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[HeisenbergWW62]

I don't believe that the problems with Xbox are entirely Phil's fault, in many ways it's the higher ups at MS. It's definitely starting to show that he isn't a good head of Xbox, just comparatively better than Don Mattrick. In some ways

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Yeah, I think ultimately it's pretty difficult to look at MS's moves and say that the problem is people within Xbox -- versus issues above their heads in terms of what MS wants to commit resources to.

This is how I see it. I work in a position that is in between middle and high in a billion dollar corporation and when it comes down to it...budgets get reallocated, different departments/teams win out, priorities are constantly shuffled, etc...

My guess is the priority with the XBOX brand is solely around Live services and converting them into paying subscribers to whatever other service and make them windows users, etc... I think the sales of an xbox home console are a nice to have but they're going to try to do it without ever breaking the bank.

Unless Phil can find himself on the winning end of one of those priority shifts/budget fights.

 

[bidguy]

Wtf they said they were given the option and choose Gears to go with a safe option and more guaranteed future. In hindsight probably a good idea with MS's luck launching new IPs so far.

i dont believe that shit for a second. cboat mentioned the game was in a playable state and looked really good.

plus why would these guys put their own game aside to work on someone elses ?

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

I wonder how much power he really has.

If his reply to my tweet a month or so ago is any indication. Plenty. He said he "won't pull the higher ups card" when I insinuated his hands were tied.

If we take him at his word there, then he's full of shit here.

 

[Alchemist]

Microsoft take risks, lol. That will be the day.

 

[jelly]

They probably blew their budget on EA deals, wasn't that like a billion? NFL and the original IP like Sunset, Quantum Break, Ryse. Flop city. Had moderate success with Ori, Forza, Halo.

I can't fault them for not trying but it seems the brakes have been put on. Have they shifted strategy after the failures and want to do better with IP or are they regressing to their Forza, Halo, Gears pillars as services instead of risking new IP?

 

[family_guy]

The question is who will really want to work with you to deliver exclusive games?

 

[Crayon]

Interesting there seems to be more backlash with Phil Spencer over Scalebounds cancellation than actually shuttering Lionhead.

I wonder if its a result of cumulative actions, or just GAF think more of P* than they did Lionhead

That was a somewhat big deal but between the timing among rumors of pro and Scorpio, and the fable game looking bad, it blew over.

Everyone has a favorite developer that met this fate, tho. Mine was FASA.

 

[Jotaka]

Someone need to update the Spencer Effect chart.

Do you remember this?

 

[hydrophilic attack]

Wtf they said they were given the option and choose Gears to go with a safe option and more guaranteed future. In hindsight probably a good idea with MS's luck launching new IPs so far.

just saying from everything i've heard about how working for microsoft is, that "decision" that was given to them may not have felt all that free. i would have been scared shitless to lose my job if i were in that position and chose the "wrong" answer

 

[jayu26]

I don't know guys, Scorpio is kind of a risk.

 

[Boke1879]

Oh I agree, its not a good sign. Same thing with 343 just becoming a Halo factory.



I think its a couple things. Lionhead had been on a downward trend for a while and things like Fable 3, Fable Kinect, and Fable Legends had really alienated the fan base. Then pair that with this becoming a disturbing trend of MS shuttering publicly revealed projects down and I think people are becoming increasingly unhappy with the way things are going down.

This is exactly what it is. Shuttering many already revealed projects and then you look at this year and there really isn't much on the horizon.

 

[Alucrid]

Dead Rising 5 coming next year

 

[Kenzodielocke]

Killzone is not Halo and Sony is not MS. By that logic why doesn't Treyarch try their hand at an RPG or action adventure game? I mean Rockstar has had great success making various games. So why not Treyarch?

Acitivision and Rockstar don't sell consoles. I think the situation is comparable. But as I said, I kinda accepted how MS is and that I will continue to half ignore them, until I see otherwise.

 

[Bronetta]

Holy crap the one on the right is killing me.

MOAR.

Ask and ye shall receive

 

[Nikana]

i dont believe that shit for a second. cboat mentioned the game was in a playable state and looked really good.

plus why would these guys put their own game aside to work on someone elses ?

Hasn't cboat been wrong many times before. Wasn't he the guy that said a lot of stuff about Titanfall that was just flaout out made up? Or was that someone else?

 

[Fat4all]

I don't know guys, Scorpio is kind of a risk.

Seems more like a necessity to stay relevant/current.

 

[Trago]

All of their risk taking in terms of games publishing this gen has been through second party partnerships. They funded a bunch of new IP's this generation, some hit, some missed.

It's very clear that first party is gonna be stuck on the same franchises, so when it comes to new stuff, we'll pretty much have to look at their second party releases. I'm still bummed about Scalebound, but if they keep up with new second party IP's, then it's better than nothing I guess.

 

[EGM1966]

To be honest it increasingly feels like Xbox Division and Spencer is particular are less able to execute on their promises than is ideal. Spencer definitely talks a good fight, but I feel the actual delivery lags some way behind.

He's stabilized the division for sure but the actual delivery on many promises has been low IMHO. Speaking of diversity of gaming experiences and taking risks does feel particularly hollow right now as I'd argue MS lags far behind Nintendo and Sony at this point in terms of actual games released that would fit that bill.

The intent may be there but I feel if more results don't surface soon the general feeling that there's more talk than action is going to grow.

 

[Alienous]

Dead Rising 5 coming next year

Another smart funding choice. It'll be great right next to State of Decay 3.

 

[Hugh Swank]

I love all the people busting Spencer's balls...lol. You do realize he could just say nothing...right? He has no obligation to talk to fans on Twitter. He could just leave that to Larry & Greenburg. I give him props for responding to people.

 

[Outrun]

But... Scalebound was the risk foo

... That did not pan out....

 

[Obliterator]

They probably blew their budget on EA deals, wasn't that like a billion? NFL and the original IP like Sunset, Quantum Break, Ryse. Flop city. Had moderate success with Ori, Forza, Halo.

God I forgot about that NFL Deal they made back when it was "TV! TV! TV!"

$400 million dollars. Imagine that invested into 1st party software instead.

 

[Neonep]

Dead Rising 5 coming next year

I wish Capcom would make that team do something else.

 

[Cess007]

(..) Bring Back perfect dark (..).

I won't lie. If they made a new Perfect Black, I would be buying the goddamn Scorpio the same day that PD launched.

Ask and ye shall receive

LMAOOOOOOOOO. Best one so far lol

 

[jayu26]

Seems more like a necessity to stay relevant/current.

So a necessary risk...

 

[Goose_Se7en]

Am I the only one that believes Scorpio will be the launch of Phill's actual run Xbox head. I mean, yes he was on the team for the Xbox one, but he wasn't the head.

He was made chief only three years ago, closer to 3 and a half.

He is still cleaning up what Mattrick did. Green lighting new games and studios take serious time. I'd expect his vision is just now finally getting ready to be shown

Just my thoughts

I agree that with Scorpio, Spencer and Co. can use that to launch the Xbox division in his vision but he needs the backing and investment of MS to deliver the games. It's the "video games business" not tv or sports or Kinect or Windows 10. They need stronger 1st and 2nd party support. For now they have enough market share that 3rd parties still publish their games on the box, but even so notable 3rd party games have been missing from the platform or have come after a Ps4 release, Nier Automata and Firewatch being examples respectively.

He needs to come out and say these are the 1st party games we're working on, Halo, Gears, Forza and this new IP and these developers are working on them etc.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

If his reply to my tweet a month or so ago is any indication. Plenty. He said he "won't pull the higher ups card" when I insinuated his hands were tied.

If we take him at his word there, then he's full of shit here.

I think he's just being a good sport and taking ownership of the issue. Which is the right thing to do, even if it aint his fault.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

Unless it is a multiplayer game which can be utilized for micro transactions, probably not going to happen. Xbox doesn't have the budget or the backing from the company to pull out a TLoU type of game, unless something changed VERY recently.

I don't understand what you're saying. You think The Last of Us had a bigger budget than Halo 5 or Gears 4?!

 

[sublimit]

He probably means that it's a risk to not make a Halo/Forza game every year.

 

[Strootman]

Gears 4 was not a a commercial hit. It under-performed to my knowledge, but they were given a choice to continue on shanghai or make gears.

lol you really believe this?

 

[RichiRamjag]

Many of us haven't been convinced by the 'Good Guy Phil' persona since the beginning. His statements are more and more hollow every time another game is cancelled and a studio shut down, and being nearly three years into his tenure as head of Xbox we should really be seeing the fruits of his efforts by now. I'm sure some people are excited for Scorpio, but new hardware is pointless without new software to showcase it.

Gotta agree. As someone who doesn't really become huge fans of individuals in the industry, I've always said that he just talks a good game. He says what folks want to hear, which is probably the norm and nothing Id hold against him. Wasn't going to pretend that he was the 2nd coming for the X1 like some folks online.

That said, I hope things do work out. I don't think he's malicious, just a bit stifled by the folks at the top.

 

[Fat4all]

So a necessary risk...

It'd be more of a risk to not release something new and just wait out the generation.

 

[Samurai G0SU]

Lmao oh man... i knew a thread would be made from his tweet barrage today.

We had 'heavy' discussions in the other ms thread

 

[Matt]

So a necessary risk...

In the same way that me leaving my house to go to work in the morning is a "necessary risk."

After all, I could be hit by a car!

 

[oti]

They wouldn't have that mindset if they were more open as a games division and havin diversity in their software library was part of their culture and message as a division.

They may have had many startups and projects behind the scenes get started only to have the MS corporate hammer to shut it down when they looked at cost.

Xbox division needs to just be its own thing and operate outside of it's big brother. If they could get a restart as a division with a big chunk of money to restructure the culture, studios, and people within xbox I THINK it would be for all the better. Just like how when Kaz took over things started to turn around not from a business perspective, but moral within the company, and look at where Playstation is now.

Comparing Sony with MS here makes no sense for several reasons. The truth here is we don't know or Microsoft's organizational structure. From what I've read over the years it's supposed to be a quite a hostile atmosphere between the divisions and they try to beat each other. Add in that I'm sure Microsoft wants to win at everything and beat the competition so they hate this console generation to no end.

To your suggestion with the independent funding and operation of the Xbox division, this sounds like fanfiction to me. In the greater picture Xbox might as well only exist to get Windows 10 in peoples' living rooms. The truth is there's no need for the expensive dedicated console market to achieve that goal. That's why I don't believe Xbox as we know it will be around for much longer if Scorpio fails. The way MS is talking up the machine it doesn't sounds cheap and I can't imagine the higher ups being eager to invest even more into the current Xbox brand.

 

[Jawmuncher]

I hope they got some big stuff to release this year, because their first party stuff is looking weak. I was really excited for scalebound this year, and it seemed poised to be their big launch of the year before the cancellation.

Seems like now their big push will be on Crackdown, and whatever Forza releases. Halo Wars 2 at this point feels like it's getting swept under the rug. Honestly surprised they're making a 2.

(I'm not counting any signed indies like cuphead, that's stuff cool. But I'm not counting it as their big 1st party stuff)

 

[FinaruDensetsu]

If his reply to my tweet a month or so ago is any indication. Plenty. He said he "won't pull the higher ups card" when I insinuated his hands were tied.

If we take him at his word there, then he's full of shit here.

I think you're being way too harsh.

His initial message to you was just him taking responsibility and not wanting to blame anyone else even if there is blame to throw around. That's what a leader does.

Saying he knows they need to take risks just means he knows. He probably hopes his bosses hear that too.

I don't see why he's full of shit.

 

[Kthulhu]

I like Spencer and the work he's done since Mattrick was shown the door but you've voiced something I've been wondering since this whole Scalebound thing went down.

I'm starting to feel like it's very little compared to PlayStation.

The Kinect was essentially an excuse to push the Hololens technology to a point where it was viable.

They've been following the same trends as Windows for better and for worse.

Play anywhere obviously wasn't their idea, nor was using the Windows store to sell games.

The list goes on. In some instances it's almost like they're on a leash.

 

[Moze]

Poor Phil. He is in a lose / lose situation at this point. Scorpio has been built up to be Xbox's saving grace by the xbox community. So much so that I don't think it is possible to live up to the expectations.

If Scorpio isn't $399, And at this point MS won't sell hardware at a loss so odds are it won't be.

People will complain

If Their E3 conference only shows known games and doesn't have any surprises other than Halo 6, Forza 7, Crackdown, Sea Of Thieves, Cuphead, State of Decay, Voodoo Vince Remaster, and Phantom Dust Remaster.

People will complain

And finally unless Scorpio's graphics aren't a generational leap from PS4 (or even Pro for that matter).

People will complain

Phil has done a lot of good to the Xbox brand the last 2 years, but he is fighting a serious uphill battle. arguably more so then when he was appointed as head of xbox. Some of it is self inflicted, but most of it was conjured from hyperbole from the Xbox community.

There isn't really winning scenario here for Phil.

He could stop chatting shit on Twitter and actually do something about the lack of games on his system? His answer to lack of software is cancelling games and releasing more hardware. Hardware that nobody really asked for.

 

[Papacheeks]

i dont believe that shit for a second. cboat mentioned the game was in a playable state and looked really good.

plus why would these guys put their own game aside to work on someone elses ?

They were probably given a much bigger budget and I believe they got more people the studio grew when they took on gears franchise.

It's been documented that they were given a choice, and they chose to have more stability and job security by going with gears, it sucks I would have rather seen black tusk's game, but if you were in their shoes in this cut throat industry I can't blame them.

 

[Lockjaw333]

I get the backlash against Phil and MS, but why aren't people blaming platinum? They seemed to get enough time to work on it, maybe the game just sucked and was a mess. I'm sure the last thing Phil wanted to do was to cancel it. It must have been in a pretty sorry state to force his hand.

I keep reading responses here that sound like he cancelled it out of spite or something. Just realize that he probably literally agonized over it, and I'm sure gave platinum numerous chances to right the ship.

They took a "risk" on scalebound, and ended up losing. That's the nature of a risk, sometimes it turns out shitty.

 

[MarveI]

I said this before I'll say it again. Talk is cheap Phil. Show or shush.
The things you say and the actions you take are so contradictory. Can't even take it seriously.

You said ''games, games and more games''. Under your leadership it's been ''less games, less games and lesser games''. You take little risks, your portfolio is anything but diverse and your portfolio is weak.

 

[Alucrid]

If his reply to my tweet a month or so ago is any indication. Plenty. He said he "won't pull the higher ups card" when I insinuated his hands were tied.

If we take him at his word there, then he's full of shit here.

lol like he's going to call out his bosses on twitter. come on

 

[digoutyoursoul]

I don't think it's entirely his fault either, I feel Microsoft itself is. He talks to fans on twitter, I like that, however to me it's just recycled soothing attempts more than anything most of the time.

The studio discussions don't seem to go away, the latter years of the 360 they were questioned, look at this reply from 2014, he's saying similar two years later

https://mobile.twitter.com/XboxP3/status/425753110787543040

 

[Dante]

Nope. Actions speak louder than words, this guy is a windbag, and I've never gotten the love he gets in this board. This brand has really suffered under him.

 

[Kill3r7]

God I forgot about that NFL Deal they made back when it was "TV! TV! TV!"

$400 million dollars. Imagine that invested into 1st party software instead.

Most of that was for Surface and having those on the sideline but yeah they had a totally different vision for their device than what ultimately became X1.

 

[jayu26]

It'd be more of a risk to not release something new and just wait out the generation.

In the same way that me leaving my house to go to work in the morning is a "necessary risk."

After all, I could be hit by a car!

O'come on guys. I am joking around.

 

[Jumeira]

Gears 4 was not a a commercial hit. It under-performed to my knowledge, but they were given a choice to continue on shanghai or make gears.

I thought it bombed like Judgement ? But it was revealed that Judgement was extremely profitable, and we know Gears 4 performed much better. But what i really meant it was performed well critically, the team released a great game.

It's too late because games take a long time to develop and right now they have Sea of Thieves and that's it. They showed off games in 2014 that we probably won't see this year. You can't just magic this stuff up, if Ms wanted a solid line up of exclusives for this year they needed to start investing several years ago - which they didn't. If Phil actually started doing what he keeps saying he is going to do (but never actually does) then we'll see the fruits of this in 2019.

Its never too late though if your committed for the long run, Phil drums on and on about 1st party so we know that its important for him but the products they've invested it cannot be announced until there's something to show. If he has or has not got something to show is a different topic, but its not too late you have to start at some point.

 

[Kyoufu]

It's been 3 years since the launch of Xbox One and Phil Spencer's reign as head of Xbox. What have they really achieved since then?

They've shut down at least one first party studio, cancelled at least 3 games, one of which led to another studio having to close down, cancelled at least two new IPs, one of which was sacrificed to put out more Gears games but that's OK right because you've got more 360 games to play on your Xbox One next week!