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[Fulcizombie]

I wanted to make this thread because I see many people «concerned», usually not gamepass users, that once gamepass gains more. users , MS will increase its price. They bring up Netflix as an example of the terrible gaming future ahead of us.

The thing is that Netflix has been available in my country for 4 years , give or take. During these 4 years Netflix has provided a ton of new Original content, big budget movies with the biggest stars, a gazillion new expensive tv shows and more. The increase in price from the day it arrived until now has been 1 ( ONE) euro per month. Sony just announced a 10€ increase in its games , pricing them 80€ (almost 100$) .

Netflix has already, what, 150-200 million subscribers worldwide and its monthly price is still very low while providing more and more (and more expensive) exclusive content. So where does this fear that MS will increase its gamepass price at enormous heights if they see similar success comes from ?

 

[M1chl]

Neogaf and concern

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Thanks for the advertisement. We understand the concept of subscriptions, including loss leader strategies.

 

[Warnen]

Sony’s $70 price increase shows nothing last forever. If Gamepass price increases over the years it has to show that the value is still there. If not people will leave.

 

[AV]

I see many people «concerned»

Do you though? Where?

 

[Fulcizombie]

Do you though? Where?

Everywhere in this forum and not only in this forum ? I don’t get it, these services depend on volume of users not raising the prices to absurd heights.

 

[Eliciel]

You won't believe how much easier is it, business wise, to improve a subscription fee by ~10% than to increase prices for a one time purchase by 10%.

Just look at the maths:
10,99 = 11,99 (with blabla blabla value proposition that basically gives you some games for free 3 years after release lol, THE VALUE!!)
69,99 = 76,99 (with what? An ingame item for free? lol)

 

[Yoboman]

Looking forward to never being able to unsubscribe because my whole library is tied to a subscription

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Neogaf and concern

Yeah. There have been no shortage of idiotic threads around here. The dumbest one about Sony dropping the price of the sold out PS5. That one still takes the cake.

 

[Flintty]

If the value drops, people won’t pay it. It’s really quite simple. She we're good as long as you can still buy games to own.

 

[CeeJay]

The Gamepass / Netflix model relies on a rapid increase in subscribers to offset the investment a little like the way that the railroads were built. They have to carry on expanding it to encourage more and more regular customers so that they can invest more to carry on growing... Increasing the price of the sub too much does the opposite of what they want to happen in the short term and would cause that rapid growth in subs to stall. In the long term the strategy becomes a little more uncertain as at some point they will hope to reach full saturation of the market and would need to develop other methods of growth.

I really don't think we need to be concerned with rapid price increases.

 

[Lupin3]

Of course they will increase the price of Game Pass in due time. But never more than what people is considering to be good value for money.

 

[GHG]

Sony’s $70 price increase shows nothing last forever. If Gamepass price increases over the years it has to show that the value is still there. If not people will leave.

This is what it comes down to.

Value is more important than price.

 

[prinz_valium]

It will happen for sure.

 

[Jadsey]

Game Pass will be somewhere around $25 a month by the end of 2021.

It will then go up by a few dollars a year.

They way overpaid for Bethesda and Xbox customers will be paying that tax for years.

 

[Bonfires Down]

Well, I’m sure there will be price increases at some point. But it’s ridiculous that some people think it’s unsustainable. Even at $10 per month, with 50 million subs that’s enough to fund several AAA games each month. And you know that 50+ million is coming.

 

[cormack12]

That's what loss leaders are. At some point that will change, MS will grow their market this generation and a sweeter spot will be found. It doesn't matetr whether it happens in 6 months or 6 years. The price of everything will eventually rise. They've just invested $7.5 billion for the privilege of having more exclusives on Game Pass. It's fine, no one is saying it's suddenly going to stop being value for money - Netflix has gone up but it's still value for money. Our ISP bill gos up but generally its still value for money. There will probably just be more incentives to squeeze a few dollars more.

You already have different tiers and pricing for Game Pass and Game Pass Ultimate. You've already got tiers at different price points

 

[TKOFromTokyo]

Eventually, the costs of subscriptions will increase. If you look at cable alternatives in the US, streaming costs like YouTube tv or Hulu tv have increased. Cutting your cord no longer leads to the same drastic savings, especially if you also pay for premium streaming services like HBO and Showtime. The whole whole notion of subscription streaming eventually increases the overall cost of things because you break up the cost into pieces and small increases in each piece at different points in time is easier to swallow than a larger increase in a higher cost model.

 

[Vawn]

You don't see AAA summer blockbuster movies release day one on Netflix instead of theaters (especially before this pandemic).

AAA games are more akin to huge movies. But they are often even more expensive than that to produce. It becomes difficult to justify a 200 million dollar budget on a single game if it's not being sold directly.

Sure, GamePass could be something like Netflix, Hulu, or basic cable. I just hope Sony continues making the big AAA blockbusters, even though those will come with a price for admission.

In an ideal world these three companies - Sony, Nintendo, MS all contribute completely unique options that complement each other instead of trying to imitate each other.

 

[odhiex]

But, I rarely buy games at full price this gen...why would I want to suddenly buy everything at $70?

 

[Smoke6]

The Gamepass / Netflix model relies on a rapid increase in subscribers to offset the investment a little like the way that the railroads were built. They have to carry on expanding it to encourage more and more regular customers so that they can invest more to carry on growing... Increasing the price of the sub too much does the opposite of what they want to happen in the short term and would cause that rapid growth in subs to stall. In the long term the strategy becomes a little more uncertain as at some point they will hope to reach full saturation of the market and would need to develop other methods of growth.

I really don't think we need to be concerned with rapid price increases.

Why not? 15mil subs is nowhere close to being sufficient given that most of those subs are at baited prices!

Halo cost over $500mil alone and that an 1st party game, explain how’d you recoup that and at what cost to subscribers do you charge to even break even?

After you figure that out, then factor in the 100’s of other games the service offers and had to pay for! That includes estimated profits said studios set out to make as well!

I think you’ll need way more time once you get to this $7.5b acquisition that’s gonna have to pay off soon!

 

[Tiamat2san]

Of course the price will rise with time.
if I don’t think it is good enough for the price I paid then I will unsubscribe.

 

[danielJackson]

I wanted to make this thread because I see many people «concerned», usually not gamepass users, that once gamepass gains more. users , MS will increase its price. They bring up Netflix as an example of the terrible gaming future ahead of us.

The thing is that Netflix has been available in my country for 4 years , give or take. During these 4 years Netflix has provided a ton of new Original content, big budget movies with the biggest stars, a gazillion new expensive tv shows and more. The increase in price from the day it arrived until now has been 1 ( ONE) euro per month. Sony just announced a 10€ increase in its games , pricing them 80€ (almost 100$) .

Netflix has already, what, 150-200 million subscribers worldwide and its monthly price is still very low while providing more and more (and more expensive) exclusive content. So where does this fear that MS will increase its gamepass price at enormous heights if they see similar success comes from ?

Netflix were 8€/month 2 users, when I got it.

Now it is 13€/month 2 users.

That is big increase

In the same time they have lost A LOT of content, 80% of time when I want to watch something, it is not in netflix

They lost maybe 40-70% of old series/movies they had when I started

Also many times they dont have all seasons of series and only few movies if there is multiple on the "series"

Compared to US Netflix we have maybe 20-30% of the content, yet it is more expensive I think

So when Netflix fucks us, maybe MS will do too

 

[VN1X]

I wanted to make this thread because I see many people «concerned», usually not gamepass users, that once gamepass gains more. users , MS will increase its price. They bring up Netflix as an example of the terrible gaming future ahead of us.

The thing is that Netflix has been available in my country for 4 years , give or take. During these 4 years Netflix has provided a ton of new Original content, big budget movies with the biggest stars, a gazillion new expensive tv shows and more. The increase in price from the day it arrived until now has been 1 ( ONE) euro per month. Sony just announced a 10€ increase in its games , pricing them 80€ (almost 100$) .

Netflix has already, what, 150-200 million subscribers worldwide and its monthly price is still very low while providing more and more (and more expensive) exclusive content. So where does this fear that MS will increase its gamepass price at enormous heights if they see similar success comes from ?

Imagine typing up a post on a forum but you end up with an ad.

Good job!

 

[The Cockatrice]

I'll take gamepass over 80euro price any day. Yes ownership of the game matters to some but to me not so much.

 

[Wunray]

Looking forward to never being able to unsubscribe because my whole library is tied to a subscription

The good thing about it (well at least on pc) you get discounts on the games in your subscription so if you like em you can buy and keep em, can't say that'll be the case forever.

 

[aerts1js]

Netflix is still losing vast amounts of money but are unable to increase price too much due to competition. More and more price increases will come.

 

[DavidGzz]

The fanboys will always be reaching to come up with negatives reference anything positive for Microsoft.

 

[Neko Mimi Mode]

So when Netflix fucks us, maybe MS will do too

Literally the only thing you do on GAF is spread FUD about Xbox.

 

[RGB'D]

You don't see AAA summer blockbuster movies release day one on Netflix instead of theaters (especially before this pandemic).

AAA games are more akin to huge movies. But they are often even more expensive than that to produce. It becomes difficult to justify a 200 million dollar budget on a single game if it's not being sold directly.

Sure, GamePass could be something like Netflix, Hulu, or basic cable. I just hope Sony continues making the big AAA blockbusters, even though those will come with a price for admission.

In an ideal world these three companies - Sony, Nintendo, MS all contribute completely unique options that complement each other instead of trying to imitate each other.

I see the AAA game or movie releases as the justification for game pass subscription. Game pass is like having your home theater and "bel air cinema" or "red carpet cinema" getting you movies that are in theaters day one on your home theater.

Each first party AAA that I play makes me feel good about my gamepass subscription and there have been more than enough to justify my time there. I hope SONY continues to make AAA games too, but it in no way detracts from just how worth it Game Pass has been (and how many AA gems I've found because I keep the service for first party AAA).

 

[DavidGzz]

I'll take gamepass over 80euro price any day. Yes ownership of the game matters to some but to me not so much.

Yep it's not like I can resell a digital game that I'll never play again. I'll still buy some of course.

 

[Fulcizombie]

You don't see AAA summer blockbuster movies release day one on Netflix instead of theaters (especially before this pandemic).

AAA games are more akin to huge movies. But they are often even more expensive than that to produce. It becomes difficult to justify a 200 million dollar budget on a single game if it's not being sold directly.

Sure, GamePass could be something like Netflix, Hulu, or basic cable. I just hope Sony continues making the big AAA blockbusters, even though those will come with a price for admission.

In an ideal world these three companies - Sony, Nintendo, MS all contribute completely unique options that complement each other instead of trying to imitate each other.

You see AAA blockbuster movies BEING MADE BY NETFLIX.

 

[Boaty McBoatface]

dafuq has happened to neogaf.

 

[Mmnow]

You don't see AAA summer blockbuster movies release day one on Netflix instead of theaters (especially before this pandemic).

AAA games are more akin to huge movies. But they are often even more expensive than that to produce. It becomes difficult to justify a 200 million dollar budget on a single game if it's not being sold directly.

Sure, GamePass could be something like Netflix, Hulu, or basic cable. I just hope Sony continues making the big AAA blockbusters, even though those will come with a price for admission.

In an ideal world these three companies - Sony, Nintendo, MS all contribute completely unique options that complement each other instead of trying to imitate each other.

There's a reason streaming services don't get your big summer blockbusters day one. Because cinemas throw a fit whenever it's mentioned and they still have the power to do that. Go look at the reaction to Trolls. A deal has just been struck to allow a bunch of movies to come to streaming services 19 days after cinema release, and that's huge. Biggest shake-up in years. Its also just the beginning.

If you wanna see how that plays out in the long run, go look at Steam vs Game. Digital day one is going to be the norm sooner than later.

Second, Netflix are spending record amounts on films and TV series. The idea that just because they're not exclusively streaming Star Wars or Marvel so therefore they're not bringing out AAA titles or they're not making blockbuster shows and films is ridiculous. They also don't have the same costs on distribution and marketing as traditional studios.

The problem with the Netflix "summer blockbuster" argument isnt just that it's factually wrong, but that it's shortsighted. Gears of War 6 is inevitable. Halo Infinite supposedly has one of the biggest budgets ever. You don't buy Zenimax and then cut their budget.

So when Microsoft is spending more on game budgets than Sony - and presumably over 23 studios that'll be coming very soon - where do you go from there?

 

[Fulcizombie]

The good thing about it (well at least on pc) you get discounts on the games in your subscription so if you like em you can buy and keep em, can't say that'll be the case forever.

Same on the Xbox.

 

[TonyK]

The thing is that Netflix has been available in my country for 4 years , give or take. During these 4 years Netflix has provided a ton of new Original content, big budget movies with the biggest stars, a gazillion new expensive tv shows and more.

What? I have Netflix and ALL the movies from them are the equivalent to AA games. Netflix movies seem the poor version of a Hollywood movie, like a TV show episode of 2 hours long.

An that's exactly my fear with Gamepass. That at the end, games produced directly for Gamepass will be like Netflix movies: poor and medicore AA products.

 

[Vawn]

You see AAA blockbuster movies BEING MADE BY NETFLIX.

Right... And made-for-TV movies are the same quality you get from the theater. /s

 

[CeeJay]

Why not? 15mil subs is nowhere close to being sufficient given that most of those subs are at baited prices!

Halo cost over $500mil alone and that an 1st party game, explain how’d you recoup that and at what cost to subscribers do you charge to even break even?

After you figure that out, then factor in the 100’s of other games the service offers and had to pay for! That includes estimated profits said studios set out to make as well!

I think you’ll need way more time once you get to this $7.5b acquisition that’s gonna have to pay off soon!

I explained it right there in the post.

15 million subs @ $14.99 = around $225 million

Rapid increase in sub numbers to say 20 million over the next 6 months (conservative estimate) brings it to around $300 million. Keep scaling that up to the 100s of millions of subs and those returns soon become sustainable. 200 million subs @ 14.99 is just shy of $3 billion (That's nearly a Zenimax every two months)

If they increase the cost of the sub too rapidly then that growth in subs will not be as fast and could even take a downturn. MS will want the growth in the service to come from the number of monthly subs, not from increases in the monthly price.

 

[12Dannu123]

Thanks for the advertisement. We understand the concept of subscriptions, including loss leader strategies.

Actually a lot of people here don't. They expect it to be profitable day 1.

 

[KellyNole]

I think the ultimate pass will be 25 or 30 when it is all said and done. Xbox only will be 15 to 20. To me this is still a great value, especially if you buy more than six new games a year.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Actually a lot of people here don't. They expect it to be profitable day 1.

The issue isn't that people expect it to be profitable, but that they expect the lucrative loss-leader strategy to last forever. That's not how these things go.

 

[ReBurn]

Prices go up all the time. Whether they will increase the price isn't the issue. Whether people will keep subscribing when they do is the real discussion.

 

[Nikana]

The Netflix debate is a tired one. Theres always an avenue to how it will fail by people who don't understand numbers and this notion of diminishing quality that always point to the worst examples while leaving out the truly high quality shows.

But even still, trying to compare the consuming habits of the consumer in videos games to movies makes zero sense as they are not a parallel market.

Panera bread has a coffee subscription. Should we compare that to netflix too? Is the quality of the coffee gonna dip?

 

[iorek21]

I really hope that Gamepass doesn’t follow Netflix that much.

Netflix has been in a terrible downhill for a couple of years, the prices increase but the quality of products decrease. Most of Netflix originals are teen stuff, woke stuff or that disgusting Cuties movie. There are some exceptions like Our Planet or Stranger Things, but the rest is pretty mediocre.

MS needs to keep their exclusives quality as high as possible

 

[acm2000]

I really hope that Gamepass doesn’t follow Netflix that much.

Netflix has been in a terrible downhill for a couple of years, the prices increase but the quality of products decrease. Most of Netflix originals are teen stuff, woke stuff or that disgusting Cuties movie. There are some exceptions like Our Planet or Stranger Things, but the rest is pretty mediocre.

MS needs to keep their exclusives quality as high as possible

maybe you need to just look deeper in to Netflix's library, the likes of Black Mirror, Umbrella Academy, F is for Family, Snow Piercer, The Witcher, Ozark, Final Space, Dark, You, Happy, Paradise PD, How to sell drugs online fast, etc etc

 

[Wunray]

Same on the Xbox.

Oh that's even better, game pass is a great deal right now especially in the current climate, I love ya Sony but that 70$ price tag might scare a few people away.

 

[iorek21]

maybe you need to just look deeper in to Netflix's library, the likes of Black Mirror, Umbrella Academy, F is for Family, Snow Piercer, The Witcher, Ozark, Final Space, Dark, You, Happy, Paradise PD, How to sell drugs online fast, etc etc

Watched most of this list, all mediocre at best, aside from maybe Ozark.

Black Mirror turned into shit after it moved to Netflix

 

[chonga]

I explained it right there in the post.

15 million subs @ $14.99 = around $225 million

Rapid increase in sub numbers to say 20 million over the next 6 months (conservative estimate) brings it to around $300 million. Keep scaling that up to the 100s of millions of subs and those returns soon become sustainable. 200 million subs @ 14.99 is just shy of $3 billion (That's nearly a Zenimax every two months)

If they increase the cost of the sub too rapidly then that growth in subs will not be as fast and could even take a downturn. MS will want the growth in the service to come from the number of monthly subs, not from increases in the monthly price.

The 15 million subscribers are not paying $15 a month though are they.

Countless people loaded up 3 years for just $1. Countless people will stock up on discounted deals and keys. Countless people live in countries where these services are always cheaper. And who knows how many elect not to go for GPU but instead forgo Live and the other benefits and just get the $10 tier.

And do you honestly think they are going to reach 200 million subscribers any time soon? Even Netflix hasn't hit that mark yet and it has taken them well over a decade to do so.

 

[Mmnow]

The 15 million subscribers are not paying $15 a month though are they.

Countless people loaded up 3 years for just $1. Countless people will stock up on discounted deals and keys. Countless people live in countries where these services are always cheaper. And who knows how many elect not to go for GPU but instead forgo Live and the other benefits and just get the $10 tier.

And do you honestly think they are going to reach 200 million subscribers any time soon? Even Netflix hasn't hit that mark yet and it has taken them well over a decade to do so.

Those people who stocked up to convert to ultimate bought 3 years of Gold to do it. MS got a huge influx of cash at the start of all that madness just of starting the deal.

Not enough to make it a success, but enough to get it swinging.

Either way, the guys point is that MS hopes there will come a time when everything is paid for through Gamepass. With how quick it's taking off and the bonus of Xcloud in parts of Asia, I can't believe theyre wrong.

I reckon 50m by the end of 2021.

 

[Nikana]

The 15 million subscribers are not paying $15 a month though are they.

Countless people loaded up 3 years for just $1. Countless people will stock up on discounted deals and keys. Countless people live in countries where these services are always cheaper. And who knows how many elect not to go for GPU but instead forgo Live and the other benefits and just get the $10 tier.

And do you honestly think they are going to reach 200 million subscribers any time soon? Even Netflix hasn't hit that mark yet and it has taken them well over a decade to do so.

Man those people using the free month of netflix over and over must be sinking the company. Has to be 100 million of em.