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Billion dollar travelling carnival orders one performer to give another a concussion

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Anth0ny

Member
The carnival is more commonly know as WWE.

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Bolded the important bits, but here's the entire story if you're curious why we're looking at the above images, yet also dealing with a "fake" sport.

Via Dave Meltzer from The Wrestling Observer:


Randy Orton suffered a concussion, which was hidden by WWE and all concerned, in his 8/21 SummerSlam match with Brock Lesnar from taking the hard elbows to the forehead that busted him up.

Orton still wasn’t able to be cleared to compete and missed his Backlash match with Bray Wyatt. He did work his first match since the injury the next night on a house show in Fairfax, VA, where he teamed with John Cena against Wyatt & Erick Rowan. But in that match, Cena did almost all the wrestling, and Orton was limited to a hot tag. Orton had his leg all taped up to sell the angle done at the PPV. He took no offensive moves from his opponents, and only took one bump. But he did deliver his RKO finisher, a relatively safe move but still a bump, both in doing a run-in at Backlash and for the finish on Wyatt in Fairfax. It is not clear if he was cleared medically to compete the next day or the decision was made, similar to the last several matches of Daniel Bryan’s career in the U.K., to just have him work a finish and do one big move. He also did only an RKO on Erick Rowan at the Smackdown tapings on 9/13 in Philadelphia.

Orton is still advertised for the 9/24 house show in Chicago with Lesnar.

This entire situation opened up a hornet’s nest of problems. The first is, with the benefit of hindsight, the decision to have Orton sit and take the live shots to the head makes no sense in this day and age. Older wrestlers will note that planned hard way juice, while not a regular occurrence, was also not a foreign concept in wrestling in another era. Usually the hard ways were more to deliver a black eye or heavy bruising that would be visual on television, giving the sense of reality to the program and for building returns. In this case, since Lesnar had no high profile dates, just the 9/24 house show in Chicago that isn’t even likely to be promoted outside the market, there was really no follow-up. If anything, it appeared the main follow-up was going to be Lesnar with Shane McMahon (which also hasn’t been mentioned in storyline on any show the past two weeks) and not with Orton. Orton did no strong promo challenging Lesnar, and if anything, treated the beating as an “Oh well,” and Lesnar hasn’t even been back on television since.

In this case, the idea was to end SummerSlam with confusion, and having people wonder what was and wasn’t real. And that goal was accomplished. Vince McMahon created a scenario where people didn’t really know what happened. Sure, deep down few thought Lesnar “shot” on Orton. It was more a question as to was Orton accidentally injured and did they stop the match early, or was that the scripted ending. And since nobody in the ring but Orton and Lesnar (and likely Paul Heyman outside it) knew the answer, the officials didn’t react in a normal fashion, leading some in the audience to wonder if something went wrong. People did leave the building confused, and a lot of them leaving the building felt they got an unsatisfying ending, although pro wrestling sometimes has to do unsatisfying endings as part of its storytelling and building future matches. Did it build Lesnar into a bigger monster? Perhaps so. It didn’t do Orton any favors, but he’s established long enough where it didn’t hurt him either.

Fans, and even media, didn’t fully understand what they had just seen because it didn’t look like standard pro wrestling. If you’re going to do blood, a blade job is safer, but it’s also harder to defend because with a blade job, the promoter ordered a guy to cut his forehead with a razor blade. While for long-time pro wrestling fans, that’s just standard for the business, for sponsors and people who aren’t fans of another era, it sounds barbaric. Yes, it is far less barbaric than what was done, but the idea was to give plausible desirability that the rare heavy blood was just an accidental of hard physical activity as opposed to something actually planned out. The idea was that only a few would know, and perhaps the only reason the full story got out was a combination of just how bloody it was, and the backstage situation with Lesnar and Chris Jericho.

But the business is filled with risky physicality. Concussions happen. Injuries are frequent. Because Orton was injured, the scenario comes across far worse than if it had gone as planned, but even as planned, the risk was very different from the usual risks of pro wrestling.

The second stage of this is impossible to defend. The WWE was aware Orton had a concussion, and covered it up. Orton, likely to protect the company, also downplayed his injuries, even to friends and co-workers who were not aware of this. He was pulled from house shows, but was at television and kept from anything physical.


However, the WWE was promoting Orton vs. Wyatt the entire time. The company knows full well that the time line for recovery from a concussion is impossible to predict. It could be a few days. It could be a few weeks. It could be a few months. There is no way to defend the company for promoting a PPV match with a concussed wrestler when they had no way at all of knowing whether he’d be able to perform. If they’d have gone on television and at least told the situation, that it’s touch and go and he’s hoping to wrestle, it would be one thing. The fact is the scenario with Wyatt vs. Kane was something planned as a backup for some time, so they were fully aware from the start. Worse, after he was checked out before Backlash that day, and it was ruled that he would not be able to do the match, the WWE not only hid that from the audience, but continued to heavily promote the match on social media hours after the reports were already out that he was off the show, as well as during the pregame show.

The storyline created was that early in the PPV, they showed Wyatt slamming a door on Orton’s ankle to injure him to where he couldn’t wrestle. Kane was the replacement. It was made into a no DQ match. At the finish, Orton showed up and delivered an RKO on Wyatt to lead to Kane getting the pin.

According to one doctor who is a concussion expert and some wrestlers who know the bump, they questioned allowing a wrestler not cleared to deliver an RKO.

Bret Hart, whose career for all real purposes ended due to a concussion, said, “Absolutely, he shouldn’t take any falls. The impact of any bump will pose problems. The brain is usually swollen and can’t be banged about.”

While WWE can defend itself for usage of the Impact testing of Dr. Joseph Maroon as its guideline, and other sports use it as well, it’s well known in football how to cheat on those tests. That’s not saying Orton did, but there may be better systems to use. A lot of that becomes political in the sense WWE’s head of medical is the guy who was at the forefront of the program they use. But it does feel like WWE may be behind on the curve on the nature of its testing. Even so, there is obviously something, if not many things wrong with how this was handled.

I think this is absolutely disgusting in a day and age where concussion awareness is so high. This is even the case in WWE itself, where a number of moves have been banned due to potential head injuries they could cause, AND certain performers, like Daniel Bryan, have been forced to retire due to continued concussions.

Yet they tell one of their performers to legitimately take down his opponent and punch him in the head 10 or so times in an attempt to draw blood. This was PART OF THE PLAN. What's worse, almost no one (people back stage, referees IN THE RING) were informed that this was how the match was going to end.

It's barbaric imo.

What do you think? Should WWE be able to get away with this kind of shit? Especially in 2016?
 

Indelible

Member
This is pretty fucked up, I have no idea why Vince would think this is a good idea. It was a shitty way to end the PPV and I highly doubt it will lead to more viewers.
 
Covering up concussions on athletes/performers is always awful but other than that I find the story hard to parse as presented. Read through most of it too
 
It's absurd. You can't use a sterile blade to get a messy, but safe cut. But feel free to pound someone in the head with your elbow until they need 13 staples and get a concussion. And he can get away with it because he's BRRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOCK LEEEEEEEEEESSSSNAR!

I get the draw of Brock working stiff. But he was able to squash John Cena and still look like a monster with nothing but suplexes. Orton's injury was disgusting, not compelling.
 

Stat!

Member
I still don't see how Lesnar vs Orton benefited anyone. We know Brock is a beast. He beat Cena and Undertaker. Beating up Orton doesn't really help him, let alone drawing blood.

Less than a month later, that match means nothing. Not like Orton has had a redemption tour or Lesnar is in a new feud.
 

Anth0ny

Member
Covering up concussions on athletes/performers is always awful but other than that I find the story hard to parse as presented. Read through most of it too

Basically:

-In August at Summer Slam, Brock Lesnar and Randy Orton had a wrestling match. Wrestling is predetermined. they aren't really trying to kill eachother out there. In fact, they're trying to protect each other.

-The way the match was planned to end, as discussed before the match with the two performers, was that Brock was to take down Randy and give him REAL shots to the head in order to bust him open. This was the decision of Vince McMahon, the booker of WWE. This never happens, SINCE WRESTLING IS FUCKING FAKE. But, as you can see in the OP, it did, in fact, happen.

Try to imagine an actor being told by a director to legitimately beat the shit out of his fellow actor in a fight scene. They could use blood packs or other forms of movie magic to get the same/similar effect, but... opt not to, for unknown reasons, at the risk of the performers well being.
 

sakipon

Member
As long as everyone involved agree to the plan, then I'm not sure if there's an issue. I wouldn't risk my health like that for a million dollars but well, people are different.
 

Fluvian

Banned
They have to do stuff like this to make Lesnar interesting, without Heyman he would be nothing but a juiced up middle aged man, fuck him, good on Randy Orton for taking a bump like this though, the guy is a fucking trooper.
Lol on a lighter note Chris Jericho had no idea it was a work and confronted Lesnar backstage about it, seriously got in his face and shouted at Brock Lesnar, Lesnar apparently said "are you gonna kiss me or fight me?". Jesus it would have been amazing if Jericho kissed him.
 

Cuburt

Member
Good title.

Got me to click and then laugh.

Lesnar is wack ever since I'd see him doing MMA where he'd just lay on guys half his size and elbow them until the ref calls the fight.
 

Fluvian

Banned
How bad are the ratings at the moment?

Lowest in like 20 years, the network is doing well though, gets way more subs everytime they do a free month. The biggest problem with WWE is that their failing to make stars that bring casuals in, that's why they have to give dickheads like Lesnar free reign to keep him around.
 

siddx

Magnificent Eager Mighty Brilliantly Erect Registereduser
Since I first watched it I thought the match finish was pointless, poorly done, and benefited absolutely nobody. This just doubles down on that for me. Stupid fucking choice that should have never happened. Really tired of wwe giving some barely invested par timer wins in such a overwhelming way that it makes everyone else look weak and pathetic. Especially if those wins result in serious and preventable injuries.
 

Fluvian

Banned
WWE need to seriously start thinking about downsizing and focusing solely on the niche hardcore fans, get rid of the bodybuilders and part timers and make a god damn wrestling show
 

Anth0ny

Member
As long as everyone involved agree to the plan, then I'm not sure if there's an issue. I wouldn't risk my health like that for a million dollars but well, people are different.

I'm pretty sure the concussion wasn't a part of the plan. My title was kinda tongue and cheek if it wasn't obvious :p

I'm ASSUMING the plan was for Brock to "safely" bust him open hardway. which is fucking insane. obviously he hit him a little too stiff because he fucking concussed him. Orton was even advertised for this Sunday's PPV, but didn't pass the concussion test and had to sit out for the night.
 

Rellik

Member
Wasn't cleared to wrestle yet he came in and did an RKO, a move where he can land on the back of his head, after a concussion? Someone is bullshitting or the WWE are idiots who don't listen to their own concussion tests because if you're not cleared, you can't do ANYTHING physical.
 

Luschient

Member
The whole thing with Jericho backstage is pretty funny. He would've gotten the absolute shit beat out of him if he legit tried to fight Lesnar.
 
Basically:

-In August at Summer Slam, Brock Lesnar and Randy Orton had a wrestling match. Wrestling is predetermined. they aren't really trying to kill eachother out there. In fact, they're trying to protect each other.

-The way the match was planned to end, as discussed before the match with the two performers, was that Brock was to take down Randy and give him REAL shots to the head in order to bust him open. This was the decision of Vince McMahon, the booker of WWE. This never happens, SINCE WRESTLING IS FUCKING FAKE. But, as you can see in the OP, it did, in fact, happen.

Try to imagine an actor being told by a director to legitimately beat the shit out of his fellow actor in a fight scene. They could use blood packs or other forms of movie magic to get the same/similar effect, but... opt not to, for unknown reasons, at the risk of the performers well being.

Wow that just seems dumb. Like it's horrible and unforgivable but honestly what's the upside? What do you really gain in actually hurting someone in that manner versus faking it or going for real damage but less, you know not a freakin concussion
 

Anth0ny

Member
Wow that just seems dumb. Like it's horrible and unforgivable but honestly what's the upside? What do you really gain in actually hurting someone in that manner versus faking it or going for real damage but less, you know not a freakin concussion

The upside is making Brock look tough. Even though he's barely on WWE programming (his contracts says he only has to work like 9 days a year, as opposed to everyone else who is working 300 days a year) AND is already perceived by audiences to be the toughest guy on the roster by far.

So yeah, no upside. Just dumb.
 

Entropia

No One Remembers
WWE need to seriously start thinking about downsizing and focusing solely on the niche hardcore fans, get rid of the bodybuilders and part timers and make a god damn wrestling show

Smackdown on Tuesdays my friend.

Also that title is A+
 
Somebody needs to find a way to get rid of Vince. It's pretty clear the current leadership have no clue how to connect to today's audience if they think pure savagery will drag people in.
 
The spot was dumb as fuck but lots of spots are dumb. If they wanted to bust someone open for reals they should have thought of a cleaner way then having big dumb Brock beat the other guy with his big dumb elbow over and over.


But The real big dumb thing is they have Randy doing dark matches when he isnt fit for work. He is just doing a few basic spots and RKOing people but still....

Thats WWE for ya. Maybe they will change the concussion policy around Randy like they changed their drug policy around him.


Wonder if the ex wrestlers currently suing WWE for concussion related issues will get wind of this.
 

Heroman

Banned
Shit, it was common sense to be cautious and wait.

The very first thing I thought was "probably a murder suicide, hope they don't do a tribute until that's ruled out".
Murder suicide isn't what most of their audience thought of . Should they have waited sure but they did it without knowing what Pegasus kid did.
 

Ploid 3.0

Member
Very interesting title. Had me imagining a Cirque Du Soleil type high end act traveling from city to city. Pretty accurate title in the end.
 

Clegg

Member
Vince thought beating someone bloody was less savage than having a wrestler quickly slice a small blade across their forehead to bleed.

The mind boggles.
 

Hex

Banned
Way to fill the op with horse shit.
There was no "give him a concussion", it was bust him open and make it look like a shoot.
Period.
Busting someone open with elbows is very easy without concussion, many MMA fighters go to it because blood is dramatic for the judges.
The concussion that is rumored was an unfortunate side effect of Brock being a little zealous and just a big slobbering brute.
It was covered up because they did not know the extent of it and thought that Orton would have been cleared before the last ppv.

Blade jobs are obvious, and just stupid and can go badly too.
This is a thread full of people looking for an excuse to hate on something running wild.
 

Bandini

Member
Way to fill the op with horse shit.
There was no "give him a concussion", it was bust him open and make it look like a shoot.
Period.
Busting someone open with elbows is very easy without concussion, many MMA fighters go to it because blood is dramatic for the judges.
The concussion that is rumored was an unfortunate side effect of Brock being a little zealous and just a big slobbering brute.
It was covered up because they did not know the extent of it and thought that Orton would have been cleared before the last ppv.

Blade jobs are obvious, and just stupid and can go badly too.
This is a thread full of people looking for an excuse to hate on something running wild.

Daniel-Bryan-Angry-Eye-Roll.gif


What a truly awful post. You're defending a company that decided to bust open one of their top performers hard way in 2016. Comparing a scripted fight to MMA, where the fighters are actually trying to protect themselves and not stick to a script, is beyond ridiculous.
 

thefro

Member
Wow that just seems dumb. Like it's horrible and unforgivable but honestly what's the upside? What do you really gain in actually hurting someone in that manner versus faking it or going for real damage but less, you know not a freakin concussion

They can tell sponsors it was an "accident" if they complain about the blood.
 
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