Airbus Jr
Banned
What? No safe? Not even checkpoint?
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Returnal |OT| Live. Die. Repeat.
- Thread starter cormack12
- Start date
LectureMaster
Member
It's roguelike, if you die, you start over with randomized map each time. However generally this type of game will let you save such that you can pick up where you left from last session.
Gungeon didn't have saves from the beginning, they add them later. HM also can add saves, if there will be demand, it's not hard.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
It's roguelite. So you keep some permanent stuff, and also every place/shortcut you open is permanent so you can jump right where you were last time. Also enemies aren't bullet sponges so even with 0 level you can do well in advanced areas.
Gamerguy84
Member
I just tried looking it up with no luck.
When you die in returnal in the 4th biome for example do you start at the 4th or back at the 1st?
So if your in the 6th and it took you 20 hours to get there, you start back at 1 with 20 hours to go?
If that's true it might cause me to launch my dualsense to the International Space Station by hand.
When you die in returnal in the 4th biome for example do you start at the 4th or back at the 1st?
So if your in the 6th and it took you 20 hours to get there, you start back at 1 with 20 hours to go?
If that's true it might cause me to launch my dualsense to the International Space Station by hand.
Dr Bass
Member
Yes. Housemarque obviously intends for you to sit and do a 20 hour play through with no saving.
Gamerguy84
Member
Of course there is rest mode which would "save" progress but I've seen people saying this.
So you start at 1 or the biome your on? Because I like my dualsense.
Based on everything we've seen, you start at Helios after the crash following every death. If you've unlocked the shortcut to the future biomes, you can use those to jump close to where you were.
Gamerguy84
Member
Oh OK. Thank you for answering my question. So their are shortcuts then that let you get back to where you were.
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mxbison
Member
A complete run in a Rogue-like usually takes like 30-60 minutes.
Just takes lot's of runs to get there until you have enough upgrades, shortcuts, skills, etc. to make it.
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Gamerguy84
Member
That's good news. Honestly, this will be my first Rougue like (lite) game.
From what we've seen, there are shortcuts and new traversal mechanics like a grappling hook thing.
The thing about this game type is that it isn't just the layout of levels that changes each run - it's your available powers. Enemies and environments will change, which keeps things fresh, but the genre really gets ya hooked when you end up doing two runs back to back with completely different builds, weapons, buffs, etc.
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kyliethicc
Member
To make 1 run through all the biomes, its not gonna take you 20 hours lol. A single run to beat the whole game will probably only be a few hours. The thing is tho, it will take players many attempts to do that.
And no there's no saving. Its arcade gameplay. Boot it up, try a few runs, then quit. Come back and try again later. Then once done, keep playing for the daily challenge mode. High score chases.
Salmon Snake
Member
Bought the game with 50 € so I'll think money well spent.
Let's see on friday if the post office will get it for me in time.
Let's see on friday if the post office will get it for me in time.
Gamerguy84
Member
Nice. Dualsense saved.
Still, you should buy spare dualsense, just in case
nowhat
Member
I mean, it's Housemarque. They always nail the gameplay. I was skeptical whether they'd be able to transition to third person, but so far the consensus seems to be "yes", so I've preordered my copy.
DonJorginho
Banned
Damn this game looks fucking gorgeous. 
Bo_Hazem
Banned
You start from the beginning, but use the shortcut and you're right there again. If you beat a boss you don't need to beat him again, and the next biome is permanently open, same with shortcuts. Also the Ether is a permanent currency, so you can buy shit from that alien vendor machine right when you respawn.
Dr Bass
Member
Sorry I didn’t realize this would be the first game of this kind you will play. It seemed obvious to me how it would work out.
I shouldn’t have given you such a snarky reply. I apologize.
Con-Z-epT
Live from NeoGAF, it's Friday Night!
Of course it is unintentional since rest mode is not even part of the game. It is a functionality of the console.Ah, so pausing via rest mode is already unintentional and the developer simply forgot that this functionality exists on their exclusive target platform
Who said that they forgot this? Now you are being naive on purpose.
We are running in circles here. I'm sure you should not use rest mode to "save" your progress by pausing the game. Although you can.
Nothing here is half broken. Maybe your phrasing.
Maybe you should wait for the game to come out and see for your self before you draw any meaningful conclusions from things someone said on the internet.Gee, who hasn`t always 3+ hours slots open (considering reported 90+ min runs for just 2 out of 6 biomes probably even more) ....oh right most people with a social life/family. So this game is mostly for school children with lots of free time who don`t mind if a game takes their console hostage... got it.
You obviously have a hard time to put the informations available into a correct perspective.
Sure, but as long as you post hyperbolic statements you gonna get called out for them.
S
Shodan09
Unconfirmed Member
Most of the game does visually and I'm yet to see if the compromise has been made for better frames or more enemies on screen. Still looks fun though!
Rikku-X
Member
If the map is randomized how can you find the shortcuts you have opened up?
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Shortcuts are usually found in semi-safe spots where you don't usually have enemies around, and from many previews I've seen those places don't seem to change, so not everything changes but mostly places that are usually filled with enemies change. Also rooms are usually placed approximately in the same order even with randomized changes to the spot. You discover them first without the tech needed, but that doesn't register until you actually check them out again with the needed tech to have it saved permanently.
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GymWolf
Member
I was about to post this, if radbrat completed it, the game must be not very challenging , now i can believe this game being easier than hades...
Haggard
Banned
No. I´m just pointing out how absolutely nonsensical forgoing saves/checkpoints is in this context considering you have that innate OS functionality.
Which is exactly my point.....
The intentional design is automatically "broken" by the basic OS features. The phrasing is absolutely correct.
You obviously have a hard time accepting differing opinions.
We´ve had dozens of hands on previews from streamers and YTs that barely got through the first biome in 45 minutes, some who tried to really speedrun it got maybe mid 2nd, out of 6.
It really isn`t quantum mechanics to extrapolate that runs in this game can easily take 3+ hours, even failed ones.
Not having checkpoints nor a temp-save feature is just a ridiculous oversight or straight up stupid design if the average time per run isn`t somehow massively lower in the final game.
That is simply my opinion.
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GymWolf
Member
Oh and btw, no save during a run of 3-4 hours is complete bullshit.
The rest mode on ps5 has some problems and it is not perfect, a lot of videos on yt about not leaving the ps5 in rest mode, but i don't know if they fixed it.
Basically, if i have a gaming window of 4 hours (probably more than the average person) and i fail the first run after 2 hours, it's useless to start a new run because i don't have another 4 hours to complete the game...how fucking stupid it sounds?!
Hades and many other roguelite make you save during runs, this is an inexcusable flaw.
And before you say, "but gym, you can open shortcuts to save time between runs"...well that is complete bullshit for whoever is familiar with the roguelite genre because if you don't explore every area to get upgrades your character remain weak.
Good luck surviving the advanced areas with zero upgrades from the previous areas because you used those shortcuts.
This mechanic is only smart for people who never played a roguelite but in practice, it is absolutely useless because all the time you save with shortcuts get wasted by enemies fucking your non-upgraded corpse...
I think that we don't know the entire story about the save system, i don't think that housemarque is stupid enough to have such a glaring flaw in their more important game that aims to sell at the masses.
The rest mode on ps5 has some problems and it is not perfect, a lot of videos on yt about not leaving the ps5 in rest mode, but i don't know if they fixed it.
Basically, if i have a gaming window of 4 hours (probably more than the average person) and i fail the first run after 2 hours, it's useless to start a new run because i don't have another 4 hours to complete the game...how fucking stupid it sounds?!
Hades and many other roguelite make you save during runs, this is an inexcusable flaw.
And before you say, "but gym, you can open shortcuts to save time between runs"...well that is complete bullshit for whoever is familiar with the roguelite genre because if you don't explore every area to get upgrades your character remain weak.
Good luck surviving the advanced areas with zero upgrades from the previous areas because you used those shortcuts.
This mechanic is only smart for people who never played a roguelite but in practice, it is absolutely useless because all the time you save with shortcuts get wasted by enemies fucking your non-upgraded corpse...
I think that we don't know the entire story about the save system, i don't think that housemarque is stupid enough to have such a glaring flaw in their more important game that aims to sell at the masses.
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SkylineRKR
Member
Rest mode was gone today when I wanted to continue a game because the PS5 updated itself. Its not reliable.
Holy shit I was thinking the same. That guy is one of the worst LP's I ever seen, I usually click the video away if I see his name. He's bad, and his fake enthusiasm is cringe. If he can beat it, then well...
Holy shit I was thinking the same. That guy is one of the worst LP's I ever seen, I usually click the video away if I see his name. He's bad, and his fake enthusiasm is cringe. If he can beat it, then well...
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GymWolf
Member
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Con-Z-epT
Live from NeoGAF, it's Friday Night!
Maybe i just have a hard time to understand your point or i'm taking your words too literally, but let me try again.
I'm convinced that the game was intentionally designed with the fact that you can not save midway through the game.
It adds a lot to the game and forms a very specific gaming experience which i explained more than once.
Some could argue that this renders the game inaccessible to a part of the audience.
It is a completely comprehensible thought and i wouldn't even reply to such a statement.
But to say the game design is stupid or bad is not a viable opinion.
"Game is King" is the motto of Housemarque. It is shown on their website.
Do you really think they develop the game for years and haven't talked about the pros and cons of such a decision?
It is a testament to their philosophie.
Rest mode has nothing to do with all of this!
It has to work with the game since it is a core feature of the console.
A by product of this is the fact that you can "pause" your game at any time which is not part of the game itself.
If something happens and you are unable resume to the game than this sure is not the games fault.
Especially not in regards of the game design.
You may think that you have a broad understanding of the whole game.
The embargo is still up if i'm not mistaken.
You haven't seen everything and nobody has talked about everything.
I really appreciate your opinion but it is to early to make final conclusions about the game.
You can configure the PS5 to download but not install any system updates during rest mode.
I've been using rest mode since launch, both with running PS5 games and PS4 games stored on external SSD and only had problems with it twice (console did not react to any inputs after booting).
It's all in the wrist
Member
Fuckin' hate Rogues. Never played one I liked after dying once and seeing the majority of my progress lost to time. It pisses me off.
I'm giving this a chance because PS5 no games, and I've always liked Housemarque.
I'm giving this a chance because PS5 no games, and I've always liked Housemarque.
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Haggard
Banned
And I simply disagree. I think it adds nothing, and since the rest mode is there it simply fails on design level. That is my opinion with the infromation we currently have.
On top of it I personally think it`s absolutely stupid to try to force people to keep playing your game when drop in drop out has been the quasi standard, even for "hardcore" games, for so long.
We do not know everything, yet, but from the previews it sure doesn´t look like something you can "finish" in short(er) bursts.
It absolutely is from the perspective of someone with a lot of real life stuff on the plate. If I have ~2 hours at once that`s already an exception.
If runs really turn out to be as long as they seem from the previews and the save/checkpoint system stays like this this just made the game practically unplayable for me since I´d either never be able to finish it or would have to leave my console running 24/7 which is not acceptable.
Developers are just humans. There´ve been innumerable games where developers made stupid decisions and got critizized in return. I´m a software architect and I can`t count how many downright retarded designs I´ve seen in my career, especially in the usability sector.
It`s an integral part of the OS. If you design for a system you have to take everything into consideration.
Nothing is final ofc.
But a week before release with a lot of hands on previews out I sincerely doubt, that we`re completely misunderstanding the game structure at this point, wouldn`t you agree?
I´d love to get presented with a solution in the final game, but right now it does not look like there is one.
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ToadMan
Member
All of those streamers had opened the jump points well before the 45 minute point.
This is a common gameplay mechanism in rouge-likes/lites even on systems with a suspend function.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
You can't backup any saves on PS5 though lol
That is clearly not what the douchebag responding to me was talking about.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
I think they should make saves possible. Doesn't make sense to me. Not every person can dedicated his time to long sessions. And if you have a family you would have some things popping up.
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Haggard
Banned
Since you have to level up your weapons and health every time anew shortcuts are worthless for overall progression here. Also, teleport points are reset every run, too, as far as I know....
So i`m not sure what your point is.
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
But the good thing is even 0 level weapon is very powerful and enemies aren't bullet sponges. I'm more than sure you can survive through the game with just 0 level gun, that's why they probably made it easier going forward instead of the reversed method. Still reviews might expose some "device" that will let you save related to the story?
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
go play hades
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
go play hades
FrankWza
Member
Headphones with 3D audio highly recommended for Returnal.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Ok wanna say that dashing gets you through most bullets and lasers barriers with no damage. Put that in mind while playing.
That's a no brainer! Won't let that ray-traced 3D audio of Returnal go to waist. I remember using my Pulse 3D for one of the streams and I think I can feel the separation of droplets. Not sure though as the rest seem to have audio a bit missed up instead of being kept as PCM like the output from the console.
That's a no brainer! Won't let that ray-traced 3D audio of Returnal go to waist. I remember using my Pulse 3D for one of the streams and I think I can feel the separation of droplets. Not sure though as the rest seem to have audio a bit missed up instead of being kept as PCM like the output from the console.
skit_data
Member
Yeah, i saw this in Yongyeas stream. If this works for enemy projectiles this game will be a lot easier than I first anticipated, unless it has a really long cooldown
FrankWza
Member
I should have put my post in quotes. It’s written in the menu. The guy had av receiver selected and it says that below the option. But yeah, no brainer. I was going headphones all the way regardless. I can see it actually helping when things get hectic and you have to pan around it can help pinpoint some projectiles like you said.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Yes it works, saw it on other streams. It's more forgiving that people think. Also falls don't do damage, but falls outside the map only give you a small health penalty and you respawn again up.
drotahorror
Member
Unless you get that one perk or w/e it is that gives positives and negatives and one of the negatives is falls do damage hah.
On another note, there should be saves between biomes IMO. If the game is 3-4 hours when you're good at it, that's quite a long time for some people. Rest mode for me, isn't really an option. I've never used it once on PS5 and don't intend to until I know every single kink is ironed out.
Salmon Snake
Member
I would but it's not on Playstation.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
I'm with you there. Also I used to use rest mode back on PS4 because I had shit 16Mbps ADSL. Now I don't really need it. I don't even use sleep mode on my PC.