la flama blanca
Banned
Man child generalizes GAF and thinks his angry opinion matters, we sound like that to those people, yeah.
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EA and YouTube producers seemingly broke FTC guidelines with Battlefield 4 promotion
- Thread starter fluffydelusions
- Start date
Man child generalizes GAF and thinks his angry opinion matters, we sound like that to those people, yeah.
Thats not really possible without spending money in some capacity if they dont put out a demo for it. The best you can do on your own is rent it if its available. Of course, even that was difficult because of games in the previous generation having these online passes which block features from people who dont register the game.
My God stop with your PR centric bullshit. You sound just like a few other people who I've heard speak about this recently, who also happen to work in the industry. Downplay, downplay, everyone does it, everyone does it, this is the future guys, this is the future. You're not fooling us mate.
There are plenty who don't sell out to this sort of crap. Case in point Total Biscuit who is pretty vocal about these sorts of shenanigans.
You know what really pisses me off, EA got me with this shit.
I didn't really follow BF4 too much, but towards mid November my buddy and I were looking for an FPS to play. I obviously went to YouTube to get player impressions rather than read reviews since I felt I'd get a more honest view than a reviewer that is likely collecting stacks of Benjis for praise.
I came across some vids from both JackFrags and LevelCap, as they were the most watched and highest rated videos. Watched them, and everything seemed so far so good. Neither of them complained about glitches or crashes, and most of the problems I had heard were with the 7th gen problems which was to be expected since it was a cross gen game.
My buddy and I both then bought BF4 + Premium on Black Friday for $70. At first everything seemed fine, but days later we both experienced constant crashing and entire hour long matches worth of progress lost. Had I known about these issues beforehand, I would have either skipped the game entirely, or picked it up much later down the line. But because EA (and Microsoft) are unethical fuckbags, I got tricked into buying a broken ass game.
So fuck EA, and fuck the people who sold out their opinions to make a quick buck. I hope their fines are so outstanding that it will stop this kind of shit from happening in the future (doubtful).
I didn't really follow BF4 too much, but towards mid November my buddy and I were looking for an FPS to play. I obviously went to YouTube to get player impressions rather than read reviews since I felt I'd get a more honest view than a reviewer that is likely collecting stacks of Benjis for praise.
I came across some vids from both JackFrags and LevelCap, as they were the most watched and highest rated videos. Watched them, and everything seemed so far so good. Neither of them complained about glitches or crashes, and most of the problems I had heard were with the 7th gen problems which was to be expected since it was a cross gen game.
My buddy and I both then bought BF4 + Premium on Black Friday for $70. At first everything seemed fine, but days later we both experienced constant crashing and entire hour long matches worth of progress lost. Had I known about these issues beforehand, I would have either skipped the game entirely, or picked it up much later down the line. But because EA (and Microsoft) are unethical fuckbags, I got tricked into buying a broken ass game.
So fuck EA, and fuck the people who sold out their opinions to make a quick buck. I hope their fines are so outstanding that it will stop this kind of shit from happening in the future (doubtful).
He's like the one person in this thread with expertise?
Guess this explains why nobody was calling the game out when it launched.
While I don't think he's involved with this sort of stuff, coming out and being against it doesn't really prove anything.
entremet
Member
I'm not downplaying it, i'm giving information. If anyone is viewed as popular on Youtube, they will be a target for marketers and advertisers. They will be approached for marketing.
If you want unbiased non shill videos on youtube, go for guys who don't have a crap ton of subs or followers. You're more likely to get an honest view of the game. It's how the industry works, people should be made aware so they know what the hell they are seeing online, and don't fall for it. If you don't want to be informed, and pretend it doesn't happen, thats fine with me. I'm simply providing those who would like to be enlightened with how the industry works with the information to understand what content they are consuming online.
Just like the PR guy they had on Address the Sess, right?
Just because "it's the future" and "everyone does it" doesn't make it okay. We need to air it out that this practice is not okay in the video game industry.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
What a surprise.
It was pretty goddamn obvious from the very beginning. Getting flown out to DICE's studio, given free shit. Mordor saw this a mile away, glad to know we have confirmation. I just want to see who else is a shill on YouTube.
I didn't mean just on GAF, I meant the internet as a whole. For example, the PR guy who works with EA who spoke on Sessler's show the other day. A very different tune to everyone else.
No ones defending it? But he's the only one in this thread with specific knowledge on the practice. Why would you want to have an uninformed discussion?
Gormless Noodle
Member
That's the thing I believe we see happen often in the traditional media as well actually. If they employ these tactics with Youtube networks, then why wouldn't they with other media outlets?
So wait, EA and MS broke FTC rules but they aren't legally enforceable? What the point of having rules if you can't enforce them? The FTC should be legally obligated to enforce their own rules because if they don't, then any company could just bribe reviewers. Not enforcing your own rules is complete crap and will just lead to more bribes to more reviewers.
I'm not saying its ok. I'm simply pointing out how it is, so people can have an understanding and make their own decisions about what content they consume. It's better to atleast understand it happens, and think about the content you consume online than go about it blindly and take everything at face value.
It's good to think about the stuff you see and try and evaluate whether its influenced by marketing dollars in some way. If people are better informed, it would be harder to fall for the stuff being thrown at them. An understanding of the basic practice is a step towards that.
phosphor112
Banned
Sites like Digital Foundry were begging for video for comparisons (since that whole "resolutiongate" thing was going on) and Jackfrags got that shit like a week early.
More likely, sure, but to just assume anyone with a substantial following is a shill is just bollocks, and I'm sure a disservice to many who pride themselves in being open and honest. Many you can usually tell apart, because they will happily rip certain games apart, even major titles that others won't dare to.
My point is, stop with this everyone is doing it malarkey. Because it simply is not true. And not all promoters are alike either. For example, is it surprising to anyone EA and Microsoft are two of the biggest culprits? These have always been among the shadiest and most un-trust worthy in the industry.
Jeff at giantbomb has been mentioning for awhile that he is going to release a book basically talking bout all the shit bts in gaming press. Think he said it might be when he is done with gaming press in general
SneakyStephan
Banned
I remember the jackfrags videos being posted on gaf a lot before launch and they fueled the hype so much on here
he was overwhelmingly positive about the game and praised it to high heaven
you all got tricked
Actually TB got caught shilling for planetside 2
they hired him to do pr for them and he posted the videos on his channel without labeling them or mentioning he was getting paid
he ended up apologising and releasing a video with some criticism of the game in an attempt to salvage his name
he literally didn't say a bad thing about the game (performance, bugs, the grindy f2p nature etc etc) before he got caught
he was overwhelmingly positive about the game and praised it to high heaven
you all got tricked
Actually TB got caught shilling for planetside 2
they hired him to do pr for them and he posted the videos on his channel without labeling them or mentioning he was getting paid
he ended up apologising and releasing a video with some criticism of the game in an attempt to salvage his name
he literally didn't say a bad thing about the game (performance, bugs, the grindy f2p nature etc etc) before he got caught
N0REGARD4L1FE
Banned
Good. I hope Levelcap, JackFrags and Frankie all get a healthy dose of fines for betraying those that look to them. 0 integrity at all anymore.
How do you know it's malarkey? He's the expert. Shit, boogie even said that while he's never signed a deal like this, he routinely gets stuff for games he likes.
TekGryphon
Banned
A full list of the youtube channels that accepted EA's money but failed to disclose it should be posted in the OP so we can clear out our subscriptions.
The Janitor
Member
He's been also caught hacking in DayZ
Neuromancer
Member
Wow. It's disgusting to find out how many of these big names are absolute shills.
It's even worse that it seems that MS and EA are going to get away with doing this time and time again. I guess you really can't trust anything, other than direct footage you see with your own eyes.
It's even worse that it seems that MS and EA are going to get away with doing this time and time again. I guess you really can't trust anything, other than direct footage you see with your own eyes.
entremet
Member
Commanche Raisin Toast
Member
so you have no issue with influential people being paid to make potentially millions of people think that a product or service is good by taking advantage of the trust they've gained from the audience and then passing off paid-opinion as genuine? simply so the company paying them can get more sales or better favor amongst the audience?
i just want to make sure this is clear.
I feel like the completely biased reviews make it pretty apparent.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
Come on guys some of the melodrama in here is a bit much, oh no some of these youtube celebrities sold out! When the fact of matter is many of these youtube personalities (hell I'd wager most), started and continue to make video's because it provides them with an earning.
Hell, I thought you guys referring to them as celebrities, would have made you catch on (most celebrities do all kinds of promotions heck for many it's their major revenue source).
Did you not really believe this was happening, really.
Hell, I thought you guys referring to them as celebrities, would have made you catch on (most celebrities do all kinds of promotions heck for many it's their major revenue source).
Did you not really believe this was happening, really.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
I never heard of him until GAF was posting videos of BF4 footage since he was playing the PS4 version. Guess we made him a few bucks, and perhaps that's why he sort of downplayed the difference in the two versions.
Pisses me off that we have such dishonest sellouts on Youtube. Looks like I've been naive. If guys like Jackfrags were honest, it could've saved us some money. I hope his subscriptions plummet, as I'm sure he'll be doing Battlefront for more dough down the road.
And yet has never taken one up. Case in point.
By the way, the issue is not with these promotions, it's when the said users don't disclose they're part of one that causes the issue.
it's better to assume everyone does it until you evaluate the value of the content you consume for yourself.
I'm not saying don't watch your favourite youtube personalities. If you feel confident they aren't being paid for their content, then by all means, watch and enjoy their content. Just understand, that the higher their audience, the more attractive they are to an advertiser.
I still watch all sorts of content online, reviews, previews etc, even knowing what I know about the industry. I just also understand that I can't always take everything at face value and evaluate the content based on how valuable I feel it is. I enjoy TB just as much as the next guy, I even watch Sessler, but I will think about their content and evaluate it on my own.
My industry has made my cynical of most content I see. I can't even go to a movie anymore without seeing the stuff I've worked on. I'm probably more critical of this stuff simply because I work in it.
Making money off of banner ads and whatnot via Adsense is cool, its expected, its how most of these guys make money. But just be weary of the content.
krypt0nian
Banned
Unsubbed from every vg "review" channel, boogie included. I don't care if this "is the way things are done". I'm not having any part of you monetizing this shit stain system.
He said he does take stuff
Yep, what a shame.
All reviewers do. I used to get review and promo copies too. Free consoles to review outlets too. I know he got a free console from Microsoft / Sony, but I don't think he's on any CPM deal. He was still pretty honest and scathing about certain things, hopefully he doesn't sell out and stays on point.
mangochutney
Member
What is it based on though?
They posted a video about levelution. Therefore they are guilty. That seems to be the only proof that BF site is using.
Don't these things ask you to put tags and stuff in the video? I couldn't see any in the video of Jack's they linked to.
Also regarding the FTC, penalty or no penalty - Jack is from the UK and the ASA in the UK can very much impose a fine, though this typically is not done for the first few offences unless they're severe.
Yeah see that's why I think- without excusing CPM shit- the whole model is flawed.
You're making a lot of assumptions because Boogie portrays himself as a pretty honest guy. I think its better to put aside any personal biases and assume the worst. You-tubers are doing this for the money no matter how much of a passion they have for the hobby (at least the wholes who do it for a living). You can enjoy their content but take their recommendations with a grain of salt.
Even accepting free games/consoles/schwag is no different than taking cash.
Speedy Blue Dude
Banned
I assume everyone I like watching on YouTube is a sell out, and only watch for their commentary/humor and not their opinions.
RoosterTeeth? Basically a Microsoft company.
WhiteBoy7thst/WoodysGamertag/FPSRussia/iJustine/etc? All basically PR for Activision.
PewDiePie? I bet he does get paid by indies and such for exposure.
JackFrags, and the other other guys were just confirmed to basically PR for EA.
TotalBiscut did sell out yo Planetside before, and probably still does to other companies, just probably hasn't been leaked.
This guys are like TV, they have to eat and make money, and aren't above selling out to do so.
Quadraphonic
Member
People seem to be skipping over the important parts and getting depressed ahead of time:
There still are laws involved, but it's more a two-strike system.
Those companies wouldn't disclose that they got those letters. And even if they ignored them, we wouldn't know until the FTC found them guilty, though.
There still are laws involved, but it's more a two-strike system.
Those companies wouldn't disclose that they got those letters. And even if they ignored them, we wouldn't know until the FTC found them guilty, though.
FTC wouldn't/can't find them guilty tho. They'd file a complaint and then I assume an ALJ would decide the matter if it didn't settle.
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