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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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FeiRR

FeiRR

Banned
HAL-01 said:
I see, not surprised as I’m confident I’ve never used it in my life
Click to expand...
If you're into good sound for reasonable money, an old amplifier is a way to go and those don't have HDMI ports. But nowadays I think all TVs have optical out. But anyway, I stopped playing on speakers as my new neighbours aren't reasonable people and they just call the police about noise, damn millennial snowflakes...

Also if you have a PC monitor, those sometimes don't have speakers at all or very crappy ones. Xbox supports 144 Hz and 21:9 formats but what to do with sound then? I don't know.
 
T

TearInto5th

Member
Rusco Da Vino said:
Just curious.

Right now, with all the info available, would you exchange the PS5 specs for the XSX ones?

I would not :)
Click to expand...
Not a chance. Sony has the far more interesting piece of technology. Initially I was disappointed because of the numbers. But now that it's been a while and I can actually sift through the 10 feet of shit to get to the truth about what Cerny was actually saying. (I woke up at 2am to take it in, and not much stayed)

Seeing it being broken down the way it has by a lot of good info in here and other sources helps me see where Sony was going. They've poured years into all of this technology, and it interests me a lot more than the Xbox side.

Microsoft has just gone biggest and best on an affordable product. They have a monster machine with a lot of customization, don't get me wrong. But they haven't put the same amount of effort in the actual hardware itself.

Sony said to themselves, how can we create predictable efficiency in thermals to push the CPU and GPU to their max speed. They did it, thats exactly how their power delivery works.

They also knew that an SSD would be going in there from the 1st PS5 briefing 6 years ago. They still pushed and created an SSD technology that is industry changing.

We already know what big power gets us. Resolution! 4k Native wow! 60feps omg! So many refreshes!... it's almost at the point of indiscernability.

But I want to see what sort of games we can get with SPEED.

And that's what interests me about their philosophy. And with it They are the only ones who can create an experience that isn't possible on any other platform. Until they catch up.

Sony has sort of made something I didn't think I needed, and it's amazing to see the devs coming out and saying how much changes for them too. By developers choice we will get these experiences faster this generation, or we will get game world's we can't even imagine yet, because of the extra efficiency and time.

You can call me what you like, but that's how I see this. I can't wait.
 
B_Boss

B_Boss

Member
ethomaz said:
So the Wiki needs to be fixed.
Click to expand...

Oftentimes wiki has to be taken with a grain of salt also 👌.

TBiddy said:
I appreciate you setting things straight. Glad to see some level headed people in this thread.
Click to expand...

Agreed. They’ve been hanging around even this discussion for sure since it began and before he/she became a member.

ToadMan said:
Devs will either ignore those priority levels or include code to make use of them only on the platforms that support
Click to expand...

Objecton, speculation lol? Perhaps you’re right but possibly wrong. We’re (devs as well) entering a new fundamental shift in game development of the likes which we’ve never really experienced if I’m not mistaken 🍻.
 
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Gediminas

Gediminas

Banned
Neo Blaster said:
Just play them twice, good games deserve it, and the second time will have the benefit of improved graphics/frame rate/loadings.
Click to expand...
problem is, i have hard time to play any game a second time. only one game which i remember i played 2 times is Borderlands 2 and it was long time between the playthroughs, like really long time.

i am speaking about Cyberpunk here, because TLOU 2 and Ghost of Tsushima i gonna play day 1. Cyberpunk looks like a game which you gonna need to play at least 2 times for platinum :)
 
K

ksdixon

Member
FranXico said:
A while back, Todd Howard also said "Skyrim looks awesome on the PS3 too" and sure enough, the PS3 did run Skyrim...
Click to expand...

Did it really though? I didn't have any Internet at the time, and without the launch patch for Skyrim PS3, my dude was frozen in that horse carriage at the start of the game after that long-ass into cutscene. I couldn't even start the gameplay.
 
mitchman

mitchman

Gold Member
Corndog said:
Ya. Raid a couple high end ssd’s. One poster in here talked about 12 GB/second.
Click to expand...
That would solve half the bottleneck. How would the CPU handle the rest of the bottleneck, you think? How would you replace textures and models in memory every frame and avoid a full GPU stall due to the GPU cache having to be invalidated for every frame? Too many people are hung up on the raw SSD bandwidth when it's just half the story. The real gem in this technology is the DMA into video memory and the GPU cache scrubbers.
 
T

TearInto5th

Member
X-Fighter said:
He's asking where he says it's not possible on any other system. It doesn't say that. It merely says that they couldn't show this without the breakthroughs Sony made. Who says Microsoft didn't make breakthroughs with their XVA to make it possible on the XSX? We just don't know.
Click to expand...

If they had such a thing with the amount of talk they do, that they wouldn't have announced it by now?
 
TBiddy

TBiddy

Member
Physiognomonics said:
jackets with pockets jackets with pockets Thanks for reminding me their impressive SSD demo loading a XB1 games in 11 seconds.
Click to expand...

Cutting 40 seconds (give or take) of the loading time for an old unoptimized game is pretty good, wouldn't you say?

You could also check the Gears 5 demo. Or the Minecraft RT demo. Lots of videos for you to check out and then post passive-aggressively about here in the thread.
 
Bonsaibäumchen

Bonsaibäumchen

Member
TearInto5th said:
Not a chance. Sony has the far more interesting piece of technology. Initially I was disappointed because of the numbers. But now that it's been a while and I can actually sift through the 10 feet of shit to get to the truth about what Cerny was actually saying. (I woke up at 2am to take it in, and not much stayed)

Seeing it being broken down the way it has by a lot of good info in here and other sources helps me see where Sony was going. They've poured years into all of this technology, and it interests me a lot more than the Xbox side.

Microsoft has just gone biggest and best on an affordable product. They have a monster machine with a lot of customization, don't get me wrong. But they haven't put the same amount of effort in the actual hardware itself.

Sony said to themselves, how can we create predictable efficiency in thermals to push the CPU and GPU to their max speed. They did it, thats exactly how their power delivery works.

They also knew that an SSD would be going in there from the 1st PS5 briefing 6 years ago. They still pushed and created an SSD technology that is industry changing.

We already know what big power gets us. Resolution! 4k Native wow! 60feps omg! So many refreshes!... it's almost at the point of indiscernability.

But I want to see what sort of games we can get with SPEED.

And that's what interests me about their philosophy. And with it They are the only ones who can create an experience that isn't possible on any other platform. Until they catch up.

Sony has sort of made something I didn't think I needed, and it's amazing to see the devs coming out and saying how much changes for them too. By developers choice we will get these experiences faster this generation, or we will get game world's we can't even imagine yet, because of the extra efficiency and time.

You can call me what you like, but that's how I see this. I can't wait.
Click to expand...


This reminds me of wester vs. eastern fighting styles. Raw Power vs. speed and efficency.

MS vs. Sony:


The moment the big guy loses his nunchucks to Bruce = The moment MS showed of 3rd party titles only and not running on real XSX
 
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D

Deleted member 775630

Unconfirmed Member
TearInto5th said:
If they had such a thing with the amount of talk they do, that they wouldn't have announced it by now?
Click to expand...
Announced what? Their breakthroughs? They did, we have a whole topic about it here. I hope Microsoft shows some games in their June event so that this discussion can be put to rest, otherwise we have to wait until July.
 
C

Corndog

Banned
xacto said:
T72aECs.png
Click to expand...
What is your point? This looks like some type of personal attack. You are not arguing any point.
 
Bogroll

Bogroll

Likes moldy games
TearInto5th said:
Not a chance. Sony has the far more interesting piece of technology. Initially I was disappointed because of the numbers. But now that it's been a while and I can actually sift through the 10 feet of shit to get to the truth about what Cerny was actually saying. (I woke up at 2am to take it in, and not much stayed)

Seeing it being broken down the way it has by a lot of good info in here and other sources helps me see where Sony was going. They've poured years into all of this technology, and it interests me a lot more than the Xbox side.

Microsoft has just gone biggest and best on an affordable product. They have a monster machine with a lot of customization, don't get me wrong. But they haven't put the same amount of effort in the actual hardware itself.

Sony said to themselves, how can we create predictable efficiency in thermals to push the CPU and GPU to their max speed. They did it, thats exactly how their power delivery works.

They also knew that an SSD would be going in there from the 1st PS5 briefing 6 years ago. They still pushed and created an SSD technology that is industry changing.

We already know what big power gets us. Resolution! 4k Native wow! 60feps omg! So many refreshes!... it's almost at the point of indiscernability.

But I want to see what sort of games we can get with SPEED.

And that's what interests me about their philosophy. And with it They are the only ones who can create an experience that isn't possible on any other platform. Until they catch up.

Sony has sort of made something I didn't think I needed, and it's amazing to see the devs coming out and saying how much changes for them too. By developers choice we will get these experiences faster this generation, or we will get game world's we can't even imagine yet, because of the extra efficiency and time.

You can call me what you like, but that's how I see this. I can't wait.
Click to expand...
Did Sony invent that, because you can buy laptops with that technology now. 4800h 5600m gpu.
 
Bonsaibäumchen

Bonsaibäumchen

Member
SSfox said:
What did he meant by latency here? Input Lag?
Click to expand...

Latency is always time related.
In this case probably the time between requesting data and the arrival of said data package.
See those two cases I've came up with. Note this is not how any of it works these are just examples how different 2 solutions could be.

Case 1: Data request from GPU -> CPU Computes this request -> Sends request to SSD -> SSD Reads it to RAM -> SSD informs CPU about finishing the Job -> CPU Decompresses it in RAM -> CPU Informs GPU Data is ready -> GPU gets Data from RAM ( Probably again via CPU Request ) = Big latency

Case 2: Data request from GPU -> I/O Complex receives request -> Streams Data decompressed to GPU = Small latency
 
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icerock

icerock

Member
Agnostic2020 said:
So the bloomberg guy expects sony to show console design as the mass production is starting soon.

Click to expand...


I wrote it a while back but that ‘Mel Gibson picture’ thing on June 2 as teased by Grubb could be PS5 hardware reveal. You know the best part about that day? It’s a TUESDAY! 😁

A point on over-arching philosophical design of PS5, once you are able to look past the teraflops, one thing which seems constant throughout their design choices is to improve the user experience. SSD has driven a lot of conversation, but one thing a drive with that amount of speed can have a huge bearing on is the UI. I’m very excited about it based on what they’ve teased. These design choices are also reflected in the resources they’ve dedicated to the audio and controller, I expect both of them to help enhance users experience.

I reckon all of these would form a talking point on their own once the console is released.
 
pawel86ck

pawel86ck

Banned
TBiddy said:
Cutting 40 seconds (give or take) of the loading time for an old unoptimized game is pretty good, wouldn't you say?

You could also check the Gears 5 demo. Or the Minecraft RT demo. Lots of videos for you to check out and then post passive-aggressively about here in the thread.
Click to expand...
Exactly. These xbox one BC games arnt build to use XSX I/O hardware, so they load exactly the same as on PC. Quick resume feature shows, when game data is already decompressed XSX I/O can move 12 GB RAM into RAM without any bottlenecks (5 seconds) with it's RAW SSD 2.4 GB/s transfer speed, and native XSX games will use 4.8-6 GB/s transfer thanks to BCpack. We can expect 3 seconds loading times on XSX.

Gears 5 tech demo was impressive, but maybe even a little bit too much, because I dont know how they managed to run Gears 5 with such quality at 4K 60fps. Results are far above 5700XT and not even 2080ti can do it on PC, so they were either using dynamic resolution, or something like VRS.
 
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geordiemp

geordiemp

Member
TBiddy said:
Cutting 40 seconds (give or take) of the loading time for an old unoptimized game is pretty good, wouldn't you say?

You could also check the Gears 5 demo. Or the Minecraft RT demo. Lots of videos for you to check out and then post passive-aggressively about here in the thread.
Click to expand...

The reloading of a pause state is nothing to do with unoptimsied game though, that is reloading 5 GB or so of a last gen game that has been stored and reoloaded by XSX using all its hardware bells and whistles, SFS, VRS, BCPack, light saber, the one ring, bla de blah

So 5 GB is generous, probably allot less as obviously will be a compressed save state.

Fact is, what has been shown sio far by MS, XSX is very slow I/O compared to Ps5 however you want to dress it.

 
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T

TearInto5th

Member
icerock said:
I wrote it a while back but that ‘Mel Gibson picture’ thing on June 2 as teased by Grubb could be PS5 hardware reveal. You know the best part about that day? It’s a TUESDAY! 😁

A point on over-arching philosophical design of PS5, once you are able to look past the teraflops, one thing which seems constant throughout their design choices is to improve the user experience. SSD has driven a lot of conversation, but one thing a drive with that amount of speed can have a huge bearing on is the UI. I’m very excited about it based on what they’ve teased. These design choices are also reflected in the resources they’ve dedicated to the audio and controller, I expect both of them to help enhance users experience.

I reckon all of these would form a talking point on their own once the console is released.
Click to expand...
Completely agree with you. I feel like Sony is at their best, just the look of the controller alone makes their slowly unfolding presence feel a bit "future"
 
IkarugaDE

IkarugaDE

Member
So, I've never been a Sega fan. I always had Nintendo consoles and switched to the PlayStation later. So I see all with a little distance.
But reading hints like "It will shatter the gaming industry", "it's PS5-wired-revelation like" and "It's an article about a world premiere" doesn't sounds like a Sega mini-console like a dreamcast mini or saturn-mini. IMO this would not be a thing which shatters the gaming industry.

On the other hand, I somehow cannot imagine that Sega will bring a competitor to the PS5 and XSX onto the market. That would be doomed to fail. What I can imagine, however, would be a competitor to the Switch with some cool/innovative features. In my view, that would be the most sensible and obvious idea. What else would be so revolutionary?
 
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martino

martino

Member
geordiemp said:
The reloading of a pause state is nothing to do with unoptimsied game though, that is reloading 5 GB or so of a last gen game that has been stored and reoloaded by XSX using all its hardware bells and whistles, SFS, VRS, BCPack, light saber, the one ring, bla de blah
Click to expand...

explain me how vrs and sfs help to load a viewstate.
it's even possible bcpack is not use here if they are blindly dumping all the ram when they save.
in this scenario PS5 is untouchable but most VXA features are not there for it ( and need game engine to support them)
 
Agnostic2020

Agnostic2020

Member
Vaztu said:
Does AMD SmartShift use activity information to control power ?

OR is Sony adding their own solution to improve AMD SS ?

Cause I do remember Cerny being proud when talking about making cooling deterministic by using activity info

sony1.png
Click to expand...
There is power control by activity info monitoring and AMD smart shift. Both help to keep the console quite while keeping the GPU and CPU at max clocks when needed
 
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