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Project CARS | OT | Made by 80.000 slightly mad developers
- Thread starter Staab
- Start date
flipswitch
Member
Ryökäle;165200187 said:Second try, 1:32:678.
I'm starting to get some flashbacks from couple of years ago with Dilly and Arucardo in front of me.
Think you mean 1:32:578
I've been watching some of the faster hot laps of Oulton by you lot trying to improve, and I just cannot figure out how you get round corners so fast.
For example, watching kie25's video, he takes the slight left hander before the first hairpin at around 130mph! Anything over 110mph for me has me in the grass. I'm probably in average 10-15mph slower in each corner.
For example, watching kie25's video, he takes the slight left hander before the first hairpin at around 130mph! Anything over 110mph for me has me in the grass. I'm probably in average 10-15mph slower in each corner.
Ryökäle;165200187 said:Second try, 1:32:578.
I'm starting to get some flashbacks from couple of years ago with Dilly and Arucardo in front of me.
Haha, good times. I'd love to do some organized races with GAF again
, not sure if I can do a full on league but some individual races could be fun.
TJP
Member
If the PRC website is true (I know & understand some people hate the website), things aren't as rosy at RD nowadays sadly. People need to step away from the keyboard and/or the internet for a while
I'm happy to play these sims and ignore the storms in teacups that appear to crop up from time to time.
If the PRC website is true (I know & understand some people hate the website), things aren't as rosy at RD nowadays sadly. People need to step away from the keyboard and/or the internet for a while
I'm happy to play these sims and ignore the storms in teacups that appear to crop up from time to time.
Lots of youtube videos about Mr Bell, and also the way the crowdfund was run popping up.
I don't think, no matter how Mr Bell wants to dress his actions up in the forum, or how the individual views his response, has done SMS, or his game, any favours, infact, it's probably irreparable damaged their reputation, regardless of how the zealots want to dress his actions up.
Yes, there are issues in the game, big ones, the game changing your setup is a massive one for me, and the reason why (I think) people have reported massive differences in handling between users copies of the game, so I hope they will be fixed in due course.
But I've still got 40+ hrs in it, and I still return to it every day, so regardless of the shitstorm that surrounds the game, I think I've got my moneys worth.......
If you're finding the AI at 90% to be easy, then you're doing alright man.
TJP
Member
All I can find is the English cricket player when I type the name into YouTube
This is the saddest part of the commentators versus WMD/SMS soap opera as the games SMS make are, on the whole, pretty solid experiences.
Bugs are now an established part of any SMS release
Shame as the core gameplay in project cars is a lot of fun so I too hope the issues are fixed ASAP.All I can find is the English cricket player when I type the name into YouTube
"Lots" was probably a bit hyperbolic on my part........
On both the customer "service", and the smoking gun about the WMD investments (that aren't, but are, investments)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8yAwlAUGPc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjKWpF0MeAY
TJP
Member
Thaks for the links; I'll take a look at these a little later
Edit: I like that his video revenue goes to charity and the two videos I watched were evenhanded.
I was wondering the same thing I've been playing The Witcher 3 in the mean time, at least till they fix racing in the rain. The Witcher has had THREE patches since release and it came out after Project Cars. :/
Have they all gone on holiday?
From chatter on the official forums I believe the team were given the weekend off (it was a bank holiday in the UK) but patches for wheel/controller issues have been sent to Namco for checking before submission for certification with Sony & MS. I understand PC patching is a much quicker process.
Yeah, they gave the dev team an extra couple of days off over the BHW.
TylerDurden4321
Member
Done, but sorry for the inconsistent driving.
https://youtu.be/UQs-qr9P40k
[Sorry, posted the wrong video at first, had one with a g-force meter overlay prepared, should be the right one now]
For the PCARS video I had the feeling "you're too slow, you have to speed up to get the maximum g out of this" but it didn't speed up fast enough, then I tried more turn-in and yeah... unideal power oversteer at the end. In the Forza video I had the feeling that I was already on edge of grip and rather went wide.
PCARS felt safer to me than Forza 5, but as predicted the lateral g-forces seem to be very similar.
P.S. of course this unscientific BS, considering my driving at the size of the dot in PCARS' g-meter.
Fox Mulder
Member
I'm at 90% and can pull away with 5+ second leads in the formula c car. I'm using a couple aids on a controller though, but they need tougher AI.
Twist: PCars devs are playing Witcher 3 and have no time for your silly patches.
I think the tyre models are probably quite different, Forza 5, although less grippy overall, seems much more forgiving once you step over the limit of grip, there isn't that drop off, which means you can quite easily hold it right on the edge of grip, and hold massive slides, very easily, especially with a pad.
I agree that, overall, PCars level of grip feels more in general, however, the drop of in grip at the edges of the grip envelope makes things go very pear shaped, very quickly, and make it very difficult to hold on the limit and hold slides.
Easy to see if you take one of the slower, slick shod cars out in PCars, like the Ginetta Junior, tons of grip until you really start pushing it, and once to get to the limit and try to push past it, it goes very wrong, quickly.
As to which one is more realistic?, not an easy question, but in my experience of driving many different types of car, on different types of tyres, I'd say that overal PCars delivers a more realistic experience most of the time, real cars do have an abundance of grip most of the time, and when to do go past the limit, they bite, especially slick tyres.
Cheers for the videos, if nothing else, it shows that FM5 still looks good!
You'd expect that considering they don't have to spend any rendering budget on realtime environment lighting and heavy alpha effects. I wanna see if FM6 is a little more ambitious with their engine, they've been playing it safe for 3 generations now, it's time to implement something more in line with the competition.
I don't mind that really, I'll be perfectly honest, apart from a great "box comment" weather does nothing for me, it doesn't add much to the experience apart from "-10 grip", which can just be frustrating.
Most of my driving in PCars is in the dry, and in the middle of the day, so personally I'd have spend that rendering budget on a locked 60fps.
I'd enjoy racing in the rain a lot more if it affected the AI drivers.
TylerDurden4321
Member
Dude, clearly(!) you've been playing Forza 5 on "normal" and not simulation steering(which I found borderline unplayable with a controller). I would definitely say that Forza 5 on simulation steering is more unforgiving than PCARS when you're trying to catch a sliding car.
Nope, simulation steering for FM5, normal only really makes a difference is saving tank slappers, once the slide has become unholdable.
I can bearly hold a slide in PCars, let alone drift, I can drift like a demon in FM5!
TylerDurden4321
Member
Man, first your rain time in the F1, now drifting on simulation steering in FM5 with a controller... you just keep to impress me.
This. The apologists swarm like bees, diluting any constructive criticism or genuine questions into oblivion.
I get Ian's frustration but he would be better served by making one stickied post a day, or every couple of days with things that are included in the next patch compared to the known issues thread. He's fallen into playing whack a mole and is swatting flies with sledgehammers.
I now just read the dev posts on the pcars forum but even those are all over the map. Like the Caterham, some dev posts imply it's user side while others say it's not complete. People are buying pcars daily, going to the forums to get information but the apologists aren't helping and are more annoying than any issue with the game.
So it's essentially in the same state as launch? That's disappointing. I'll just keep playing Witcher 3 in the mean time I guess.
Which Caterham, and what's the issue with it?
soundscream
Member
Yeah I could care less about weather, but I would like night racing. Especially since all the cars have working head lights in FM5........such a tease.
Ok, so you dropped ~2 seconds off your time by adding in some assists that the car normally has...
So what that's telling me is that with the assists off, you're pushing it too hard...my guess is you're losing a lot of time under braking with lock ups, and/or having to brake way early to avoid lock ups...
I always run Forza and Gran Turismo with assists off (ABS on)...might be something for you to try. I understand the appeal of running no assists, but in the case of pCARS with the "real" setting...by turning everything off you're actually putting yourself in situations where professional drivers have some assists
You will also never find a single dropped frame. Turn 10 do not like to compromise on performance like other devs do, which limits them in what they can do, but I applaud this 'performance first' approach.
Would those same drivers be faster without the assists though? Stig always turned everything off for his power laps.
The Elite
BOSS
Hotlap Challenge #2
RUF RGT-8 GT3 @ Oulton Park (International)
---------------
1. 1:31.408 - Betta Lines (pic)
2. 1.31.512 - kie25 (pic)
3. 1.32.528 - Dilly (post), PC
4. 1:32.562 - Arucardo (pic) // PC
5. 1:32.651 - Big Takeover // pic
6. 1:32.893 - paskowitz (pic) // PC
7. 1:32.915 - Azzawon (pic) // XB1, wheel, no assists (auto clutch?)
8. 1:33:499 - PjotrStroganov (pic)
9. 1:33:843 - saladine1 (pic)
10. 1:33:867 - Scaramanger (pic) // PC, gamepad
11. 1.33.905 - Jilt (pic) // no assists wheel
12. 1:33:909 - Speech (pic) // PC/Assists Off(Auto Clutch)/Wheel
13. 1:34.691 - Ryökäle (pic) // TC and ABS
14. 1:34:744 - Metfanant (pic / video) //PS4/T500RS/Real/manual w/auto clutch
15. 1:35:047 - Flightwave (pic) // Wheel, real assists, automatic
16. 1:35.049 - Scaramanger (pic) // PS4
17. 1:35:665 - Brentech (pic/ video) // DS4, Manual/TS/ABS
18. 1:35.787 - TylerDurden4321 (pic) // wheel, no assists but auto-clutch, softer car setup
19. 1.35.993 - PriitV (pic) // stock setup, wheel/real assists/pc
20. 1:36:332 - danowat (video) // pad no assists
21. 1:36.526 - Mascot (pic) // PS4, no assists, manual gears
22. 1:37.200 - Anton668 (pic) // PC - DS4
23. 1:38.495 - Gestault // PS4 -DS4, Auto-transmission w/ TCS
24. 1:38:716 - mitchlol (pic) // Logitech DFGT / Auto Clutch + racing line // PC
25. 1:39:040 - FunkyLounge (pic) // Newbie with a wheel, assist set to real, manual shifting, auto clutch on PC
26. 1:39.073 - soundscream // wheel, no assist
27. 1:40:324 - Sickbean (pic) // PC, 360 pad, no assists,
28. 1:42.378 - RP912 (pic)
29. 1:46.853 - DoctorWho (pic)
I need to give it a second shot now that I have adjusted the controller settings. Didn't realize how difficult it would be with default settings.
soundscream
Member
Classic.
At release I spent a couple of hours trying to get the DS4 steering settings to a point where I could start tweaking car setup. Got frustrated, went the forums and found a dev post stating the classic and a couple others had not been completely tuned/balanced prior to release due to time constraints and they will get some more attention in a patch.
I just tried to find that post to link here, came across some of your setups. Will give them a try to see if it tames the car a bit, especially the front end. The post was made by the dev who is responsible for car handling. Can't remember the name or exactly what he said was not complete, once I saw it I went back to GT cars and wait until the patch.
Fox Mulder
Member
I love weather in racing games. I would be disappointed and likely pass on forza 6 if it doesnt have day night cycles and rain.
Stock setup is fairly poor, that combined with the fact that most of the setup options are locked makes it a tough car to drive and tune.
I've had some success softening the rear and stiffening the front, but it can still be a bit temperamental, especially in the wet.
Once you get your head around the fact that, braking in a straightline = good, braking in a turn = you'll end up in a hedge.
I've had some success softening the rear and stiffening the front, but it can still be a bit temperamental, especially in the wet.
Once you get your head around the fact that, braking in a straightline = good, braking in a turn = you'll end up in a hedge.
Betta Lines
Member
GT3 cars generate a fair amount of downforce so if you're able to reach a higher speed, there is, to some degree, more grip to be found. It's a positive feedback loop, where going faster gives you more grip, and more grip allows you to go faster, so that could be part of the reason why you're 10-15mph slower in each corner.
As for the kink, it's possible that you're struggling to enter above 110mph because of the way you take Cascades (T3). A good run out of there should allow you to hit over 145mph before the kink. If you're not doing at least 140mph at that point, you might not have the necessary downforce to turn in and take the kink at 130mph.
If you're at the right speed and still struggling to get the car to turn in, think about the timing of your throttle lift in combination with the steering input. It shouldn't require much steering at all - understeer is the last thing you want here - a correctly-timed throttle lift is what you need to make the car rotate.
Got some laps in yesterday and always amazes me how much fun those classic narrow British tracks are. Took me a while to get just below the 32 mark, without changes few tenths left (messed up 1st corner), but doubt I can get a lot faster. Forgot the screenshot but you can see my time either in the Profiler pic below, or Ryökäle post
For those wondering (PC) how were to gain time, there is an easy to use data logging tool by Tom Shane available here: Profiler
It has an easy (multiple) lap comparison option (just load (open) the attached file from my post in Profiler before starting a session), that helps a lot more (detail) than watching someone's replay without seeing the inputs (wheel/pedals).
@Betta Lines: do you have/use this tool, if so, could you post a lap. I would love to see the data, to check if there is a specific place were I can gain time, or it's just a little everywhere
my Profiler lap: 1.31.938 at Oulton Park (dropbox)
Profiler laptime screenshot/example:
For those wondering (PC) how were to gain time, there is an easy to use data logging tool by Tom Shane available here: Profiler
It has an easy (multiple) lap comparison option (just load (open) the attached file from my post in Profiler before starting a session), that helps a lot more (detail) than watching someone's replay without seeing the inputs (wheel/pedals).
@Betta Lines: do you have/use this tool, if so, could you post a lap. I would love to see the data, to check if there is a specific place were I can gain time, or it's just a little everywhere
my Profiler lap: 1.31.938 at Oulton Park (dropbox)
Profiler laptime screenshot/example:
Scaramanger
Member
Fascinating insight here Betta, thanks. Shows the attention to detail required for those superfast laps!
My question would be how do you approach a new time trial to find this stuff out? Is it just trial and error or something more scientific?
Thanks!
That is pretty sick! Well done.
Thanks for the input.
I'll post a video of my lap when I get a chance so you can confirm if this is the case.
Nice! Stock settings?
I must try sticking in higher gears. You did one corner in sixth that I do in fourth.
Be nice if you fasties showed full telemetry in your replays..!
kie25 mentioned further up that's he's shifted the gear ratios up one (so his 6th is like 5th on a stock setup)
Aha! Ta. Any reason?
Betta Lines
Member
I don't have it, will download it now. Might not have time to do a run today, but I'll let you know.@Betta Lines: do you have/use this tool, if so, could you post a lap. I would love to see the data, to check if there is a specific place were I can gain time, or it's just a little everywhere
It's trial and error - I never use the kind of telemetry analysis that markao is talking about (I'm not saying it isn't worthwhile, it's just not something I find enjoyable). I'm pretty familiar with Oulton, so it didn't take long to get up to speed. If the track is completely new to me, it takes longer, but the process is still the same. It's just a case of being methodical and exploring the boundaries a bit more each lap, trying a few different lines. If I get a green split number, I know I'm heading in the right direction - if it's red (and unexpected), then I have to think about what could have lost me time. Delta bars are particularly helpful for this as they blend from green to red in real time - iRacing's is particularly good, rF2 has a decent plugin... but I don't think PCARS has one, so I'm just relying on the split time.
It's just as much about extracting the most from the car as it is from the track, in the sense that you can take the perfect line and hit all the braking points but not drive the car in the right way and you'll still be losing time. The driving part is much harder to describe though!
Sure! Can be a bit tough to see exactly what you're doing without on-screen inputs being displayed, but I can try to give you some pointers.
Nice work kie25!
I don't have it, will download it now. Might not have time to do a run today, but I'll let you know.
It's trial and error - I never use the kind of telemetry analysis that markao is talking about (I'm not saying it isn't worthwhile, it's just not something I find enjoyable). I'm pretty familiar with Oulton, so it didn't take long to get up to speed. If the track is completely new to me, it takes longer, but the process is still the same. It's just a case of being methodical and exploring the boundaries a bit more each lap, trying a few different lines. If I get a green split number, I know I'm heading in the right direction - if it's red (and unexpected), then I have to think about what could have lost me time. Delta bars are particularly helpful for this as they blend from green to red in real time - iRacing's is particularly good, rF2 has a decent plugin... but I don't think PCARS has one, so I'm just relying on the split time.
It's just as much about extracting the most from the car as it is from the track, in the sense that you can take the perfect line and hit all the braking points but not drive the car in the right way and you'll still be losing time. The driving part is much harder to describe though!
Sure! Can be a bit tough to see exactly what you're doing without on-screen inputs being displayed, but I can try to give you some pointers.
Nice work kie25!
Try pressing 'tab' when ingame, it will show split times in real time.
Betta Lines
Member
Tab doesn't do anything for me, I guess it became unassigned at some point. Are you talking about the 'Cycle Lap Info' display? Didn't realise I had that turned off actually, so thanks for that. It's not really what I'm after though...
changing the gear ratios will give you some harder acceleration, at the expense of top speed...or you can go the other way...