When did I say otherwise?
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Digital Foundry: Xbox Scorpio
- Thread starter LelouchZero
- Start date
Jaguar Victory
Member
Maybe. But setting it up for disappointment and getting everyone geared up for $399 when that may not be the price is pointless. I could see anywhere from $399-$499.
I think $399 is a dream and that $449 or $499 is much more likely as they already stated this was a premium console. Looking at the CPU, memory, cooling and GPU while also having integrated DX12 and all that's it's not just a assemble and be done with it system.
It's incredible engineering to pull the most juice out of the parts.
Uncle Phil sauce.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
For those of you who think Leadbetter has a hard on for Microsoft, how do you explain him flipping off the Scorpio Engine they gave him?
Huh? HUH?
Huh? HUH?
ewww
Guessing it's Forza 6 footage showing GPU usage etc. I would put to bed the people saying it looks fake and is only showing the starting lineup​.
Scorpio is cool and all.
But why should anyone with an itch for platinum games ever not pick on Microsoft for behaving like a corporate dick? For e.g. no one ever gets called out to stop with EA for their titanfall 2 fiasco either.
Microsoft is not a hivemind.
They have smart people and they have scalebound canceling people.
Microsoft acts like it wants to listen to the crowd.
So why should there anything be wrong with listing complaints where its due?
I am too worried that the scorpio wont be as legit as it could be, because of typical microsoft shit.
Kinect, canceling scalebound, scalebound, and kinect was kinda stupid.
Kinect is seemingly not a "threat" anymore, but I am not certain what other stupid shit they are capable of. After all they canceled scalebound.
Sabotaging scalebounds development.
I mean:
What
the
fuck
Shoving multiplayer down the packed scalebound development-roadmap-throat:
....
Milestone fuckery:
.......
Canceling scalebound:
ok
/s
Presenting the Scorpio:
Oh Cool,
show
us
more
Coming in as a PC owner and 1080p set owner, it certainly doesn't sell to me at the moment. I'm not a huge framerate whore and thereby not sold on the gains it gives me. Both Pro and Scorpio are waste for me. In fact, the only thing I would consider is the cheapie PS4 as it gives me access to the games I can't get on PC and at a non-enthusiast price.
scoobs
Member
CPU and GPU are for all intents and purposes the same as the PS4 Pros, just clocked significantly higher. Adding 4GB of RAM will increase costs, but memory is not that expensive. You can't factor in software development (dx12) into the costs of the system, that has nothing to do with unit cost. I see no reason they can't sell this thing for the exact same price as the PS4 Pro, 1 year later.
Don't forget they cancelled ScaleBound.
Jaguar Victory
Member
You've been a wet blanket brother. Have you said anything positive about it?
Super Stardust
Member
So does this mean a fully modded skyrim with all the graphic mods will run at a stable 30fps? That would make scorpio a day 1 buy for me if true.
I think Matt's being very positive, yet realistic. It's what this thread needs more of.
This thing is going to be a neat compact powerful device without breaking the bank and pricing itself out of the market. That's a win for everyone.
scoobs
Member
Check out benchmarks for the rx480 then, you'll see comparable performance. Digital Foundry uses The Division's benchmark tool to test cards.
With an i7 it pulls off 1080/60fps, so its pretty damn solid. You'd probably get like 4k/30 on the Scorpio.
So many considered that Jaguar was an unbalanced CPU for PS4PRo (bottleneck) and now, despite the CPU improvements,offloading DX12 to custom hw(which is nice but in optimal situations is what, a 20% cpu time gain?) and 200mhz increase, now this makes the CPU balanced magically?
I mean, the GPU is 1.4 times more powerful than the one on the PS4Pro and the CPU gain would be at best 1.3 the performance so how would that be a better situation than the one on the PS4PRo (regarding balance). At the very best is similar. Obviously more powerful, which is nice, and also expected, it is a late 2017 console.
So , before someone says this is downplaying the console, it is not, is being realist, it is an improvement, but nothing groundbreaking.
I mean, the GPU is 1.4 times more powerful than the one on the PS4Pro and the CPU gain would be at best 1.3 the performance so how would that be a better situation than the one on the PS4PRo (regarding balance). At the very best is similar. Obviously more powerful, which is nice, and also expected, it is a late 2017 console.
So , before someone says this is downplaying the console, it is not, is being realist, it is an improvement, but nothing groundbreaking.
Jaguar Victory
Member
The die size is very similar. There are added costs for UHD drive and RAM. And due to increased clocks you need a more advanced cooling solution. Not sure if there are added costs for Dolby Atmos licensing, etc. Who knows. R&D absolutely factors into unit costs by the way. As does packaging and shipping. But the latter two wouldn't be more expensive on the Scorpio.
I doubt that is a viable tactic for a mid cycle refresh. The idea behind taking a hit on costs is to get as big of an install base as soon as possible. With there being a much cheaper option on the market to play all the games the Scorpio can (and that a lot of people already own) , I don't think making the console cheaper would have as much of an effect as with a whole new generation.
Never forget
Of course, I keep having to remind myself that PS4 Pro and Scorpio will probably never be consoles where developers get to target their capabilities without having to make sure games also run on base PS4 and Xbox One, respectively. These are mid-generation consoles, not the start of a new generation. What will separate PS4 Pro & Scorpio from future consoles in another 3+ years won't only be even higher specs, but games being coded from the ground up for next gen. I know things are getting blurrier, because in addition to the normal cross-gen games that get released during the first 1-2 years of a new console cycle, we now also have these mid-gen upgraded consoles. Yet, I am still confident that there will be games during the early 2020s that will only be made for PS5, a future Xbox and PC, that won't be playable on PS4/Xbox One, or PS4 Pro/Scorpio. I think it's just a little difficult for some to see that right now, in early 2017.
i think it is viable because it is a midgen refresh , kinda an experiment, aimed to hardcores that will buy regardless of the price (considering it isn't something out of logic). The same target that may buy 150 elite controllers.
They can drop the price later.
scoobs
Member
So are you agreeing or disagreeing with me that this thing could easily be $400 this November?
Jaguar Victory
Member
I agree. Looking forward to see how games perform and to see if there are any gains due to the bespoke nature of it's development. It's not like Checkerboard with high quality textures would be terrible. UC4 looked great on the Pro.
I'm torn. Part of me says it could be, but then I'm worried I'd just be setting myself up for disappointment. Regardless of parts, if you told me you've got a console that's 4K30 HDR in open world and 4K60 in racing, sports, fighting, I'd pay $500'for that without blinking.
I was wondering if they would show any of the games that they talked about yesterday.
Direct feed footage would be sweet so it could calm some people, eventhough this was supposed to be a pure hardware/spec reveal.
4 gigs more memory, more expensive cooling solution and more flops.
Colbert
Banned
The power difference and the customizations of the hardware enable to render games in native 4K on the Scorpio if they at least are 900p on Xbox One. By now this is several times stated by Eurogamer/DF and Microsoft. This is valid especially for games using DX12 as their graphics API.
And that is people are referring to when they say almost all games on Scorpio will be able to hit the native 4K target.
Though I'm not sure launching a console into a market where the main competitor could be 150-200$ less is a viable tactic either.
For those of you who think Leadbetter has a hard on for Microsoft, how do you explain him flipping off the Scorpio Engine they gave him?
Huh? HUH?
I dont see a PS4 console in the background, but a couple of xboxes, hence these guys are obviously paid by MS!!
(yes i see the vita
)
antyk
Member
Is there any discussion about release date?
I mean if the silicon is already being produced, if it's easy to patch existing games to take advantage of Scorpio's power then maybe at E3 they'll show it with "available now"? AFAIK it was announced to be released in Holidays* 2017, which might as well mean summer holidays, right?
Don't care either way (being a Playstation guy), but that would be something.
I mean if the silicon is already being produced, if it's easy to patch existing games to take advantage of Scorpio's power then maybe at E3 they'll show it with "available now"? AFAIK it was announced to be released in Holidays* 2017, which might as well mean summer holidays, right?
Don't care either way (being a Playstation guy), but that would be something.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Yeah... is he a traitor of the cause or something?!? Booooooourns!
Wait a minute, what's going on?
I agree. What I meant was the tactic of selling new consoles with a low profit margin or even at a loss isn't viable for a mid cycle refresh, so the price will most likely be at the higher end
The Hamburglar
Banned
Why do people keep saying that the gpu is 50% more powerful than the pros? Just because letterhead says so in his video. His reasoning for that makes no sense.
scoobs
Member
Is there any discussion about release date?
I mean if the silicon is already being produced, if it's easy to patch existing games to take advantage of Scorpio's power then maybe at E3 they'll show it with "available now"? AFAIK it was announced to be released in Holidays* 2017, which might as well mean summer holidays, right?
Don't care either way (being a Playstation guy), but that would be something.
I thought it was November of this year, but maybe I made that up.
Chobel
Member
This only works if significant percentage Scorpio buyers aren't Xbox hardcore gamers, because MS gains nothing from the already Xbox owners upgrading to Scorpio.
Its not as simple as your seeing it, it'll be $499, there are parts and costs that will increase the price as mentioned by the poster you quoted.
First of all, I'm not obligated to say anything positive.
Secondly, yes I have. Many times.
Your glass is very half-empty Matt. Serious question, with you working in the industry, has it sort of zapped your excitement for hardware/gaming in general? Always wondered this one, as it was something I thought about if I was to make such a move.
antyk
Member
No, it was always "Holidays 2017" I think (just checked some news from after E3 last year). I wonder if their narrative hasn't changed lately to just "2017" / "next year" but I wasn't really following it very closely.
Ha! Even in the reveal Phis said "next year" - check the NX Gamer video linked few posts above.
wapplew
Member
They retain their users from PS4/pro, that's a huge win.
scoobs
Member
But it is as easy as just saying "it'll be $499?"
I'm just presenting some facts here, the hardware inside this thing isn't new, nor is it expensive enough to warrant a $500 price tag. If it is $500, they're going to make a lot of money per unit sold.
Microsoft's decision to continue with the Jaguar CPU pretty much confirms to me that they wanted to have a competitive price point (ie, less than $500 for sure). That Jaguar CPU is basically costing them nothing to mass produce at this point.
I think people are at this point overestimating he number of native 4K titles on the system. And I say that also acknowledging that there will be many.
Thanks for posting this, watching now.
I think you proved his point, if anything. This seems to be pretty much what the pro would have been if it launched this year. Tech marches on, the prices don't. Next year's high end console should cost the same at launch as last year's. The specs seem to show a natural year on year increase to me.
Nothing was changed in that regard, other than Phil Spencer saying that they are ahead of schedule at some point. But I wouldn't read too much into it.
My glass is not half empty. I'm simply being realistic. I am not going to make up or embellish information because it will make me feel warmer inside.
Well I ordered myself a TI a day ago so the scorpio isn't something I'll pick up. But yes, if you have a good PC and don't mind consoles clearly the PC/PS4 combo is the way for most.
hmm I don't know. Not cheap to develop this and I'm not sure they set it up as a direct competitor either. Soon we'll know.
anothertech
Member
Yep, cause my i7 2600 is the same price as my i7 6700, cause that's how it works. And the CPU and gpu in the Scorpio are totally the same as the pros. Did you see the Scorpio breakdown articles today? No reason at all the Scorpio will be a penny more than pro. They'll both be $299 this holiday. Cause that's how it works.
$499 is conservative. $599 is not far fetched tbh.
Throw your $399 fantasies to the water closet boys, it's a pipe dream. Like zen and vega.
$499 is conservative. $599 is not far fetched tbh.
Throw your $399 fantasies to the water closet boys, it's a pipe dream. Like zen and vega.