Marvel by his sheer presence.

Wright is a very skilled director, who often deals in pastiche and reference elevated by his own style. What he is not is an unassailable visionary who redefines the medium. Pretending otherwise does a disservice to what he actually is good at.

If you have a point to make, try and make it. Its exactly this level of stupidly and in-articulation that pisses people with brains off.

Insulting people who don't share your opinions in media pisses people with brains off. Pisses everyone off, in fact.

There's that faux-intellectualism again.

 

[Raptor]

Seriously, whats his style?

Childish? quick cust to the face?

I seriously don't know what style this dude has.

 

[Anton Sugar]

Seriously, whats his style?

Childish? quick cust to the face?

I seriously don't know what style this dude has.

Did you read the OP?

Here's an eight-minute video essay from David Chen of Slashfilm, dedicated to Wright's ability to use the close-up as a storytelling tool.

Here's an eight-minute video essay by Tony Zhou that directly compares Wright's work with a number of well known comedy directors as a means to point out just how cinematic his films are, in ways other comedies can't possibly compete with, or hell, even legitimate action or drama films.

It's pretty apparent the man puts a lot of thought into what he's doing with the camera, why he's doing it, and how to get it done. He puts a lot of thought into everything he does, period, which is not a thing that can be said for many filmmakers in general. Hell, look at how much thought he poured into the matter of simply programming a hypothetical horror-film festival for the AV Club. When asked, he not only first arrived at a theme based on a Shakespeare play, he then populated the hypothetical festival with films that not only fit within that theme but stood as legitimately great picks in and of themselves.

 

[crimsonspider89]

Wright's style is using a combination of body language and dialogue to tell the story as well as a very innovative cinematographical in filming his fight scenes among an amazing knack for music and very impactful camera shots to show the mood.

 

[Mix Master]

I'm finding "everything about Ant-Man is now bad and also it would automatically have been perfect if Edgar Wright was still director" posts are vastly more common than the opposite.

This, in every thread there is someone damn near claiming edgar wright is the second coming of christ. Edgar had 8 fucking years, time to move on. and he beats his wife also.

 

[Lord British]

I'm not especially fond of his directing. I think he's a bit of a one-trick-pony, and what was impressive in Spaced - completely unique on TV - is a bit old hat when it comes to cinema.

I say this as a general fan of his films, I hasten to add. I love Shaun and especially love Hot Fuzz. Haven't seen World's End yet, and wasn't crazy about Scott Pilgrim.

 

[brian577]

While yeah, it is definitely obnoxious to see people go in thread after thread saying the same thing, it is at least a valid concern. "This movie would have been awesome with Edgar Wright, but now I don't think it will be with Peyton Reed" is a very valid concern.

Hardly a valid concern when Wright was the only reason these people gave a shit about the movie in the first place.

 

[Discotheque]

I hope WB snatches him up for a major comic book movie or he gets a big-budget sci fi or something. I feel like his whole career has been leading up to a Star Wars or marvel/DC movie. And he could be the one to make the GOAT for comic books.

 

[Doctor Decimate]

Hardly a valid concern when Wright was the only reason these people gave a shit about the movie in the first place.

I kind of doubt there'd be as many complaints if they brought on a new director with some significant name value.

 

[Raptor]

Did you read the OP?

How "Cinematic" his movies are, skilled with the camera, ok.....

Whats his style?

Still not answered.

His style is that he puts a lot of effort in what he does?

Well I guess I have a very different definition of what a director style is.

 

[Supermanisdead]

tldr: wah wah wah why dont u like edgar wright

 

[smokeandmirrors]

Hardly a valid concern when Wright was the only reason these people gave a shit about the movie in the first place.

Why isn't it a concern? It would've certainly gotten me to go pay money to see it. Now that he's not it'll be another samey marvel movie and I've seen enough of those already.

I hope WB snatches him up for a major comic book movie or he gets a big-budget sci fi or something. I feel like his whole career has been leading up to a Star Wars or marvel/DC movie. And he could be the one to make the GOAT for comic books.

He was rumored to be in the running for Star Trek which would've been absolutely amazing.

I want a heist movie from him though. that would be cool.

 

[Jack Remington]

He's a lot better than Shane Black.

 

[Exterminieren]

Seriously, whats his style?

Childish? quick cust to the face?

I seriously don't know what style this dude has.

He heavily utilises close-ups, both as a narrative tool and as a source of comedy. Look at the various looks to camera that we get in Hot Fuzz for one example, or the use of close-ups to tell the love story in Scott Pilgrim.

He heavily leans on his editor, to provide humour and to utilise repetition in his plots. Look at the repeated montage of Shaun's plan in Shaun of the Dead, or the Whiskey Bar scene in The World's End, or Scott's extra life in Scott Pilgrim vs. the World- scenes were the comedy is almost entirely derived from the cutting of the camera, the choices of sound effects and the increased speed. His work is often kinetic in pace, while slowing down and using longer takes for action- observe how Scott Pilgrim has fast cuts in its montages and dialogue scenes, while slowing down for long takes capturing all of the action in the action scenes.

Linked to that is his use of sound effects to add mood and to convey the emotions of his characters. Scott Pilgrim is absolutely lousy with video game sound effects to portray Scott's emotions and life, but it's there in all of his works, from whooshes to give scene transitions extra pace and urgency, to cash register chimes giving Skinner's deliberately cheesy and slimy characterisation in Hot Fuzz some extra bite. There's often overlap between this and his use of close-up- there's a great example of close ups on the beer taps contrasted with the water tap in The World's End, which serves as an explanation of his characters and their emotional states without even having them on screen.

There are a lot more than that, but they're the ones that immediately leap to mind.

 

[ReplacementPelican]

Brilliant director, I absolutely love his style of transitioning between time or place and I have to say that I believe Hot Fuzz to be one of the finest comedy films in a damn long time.

 

[Cheebo]

The issue is no one can claim with a straight face Peyton Reed is even half as good as a director as Wright. No chance at all based on track record. And the quality of a film always hinges very heavily on the directors ability.

Wright inherently in being a far more skilled director would have made a better film than Peyton Reed. Thus we are getting a far lesser Ant-Man film than we could of.

I mean just look at the camera work in the teaser. It is clearly very pedestrian when Wright shots are not.

Even the most rabid Marvel fanboy can and should at least attest that what we are getting will be below the potential of what we could of had.