SolarMystic
Banned
Probably because a lot of people feel it was in the top 3 for Halo campaigns, myself included.
Only Reach and 2 were better.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
343i made a bad Halo game (campaign)
- Thread starter pj
- Start date
Probably because a lot of people feel it was in the top 3 for Halo campaigns, myself included.
Only Reach and 2 were better.
IceBringer
Banned
Lol. Ok then.
Makoto-Yuki
Banned
I really enjoyed Halo 4 + 5. Sure, 5's story was short and you hardly played as MC and there wasn't a Halo but it kinda made sense. On it's own it might be a little disappointing but I'll judge 343 and the trilogy after Halo 6 is out.
1-3 were great games but I found 4 was a good step forward for the series. New story/enemies/character's and better gameplay. Halo 5 i'd say has the best combat in any Halo game (not including ODST/Reach not played them yet).
Really looking forward to 6.
1-3 were great games but I found 4 was a good step forward for the series. New story/enemies/character's and better gameplay. Halo 5 i'd say has the best combat in any Halo game (not including ODST/Reach not played them yet).
Really looking forward to 6.
Forerunner
Member
I actually really enjoyed it. Overall Halo 3 and ODST are still my favorites when it comes to gameplay, level design, and story. However, H5 is easily number three for me.
Easy Breezy
Neo Member
Agree with most of your points, especially about the prometheans which are some of the worst enemies I've ever encountered in a video game. Absolutely hate them.
Campaign was at least better than 4's but that's not really saying much.
Campaign was at least better than 4's but that's not really saying much.
Game was a blast in co-op, miles ahead of Halo 4. Like, the two are hardly comparable in terms of scope, level and gameplay design... the things most important to Halo. Does it match the mastery of Halo 3 in this regard? No, but nothing ever will.
I'm not as invested in the story and thought it took a weird turn, but I think it works to set up Halo 6. I am disappointed about the marketing bait and switch, though, because all of that stuff was interesting to me.
In short, I disagree. Not without it's flaws of course, but a strong game nonetheless.
I'm not as invested in the story and thought it took a weird turn, but I think it works to set up Halo 6. I am disappointed about the marketing bait and switch, though, because all of that stuff was interesting to me.
In short, I disagree. Not without it's flaws of course, but a strong game nonetheless.
Lys Skygge
Member
Yup. I actually finished it but it felt like a chore.
And the final Blue Team mission is FAR from the pinnacle of the series.
Bornstellar
Member
Loved the campaign in general. Most levels are just so rich with tactical options.
I guess something I kept asking myself early on.
Why couldn't the cool action stuff in cutscenes be actual gameplay?
GeorgioCostanzaX
Member
No it's just bad design and poor AI. Halo CE and the Bungie Halo encounters still feel fresh each time because the AI reacts and flanks.
I'd agree if we were talking about Halo 4, but Halo 5 definitely felt like a Halo game to me.
I finished Halo 5 solo on Legendary within a span of about 3 days, and it was sort of on my first playthrough as well (I did run a few chapters on co-op Heroic first). It was challenging but not that hard. It didn't feel as unfair/unbalanced as Halo 2 on Legendary solo does, in my opinion.
Nearly everything in Halo 5 is a noticeable improvement over Halo 4, and that includes the encounters. The Promethians are more fun to fight this time (way more fun than the Flood ever were), and there were actually a good amount of multi-faction battles (something seriously lacking in Halo 4). The areas also felt more open than the ones in Halo 4 as well, perhaps almost as open as Halo 3's.
But there's definitely room for further improvement. As far as the enemies go, perhaps something like combining the soldier and the crawler to form a single enemy type, one that can change between both forms, and is also capable of sticking to walls again like how the crawlers could in Halo 4. As for the Warden encounters, I didn't mind them too much, but they felt designed specifically for co-op play. The Warden's behavior and attacks should have had more variety, and tied to the number of human co-op players.
The only major flaw in Halo 5 is the team mate AI, which was my only real source of frustration; they were about as intelligent as a used diaper. Giving them power weapons made them a bit less useless "sometimes", and ordering them to focus fire on an enemy was somewhat useful though they'd get themselves killed way too easily. If this mechanic shows up in Halo 6 (and it surely will), the AI seriously needs better pathfinding and better use of cover while reviving team mates, along with a better sense of general self-preservation.
I agree with this.
Though I'd say the one thing Halo 5 was lacking which Halo 4 had was a major space-sim-ish dogfight. I can think of a couple of places where 343i could have fit something like that in.
I finished Halo 5 solo on Legendary within a span of about 3 days, and it was sort of on my first playthrough as well (I did run a few chapters on co-op Heroic first). It was challenging but not that hard. It didn't feel as unfair/unbalanced as Halo 2 on Legendary solo does, in my opinion.
Nearly everything in Halo 5 is a noticeable improvement over Halo 4, and that includes the encounters. The Promethians are more fun to fight this time (way more fun than the Flood ever were), and there were actually a good amount of multi-faction battles (something seriously lacking in Halo 4). The areas also felt more open than the ones in Halo 4 as well, perhaps almost as open as Halo 3's.
But there's definitely room for further improvement. As far as the enemies go, perhaps something like combining the soldier and the crawler to form a single enemy type, one that can change between both forms, and is also capable of sticking to walls again like how the crawlers could in Halo 4. As for the Warden encounters, I didn't mind them too much, but they felt designed specifically for co-op play. The Warden's behavior and attacks should have had more variety, and tied to the number of human co-op players.
The only major flaw in Halo 5 is the team mate AI, which was my only real source of frustration; they were about as intelligent as a used diaper. Giving them power weapons made them a bit less useless "sometimes", and ordering them to focus fire on an enemy was somewhat useful though they'd get themselves killed way too easily. If this mechanic shows up in Halo 6 (and it surely will), the AI seriously needs better pathfinding and better use of cover while reviving team mates, along with a better sense of general self-preservation.
I agree with this.
Though I'd say the one thing Halo 5 was lacking which Halo 4 had was a major space-sim-ish dogfight. I can think of a couple of places where 343i could have fit something like that in.
I guess the whole designing for multiplayer is what makes the experience so limiting, which is why a lot of fans hold Halo 1 to high regard (no restrictions in space).
I got bored of the wave of enemies in a room and the sudden "Oh one more thing fetch quest." Palmer again acts as armchair commander and doesn't join the Spartans, which reminded me of Spartan Ops.
In fact, I guess you could call Halo 5's campaign an evolution of Halo 4's Spartan Ops.
The Forerunner enemies were more satisfying to pick apart in this one. I agree.
However, they just aren't very fun to fight wave after wave like flood, and I had Spartan OPs flashbacks.
Halo 5's mechanics are very good. It's just the campaign feels very flat from what we've played before.
Better than 4's, but I'd still replay 1 any day. Maybe it's nostalgia tinting my goggles, but I feel all the memorable gameplay moments are ones that I've already experienced many times in past Halo games. I get Star Wars Republic Commando vibes from the reviving mechanic, which is a good thing to add. The level design spaces are too cramped, and that could be from its multiplayer inclusion.
RedAssedApe
Banned
probably good to mention if you played the campaign co-op or solo. i've always found halo campaigns to be pretty damn boring solo...but tons of fun co-op. then again...that's kind of the case for a lot of campaigns that have bad stories.
secretanchitman
Member
Absolutely agreed with you OP. Halo 5 is by far the worst campaign out of the series and probably one of the worst Ive played yet. Its really jarring because Halo 4 in comparison was a great game with really good visuals and gameplay that really impressed me for a 360 game.
The story just flat out is not interesting (the whole Locke vs Chief thing, just ugh), the warden fights are repetitive, the prometheans were just annoying with wave after wave, the level design (sanghelios aside) is not very good and the graphics are just meh to me. Its clearly not a 1080p game (I dont expect 1080p from an Xbone game but that is besides the point) but it still didnt stand out to me visually. I also didnt like that the encounters were also more or less the same to me. They were much more varied in the previous games but in this game, I felt like I was fighting similar enemies one after another and it just bored me.
Maybe its just me, but while the gameplay is in 60fps, a lot of the animations are not (30fps) and it gets annoying. This is easily seen when you have your teammates walk 10-20 feet in front of you and their movement animations are odd, or if you look at enemies from a far distance.
TLDR - I agree with the OP that Halo 5s campaign is the worst in the series, even worse than Halo 2s campaign.
The story just flat out is not interesting (the whole Locke vs Chief thing, just ugh), the warden fights are repetitive, the prometheans were just annoying with wave after wave, the level design (sanghelios aside) is not very good and the graphics are just meh to me. Its clearly not a 1080p game (I dont expect 1080p from an Xbone game but that is besides the point) but it still didnt stand out to me visually. I also didnt like that the encounters were also more or less the same to me. They were much more varied in the previous games but in this game, I felt like I was fighting similar enemies one after another and it just bored me.
Maybe its just me, but while the gameplay is in 60fps, a lot of the animations are not (30fps) and it gets annoying. This is easily seen when you have your teammates walk 10-20 feet in front of you and their movement animations are odd, or if you look at enemies from a far distance.
TLDR - I agree with the OP that Halo 5s campaign is the worst in the series, even worse than Halo 2s campaign.
Reading some peoples thoughts on Halo 5s campaign and it's just like did we even play the same game? Halo 5 easily, had some of the best gameplay out of any game of the series and the level design was amazing to me. I agree the story left a lot to be desired but I get what they were trying to do.
So many bad posts in this thread that just seem to be repeating recycled points about this game (half of which aren't even true) smh
So many bad posts in this thread that just seem to be repeating recycled points about this game (half of which aren't even true) smh
Messofanego
Banned
That's a shame to hear, so it's not the Republic Commando spiritual successor that I expected.
Worse campaign than Killzone Shadowfall and Battlefield games? Jeez, that sounds bad.
Id rank it slightly better than Shadowfall. On par with Resistance 2.
justsomeguy
Member
qft
Halo 5 has some of the best encounter designs in the series. If you're basing your opinion on the campaign after one or two playthroughs then your opinion is invalid.
There are so many ways to tackle each level. The only thing missing from this one are the epic scarab fights which were missing in this game for story/lore purposes.
There are so many ways to tackle each level. The only thing missing from this one are the epic scarab fights which were missing in this game for story/lore purposes.
I'm just not a fan of the direction 343i took the game.
I think the story is stupid and I think where they're taking the universe is silly. They had so many open threads at the end of Halo 3 and they completely blew it. I think the atmosphere is almost non-existent during the levels. I think vehicular gameplay and level design is for the most part incredibly boring and "safe". I think the art direction - while improved upon Halo 4's - pales in comparison to Bungie's trilogy and redesigning core assets completely was a huge mistake. Especially when you see things like the new Pelican. Even MC's armour, while pretty badass, was needlessly redesigned and the iconic look was thrown away like it was nothing. And then the music - nothing memorable there at all. That's something 343i aren't even close to replicating from the original trilogy.
I was too distracted by all of these flaws to enjoy Halo 5's campaign. It felt mediocre in every sense of the word. Honestly I consider Halo 4's to be better (though that was riddled with problems too)
tl;dr: I feel like 343i trying to distance themselves from Bungie's work has hurt the franchise more than anything. It doesn't "feel" like a Halo game. On its own merits, sure. I had fun. But looking back at Halo CE to Halo Reach, it's just disappointing to think about what could have been here.
I think the story is stupid and I think where they're taking the universe is silly. They had so many open threads at the end of Halo 3 and they completely blew it. I think the atmosphere is almost non-existent during the levels. I think vehicular gameplay and level design is for the most part incredibly boring and "safe". I think the art direction - while improved upon Halo 4's - pales in comparison to Bungie's trilogy and redesigning core assets completely was a huge mistake. Especially when you see things like the new Pelican. Even MC's armour, while pretty badass, was needlessly redesigned and the iconic look was thrown away like it was nothing. And then the music - nothing memorable there at all. That's something 343i aren't even close to replicating from the original trilogy.
I was too distracted by all of these flaws to enjoy Halo 5's campaign. It felt mediocre in every sense of the word. Honestly I consider Halo 4's to be better (though that was riddled with problems too)
tl;dr: I feel like 343i trying to distance themselves from Bungie's work has hurt the franchise more than anything. It doesn't "feel" like a Halo game. On its own merits, sure. I had fun. But looking back at Halo CE to Halo Reach, it's just disappointing to think about what could have been here.
No. I played through the campaign on heroic and was bored to tears. I immediately booted up Halo 3 and was blown away about how much better it was. It felt like a generation apart aside from graphics.
Halo 5 is not just missing the scarab fights, its missing everything that made Halo so fucking amazing. The dynamic AI battles, the awesome open ended sanbox, the vehicle combat, the magic that made halo amzing. Most importantly its missing a soul. Halo 4 and 5 lack soul, they feel so lifeless compared to Bungie games.
jfoul
Member
After spending a lot of time with story & mp, I think Halo 5 is a great game. I haven't had this much fun in MP since Halo 2. The game just plays and feels great at 60FPS. I feel like I'm in total control of my character, even with boost, clamber, ground pound and hover.
I enjoyed, and finished the campaign on Solo-Legendary. I liked the story and I wasn't put off by the ending. It's nice the grunts are hilarious again. The Promethans aren't bullet sponges anymore like in Halo 4. The campaign was a nice mixture of small and open areas, with some slight path choice. I really liked the hub areas that included interaction with NPCs. The hub/interaction is something I would like to see expanded on with Halo 6.
Halo 5 is definitely not a perfect game though, and I have some criticisms. The squad AI is sub-par and way too much Warden. The Warden should have at least evolved into different forms over the course of the story. Locke was kind of lame, but at least I was still playing as a spartan.
I enjoyed, and finished the campaign on Solo-Legendary. I liked the story and I wasn't put off by the ending. It's nice the grunts are hilarious again. The Promethans aren't bullet sponges anymore like in Halo 4. The campaign was a nice mixture of small and open areas, with some slight path choice. I really liked the hub areas that included interaction with NPCs. The hub/interaction is something I would like to see expanded on with Halo 6.
Halo 5 is definitely not a perfect game though, and I have some criticisms. The squad AI is sub-par and way too much Warden. The Warden should have at least evolved into different forms over the course of the story. Locke was kind of lame, but at least I was still playing as a spartan.
smashballTaz
Member
I reckon if 343i made the exact same game but it was Bungie's name in the credits you wouldn't be anywhere near as harsh on them.
Bungie were great at Halo, but all of the Halo games had their flaws. Halo 2 was basically 2/3 of the game it should have been. I've only played up to Chapter 7 in Halo 5, but I thought Halo 4 was fantastic and 5 is easily better in nearly every way.
Bungie were great at Halo, but all of the Halo games had their flaws. Halo 2 was basically 2/3 of the game it should have been. I've only played up to Chapter 7 in Halo 5, but I thought Halo 4 was fantastic and 5 is easily better in nearly every way.
Twilight Gap
Member
Bungie before Destiny? Yes, but only because they'd already made a bunch of good games and had a "free pass" cushion to mess up afterwards.
I'd say Halo 5 feels more Halo than Halo 4 did, but it still doesn't feel authentic cover to cover.
LinkToTheFuture
Member
You cant believe that people have a different opinion than you? My god how many times does this happen on forums where people are perplexed that someone can like something that YOU don't?
my god.
Twilight Gap
Member
I was baffled playing through and noticing that almost the entire third act of the game consists of mirror symmetric Forerunner kill chambers. I'm usually all over that kind of architecture but to see it featured so prominently like that was jarring. It felt like the book end to the game was a giant Multiplayer level.
Muskieratboi
Member
Why is everyone having trouble fighting knights? Unlike Hunters, which only have one weak point in the rear, Knights have three big glowing weak points you can shoot for massive damage.. Just take out the wings, and then land a couple of headshots, done!
Yeesh..
Yeesh..
Bornstellar
Member
Also, most times you take out a wing, they agro and expose their face which is an instant kill if you land the shot.
Twilight Gap
Member
first time i saw the face i nearly wet myself. i was scoped in with a sniper and it was like some ghost rider shit looked me straight into my scope
Either implement the four spartan squad mechanic properly, or drop it. In Halo 5 it felt like it was just shoe-horned in so they can say the game features four player drop in/out coop.
I might as well've been playing on my own as the three AI team mates were absolutely useless most of the time.
Not a fan of where the story is going. There is this massive universe of stuff to explore and I feel like we're just going through the same stuff over and over again. While the campaign in 5 was fun gameplay wise, the story was super lacking and I was very disappointed by it. Again thats just me, they are making this game for millions of people not to just please my tastes.
I don't hate Osiris or Locke as much as other people BUT Chief is Halo to me. So you only play as Chief three times is weak. If they are trying to bring Locke into centre stage more they need to do it gradually.
I might as well've been playing on my own as the three AI team mates were absolutely useless most of the time.
Not a fan of where the story is going. There is this massive universe of stuff to explore and I feel like we're just going through the same stuff over and over again. While the campaign in 5 was fun gameplay wise, the story was super lacking and I was very disappointed by it. Again thats just me, they are making this game for millions of people not to just please my tastes.
I don't hate Osiris or Locke as much as other people BUT Chief is Halo to me. So you only play as Chief three times is weak. If they are trying to bring Locke into centre stage more they need to do it gradually.
Black Mantis
Member
Exactly, your squad even say to target those spots. 343 really improved the Promethean enemies over H4 imo, from making them easier to despatch, to injecting a little personality in the Soldier types.
Black Mantis
Member
Care to elaborate?
Starfield
Member
It felt rushed and not well thought-out. The campaign was again a "if you didn't read the books you're fucked" story. Like, who would know who Kelly, Fred and Linda are if you didn't read the books. Noone.
The campaign was fan service but by any means a great campaign overall. I bet anyone who ONLY played the games will say the same.
The campaign was fan service but by any means a great campaign overall. I bet anyone who ONLY played the games will say the same.
Magic Mushroom
Member
I agree with most of the OP. Love the mechanics and some of the more vertical level design, but the awful friendly AI, repetitive Warden fights, pointless talk to two people on a map missions, cramped and linear later levels and poorly thought out encounter design are a real letdown.
THERE WAS ABSOLUTELY NO MISSION IN THIS GAME THAT SHOULD BE CONSIDERED WORST OF THE SERIES.
Worse than Cortana? Worse than the Library? NO WAY. I WON'T STAND FOR IT!
I'm not really pissed at you. but seriously I won't stand for it! HahaYeah boss fights got repetive. And Forerunner aren't as fun to fight as Covenant (but aren't less fun than Halo3 flood) But there are no absolute stinkers in this game if you ask me.
343i also gets shit for there vehicle sections. But they deserve kudos for making them as fun for the guy on the ground as they are for the guy piloting. Also, the last vehicle mission is just as wide open as any classic halo level.
Also, I had only 1 issue with the friendly AI, and it seemed to be because I glitched out of the map. I have no idea why everyone else's has been so dumb, but I did issue quite a few commands.
Goldfishking
Member
The 'you need to read the books to understand the story' arguement is lazy at this point. As someone who has read the books and even the newest comics there is nothing in the extended universe that changes halo 5's story. Everything you need to know about blue team (I.e. they're like Johns family) is explained in the campaign.
el_Nikolinho
Neo Member
I don't know how people can say halo 5 campaign is worse than 2. Playing it in the master chief collection brought back the annoying memories.
Bits N Pieces
Member
The only niggle I have is with the AI Fireteam. They're adequate to pretty good on every difficulty except from Legendary.
Doing my solo run just now and it's a ball ache, its like there scared to actually shoot there weapons.
This campaign is going to take the most amount of time to complete out of every Halo game I've played - which is all of them.
You have a fuel rod cannon, Buck. Fucking use it :/
Doing my solo run just now and it's a ball ache, its like there scared to actually shoot there weapons.
This campaign is going to take the most amount of time to complete out of every Halo game I've played - which is all of them.
You have a fuel rod cannon, Buck. Fucking use it :/
immortald3ath
Member
Just finished it. I liked it. Not the best in series but better than Halo 2, Reach, and Halo 4.
Twilight Gap
Member
The latter levels of Halo 2 are definitely bad. If I were to play them back to back now, I'd probably hate Halo 2 more if not solely for the fact that it doesn't have fun abilities to make traversing through Quarantine Zone bearable.
But Halo 2 back in the day...whether solo or co-op, I used to play that shit on Legendary all the time and it was insanely replayable. The salt ever floweth from those Jackal Snipers. Nostalgia and all that, but I still had a great time with that game despite its endless problems. There were so many great (and memorable but not so great) encounters and set pieces in that game. I can tell you where we met a hallway of Snipers, where we met a room full of sword Elites, where we were chased by a pair of Hunters, where we fought a pack of Brutes, where half a dozen Ghosts came after us, where Flood jumped out from the walls on top of us, etc.
In Halo 5, I can tell you... about those waves of endless spawning Prometheans and uhh...that one time Covenant came from that one place somewhere.
Halo 5 doesn't have that magic, neither in the story nor the gameplay, and anywhere it tries to it's forced. Even if it had Splitscreen, I doubt I'd put as much co-op time into it.
I pretty much agree with everything said in the OP. Though the thing that irritated me the most personally was the story itself and how painfully stupid it was. At times it literally felt like it was written by a five year old. It also carries on the tradition from Halo 4 of continually fucking up the series lore. Because who ever wrote the recent games seriously must not have played 1-3. Because I seriously can't explain or justify all the absolutely idiotic retcons 343 made.
But yeah. Those Warden fights can fuck off into space.
But yeah. Those Warden fights can fuck off into space.
I dunno, I beat the last 3 levels of H2A immediately after beating H5 and while not great, was still waaaaay more fun than the last few levels of H5.
And I would agree there's few to no memorable encounters in H5. The prometheans are so dull to fight that I'm not sure good encounter design could have saved it.
You have got to be joking. It is much better than either one of those stinkers. It blows my mind anybody would even think they are comparable.
FunkyPajamas
Member
Cortana and Halo 2's library are the worst, easily. Library in CE is awesome.
Whoever thought falling down shafts into flood infested areas over and over and over again was good level design has no business being in the game industry.