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Is female Link set to appear in Hyrule Warriors 3DS? (Video inside)

Ushojax

Should probably not trust the 7-11 security cameras quite so much
Him being bish doesn't mean he somehow looks exactly like a girl, stature, posture, and voice he's still a dude even in Zelda U, so in all likelihood all of this would be changed for a fem link. Plus, plenty of people myself included simply refer to Link as he or him, hell nintendon is guilty of it too, that had to change though if there's a fem Link meaning the whole way people view Link has to change for a fem link.

Yes, every Link so far has been male. But he has been deliberately designed to be androgynous and quite feminine in appearance, like lots of elf characters in popular culture. Things like his stature, posture and voice would be trivial changes. To me Link is just a brave kid who wears a green tunic and doesn't speak, none of that precludes a female version. As I said, Link's basic design is already so feminine that Zelda fans thought Nintendo made him a girl once already.

I'm not particularly excited for a female Link because she wouldn't be any different from the Link we have now. I'd have no problem with it but if we are going to change the player character I'd much rather play as Impa or someone with a different story/skills to Link. A female link would be neat but it would be the same as swapping between male and female Wii Fit Trainers to me.
 

FSLink

Banned
I think the reincarnation thing allows for this sort of thing to happen more logically in-universe. You can't really just have a choice between a Male or Female Samus in the Metroid games due to the characterization, but I could see a future Zelda game give you a choice between a Male or Female Link just because it wouldn't affect anything lore wise.

I don't really see why anyone would have a problem with a female Link. He is already purposefully androgynous. It's not like making Mario a girl or Samus a man. We already had an incident where fans thought the male Link from Zelda U was female, in terms of design there is barely any work to do.

I swear some fans are just very insecure, it's why they don't understand Tingle. They spend hours playing as a fairy boy in a green skirt yet playing as a female Link is unconscionable? I don't get it. It's not even like Link is a defined, singular character like Nintendo's other heroes. He is the reincarnation of the Hero just like Zelda/Ganon are reincarnation's of Hylia/Demise. That doesn't mean their form has to stay the same, only their spirit.

Very well said, as long as they can make them represent their spirit, who cares. I'm all for allowing a Male or Female option in the Zelda series.

Of course you could always have a Zelda-centric game or something, but I also don't see why people dislike the idea of having a male and female option especially when the lore has a convenient reincarnation excuse if you really care about the canon.
 
Yes, every Link so far has been male. But he has been deliberately designed to be androgynous and quite feminine in appearance, like lots of elf characters in popular culture. Things like his stature, posture and voice would be trivial changes. To me Link is just a brave kid who wears a green tunic and doesn't speak, none of that precludes a female version. As I said, Link's basic design is already so feminine that Zelda fans thought Nintendo made him a girl once already.

I'm not particularly excited for a female Link because she wouldn't be any different from the Link we have now. I'd have no problem with it but if we are going to change the player character I'd much rather play as Impa or someone with a different story/skills to Link. A female link would be neat but it would be the same as swapping between male and female Wii Fit Trainers to me.
To be fair most people I saw thought it was Link up untill Aonuma said it wasn't, that was when people lost their shit, I never personally thought it was a girl at all though, especially when I look at like the size of his feet or calfs or the short stumpy not elongated at all legs, or in other words the calling cards of a male anime teenager.
 

Ushojax

Should probably not trust the 7-11 security cameras quite so much
To be fair most people I saw thought it was Link up untill Aonuma said it wasn't, that was when people lost their shit, I never personally thought it was a girl at all though, especially when I look at like the size of his feet or calfs or the short stumpy not elongated at all legs, or in other words the calling cards of a male anime teenager.

I remember that E3 reveal and the vast majority of posts were, if not convinced, at least questioning whether Link was male. Personally I never did because there was nothing about the design that looked any different from previous Links. If he had been wearing the green tunic nobody would have thought he was a girl, that shows how gender-neutral the character is.
 
I remember that E3 reveal and the vast majority of posts were, if not convinced, at least questioning whether Link was male. Personally I never did because there was nothing about the design that looked any different from previous Links. If he had been wearing the green tunic nobody would have thought he was a girl, that shows how gender-neutral the character is.
I disagree, the most I saw were people complaining that they made him too girly looking in the face which would imply that it wasn't that girly to begin with. I personally didn't see anyone actually think he was a girl untill Aonuma made that comment. Likewise, there's a good chance that what we saw is no longer there, they could have easily touched it up by now to make him look more like link.
 

PKrockin

Member
Quick search on the Direct thread. They were posted before Aonuma made that comment. Probably could find more in the thread for the Zelda reveal specifically.

Is it just me or does it look like we play as a girl in the new Zelda?
Who was that cool girl in the zelda teaser?
Was that a boy link or girl link?
Link looked sexy as fuck

Is he a dood? I can't tell
Is Link a female now, I seriously don't know?!
Was that a female main character? If so double-yes! You win.
 

Laughing Banana

Weeping Pickle
Since I already stated I was out before, I am jussst popping in for a quick say that holy shit you guys, you have been like crazily off-topic for a LONG while in this thread, hahaha

Someone should create a specific thread about this for further discussion, like maybe "Female Link in Zelda games, what do you think?" or maybe in broader terms like "Female-led characters in established game series."

Logging back out :p
 
Quick search on the Direct thread. They were posted before Aonuma made that comment. Probably could find more in the thread for the Zelda reveal specifically.
I'll concede than on this point, still I don't think it's enough justification to say Link in general is super girly just that whatever they were trying, most likely to replicste studio ghibli, ended up making him appear more female. I still expect for him to look more like his usual self when we see Zelda u though.
 

Ushojax

Should probably not trust the 7-11 security cameras quite so much
I'll concede than on this point, still I don't think it's enough justification to say Link in general is super girly just that whatever they were trying, most likely to replicste studio ghibli, ended up making him appear more female. I still expect for him to look more like his usual self when we see Zelda u though.

If by his usual self, you mean this:

latest

Then he still looks extremely feminine. It's part of his design ever since they moved to 3D.
 
I think you're missing the point.

No, I'm really not. The issue isn't whether they could write a female "Link" character into the series seamlessly, the issue is redesigning an iconic character for no good reason. This is exactly like Mario and Samus; they're all iconic characters with distinguishing characteristics. It's completely unnecessary.

Yes, every Link so far has been male. But he has been deliberately designed to be androgynous and quite feminine in appearance, like lots of elf characters in popular culture.

What utter nonsense.
 

Ushojax

Should probably not trust the 7-11 security cameras quite so much
What utter nonsense.

If you don't think Link is a deliberately androgynous character then I don't really know what to say. A Link with a beard would be much more bizarre to me than a Link with boobs.

There really isn't much difference between those three in terms of the way they look.
 
For those of you that say Link must be male, does Link also have to be white, with hair color staying within the current range?

I dont mind Link being female, main or spin off. Would be really cool. Now the race? As it think his blond/light brown elf chracteristics are a big part of his design I think it would break what makes him Link, at least on design (I wouldnt mind a darker tone skin Link if they kept a dark blond hair and the game was mainly placed on a big desertic area, with maybe a more arabic details kind of elf tunic).
And for example, i wouldnt mind a black James Bond (and again, would be really cool) because i dont think race or distinct facial features are part of his character.
But girl Link is A-ok because of how different timeline links and altarnate universes play with his and the world's designs.
And i wouldnt want a male Samus or a female Mario, again, because thats not how their chatacter work.
 
There really isn't much difference between those three in terms of the way they look.

This is disingenuous cherry picking. Link never looked androgynous in the art of the classic games, he sports broad shoulders and a flat chest in modern games like Twilight Princess, and Link was characterised as horny teenage boy in the 90s cartoon. One pretty faced Link in Zelda Musou doesn't even come close to backing up your revisionist history.

As an aside I'd absolutely lap up a Zelda game similar to the cartoon's setting with both Link and Zelda off on adventures together. Make them selectable Resident Evil style. Show the story from two angles. Everybody ends up happy.
 

NeonZ

Member
I disagree, Zelda or Ganon could easily be male or female, and they could still look similar, I don't really think Link is somehow more neutral than ganon or Zelda, and Linkle for example made the hair longer to make it appear more feminine, who's to say Zeldon can't do the same but instead make it shorter? Likewise, a prince character isn't all that different than a princess, so I still fail to see the issue, plus Ganon isn't the only green gerudo, kotake and Konume are green as well meaning that skin color isn't gender specific, thus you could still have a fem ganon.

A "prince" character wouldn't be wearing Zelda's dress, likely wouldn't have her long hair. His face would need to be changed too. In the end, you'd pretty much have a character with the same color pallet (and even the pink would likely need to be replaced by purple) but the entire design would need to be changed otherwise. Ganondorf suffers from the same issue. You mention the female Gerudos and that's exactly my point. If you design a female Ganondorf like them, she'd look entirely different from male Ganondorf, aside from her color pallet.

With a female Link, if we're using Koei's design, even her "longer hair" seems to be basically longer strands on the sides of her face. Note that Twilight Princess or HWs Link themselves have longer strands there than OoT's Link, for example. "Linkle's" would be even longer than HWs Link, but it's still not the type of change that even would change the characters' overall silhouette. She'd still be clearly recognizable.

Just wondering, did you also hate the addition of a female trainer option in FireRed/LeafGreen, especially with the way that she isn't even a character of her own and just outright replaced Red if you choose to play as a girl?
 

Enduin

No bald cap? Lies!
To elaborate further on my views against a Female Link and for a PC Zelda here goes.

When you turn Link into a girl, or even create a new separate Link-esque girl character to join/replace him, regardless of whether the lore supports it and all that nonsense, you are turning her sex into a selling point and defining characteristic. You are commodifying Female Link(le)'s sex. Which to me isn't acceptable nor desirable in the slightest.

"Hey whats this new Zelda game coming out about?" "Ohh Link's a girl this time."

Link being a girl won't just be a part of her character, but it will be her character. Her selling point. Everything will revolve around that central point. How is she different from Link, well she's a girl. You have original, default, Link and then you have off brand, female, Link. That's a poor relation between the two and not at all equal or progressive.

Link will always just be Link, free to be however they wish him to be, with no ulterior expectations or motivations due to his sex. While Female Link will, by very definition, be viewed, measured, designed and marketed by her sex first and foremost because that is her central defining feature she has in relation to the genuine article, Link. Whatever differences there are in her character, large or small, from how they act or how they play in game, it will all be viewed as a reflection and result of her being a girl first and foremost, if not only because.

On the other hand you have Zelda, who is a girl, but who has appeared and evolved over the span of 16 out 17 mainline Zelda games in one form or another, as well as most of the spin-offs and crossover titles. She is a known and developed individual, with her own personality, traits and features that generally stand on their own. If you make a future Zelda game with her as the player, then Zelda the character herself becomes the central selling point, not her sex. Though it will be factor, that much is certain, it won't be the only one or central one.

"Hey whats this new Zelda game coming out about?" "Ohh you play as Zelda this time, not Link."

She is a girl, but when people look at and talk about her and the game they will be looking at the character Zelda and not simply her sex in relation to everything. She will do things and be judged by people because of her personality and character traits, which people know and have been exposed to over the last 30 years. They will not expect or view the things she does simply because she is female, but because she is, and has always been, her own person.

Being an altogether different person removes the expectations that she be exactly like Link or not like him due to her sex. If she has an ability Link does not or does not have an ability Link does, it's not because she's a girl, but because she is Zelda. If she reacts in different ways and does things differently it's not because she's a girl, but because she is Zelda. She is free, as nearly as much as Link is, to be however they want her to be because as an established and separate character she is not beholden to some original mold. Where Female Link is a deviation of Link, Zelda is just Zelda.

Link is iconic, you cannot erase or ignore nearly 30 years and probably an equal number of appearances. It's not a matter of Link has to be a boy, fans won't accept it, or that you're damaging the brand if he's a girl or there are some serious lore issues preventing it, there aren't. Simply that you won't be able to break the relationship people have with him in their minds and how this new female Link will be viewed because of it.

Even if the narrative and characterization was drastically increased in future titles to allow for more character development so a female Link could display a stronger and more defined personality she will still always be viewed as Female Link, an offshoot and deviation from the real Link. Defined by her relationship and origination from Link and the main difference between the two, her sex. Plus such a change would be because she's a girl, which would bring comparisons to how for 30 years Link didn't deep characterization or narrative to define him, but a Female Link does or else all she'll be viewed as is a female variant.

You can spend all the time you want debating the justification and in universe Lore as to why or why not a female Link can be done but you will never be able to turn back time and erase the history of the last 30 years, nor gender roles/dynamics in general, and put her on equal footing with Link in people's mind and perceptions.

With Zelda at least you have a real fighting chance to do something interesting and unique that can stand on its own merits.
 
I think the reincarnation thing allows for this sort of thing to happen more logically in-universe. You can't really just have a choice between a Male or Female Samus in the Metroid games due to the characterization, but I could see a future Zelda game give you a choice between a Male or Female Link just because it wouldn't affect anything lore wise.
I think the best possible road to take is simply to make Link androgynous. He was created to be a player avatar, but I reckon that Nintendo don't want to allow players to created their own character, so I feel like making it up to the player to decide its gender is the best route.
 
Of course you could always have a Zelda-centric game or something, but I also don't see why people dislike the idea of having a male and female option especially when the lore has a convenient reincarnation excuse if you really care about the canon.

There are enough Links and Zeldas for it to be statistically significant that they will always reincarnate as the same gender. Even if it's not explicitly said.

The legend of Zelda : 1
The Adventure of Link (unconcious zelda, not the same one as in LoZ) : 2.
Link to the Past(/Seasons/Ages): 3.
Ocarina of time : 4
Four swords: 5.
Wind Waker/Phantom Hourglass: 6.
Four Swords adventures: 7.
Minish cap: 8.
Twilight princess: 9.
Spirit Tracks: 10.
Skyward Sword: 11.
Link Between Worlds: 12

So 12 Zeldas. 13 if you count hilda. 14 if we also count hyrule warriors.

Plus the reincarnations of link
Loz:/Aol :1.
LTTP/LA/Oracle of Ages/Seasons. :2.
OoT/MM: 3.
Four swords: 4.
WW/PH: 5.
Four Swords Adventures: 6.
Minish Cap: 7
Spirit Tracks: 8.
Skyward Sword: 9.
Link Between worlds: 10
+1 more if you count hyrule warriors. (LBW spoiler)
+another one if you count ravio
.

Say it's a 50:50 chance of being male or female, for it to happen that both of them end up in the same gender every time 14+12 =26 times across multiple timelines and dimensions is 0.5^26=0.000000015 (0.0000015%), or a 1 in 66million chance of that happening that way by accident.

Or the goddess and her chosen hero always reincarnate that way on purpose. Hmm. I know which way I prefer to bet with those odds.

This is all a lot of circular arguments when making Zelda the player character would allow the gameplay to change AND keep virtually everyone happy.

I think the reincarnation thing allows for this sort of thing to happen more logically in-universe. You can't really just have a choice between a Male or Female Samus in the Metroid games due to the characterization, but I could see a future Zelda game give you a choice between a Male or Female Link just because it wouldn't affect anything lore wise.

If we're going to make silly assumptions about things that could happen despite anything suggesting otherwise, sure, we can think up something for mario and Samus to take the opposite genders.

Mario grabs a double cherry type item that goes wrong and spawns female mario. Then the "male" mario dies. There we go, female mario. Hell, it doesn't even have to be "going wrong". Just have an item in universe that causes permenant gender change. There are enough magic items that can do anything in Mario that happening is reasonable.
Between games the galactic federation mandates that all people using armoured suit shave to be male and if female undergo gender reassignment. There we go, male samus.

I'm going to get destroyed for this post aren't I
 

Enduin

No bald cap? Lies!
I'm going to get destroyed for this post aren't I
It's just pointless semantics that really don't mean anything though. Nintendo can do whatever they want canon be damned. In-game lore, history, universal laws don't mean anything if they want to do it and there's always a loophole they can come up with if they so desire. That said they could make a Female Link no problem. The lore allows for it quite easily even if the math doesn't support it. The issue/question though is what does that change bring, what does it represent and is it really needed?

Link is a proxy for the player, not the player themselves. He's a character as much as any other. The whole in-game justification of reincarnation etc etc is just a device to allow them to use the same characters over and over in new scenarios and settings, with then the timeline and all those connections just as fan service and brand building. People put far too much stock into this stuff like it actually seriously matters.

Link is no different from Samus or Mario. None of them have particularly deep characterization within the games themselves. But they've all been around for nearly 30 years and have appeared in a plethora of games. Who they are, as little as they may or may not be, is pretty well ingrained in people's minds. But more importantly their sex/gender does not prevent most players from connecting or relating with them or the games they are in. There is no need to bridge any kind of gap that their current forms are prohibiting.

You can argue though that these characters do prevent certain experiences/scenarios though by virtue of their gender, at least for Mario and Link, but changing their sex wouldn't really help that. Since the issue isn't about the player connecting/relating to the characters then it's about representation and portrayal in media. Which in that case then genderswapping existing male characters is about as poor a way to solve that issue as you can get.

To change their sex would result in an inherently lesser version of them that would be mainly characterized by their sex/gender, unlike the original. Boy or Girl, though it's obvious female depictions would have the tougher time of it. They will always be compared to and viewed in relation to their original version based on their sex instead of as an independent character of their own. Especially so because none of these games have deep characterization and narratives, so there's really little in the way of expanding on them beyond those initial traits. In the case of Female Link or Mario and Male Samus, their sex.

So not only is the sex change unnecessary because their current depictions present little to no issues for players to connect with them, it's also reductive since changing their sex/gender would result in highlighting that trait above all others rendering the change pointless and counterproductive.

If you want do something use an existing character within the series. Let Peach be a player character in the mainline Mario titles again and give her own mainline style game, not just some small side adventure, and let's her shine. If you want a female player character in Zelda use Zelda. Show some growth and depth to them we haven't had the chance to see before due to the nature of their traditional roles within the series.

If you're just changing established male characters into female ones you're basically saying it's fine to have a female character, as long as they have all the traits and characteristics of the male original. And that the already present female characters, rather hyper so in these cases, like Zelda and Peach aren't any good and will never be capable of the starring role by virtue of their pronounced femininity. They're too girly, where the re-purposed male to female characters are masculine enough and not too feminine.

That or because they are girls now they'll feel obligated to gender them in unnecessary ways simply because they are girls and girls aren't boys. They'll need to have bows, and girly colors and shit. So you're pretty much screwed anyway you cut it. Dismissing and devaluing stereotypical female traits or you're excessively reinforcing them.

So really we should be calling for, and Nintendo should use, those already established female characters, subvert their roles in the franchise and do something interesting and meaningful with it.
 
If by his usual self, you mean this:



Then he still looks extremely feminine. It's part of his design ever since they moved to 3D.
Considering the bulging muscles, the broad shoulders and the straight as a board rectangle he has for his chest, that is absolutely not in anyway a female character. Likewise I think the issue here is that you're comparing Link to real world woman and are not accounting for the difference in anime characters eye size and head size, seriously find a pic of him next to Zelda and compare him to her, note things like the slope between his neck compared to how her neck slopes, compare where her eyes are on her face in comparison to her chin, then compare his hand size and feet size to her hand and feet sizes, in almost every regard I guarantee you that Link's features will be larger, which is not just nothing as in anime which is what Zelda is characters there is definitely a difference in how the female body is drawn compared to a male body.
If you don't think Link is a deliberately androgynous character then I don't really know what to say. A Link with a beard would be much more bizarre to me than a Link with boobs.
There really isn't much difference between those three in terms of the way they look.
This is actually a good example of what I'm talking about, compare for example how Impas face is more elongated and the shoulders are smaller compared to Link, it's small and unnoticeable but it's an obvious difference that highlights ones a man the other isn't, the biggest similarity is the eyes which ill concede that they've been really sharp with a lot of eyelashes since OOT, but I wouldn't equate eyelashes to the female gender.
A "prince" character wouldn't be wearing Zelda's dress, likely wouldn't have her long hair. His face would need to be changed too. In the end, you'd pretty much have a character with the same color pallet (and even the pink would likely need to be replaced by purple) but the entire design would need to be changed otherwise. Ganondorf suffers from the same issue. You mention the female Gerudos and that's exactly my point. If you design a female Ganondorf like them, she'd look entirely different from male Ganondorf, aside from her color pallet.

With a female Link, if we're using Koei's design, even her "longer hair" seems to be basically longer strands on the sides of her face. Note that Twilight Princess or HWs Link themselves have longer strands there than OoT's Link, for example. "Linkle's" would be even longer than HWs Link, but it's still not the type of change that even would change the characters' overall silhouette. She'd still be clearly recognizable.

Just wondering, did you also hate the addition of a female trainer option in FireRed/LeafGreen, especially with the way that she isn't even a character of her own and just outright replaced Red if you choose to play as a girl?
Linkle makes the hair longer that it's ever been and changes the whole shape to include a skirt, kneehigh boots, and a hood, a Zeldon could cut the hair a bit and change the dress without it ceasing to look like Zelda, same with Ganon as he isn't the only gerudo who's green so fem ganon could easily still look like ganon, in fact silhouette wise they'd all look a bit different so I fail to see the point in bringing that up.

Finally as for fire red, no I'm not against that change as,

-Red to me is not a character, none of the pk trainers are outside of the girls, as none of they're names are even set in stone at least I think.

-Every other game uses a different person for the girl so to me that's just a little mishap or whatever.
Well, you don't need a female ganondorf or male zelda in a universe of a female Link.
What's the difference? Why is one uneeded while the other is a necessity?
 

NeonZ

Member
Linkle makes the hair longer that it's ever been
You could say that TP Link's hair also was "longer than it ever was" though. That detail was never set in stone.

and changes the whole shape to include a skirt, kneehigh boots, and a hood,
It's just the same tunic but without the pants or tights. Up to the SNES, male Link himself had that kind of clothing in some artwork.

Yeah, now that I look at it, there's a hood on her tunic, but I don't see how that's very different from, say, TP and Skyward Sword Link having chainmails under their tunics, something no Link had before.

Really, the tight high boots are the only change that's really out of norm.

in fact silhouette wise they'd all look a bit different so I fail to see the point in bringing that up.

Link and Linkle would look "a bit different", the others would just look completely different, aside from colors and some clothing details.

Finally as for fire red, no I'm not against that change as,

-Red to me is not a character, none of the pk trainers are outside of the girls, as none of they're names are even set in stone at least I think.

-Every other game uses a different person for the girl so to me that's just a little mishap or whatever.
What's the difference? Why is one uneeded while the other is a necessity?

Red appears as a boss in Gold & Silver (and their remakes) and also Black & White 2. Yet, that didn't stop them from adding a female trainer option which just exists to... add a female option to the game, rather than being a character on her own.
 
You could say that TP Link's hair also was "longer than it ever was" though. That detail was never set in stone.
Actually it is kinda set in stone, as the only time they're really long are with versions of classic Link as in ALBW or ALttP, for all the modern games they're in the same average area, including the toon games, OOT was a bit shorter but I'm pretty sure on it's 3DS release, much like his face they went back and made it look more current.
It's just the same tunic but without the pants or tights. Up to the SNES, male Link himself had that kind of clothing in some artwork.

Yeah, now that I look at it, there's a hood on her tunic, but I don't see how that's very different from, say, TP and Skyward Sword Link having chainmails under their tunics, something no Link had before.

Really, the tight high boots are the only change that's really out of norm.
It's actually not the same tunic, Link's tunic seems to be one piece, whatever Linkle is sporting is separated by several pieces that when put together form a tunic, regardless though it changes the shape. Likewise for the hair it is much longer than anything even Zelda U, so it's pretty different, plus I mean it's not like Ganon or Zeldas hair lengths are set in stone, you could easily have fem ganon with short hair or male Zelda with long hair.

Also a hood is a radically different shape compared to a hat, meaning going off silhouettes Linkle would look pretty different.
Link and Linkle would look "a bit different", the others would just look completely different, aside from colors and some clothing details.
I think you're overestimating what it would take for these, admittedly terrible ideas, to look like their counterparts. Ganon doesn't need a beard to look like ganon and Zelda doesn't need a dress; if Link can be changed than so can Zelda and ganon.

Red appears as a boss in Gold & Silver (and their remakes) and also Black & White 2. Yet, that didn't stop them from adding a female trainer option which just exists to... add a female option to the game, rather than being a character on her own.
I still don't view Red as a character, and considering how leaf or whoever has never shown up again, that makes it kinda hard to get worked up over. It was one small weird mishap in a series who never has a set protagonist, that hardly compares to a series that's had the same protagonist since it started.
 
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