-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Google Interview: "Stadia only needs 25mbits for 1080p/60fps. 4k/60fps at 30mbits. 720p for slow connections." "100 Devkits shipped, big June lineup."
- Thread starter Voost Kain
- Start date
Maxwell House
Member
And you know this how? Google and Microsoft are spending a lot of money thinking it is viable in the next year.
recklesscognition
Member
It blows my mind they are going to beam a controller input through wifi to the data center and then stream back the result to my TV in 4k nearly instantly.
Shmunter
Member
The wifi controller is genius. I see no downsides of this approach for a cloud console, i.e.
- No need for pairing each time you move device
- Input latency reduced by skipping a hop in the chain. I.e. 1.Controller -> 2.device -> 3.wifi -> 4.cloud VS 1.Controller -> 2.wifi -> 3.cloud
- Bypass any unpredictable Bluetooth stack latency on a device
- Bypass Apple controller restrictions. A Stadia app is simply receiving a video stream, nothing more. Not sure how Apple can begin to block such a thing, could be part of Youtube app for all intents and purposes.
Last edited:
VisualFidelity
Member
Sorry what is SWOD? Have u streamed from PC to Xbox yet? I did so with Dirt Rally, definitely playable. The input lag is very close to Xbox level (not PC). Also played DOA6 and still nailed counters easily while streaming.
Like i said before, this is the future but I believe all 3 can co exist as they each offer a different experience. What will be nice is playing games in my bedroom without a console, since I already have an ultra Chromecast there. Stadia can't come soon enough...
RiccochetJ
Gold Member
SWOD = Spinning Wheel of Death.
No I haven't streamed from PC to Xbox yet.
I've done the other way though (xbox to PC) and when there's a hiccup even on your internal network, it's unbelievably noticeable. Now imagine when you're relying on your ISP.
Last edited:
The Scrivener
Member
Can't seem to find the OT for Stadia.
Oh well.
Wanted to say that the name sounds awful. Sounds like a cheap car.
Also the advert says no streaming and no downloads. How we gonna play your mobile games then Google, hey?
Oh well.
Wanted to say that the name sounds awful. Sounds like a cheap car.
Also the advert says no streaming and no downloads. How we gonna play your mobile games then Google, hey?
Ozymandias013
Banned
I know we are skeptical about this and I still want my physical media,but man if they will manage to do this ,and eventually will happen,the consoles and pc hardware will slowly die,imagine just to open you tv and start playing not needing anything else,except a good internet connection,that by now every big gaming market has,it will open the market to people that never invested in games because of the money they had to invest,what is google doing now is similar with what Apple did with the first iphone
Last edited:
THE DUCK
voted poster of the decade by bots
Can't you just figure it out based on the speed required?
SlashBringingHasher
Banned
i could but i want them to say it themselves
yess I can multiply pixels by frames per second and divide by the rate to get the bitrate but cmon.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
With no net neutrality, the streaming wars and the highest bidder will come.
Kenneth Haight
Gold Member
Think I have this at the right time, When Sundar announces Phil Harrison it is Hilarious, Kyle Bosmans reaction is gold. "A man that knows the difference between RPG's and NPC's", what a comment. Will keep an eye on this but no real interest as I believe it will be years before it works correctly.
angelic
Banned
They aren't.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
By vastly inconsistent frame pacing (i.e. shit gameplay).
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
They specified it is Linux.
kraspkibble
Permabanned.
in the US maybe.
Yeah, this is my take on it too. They are just cheering it on without acknowledging potential issues.
Even on here it makes posters look like complete shills when probably they are just excited.
IF the whole thing was working perfectly and with no issues whatsoever then for sure this is a fantastic idea.
You can just grab a Chromecast Ultra for 70 bucks (?) and get yourself one of those controllers and off you go.
So, on the face of it, this really could be the future of gaming.
You've got your 4k Smart TV in your living room and you just pick up your controller and fire up the app and away you go with perfect high end performance.
That would be awesome.
I see some game on YouTube and I just have to click "play this" and I'm thrown into the game and can have a go and see if I like it? That's pretty awesome, for sure.
In reality though that's not how this works.
Connection issues, data caps etc are all barriers to entry especially if we are talking AAA level games.
It is not clear to consumers, I think, if they will even be able to play Stadia at all.
Now, fair enough, this was a conference for game developers so maybe they will go into all of this later.
I got the feeling that this is going to be far more suited to viral, free to play, games that are popular with streamers.
A lot of the focus seemed to be on YouTubers etc with even things like how you can join a game with your favorite streamer etc.
Right now we don't know how much this will cost or how many people will actually be able to use it.
For sure, it will be able to run less intensive games pretty easily.
4k at 60fps? I am skeptical.
But, yeah, people are just all over this like "it's the future of gaming" and what I keep thinking is that this will come out with a sparse game library and an audience getting annoyed because they are only getting 720p at 30fps on The Division 2 or the new Assassins Creed or whatever.
However, can you imagine how much more successful Fortnite would be if it were available in this format?
For certain games this will expand the audience in a huge way.
I am also interested to see what this will do for the indie scene.
You could easily see Nintendo doing something like having a unique controller (so still some hardware purchase needed) and having their games available to purchase and play on this format.
I just can't imagine that too many people in the world will be able to get a standard that is better than existing PS and XBOX offerings. So that's going to be an instant problem.
Väinömäinen
Member
I am absolutely horrified.
I don’t care about what rate the game appears to be running at....well, I used to care about that too, but now I am really concerned about the interaction slowing down. I am only interested to see the rate at which the game reacts to your input.
I am scared to death how little concern the latency seems to be in gaming media, and most writings seem to be content in seeing Assassins Creed, the slowest reacting game there is, not being much more slower, than previously.
But Googles choice for demoing the service, most certainly carefully chosen for masking the latency (if not even developed in streaming in mind, as Ubi has been touting the streaming future for awhile now), makes me panic a little with its input latency long enough to work with carrier pidgeons.
I would love to see a snappy platformer game demonstrated as soon as possible to ease my worried mind.
I don’t care about what rate the game appears to be running at....well, I used to care about that too, but now I am really concerned about the interaction slowing down. I am only interested to see the rate at which the game reacts to your input.
I am scared to death how little concern the latency seems to be in gaming media, and most writings seem to be content in seeing Assassins Creed, the slowest reacting game there is, not being much more slower, than previously.
But Googles choice for demoing the service, most certainly carefully chosen for masking the latency (if not even developed in streaming in mind, as Ubi has been touting the streaming future for awhile now), makes me panic a little with its input latency long enough to work with carrier pidgeons.
I would love to see a snappy platformer game demonstrated as soon as possible to ease my worried mind.
Breakfast at Noon
Member
Are they expecting their YouTube streamers to have that spare bandwidth to stream themselves streaming the games?
Puskas
Member
Why on earth would anyone live there?
llien
Member
I need to know the price to make up my mind about it.
Although this bit would be missing:
No, as amount of data you send is tiny (controller actions)
They've mentioned that streaming youtubers would be shared by youtube itself.
Although this bit would be missing:
Last edited:
UltimaKilo
Gold Member
Because it’s common knowledge.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost...ge-internet-speed-has-risen-23-in-a-year/amp/
And we’re just talking raw speeds here, not latencey. Hell, when Inplay SSBU the latency of a Bluetooth controller is a disadvantage, I couldn’t imagine streaming the whole session.
Solarstrike
Gold Member
Some anagrams for Stadia:
Data Is
Said At
A Ad Its
A Ads It
Aids At
A Sad It
Ad As It
Ad At Is
Ads At I
Sad At I
Data Is
Said At
A Ad Its
A Ads It
Aids At
A Sad It
Ad As It
Ad At Is
Ads At I
Sad At I
thelastword
Banned
Console
“We are absolutely firm that we are not, will not, and will never release a console. [Stadia is] a new generation platform, rather than a next generation platform. I think that’s a really exciting moment for the industry. The whole world isn’t going to shift to that new model overnight, and it will take time for us to realize every aspect of the promise. But it’s a fundamental and, I passionately believe, an inevitable and one-way direction that the industry is moving.”
Bandwidth
“For our [Stadia] launch this year, we have made some very significant improvements in our streamer, our codecs, our hardware and software services, which means we can get to 4K 60fps at around 30mbps. 30mbps doesn’t exclude a huge segment of the population. We think we can reach a very significant part of the world with that kind of performance. It’s not a gigabyte downstream.”
https://wccftech.com/stadia-no-console-4k-60fps-30mbps/
“We are absolutely firm that we are not, will not, and will never release a console. [Stadia is] a new generation platform, rather than a next generation platform. I think that’s a really exciting moment for the industry. The whole world isn’t going to shift to that new model overnight, and it will take time for us to realize every aspect of the promise. But it’s a fundamental and, I passionately believe, an inevitable and one-way direction that the industry is moving.”
Bandwidth
“For our [Stadia] launch this year, we have made some very significant improvements in our streamer, our codecs, our hardware and software services, which means we can get to 4K 60fps at around 30mbps. 30mbps doesn’t exclude a huge segment of the population. We think we can reach a very significant part of the world with that kind of performance. It’s not a gigabyte downstream.”
https://wccftech.com/stadia-no-console-4k-60fps-30mbps/
trikster40
Member
This whole announcement still just boggles my mind.
It’s not a console, but it’s more powerful than PS4 + Xbox combined (ya know, because math.)
We are never going to release a physical console, but we’ve shipped out devs kits.
We haven’t told you how to buy games, how much it costs, when it’s going to launch, or really any details at alll other than it’s the next big thing. Trust us.
It’s not a console, but it’s more powerful than PS4 + Xbox combined (ya know, because math.)
We are never going to release a physical console, but we’ve shipped out devs kits.
We haven’t told you how to buy games, how much it costs, when it’s going to launch, or really any details at alll other than it’s the next big thing. Trust us.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
They never tell you the bitrate though.
I was watching the presentation on the YouTube app in 4k on my TV and you can clearly see the difference between the clarity of the native game textures and the one running on Stadia.
It was very appearant on the rock textures with the water demo.
I was watching the presentation on the YouTube app in 4k on my TV and you can clearly see the difference between the clarity of the native game textures and the one running on Stadia.
It was very appearant on the rock textures with the water demo.
Last edited:
Mercer_CAR
Banned
i dont believe that Google can deliver on this day 1, however all these counter arguments are the same arguments that were tossed at Apple when iTunes released in 2001 (when most people were still using dial up)
Google are right, this becoming the norm will take time.
heck, some people still cant stream Netflix very well.....
Google are right, this becoming the norm will take time.
heck, some people still cant stream Netflix very well.....
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
That requirement is for the visual fidelity but that doesn’t help me with input lag/latency concerns
Last edited:
Afro Republican
Banned
The interview was already posted:
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/goog...big-june-lineup.1473863/page-2#post-253878055
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/goog...big-june-lineup.1473863/page-2#post-253878055
Meowzers
Member
If it really can provide 4K 60 and assuming HDR too at 30Mbps then I'd only worry about peak times and most of all, that input lag.
Still, I really do think people will buy it as a supplement because hardware is trusted and it takes a long time to earn trust.
The thought of it updating its own hardware takes away that kind of next-gen excitement though. I like to see big leaps between generations. I hardly think going from 10.7 to 12 TF will get the mass population excited.
Sepending on how frequently they update their hardware.
Still, I really do think people will buy it as a supplement because hardware is trusted and it takes a long time to earn trust.
The thought of it updating its own hardware takes away that kind of next-gen excitement though. I like to see big leaps between generations. I hardly think going from 10.7 to 12 TF will get the mass population excited.
Sepending on how frequently they update their hardware.
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
it is because they are full off shit,
4k youtube looks worse then 1080p bluray.
Meowzers
Member
Kinda makes buying a 4K TV for gaming rather pointless if you go from Xbox One X to 720p/1080p Stadia.
Soon as I saw 4K HDR on Far Cry 5, it made me want to whack 1080p over the head with a shovel and bury it somewhere where it can't be found.
Barakov
Member
Haha. Phil Harrison is the kiss of death to whatever he touches. I remember those interviews when he was with Sony during the PS3 days.
kraspkibble
Permabanned.
It looks compressed to shit. YouTube has never had good quality for watching games. They will need to significantly improve the quality if they want to deliver 4K. What is the point in 4K if it's gonna look a mess due to artifacts?
The quality needs to be similar to twitch source quality. It shouldn't be hard delivering good video quality. PS now has fantastic quality. Looks just as good streaming a game as playing it on a console locally.
The main thing that people seem to be worried about is input lag/latency. My experience streaming games through PS Now/GeForce Now was great and I never felt any kind of lag/delay.
Google needs to offer a free trial for this to show people that streaming games isn't as bad as they think it is. I think for the vast majority of people they wouldn't even be able to tell the difference between playing locally or streaming. But yeah Google REALLY really really...really need to improve image quality.
The quality needs to be similar to twitch source quality. It shouldn't be hard delivering good video quality. PS now has fantastic quality. Looks just as good streaming a game as playing it on a console locally.
The main thing that people seem to be worried about is input lag/latency. My experience streaming games through PS Now/GeForce Now was great and I never felt any kind of lag/delay.
Google needs to offer a free trial for this to show people that streaming games isn't as bad as they think it is. I think for the vast majority of people they wouldn't even be able to tell the difference between playing locally or streaming. But yeah Google REALLY really really...really need to improve image quality.
juliotendo
Member
None of this matters.
Input lag will never go away.
Input lag will never go away.
Threeshotgamer
Banned
Video Games, brought to you by these guys:
ultrazilla
Gold Member
Fuck Stadia. I hope it's DOA.
angelic
Banned
Whats even worse with this idiotic trend is taking away progress from actual worthy gaming R and D. Like, make a consumer console that's powerful enough to give us new gameplay, ie: real water in a world, not a transparent texture, with physics. I hate the march towards 4k, 8k and so on when we've not even perfected 1080p/60....so why the fuck are we now attempting to send 60 screen updates per second down our broadband? Its beyond laughable, it's moronic. Im not even exaggerating when I say Quake 1 on a 56k modem worked great, was more revolutionary, and more fun than Doom Eternal in some 4k streamed laggy bullshit, utterly clogging up everyone's connections by sending absurd amounts of unnessecary data down the pipe. Literally, iDs 20 year old game will be more fun than the 2019 game, ran over this tech. The world has gone fucking insane.
GhostOfTsu
Banned
Streaming will be forever tainted by OnLive for me. I bought a couple of games there and it almost never worked. When it did the image was blurry as hell, slow and full of artifacts. The menus were unreadable and inventory management was impossible.
Wolfgang Jr
Banned
STADIA BOSS
Holy shit I hope that's the actual title sitting on that dipshit's desk.
Holy shit I hope that's the actual title sitting on that dipshit's desk.
thelastword
Banned
Yes, 4k 60fps for a game stream at 30mbps is going to have lots of artefacting, I think the quality of what we saw of Doom Eternal on Stadia is indicative. As I said in the other thread, youtube compression quality needs to be improved tremendously or even start offering non compressed videos....When next gen consoles come along with 4k native.........Trying to see the differences in games analyses with current youtube quality is not going to cut it.....
As for phil Harrison, even now with a 30mbps connection viewing a 4k 30fps video, it doesn't stream as fluidly or has as much throughput as watching a 1080p video......Perhaps it could be argued that all you would need to packet over are the inputs for said game which lay resident on google servers, but I guess we shall see how it pans out, because lots of latency/lag can still exist depending on many factors; distance, isp/infrastructure etc etc.. etc...
I guess lots wil be learnt about it when it comes out.....Just as PSNOW, there will definitely be a market for it, but it will also be interesting to compare all the services later this year.....Xcloud vs StaDia vs PSnOW will be the new DF faceoff in the coming months.....
As for phil Harrison, even now with a 30mbps connection viewing a 4k 30fps video, it doesn't stream as fluidly or has as much throughput as watching a 1080p video......Perhaps it could be argued that all you would need to packet over are the inputs for said game which lay resident on google servers, but I guess we shall see how it pans out, because lots of latency/lag can still exist depending on many factors; distance, isp/infrastructure etc etc.. etc...
I guess lots wil be learnt about it when it comes out.....Just as PSNOW, there will definitely be a market for it, but it will also be interesting to compare all the services later this year.....Xcloud vs StaDia vs PSnOW will be the new DF faceoff in the coming months.....