It's childish but she opened up that can all by herself.
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Fabricated Notch/Mojang party escort allegations; Twitter monsters spring into action
- Thread starter Misguided
- Start date
It's childish but she opened up that can all by herself.
If by "reach" you mean "did my research", then you are correct.
I wasn't involved in this thread initially. After looking back at the material it seems pretty clear that there was a lot of unsubstantiated stuff taken as fact. Even when Notch said he didn't know what was going on she still tried to make him take the blame. Why?
Now you are just trolling.
But all you have to do to open that can is to be a woman and have literally anything to do with video games.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
You must hate fox news
Delusibeta
Banned
1/10, must try harder.
EatinOlives
Member
No, by "reach" I mean reach. Of course she totally wasn't looking to shame Notch by calling him out on twitter, then her "omg other people feel you did" was totally a joke, m i rite?
Grade A research.
This.
What does the bolded have to do with Notch?
Also because you skipped over it last time:
Baconsammy
Banned
Her view of the tech industry isn't very high, that's for sure:
So the geeks who started tech were sexless women haters. Interesting.
So the geeks who started tech were sexless women haters. Interesting.
"Feel you did" wasn't the right way to say it, I'll admit that. But there were several people at the party that believed they saw hired women there.
Please try to keep up.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
pong is a misogynistic mans' power fantasy
EatinOlives
Member
Dude, stahp. You're digging too deep.
And that justifies her attempt at a scandal with Notch on Twitter how?
PedroLumpy
Member
Holy crap, well they must've been escorts then! I gotta go accuse Notch on twitter, 'scuse me.
That's not how research works. Saying you think the results would look like X does not mean that the results will look like X. Anyone can say they think anything. Research involves actually having facts.
It was an example of how the people attached to the party misrepresented the developer, Notch.What does the bolded have to do with Notch?
Also because you skipped over it last time:
Apologies if I skipped over that. They discussed it further and had lunch together. The reality of the situation may never be known, but this was an important step in (A) confirming Notch's innocence and (B) understanding that PR may have overstepped their boundaries this time.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, I realized the same thing when he did that. It's a shame that people actually defended him on the base that "he had insider info".
What? He is merely expressing his opinion, whether or not he's a moderator he has the right to express it. He banned the OP because he was going against the rules of the site.
And by the way, Holly Green was kinda attacking Notch for this. I actually think he had a lot of patience with this. 'Feeling' something does not make your opinions or position a fact.
You see "attempting a scandal," I see "starting an important discussion that will be advantageous for all parties involved."
You can start a discussion without blaming someone for something. Especially blaming them for something without having facts to back it up.
Codeblew
Member
So she did all of this to get a date with Notch? He should have told the crazy chick to get lost.
EatinOlives
Member
Look, if you choose to willfully misinterpret the actions being taken that's completely your choice, just don't pretend that you're "doing research" and everyone here is just "out to get her" by deluding yourself. We both know very well what she was doing wasn't "starting a discussion".
PedroLumpy
Member
Or not use a twitter account that has a couple thousand followers.
Considering she said herself she was satisfied with what she heard from Notch I think we're good as far as she goes but that sure isn't stopping the Big Bro Chest-Thumping Club from piling on.
Personally I don't think it matters if they did or didn't pay people to party but I think it's pretty remarkable that a forum with a 100+ page thread about "journalism ethics" and disclosure is taking anyone on the Internet at their word. I also find it amazing that many male industry people who aren't Arthur Gies and therefore are worth taking semi-seriously posted similar things - some were even there! - and they get a free pass.
But she never blamed him specifically. It was "you guys," because Mojang as a company is responsible for what one member happens to do, or allow. Which is why she discussed the dangers of out-of-control PR.
As for "Eyewitness testimonies is not evidence," well, how else are they supposed to know for sure? Plenty of people pass in and out of parties. One couple once snuck into a White House dinner without being cleared. Sometimes the only thing that you can rely on are the people who were there.
You need to get your vision checked then.
That's not enough to start a twitter shitfest. Only if one of those people was some reputable personality that addressed that issue directly with Notch or the promotor at the event. But that would preclude the twitter megaphone as the issue would be dealt at the venue immediately. Only the repercussions if there were any would transpire through twitter. As it is is just hearsay with zero substantiation besides the fact that there were pretty women at a party.
I'd say that Bennett Foddy is a pretty reliable witness. Even if you don't believe him, why everyone has chosen to go after Holly Green or Arthur Gies instead of the person who is making the claims is beyond me.
This kind of stuff is ridiculous. You want to have a substantive discussion then don't name call. Just because people don't agree with you doesn't mean there is some sort of hivemind.
We know you are up there on your pedestal. It's OK. You don't have to keep reminding us. It is highly evident.
faceless007
Member
Hmm....reading that tweet in the context of the full conversation, it's not quite as dumb as it seems standing alone. To be sure, Green definitely acted extremely irresponsibly and was drastically out of line throwing accusations the way she did without doing any homework. And even in the full conversation, she has an annoyingly presumptuous and demanding tone that Notch is admirably polite in responding to. She hasn't done herself any favors in this mess, and I'm not defending her in general. That said, in that tweet she isn't saying that Notch's opinion as to whether girls were hired is irrelevant (which would be loony), she's saying that there were multiple attendees who independently thought that there were paid escorts there, which should be cause for concern if Notch cares about how his company is perceived and what happens at events affiliated with his company. She's telling Notch essentially, "You should know what people are saying happened, so if they're wrong you should get that out there." Even if Notch is right and the company did nothing of the sort, the perception that they did could become a PR mess that he would want to get in front of (and he's been trying to).
Again, granted, she acted in a patronizing, smug, unwarranted, and irresponsible manner that wasn't deserved at all. But that tweet is not as ignorant as it seems on its own.
CouldBeWorse
Member
If she was truly concerned, she would have handled it privately. Doing this publicly undermines any "honorable" intentions that you think she might have had.
I disagree that her tone was unpleasant, but I mostly agree with you here. It's nice to have cooler heads explain this.
Also, you're right about the selective quoting business. It's hilarious to see users blast major television networks for using the technique, then turning around and engaging in it themselves.
Search this thread > "nutjob", "crazy", etc
The people who want to discuss are discussing. The people who don't popped in and quoted Evil0re, posted a gif and left. I apologize if you didn't realize who I meant there.
faceless007
Member
I never said her intentions were honorable. I said she was trying to tell Notch what at least a few witness accounts were saying about the party, which he might want to know. I agree it would have been better handled privately, but I don't presume to know her intentions.
Those "witness accounts" amount to one or two guys going "I think these people are escorts for some reason" and a bunch of other people reading that and going "OMG Notch hired hookers!"
Sure, when you put it that way, it sounds ludicrous. But your statement waters down the particulars.
"one or two guys" happen to be (and this is hardly a comprehensive list); Bennett Foddy, Nick Robinson, a developer at Infinite Ammo, Terry Cavanagh, Alex May, etc. These are hardly random voices in the crowd. These are influential developers, respected in their field, and wouldn't be making these statements based on "I think".
Please don't try to downplay this by reducing these people to vague terms.
You shouldn't dig so deep!
CouldBeWorse
Member
You absolutely implied that she had good intentions and I think we are ALL smart enough here to understand what her intentions truly were. She did this publicly for a reason.
Can you even come up with a reasonable explanation for why she would have done this publicly that don't involve ulterior motives?
Most of the people in your list are the echo chamber, not the "witnesses"
Horseshit.
Notch and Mojang are, for all purposes, one and the same in the public's eye. If her intent was to inform out of courtesy, she could have easily provided a DM, or contacted his partner instead.
Of course, that wouldn't have been as opportunistic, would it?
Twitter: giving know-it-alls a public platform since 1886
You can't DM someone on Twitter who isn't following you.
But Notch's email address is no secret.
Baconsammy
Banned
The funny thing is, I found her quote rather easily in the comments section of an article about paid escorts at tech parties dated a year ago this month.
faceless007
Member
OK, if you say so.
Why should I? I already said I'm not defending her in general.
But I try not to attribute to malice what could better be explained by stupidity. Twitter provides pretty ample proof of that daily.
I don't really understand the hilarious stretching to absolve her actions by some folks here.
Its all laid bare by this point. Someone somewhere makes an assumption when they see some attractive people.....
a few miles of tin cans and string later, someone tweets it.
She ups and runs with it looking for a platform.
She turns out to be wrong, and carries herself terribly (in terms of her tone) after the fact.
This one is all on her. If you have a hard on for arguing about sexism, misogyny or whatever, there HAS to be better topics and places for you to exercise your 'mighty' intellect (See the recent Samsung event thread, now THAT was a serious serious screwed up situation). This one is a closed book, and you just look silly trying to paint everyone that recognizes what happened here for what it was as monsters out to "attack" this poor girl.
Its all laid bare by this point. Someone somewhere makes an assumption when they see some attractive people.....
a few miles of tin cans and string later, someone tweets it.
She ups and runs with it looking for a platform.
She turns out to be wrong, and carries herself terribly (in terms of her tone) after the fact.
This one is all on her. If you have a hard on for arguing about sexism, misogyny or whatever, there HAS to be better topics and places for you to exercise your 'mighty' intellect (See the recent Samsung event thread, now THAT was a serious serious screwed up situation). This one is a closed book, and you just look silly trying to paint everyone that recognizes what happened here for what it was as monsters out to "attack" this poor girl.
Baconsammy
Banned
Sometimes stupid does more harm than malicious.
CouldBeWorse
Member
It's less malice and more opportunism.
You're giving her a free pass by chalking up to "stupidity" what was clearly premeditated.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Why not? It helps us have insight about her views on this kind of thing. Specially on the article that Bacon found it.
But you can tell that person through Twitter: "Hey can we discuss something throw DM?". There are always alternatives.
But in this case she actually did open that can with her tweets...