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[Wereroku]

My thoughts, exactly. Crystal D made a fantastic game (one of the best action/adventures ever, IMO), but no one is playing it because two huge companies made terrible decisions. Utterly depressing.

Actually looking through the NPD thread the guy Bish verified had actually also heard that CD had a hand in the exclusive deal happening as well.

That's what i heard too, the guy who told me said there will be other repercussions of that decision, so I'm waiting on that before I can deem it reliable.

So CD may be just as responsible as MS and SE.

I'm not sure if bish ever saw the post. The concept does make sense. CD are very close to MS. The last game they made for a non-MS console was on the PS2. All of their games last gen were developed for the 360 and ported to other platforms by Nixxes. They've also had exclusive marketing deals and DLC deals since them on MS platforms. So in some ways you could say they've been working up to this.

The original guy wasn't verified but AnthonypUK had heard the same thing.

 

[Nightengale]

I can't fathom out how anyone could have interpreted that as the game never coming to PS4, from the very outset it was clear to me that PC/PS4 versions would become reality, but how much later was a big question mark.

I wrote a chronology of why this whole deal pissed me off.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=185771957&postcount=2177

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Deal had a duration
I didn't buy the franchise
It's similar to Ryse and Dead Rising 3

People who can read between the lines can tell it's effectively a timed exclusive.

But they would not actually use the word "timed exclusive"

Don't forget that they only said it was 'Launching exclusively on Xbox, Holiday 2015' for quite a few months until they were so harangued that Spencer finally admitted that "the deal has a duration". It was a concerted effort to make fans think it was a permanent exclusive rather than timed.

 

[Fury451]

Honestly, I'm over ROTR.

Its to the point now where I dont think I'll even pick it up when it hits the PS4.

IF I do, it would need to be a damn good sale. And this from a guy who loved the reboot. Bought it on ps3, then again on PS4.

Pretty much feel the same, and I tripled dipped on the reboot. I didn't really get caught in any hype for Rise because I don't have a One and was waiting patiently for my turn, and delaying that for so long won't help things at all. Seems like it's really good if you liked the reboot, which I did thoroughly. Those sales are actually pretty upsetting though because I presume the fault will be pinned on te game or devs rather than a pretty baffling business deal.

They couldn't have picked a worse release window either; no idea why they thought it would have the selling power to compete with such big releases.

 

[mreddie]

Congrats Square and XBOX, you made a goof of the yearonly that rivals the Seahawks goof in SB 49.

PS Tomb Raider coming in summer I guess?

 

[sirap]

Yeah! CD's CEO really suffered from that deal.

There's no need for that. I'm talking about the developers who worked on this game. Dozens of modelers, animators, texture artists etc who put so much effort into the game, only for it to reach 1/3rd of the audience.

 

[Nightengale]

PS Tomb Raider coming in summer I guess?

Fall 2016.

If we assume there's a hard 12 months window, then no earlier than mid-November 2016.

Aka in between Call of Duty, Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, and other big AAA games.

Again.

 

[nakedeyes]

Man! Got a lot of hate here! So the news is actually about how, maybe, before anything was announced, there were internal discussions and deals that affect the release date?!

Get out!

I will agree all day that this IP has been severely mid handled. But, now the news is just about a possible cause for an exclusivity window we have known about for ages?? Sure! Sorry I stopped reading the OP after like 5 paragraphs and didn't find this incredible news.

 

[Pancake Mix]

So it was delayed so they could announce it and SE agreed because they didn't want to go up against Uncharted 4? Square Enix please, a year is a long time... May or June would have been an okay release month away from Uncharted and with little competition, no?

I love Tomb Raider 2013 so much

 

[Wereroku]

Fall 2016.

If we assume there's a hard 12 months window, then no earlier than mid-November 2016.

Aka in between Call of Duty, Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, and other big AAA games.

Again.

If they were going to delay to avoid UC4 in Q1 they should have gone for Q2 since they would have had no competition. Basically everyone making decisions around this game went collectively stupid for a few months.

 

[Chris1]

I can't fathom out how anyone could have interpreted that as the game never coming to PS4, from the very outset it was clear to me that PC/PS4 versions would become reality, but how much later was a big question mark.

Exactly.

The reveal might have been misleading, but after that it was clear as day... Come on, Phil literally came out and said the deal had a duration, how much more obvious do you want it to be? It's not like they're gonna announce a game for a competing platform..

Like I said in the other topic, SE are fucking idiots if this is true. Giving up an extra 6 months of exclusivity just to essentially reconfirm what Phil already said is stupid. The exclusivity deal is one thing, this is a complete different ballgame. I can't believe anyone that thought this part of the deal was a good idea is actually in charge of a multi million dollar company.

 

[FonkyByNature]

The game is great on Xbox One but i don't know a single person who has it who also owns an Xbox One. The game has sales fail all over it.

This deal went to shit big time and i still don't understand why Microsoft insists on having Tomb Raider associated with Xbox when the majority of people buy it on Playstation and the franchise has always been associated with Playstation.

I wish Microsoft creates a studio that makes those kind of action/adventure games instead of throwing money at a problem like they usually do.

 

[Nightengale]

There's no need for that. I'm talking about the developers who worked on this game. Dozens of modelers, animators, texture artists etc who put so much effort into the game, only for it to reach 1/3rd of the audience.

There's nothing wrong with games being exclusive and reaching a small audience imo.

But it's a problem if there's a risk that the deal affects the financial returns of the game and risk jobs.

 

[Niteandgrey]

My thoughts, exactly. Crystal D made a fantastic game (one of the best action/adventures ever, IMO), but no one is playing it because two huge companies made terrible decisions. Utterly depressing.

Amen. The 'Bone rarely gets used for anything in my house other than a media center. but I was excited enough for ROTR that I didn't want to wait to get it on PC or PS4 and I'm glad I didn't wait. It's a really fun game that deserves to be played whenever it finally releases on the other two platforms.

I think some people are forgetting that at the time when this deal was announced, it was pretty apparent that this was a desperation deal for Microsoft. It never made a whole lot of sense beyond that. Just a shame that they took an odd decision and then proceeded to execute on it so poorly. It's hard for me to blame Square/CD because I have little doubt that MS backed up a dump truck full of money to their offices.

 

[thekiddfran]

Sucks that the ones who suffer the most from this botched deal are the actual developers.

and the consumer

 

[nakedeyes]

Right, so you were wrong in your original post and then didn't read the op about the extra delay before announcement

What extra delay? There was only ever a single date announced. This news is simply a report on one of the reasons that date came to be.

I didn't get to the actual point in the OP, cause the OP didn't get to it for 5 fucking paragraphs, and the news, is so shallow you have to hunt for it in there.

My bad on commenting before fully reading the OP

 

[Kralamoonard]

Man! Got a lot of hate here! So the news is actually about how, maybe, before anything was announced, there were internal discussions and deals that affect the release date?!

Get out!

I will agree all day that this IP has been severely mid handled. But, now the news is just about a possible cause for an exclusivity window we have known about for ages?? Sure! Sorry I stopped reading the OP after like 5 paragraphs and didn't find this incredible news.

No, the "hate" (if you want to even call it that...) was just telling you read the damn OP because you attempted to backseat mod and claim that "This is non news. Don't really need the fucking block of disclaimer text for this."

Yeah, unfortunately, the world doesn't revolve around you mate; just because you don't find it news-worthy, doesn't mean others don't, and evidently, it was shocking news to many people, as you can see by reading all three threads.

Whether you find it interesting or not is irrelevant; it also shows an even further mishandling than what was already thought and clearly people want the insight. Nothing wrong with that.

What extra delay? There was only ever a single date announced. This news is simply a report on one of the reasons that date came to be.

I didn't get to the actual point in the OP, cause the OP didn't get to it for 5 fucking paragraphs, and the news, is so shallow you have to hunt for it in there.

Yeah, gosh, it's so hard to read that many paragraphs isn't it? The horror! How are we going to ever cope? (Perhaps reading the part where it says "here's the story" underline with borders around it can also help, but hey, reading is hard, right?)

We don't need you to tell us if the news is "shallow" or not. You don't get to decide that here bud.

Good day to you.

 

[Fury451]

Amen. The 'Bone rarely gets used for anything in my house other than a media center. but I was excited enough for ROTR that I didn't want to wait to get it on PC or PS4 and I'm glad I didn't wait. It's a really fun game that deserves to be played whenever it finally releases on the other two platforms.

I think some people are forgetting that at the time when this deal was announced, it was pretty apparent that this was a desperation deal for Microsoft. It never made a whole lot of sense beyond that. Just a shame that they took an odd decision and then proceeded to execute on it so poorly. It's hard for me to blame Square/CD because I have little doubt that MS backed up a dump truck full of money to their offices.

I read it as that too initially, but I was always confused as to why they picked Tomb Raider of all things- that was never going to be a system seller, and they turned out to not need it anyway within a couple months after announcing it by showing off some great things they had in the pipe. Granted the deal was probably made awhile before announcement, but it was and always has been a horizontal move for them IMO.

 

[Apathy]

I'm not sure if bish ever saw the post. The concept does make sense. CD are very close to MS. The last game they made for a non-MS console was on the PS2. All of their games last gen were developed for the 360 and ported to other platforms by Nixxes. They've also had exclusive marketing deals and DLC deals since them on MS platforms. So in some ways you could say they've been working up to this.

Thought one of the running theories was that CD were the ones that chased Microsoft and brokered a deal as it were and took it to SE. If that is true (which again, I am not sure), then the higher ups at CD will get some talking to/demotion/leaving of the company. Also, if true, it showed that CD had a lot of freedom and say about what they did, something I'm sure won't be true for long as SE would be keeping a much shorter leash on them from now on.

 

[black070]

What?? How is this even news? About a week after the XBONE exclusivity was announced, they caved and said Q1 2016 for PC, Q4 2016 for PS4. This has been known for a long time.

That's not true at all - it was announced as an Xbox exclusive at Gamescom in August 2014.

 

[Prototype-03]

What? Shouldn't have they just made it Xbox Exclusive if they don't want to compete with UC4? This is ridiculous... I hope they get this sorted out. It's a shame since the game is a blast to play.

 

[Kezen]

Because it took a few months before they ponied up and said so.

It took a few days.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-08-13-microsoft-confirms-rise-of-the-tomb-raider-xbox-exclusivity-deal-has-a-duration

Titanfall, Ryse, and Sunset all were announced exclusivity agreements and all only saw PC releases. Usually when something is timed, you get the announcement its coming to so and so first.

To my knowledge Sunset never released on PC but I get your point. Still, Tomb Raider unlike DR, Titanfall and Ryse has always been a multiplatform IP so PS4/PC versions were a sure thing. If you thought otherwise you did not pay enough attention.
They tried to avoid mentioning the possibility of the game hitting other platforms down the line but very quickly it was crystal clear it would happen. In fact right after Spencer the deal had a duration PC/PS4 versions were essentially confirmed.

No seriously anyone with a shred of intelligence knew the game would not remain exclusive to the Xbox ecosystem.

 

[dumbo]

Exactly.
The reveal might have been misleading, but after that it was clear as day... Come on, Phil literally came out and said the deal had a duration, how much more obvious do you want it to be? It's not like they're gonna announce a game for a competing platform..

Errr... that's hopelessly misleading.

The reveal said 'exclusive winter 2015' or whatever. That was then clarified to journalists at the meeting *and* in a direct statement issued by CD that it meant 'exclusive, period'... with the suggestion that fans on other platforms could buy the other tomb raider game instead.

It was only after continuous pressure that MS eventually stated that the deal had a duration.

To suggest that this was in any way acceptable by either company is total bull manure.
[with bonus points to CD for publishing "that" statement, and to MS for throwing windows gamers under the xbox bus]

 

[Pie and Beans]

What a terrible all round deal. "Yeah sure, you can mention those other versions now but the made up bullshit cost is you'll have to delay them even further!" Just no idea why you keep generating ill-will MS! None at all!

Also can ModBot perhaps cool it on canning actually interesting topics with reckless abandon? OP shouldnt feel the need to preface with 3 paragraphs of paranoid text just to get a pretty solid rumour/news into our eyes.

 

[nakedeyes]

That's not true at all- it was announced as an Xbox exclusive at Gamescom in August 2014.

I was wrong. Sorry! Still been available info since July, so hopefully the point still makes sense.

Unfortunately, I didn't read far enough into the OP to see that they were trying to talk about a potential reason for the delay, and not the delay itself, which has been known about for ages.

 

[Kralamoonard]

Also can ModBot perhaps cool it on canning actually interesting topics with reckless abandon? OP shouldnt feel the need to preface with 3 paragraphs of paranoid text just to get a pretty solid rumour/news into our eyes.

Ha, I was thinking for a while on when to make this thread in case I got banned or whatever because the lock didn't make any sense; so I just decided to preface it with 3 walls of text!

 

[Bruce Springsteen]

Will pick this up on PS4, used, can't support something like this at all, just a mess all the way around

 

[mreddie]

Fall 2016.

If we assume there's a hard 12 months window, then no earlier than mid-November 2016.

Aka in between Call of Duty, Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, and other big AAA games.

Again.

FFS so they can go though this...again!

 

[black070]

Will pick this up on PS4, used, can't support something like this at all, just a mess all the way around

Will be doing the same, as much as I enjoyed the first title (double dipped for the Definitive Edition day one) - I just can't support this whole ordeal.

 

[Espada]

Man, reading that one gets a sense of the kind of stupid going on at Square-Enix to think this deal was a good idea. The franchise was back and off to a very strong start with the reboot, but this basically broke ROTR's knees. And for what? The potential rewards really don't see worth the cost they had to pay.

When this launches on PS4 Holiday 2016 it's just going to get buried by COD, Assasin's Creed, and whatever other big games are out at that time.

 

[SolidSnakex]

I read it as that too initially, but I was always confused as to why they picked Tomb Raider of all things- that was never going to be a system seller, and they turned out to not need it anyway within a couple months after announcing it by showing off some great things they had in the pipe. Granted the deal was probably made awhile before announcement, but it was and always has been a horizontal move for them IMO.

The first reason is that they wanted to combat Sony's biggest exclusive for 2015, which was supposed to be Uncharted 4. TR would've gone head to head with it this holiday. But of course that was delayed. The other reason is because TR is big in Europe. And that's a territory that MS isn't that strong in. I don't think it was a coincidence that the exclusive announcement was made in Europe.

 

[black070]

 

[Plague Doctor]

well it makes sense for MS to want to sell more consoles with games that actually has the potential to appeal to a broader market like FO4 and they just said FU to SE/CD. It would piss off any developer.

Clearly FO4 has more appeal and that was the decision made. But, MS and SE/CD already took the brunt of the PR backlash for the murky deal, atleast support the game on par with the multiplatforms. Bundle it in with everything like Unity in 2014 (a hot mess of a game that had horrible word of mouth). None of that happened, and the most notable thing about the scenario is that its a positively reviewed game that got shafted upon release due to a lack of support, a crowded window, and negative backlash to a wonky deal.

I wrote a chronology of why this whole deal pissed me off.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=185771957&postcount=2177

Nailed it.

 

[DannyDanger]

I wrote a chronology of why this whole deal pissed me off.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=185771957&postcount=2177

This pretty much sums it up

 

[Niteandgrey]

I read it as that too initially, but I was always confused as to why they picked Tomb Raider of all things- that was never going to be a system seller, and they turned out to not need it anyway within a couple months after announcing it by showing off some great things they had in the pipe. Granted the deal was probably made awhile before announcement, but it was and always has been a horizontal move for them IMO.

Completely agree on all points. It seemed like a very odd IP to pair with their console. Never felt like a good fit. And yeah, ironic isn't it? When the title finally came out, the Xbone was already doing pretty well with a strong holiday library.

 

[Harmen]

The thing that makes me scratch my head the most is how the release was handled ultimately.

MS wanted to have an answer to UC4 and probably SE/CD got a shitton of money for it. But instead of being "THE" current blockbuster on the One next to PS4's UC4, it launched in complete silence, exclusively on a platform with many other major games marketed much better. Hell, MS themselves just released Halo 5 not long before it.

They did not even try to make the most out of this deal, which ultimately impacts TR's market potential in general (that is SE's problem) and is likely to negatively affect business relationships with SE for MS. And since SE is lining up for a wide range of major AAA games (Dues Ex, Hitman, FFVII-R, KHIII, FFXV), I'd say that is not a very smart decision. Furthermore, if this is how you handle a major gaming ip's exclusivity, that is not a good sign towards other major publishers.

 

[black070]

The thing that makes me scratch my head the most is how the release was handled ultimately.

MS wanted to have an answer to UC4 and probably SE/CD got a shitton of money for it. But instead of being "THE" current blockbuster on the One next to PS4's UC4, it launched in complete silence, exclusively on a platform with many other major games marketed much better. Hell, MS themselves just released Halo 5 not long before it.

They did not even try to make the most out of this deal, which ultimately impacts TR's market potential in general (that is SE's problem) and is likely to negatively affect business relationships with SE for MS. And since SE is lining up for a wide range of major AAA games (Dues Ex, Hitman, FFVII-R, KHIII, FFXV), I'd say that is not a very smart decision. Furthermore, if this is how you handle a major gaming ip's exclusivity, that is not a good sign towards other major publishers.

The exclusivity deal was made for all the wrong reasons - it seems all Microsoft wanted was an answer to Uncharted 4 this holiday season, and left it at that.

 

[eshwaaz]

Actually looking through the NPD thread the guy Bish verified had actually also heard that CD had a hand in the exclusive deal happening as well.

So CD may be just as responsible as MS and SE.

The original guy wasn't verified but AnthonypUK had heard the same thing.

Damn. I had no idea. That makes it even worse.

I'm talking about the developers who worked on this game. Dozens of modelers, animators, texture artists etc who put so much effort into the game, only for it to reach 1/3rd of the audience.

Seriously. These folks did just extraordinary work. My mouth was agape on so many occasions.

 

[Harlequin]

Uncharted and TR are very different games. I can understand the environmental similarities between Uncharted: DF and the original TR games, but they've both very much gone in their own directions since then.

Seems silly to have them trying to avoid each other all the time.

That was true before the Tomb Raider reboot. Now? Not so much.

 

[Gurish]

I know the game bombed miserably but I believe it will have some very good legs, yea obviously the deal was bad and everybody regrets it, but this game got a great word of mouth.

People didn't buy it when it was new during FO4 week, but after the great reviews and players responses, I think many people will eventually get it, even if they are waiting for a sale, I think there is enough audience for this franchise.

Even when it was treated badly, sooner or later SE will get to their target.

 

[Harlequin]

I can't fathom out how anyone could have interpreted that as the game never coming to PS4, from the very outset it was clear to me that PC/PS4 versions would become reality, but how much later was a big question mark.

People are stupid, especially on the internet. You have no idea how often I read comments on news articles by people who were convinced that the game was going to be a permanent Xbox exclusive long after Microsoft had confirmed that their deal with Square had "a duration".

 

[NotTheGuyYouKill]

Now I'm pissed again that I have to wait a goddamn year to play ROTR.

Loved the '13 game. Shitty Canadian dollar and me being at school full time means I'm not buying an X1 for a long while.

What a piss off.

 

[Lemondish]

Exactly.

The reveal might have been misleading, but after that it was clear as day... Come on, Phil literally came out and said the deal had a duration, how much more obvious do you want it to be? It's not like they're gonna announce a game for a competing platform..

Like I said in the other topic, SE are fucking idiots if this is true. Giving up an extra 6 months of exclusivity just to essentially reconfirm what Phil already said is stupid. The exclusivity deal is one thing, this is a complete different ballgame. I can't believe anyone that thought this part of the deal was a good idea is actually in charge of a multi million dollar company.

Well, a large part of the issue here is the difference between the "from the very outset" and "after Phil literally came out and said deal had a duration". These things did not happen "from the very outset". It happened a little while after and following several blatant attempts to obfuscate the truth.

 

[mreddie]

I know the game bombed miserably but I believe it will have some very good legs, yea obviously the deal was bad and everybody regrets it, but this game got a great word of mouth.

People didn't buy it when it was new during FO4 week, but after the great reviews and players responses, I think many people will eventually get it, even if they are waiting for a sale, I think there is enough audience for this franchise.

Even when it was treated badly, sooner or later SE will get to their target.

Seeing what's coming in the next 3 months...I doubt it.

 

[Ray Down]

I wrote a chronology of why this whole deal pissed me off.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=185771957&postcount=2177

Really sums the situation up.

 

[M°°nblade]

What a terrible decision to release the PS4 version around the same time THIS game will happen.

 

[Lemondish]

The first reason is that they wanted to combat Sony's biggest exclusive for 2015, which was supposed to be Uncharted 4. TR would've gone head to head with it this holiday. But of course that was delayed. The other reason is because TR is big in Europe. And that's a territory that MS isn't that strong in. I don't think it was a coincidence that the exclusive announcement was made in Europe.

It's almost as if they started out with a plan and then halfway through it they shit all over it, lit it on fire, and tossed it out the window.

Because if that was their goal, they probably could have done a better job of promoting the bloody thing. Like a bundle, or any sort of marketing in Europe.

 

[AndyD]

That was true before the Tomb Raider reboot. Now? Not so much.

This. The reboot was so much closed to Uncharted than to the original games.

That said it looks like all sorts of unfortunate decisions for such a renowned franchise. I'll get it on PC eventually, but highly unlikely to get it on PS4 if its out after UC4.

 

[wumster3000]

Is that suppose to make people feel better that want to play Tomb Raider? Some people feel that Tomb Raider is a better game.

I have played TR and enjoyed the hell out of it but I wish that this deal had never happened. It is taking away the positive aspects of the game. What a dumb deal. I don't want anything bad to happen to the people involved in making the deal, but someone should be held accountable for making this one.

 

[sora87]

Actually looking through the NPD thread the guy Bish verified had actually also heard that CD had a hand in the exclusive deal happening as well.



So CD may be just as responsible as MS and SE.

This seems so strange to me.