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30fps feels smoother on a CRT
- Thread starter nkarafo
- Start date
LinkSlayer64
Member
Inject those cathode rays directly into my EYES
Now try some 60fps games on that CRT. 60fps is on a whole different level on a CRT, get ready to feel amazing.
I miss CRT. I've had plasma, it was wonderful. I've got OLED, it's incredible. I've got LCD in the bedroom, it's shit. But CRT, well.. when I see a game running on a CRT in the arcades I get goosebumps.
I miss CRT. I've had plasma, it was wonderful. I've got OLED, it's incredible. I've got LCD in the bedroom, it's shit. But CRT, well.. when I see a game running on a CRT in the arcades I get goosebumps.
nkarafo
Member
I know. Everything looks so clear and blur free...
Yep. Plasma is the nearest you'll get to that life-like, clear and blur-free look when gaming, but it's still not CRT level.
There is just something so 'alive' about the CRT picture that no amount of BFI and motion interpolation on a LCD or OLED will ever come close to re-creating. Well, maybe the latter could one day once LG ditches sample-and-hold.
sixteen-bit
Member
the feel of 60
AtomicShroom
Member
Everything except for image clarity/sharpness, especially near the edges.
Tiny text near the edges looks really blurry and unreadable on my old Sony CRT HDTV. It looks crystal clear on a LCD.
I wish I didn't have to make that compromise though...
InsaneTiger
Member
CRT was excellent for videogame framerates
cireza
Member
This.
nkarafo
Member
CRT looks sharper in motion though. Especially with side scrolling.
funny how we get rid of old equipment and then always want to go back to it. I've been listening to Vinyl (my father's collection) and can't believe how much sweeter it sounds. MP3 sucks! That, and now we are nostalgic for CRT. I once had a 1080i widescreen sony CRT. regret getting rid of it now. lol.
dragonyeuw
Member
Great thing is so many people are dumping them for free nowadays, I've gotten a few Trinitrons recently and due to pick up a 21" today which I want next to my PC for retro games. Can't wait to hook up my Saturn for some arcade Capcom vs fighting goodness
This. It's all about the motion with CRT.
Humans are analogue. Analogue things have more soul and we can't help but get drawn back to them
Now, where's my analogue games console?
I miss the colors, input lag and refresh rates of CRT monitors, but back in the day the kind of high end CRT monitors and televisions that retro collectors have today were really expensive and out of reach.
Personally I have always preferred 1:1 pixel accuracy over having to find a compromise for the picture geometry using 12 different knobs to make adjustments without never getting a perfect image. Also I really like it how my LCD monitors don't pulse on voltage changes or have weird shit and blurrier image on the edges.
LordOfChaos
Member
CRTs have less than 1 µs response time. One fucking µs.
The best LCDs we can get are 1000-2000x as slow, though of course there's diminishing returns at some point. But I find it interesting how the older tech is in some cases still better than most new tech in some aspects. I wonder at the alternate universe that instead of setting everything back many years for thinness, we instead carried on CRT development to its peaks.
OLEDs are going to make displays interesting again at least. OLEDs on a monitor have very low pixel retention times (on TVs they have lots of processing done that can add latency, most high end OLED TVs are more optimized for looking good than speed).
The best LCDs we can get are 1000-2000x as slow, though of course there's diminishing returns at some point. But I find it interesting how the older tech is in some cases still better than most new tech in some aspects. I wonder at the alternate universe that instead of setting everything back many years for thinness, we instead carried on CRT development to its peaks.
OLEDs are going to make displays interesting again at least. OLEDs on a monitor have very low pixel retention times (on TVs they have lots of processing done that can add latency, most high end OLED TVs are more optimized for looking good than speed).
Crimsonclaw111
Member
The only drawback to crt is the unholy amount of weight they have.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Except geometry and overscan.
nkarafo
Member
Heavy means good. Like when buying a psu. You want the heavy ones
I remember Gears of War and PGR3 on my old sony CRT. With 360 in progressive mode, the 30 fps were to juddery for me. Using interlaced mode, both were smoother. A lot more. Too bad I was not able to play them anyway.
Maybe in interlaced the console renders half frame resolution at double frame rate?
Maybe in interlaced the console renders half frame resolution at double frame rate?
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Heavy means good. Like when buying a psu. You want the heavy ones
I move too goddamn often to bother with hefty TVs anymore.
I'll stick to my trusty 17" Dell monitor.
Not really, but interlacing artifacts won't be as severe on a CRT nor require the laggy deinterlacing methods used on flatscreens.
LordOfChaos
Member
Heavy means good. Like when buying a psu. You want the heavy ones
There's probably some truth to that!
Actual Macbook PSU
Knockoff
Look at all the extra stuff that the real one uses to ensure smooth power delivery!
JoshuaJSlone
Member
Is the old set interlaced? Full-frame 30 fps game will still be using as many pixels as the screen can push. It won't allow for motion as smooth as 60 of course, but does lessen the improvement.
professor denim
Member
I still use crt. Own a small one ( since its lighter and easier to Tate ) for my Neo Geo Aes, Pcb and overall older systems needs.
Doc Holliday
SPOILER: Columbus finds America
I love CRT, I have a plasma now and they have taken that from me as well :/
But I don't miss carrying my 24 inch Panasonic Tau up a walk though...Holy shit!
But I don't miss carrying my 24 inch Panasonic Tau up a walk though...Holy shit!
My theory has always been that it's a combination of resolution, details and size.
The bigger the screen, the longer the distance between the frames making the individual frames stand out more.
And higher resolutions and details in the graphics means there is a lot more information you see move at 30 fps making the framerate even more obvious.
The bigger the screen, the longer the distance between the frames making the individual frames stand out more.
And higher resolutions and details in the graphics means there is a lot more information you see move at 30 fps making the framerate even more obvious.
Phatosaurus
Member
I never really knew enough about TVs at the time, I jumped on a HD LCD Toshiba back in 2007 (which I'm still using).
The picture quality was such a huge leap from the old Bush CRT I had that nothing else mattered.
The picture quality was such a huge leap from the old Bush CRT I had that nothing else mattered.
SeeNoWeevil
Member
Some of the higher end Sony LCDs with BFI are glorious at 60fps. Closest thing you'll get to a CRT imo.
QuantumZebra
Member
There's probably some truth to that!
Actual Macbook PSU
Knockoff
Look at all the extra stuff that the real one uses to ensure smooth power delivery!
I really can't tell if this is sarcasm or not, lol
You should grab a PVM and some RGB cables for your old systems. It's like experiencing a videogame-wet dream.
Metal Slug games are only 30fps but they do feel amazing on my CRT. It definitely doesn't feel or look slow by any means.
It's not the size. The temporal resolution of fixed pixel displays is lower at 30fps because they have a slower refresh rate than CRTs. I'm specifically talking about refresh rate, not input lag (which is a separate concept).
Yo, this man knows what's up ^
I used to own one of these things--
Calibrated too, was a beautiful display. I had to literally leave it out at the front of my home when I last moved. No one wanted it, even for free.
Closest things that remind me of the CRT motion is a plasma (still not as good though), and maybe even ULMB on my G-sync monitor.
I had to let it go, I've moved with it way too many times, and I never used it.
Calibrated too, was a beautiful display. I had to literally leave it out at the front of my home when I last moved. No one wanted it, even for free.
Closest things that remind me of the CRT motion is a plasma (still not as good though), and maybe even ULMB on my G-sync monitor.
I had to let it go, I've moved with it way too many times, and I never used it.
It isn't sarcasm. But PSU quality isn't necessarily predicated on how many components it uses.
In this case the official version definitely has better power delivery than the knockoff. It is also much more reliable but that is because of component quality rather than quantity.
Ivan
Member
Model and picture mode please?
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Warped geometry, chroma shift, low-quality input formats, and horrible overscan are typical flaws of subpar tubes.
Not really.
Truer words have never been uttered.
Motion might look good on those, but input lag is going to be terrible.
Unfortunately, even high end tubes can have warped geometry, chroma shift, and overscan.
neogaf.gif
amdb00mer
Member
The irony of this thread. I was online searching craigslist for one of the last model Sony or Samsung widescreen HD-CRT TVs. Could not find anything local. However, on eBay, I found plenty, but they were all local pickup only. 
They were super cheap too. I was going to use it for my retro systems and would mod each of them for HDMI/RGB output.
They were super cheap too. I was going to use it for my retro systems and would mod each of them for HDMI/RGB output.Wolfgunblood Garopa
Member
The best consumer grade CRTs are small and have an S-Video input.
The issue with HD CRTs is that they will take an SD or HD signal and display 1080i. That was an awkward era of gaming, where the consoles were outputing 480i in most cases. It looked weird.
I used to own one of these things--
Calibrated too, was a beautiful display. I had to literally leave it out at the front of my home when I last moved. No one wanted it, even for free.
Closest things that remind me of the CRT motion is a plasma (still not as good though), and maybe even ULMB on my G-sync monitor.
I had to let it go, I've moved with it way too many times, and I never used it.
The issue with HD CRTs is that they will take an SD or HD signal and display 1080i. That was an awkward era of gaming, where the consoles were outputing 480i in most cases. It looked weird.
The irony of this thread. I was online searching craigslist for one of the last model Sony or Samsung widescreen HD-CRT TVs. Could not find anything local. However, on eBay, I found plenty, but they were all local pickup only.
Don't go for HD-CRTs (unless they're professional monitors) if you want to use them with retro systems. That defeats the whole purpose. Most consumer HD-CRTs will scale the image which ruins what you're going for.
If you want a good experience, grab a broadcast-quality monitor or any SD CRT with component or SCART input.
professor denim
Member
I used to own one of these things--
Calibrated too, was a beautiful display. I had to literally leave it out at the front of my home when I last moved. No one wanted it, even for free.
Closest things that remind me of the CRT motion is a plasma (still not as good though), and maybe even ULMB on my G-sync monitor.
I had to let it go, I've moved with it way too many times, and I never used it.
Is it a 100hz one? I had a lot of issues with a similar model (pal). My super gun wouldnt sync no matter what. And the set wouldn't produce any scalines with any system i throw it... It was cool to watch dvds but not so good for sd gaming...
PyroPaperPlanes
Member
To contribute to discussion: I wouldn't mind trying to game on a nice CRT TV again. That being said, I do not miss the weight they possess.
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