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Digital Foundry: Xbox Scorpio

Papacheeks

Papacheeks

Banned
LukasTaves said:
It's like the january reveal all over again. DF show some impressive stats, but everyone gets so hung up on stuff that doesn't matter and pretend the impressive stats never happened.

It's a (surely) $400 console delivering the same performance of a 1080, a gpu that by itself costs more than double the console.

You'd think gamers would be excited for that, specially on all the praise Pro receives (yeah, it's not close to Pc, but it's impressive performance for $400), but no, let's trash on how the cpu is not zen XD
Click to expand...


Are you for real?
 
W

WhiskerFrisker

Member
Gurrry said:
Crazy that its stronger than a GTX1070. Thing sounds like a fucking beast. I probably am not going to get one at launch, mainly because I imagine its going to cost a pretty penny, but I have friends that are going to jump all over this thing.
Click to expand...

Are you sure about that? Only showcased in one game.
 
T

The Albatross

Member
SG-17 said:
So when people were saying it's like the launch PS4 vs the launch Xbox they were not talking lightly. It's barely an upgrade over the Pro.
Click to expand...

I dunno if I'll buy the console, but watching the DF analysis video, it's sounds like a major upgrade. Dude says that they 'surpassed our expectations.'
 
thelastword

thelastword

Banned
Paganmoon said:
Didn't the segments with the 4K picture and some of the other footage state 50% resolution scale?
Click to expand...
I saw that too, which would suggest half of 4k, but I actually believe the Scorpio can run Apex at Ultra 4k with that GPU as have been proven with similar PC Parts.....

I suggest people saying that the Scopio scales to a 1070 because of their custom DX12 chip to hold their horses though. Let's see games under the microscope and under analysis tools first before we make such assertions/calls......
 
M

MosquitoSmasher

Member
So we know that Forza 6 was native 4K and had room for better visuals. That's great. But I am wondering if we can expect that from their other first party titles as well. Yes we know they will be native 4k but ALSO room for extra visual improvements? Games like Sea of Thieves, State of Decay 2 and Crackdown? Really want to know that. :)
 
G

gamechanger87

Member
WhiskerFrisker said:
Are you sure about that?
Click to expand...

He is referencing the below.


Project Scorpio vs PC: to-the-metal design vs sheer brute force
The closest equivalent to PlayStation 4 Pro's GPU in the PC space, in pure performance terms, is the Radeon RX 470 or an underclocked RX 480 - both mainstream graphics cards. The latter product typically overclocks to hit the same six-teraflop compute output as Project Scorpio. However, teraflop comparisons here simply do not reflect real-world results. With one or two exceptions, the 'next-gen' upscaling techniques used on PS4 Pro don't tend to exist in the PC space - and software-level PC upscalers that can produce great results still only manifest in a minority of games. On both counts, we expect things to change rapidly, but the bottom line is that right now, consoles are capable of producing some great 4K results even if the technical sleight of hand required to get there means that it's not strictly speaking a 'proper' native ultra HD resolution. This means more bang for your buck from your console purchase.

The bottom line is that Scorpio's six teraflops will almost certainly go a lot further than an equivalent PC part. I asked Microsoft about this specifically, and they raise a number of good arguments that make the case strongly. Firstly, that their shader compiler is far more efficient than PC equivalents (think of shaders as native GPU code). Secondly, addressing the hardware directly via their API and with access to console-specific GPU extensions again adds to the advantage of a fixed platform box. And finally, they point to their optimisation software - PIX (Performance Investigator for Xbox) - as a tool that provides the path to console-specific optimisations that PC simply cannot get.

From what I've seen so far, there is some evidence that Scorpio's true 4K performance could pose a challenge to the likes of Nvidia's GTX 1070 and AMD's Fury X-class hardware. I've seen Microsoft's new console running a Forza Motorsport 6-level experience locked to 4K60 on the equivalent to PC's ultra settings - cranking up the quality presets to obscene levels was one of the first things developer Turn 10 did when confronted with the sheer amount of headroom it had left after a straight Xbox One port. Out of interest, we tested Forza 6 Apex with similar settings at 4K on GTX 1060, 1070 and 1080. Frames were dropped on GTX 1060 (and a lot of them when wet weather conditions kicked in), while GTX 1070 held firm with only the most intense wet weather conditions causing performance dips. Only GTX 1080 held completely solid in all test cases. It's only one data point, and the extent to which the code is comparable at all is debatable, but it certainly doesn't harm Scorpio's credentials: Forza 6 Apex received plenty of praise for the quality of its PC port.

The bottom line: PC games need to evolve to more efficiently address 4K, in order to bring down the cost of GPU hardware to effectively and consistently power an ultra HD screen with the latest games. The best console titles have led the way here, and it's a tradition we expect to see continue on Project Scorpio. If third-party games live up to the first-party results we have seen, where 900p and 1080p games scale up to native 4K, the comparisons with PC hardware will prove absolutely fascinating. If Scorpio's GPU can hold native 4K and hand in results on par or better than GTX 1070, this is a seriously good result for a console.
Click to expand...
 
T

TheSpecialOne

Banned
LukasTaves said:
It's like the january reveal all over again. DF show some impressive stats, but everyone gets so hung up on stuff that doesn't matter and pretend the impressive stats never happened.

It's a (surely) $400 console delivering the same performance of a 1080, a gpu that by itself costs more than double the console.

You'd think gamers would be excited for that, specially on all the praise Pro receives (yeah, it's not close to Pc, but it's impressive performance for $400), but no, let's trash on how the cpu is not zen XD
Click to expand...
The bolded is false. Using a Microsoft game optimized for the console to gauge performance similarities is garbage reporting.
 
V

Voyr

Banned
This excites me. While I have my own qualms about MS and their commitment to compelling 1P titles, there is no question that Scorpio is my go-to for multiplats. RDR2 on the strongest console is a no-brainer. All the worry over price is also of no concern, as saving $75/month from this day forward (assuming Nov. launch) isn't at all a problem. E3 cant come soon enough.
 
SenjutsuSage

SenjutsuSage

Banned
Also, what's this stuff about a hardware implementation of DX12 on the GPU command processor!? That sounds like some seriously amazing shit. Supposedly taking instructions that generally cost upwards of thousands of instructions all the way down to 11 or 9!?
 
Z

Z O N E

Member
I think what some people are forgetting is that it's going to release sometime around Sept/Oct/Nov window, so parts will obviously get cheaper.

Maybe the $399 tag will be possible and they'll eat up the cost a little just to please gamers.
 
M

MissCauthon

Member
Anung said:
tumblr_no3mp6gOk41qhwoa6o1_500.gif
Click to expand...

Funny how someone hasnt modified this gif with console logos for this thread. Haha
 
BennyBlanco

BennyBlanco

aka IMurRIVAL69
at least DF threads will get interesting with MS having the clear advantage in hardware muscle now. I still see no reason to buy one if you own a nice PC.
 
LowParry

LowParry

Member
I just don't see it being priced 399. I think we need another "Kaz moment" with a $599 price tag. But if I were a betting man, 499 seems like a good price point.
 
E

EGM1966

Member
Markoman said:
Xbox One: Apollo Creed
PS 4: Clubber Lang
PS 4 Pro: Ivan Drago
Scorpio: Rocky Balboa
Click to expand...

So PC is Muhammad Ali?

Joking aside liking the boxing scale a lot more than the usual DBZ. But then I've never watched an episode of DBZ so I can get the reference.
 
F

Faustek

Member
Steve Youngblood said:
Can someone explain this to me in terms of power levels of characters from Dragon Ball Z?
Click to expand...


It's like old Krillin to New Krillin. Gohan is Switch, laughable but you still want him around.


LukasTaves said:
It's like the january reveal all over again. DF show some impressive stats, but everyone gets so hung up on stuff that doesn't matter and pretend the impressive stats never happened.

It's a (surely) $400 console delivering the same performance of a 1080, a gpu that by itself costs more than double the console.

You'd think gamers would be excited for that, specially on all the praise Pro receives (yeah, it's not close to Pc, but it's impressive performance for $400), but no, let's trash on how the cpu is not zen XD
Click to expand...


AbeOik6.jpg
 
RoyalLaFlame

RoyalLaFlame

Banned
SenjutsuSage said:
Also, what's this stuff about a hardware implementation of DX12 on the GPU command processor!? That sounds like some seriously amazing shit. Supposedly taking instructions that generally cost upwards of thousands of instructions all the way down to 11 or 9!?
Click to expand...
That's something that I'm actually intrigued as it is a well thought process.


Reduces the stress on the CPU. It's really nice.
 
L

LukasTaves

Member
mejin said:
$400? Really?
Click to expand...

Well, the info they released here all but confirms $400.

It's not a super huge chip using high end parts, it's very similar to what's on Pro, with the clock tuned to eleven and a few co processors to help performance.


Papacheeks said:
Are you for real?
Click to expand...

Well, $400 is a bet, but the performance results are there. It's one game only, yeah, but in that game it delivers the performance of a 1080.
 
T

TyrantII

Member
Obliterator said:
Scorpio isn't going to have issues hitting native 4k resolution on Xbox One games with the same settings.

I expect quite a few native 4k games. People are thinking of this as PC Ultra settings at 4k, when consoles don't run games with Ultra settings.

Sure there will also be lots of games that aren't native 4k but it isn't going to be super rare
Click to expand...

Sure, but are these Xbox Pro users gonna really want One games with a simple 4k res bump?

I wouldn't. Most will be Pro versions with more bells and whistles and use a rendering technique for scaled 4K. MS and users want more impressive visuals and preformance, not up-resed XBO games.
 
Ploid 3.0

Ploid 3.0

Member
LukasTaves said:
It's a (surely) $400 console delivering the same performance of a 1080, a gpu that by itself costs more than double the console.
Click to expand...

We may need a new thread to clear some people up on what's inside of the Scorpio, and what the specs relate to... It's in no way the equivalent to GTX 1080.
 
rokkerkory

rokkerkory

Member
I think with these specs, we might be able to see a $400 Scorpio lowest sku. It's pretty awesome to see at least a 40% improvement in performance or more across the board vs the pro in just a year's time if it's at a similar pricing.

Anything above $450 is probably pushing it too much.
 
L

LukasTaves

Member
WhiskerFrisker said:
I know what he is referencing. To say that after one test is quite bold. So I asked if he's sure about that.
Click to expand...

Well, it's obvious I'm not saying the console will deliver a performance comparable to a 1080 in all games.

But even if just for one game it's a very impressive result nonetheless.
 
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