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[Xe4]

I think a lot of people don't understand that very few people find a book in a library unless they're looking for it, or at least something like it. Libraries contain tens of thousands, sometimes hundreds of thousands of books (or millions, in the case of the largest libraries) on a vast variety of topics and even more online. People either know how to read the particular libraries organizational system, or they ask for help in order to find the type of book they're looking for.

The chances of a kid just stumbling upon it is very unlikely. Children are usually not allowed to check out books from a library without their parent okaying it first (and let's be honest, a kind wouldn't find this book very interesting anyhow).

The whole point is moot anyhow, because it's not a hateful book, but a book looking at a hateful movement trying to influence America by the way of different songs.

meanwhile in the UK

I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say. Most libraries have a black culture and black writers section much larger than even that (or several even, depending if you're talking sociologically, historically, or whatever).

Edit: Oh, you're talking about having a series of books solely put in a section because they had black authors. That's unfortunate.
Edit: I understand that stuff like that collection leads to black authors getting more visibility too, that's a good thing. I definitely see two sides to the argument.

 

[ghst]

"don't judge a book by its cover" comes from the halcyon age before every puritanical internet hero learned the word "optics".

 

[daveo42]

You reprehensible would-be book burners should maybe try reading the damn book.

Here, I'll even help you out, this is the first thing in it:

Some of you need to take a long fucking look in the mirror.

Thank you. People advocating to burn a book where the author is essentially cataloging the songs and people who wrote them as a reminder of the what the KKK truly are and decided to write it because of direct comparison between the Taliban and the KKK after 9/11. If nothing else, read the A Note to the Reader section in its entirety before commenting on burning it.

Sheesh. Anyone advocating book burning might as well just shack up with the ultra-conservatives right now.

 

[More_Badass]

Could a mod update the title and OP, then, so we can avoid constantly having to explain to people that this is a history book? The OP doesn't even have a source.

Yeah, was working on that. Added some context and details to the first post

 

[norm9]

No, it's incredibly unnecessary. Imagine being a writer and having your book removed from the rest of the library to be put in its own space. Your work is only viewed by people interested in the fact that you were black while you wrote it.

You could have had a list of recommended books and not have all the cons.

I see what you're saying, but I disagree though. A list of recommended books doesnt work because they have to look at the list and then now try to find it in the sea of other books. And while looking for this book, theyve now been distracted and grab some other book. And that's not taking into account that the book on the recommended list might be checked out, so they've had to jump through hoops for possibly no reason.

The pictured shelf allows for serendipitous discovery of these authors.

I can understand why some people may not like it though.

 

[Izuna]

I see what you're saying, but I disagree though. A list of recommended books doesnt work because they have to look at the list and then now try to find it in the sea of other books. And while looking for this book, theyve now been distracted and grab some other book. And that's not taking into account that the book on the recommended list might be checked out, so they've had to jump through hoops for possibly no reason.

The pictured shelf allows for serendipitous discovery of these authors.

I can understand why some people may not like it though.

What about the vast majority of people looking for any book having no chance to find one written by a black author? Or the fact that there is no specific genre in the collection?

 

[LionPride]

This is what happens when peoole don't even try and actually read up on shit and just run with what first comes to mind

Advocating for burning books because you ain't read, give me a break

 

[Vicetrailia]

This is what happens when peoole don't even try and actually read up on shit and just run with what first comes to mind

Advocating for burning books because you ain't read, give me a break

To be fair the OPs should do a better job of setting the tone too. They left this one wide open.

 

[LionPride]

To be fair the OPs should do a better job of setting the tone too. They left this one wide open.

Definitely

But people should also read for themselves and not rely on a post on a message board that's a summary

 

[norm9]

What about the vast majority of people looking for any book having no chance to find one written by a black author? Or the fact that there is no specific genre in the collection?

I'd guess that the library believes that the number of people checking out the books in a clearly marked section is higher than if they were in the rest of the stacks and having people stubbling upon them, based on their circulation stats.

There are Gay and Lesbian, Asian and Pacific Islander, Latino Heritage Months and books are pulled from the stacks to make a display to spotlight for people who may not be aware of the stuff they've written to check out and take home. Because libraries do want people to check out their books as it decides funding, budgets, and they're usually the first to get the ass end of city financial crises.

 

[Aytumious]

No, it's incredibly unnecessary. Imagine being a writer and having your book removed from the rest of the library to be put in its own space. Your work is only viewed by people interested in the fact that you were black while you wrote it.

You could have had a list of recommended books and not have all the cons.

I've seen similar displays during Black History Month. Do you find those distasteful?

 

[Sulik2]

"Where they burn books, they also burn people." H. Heine

This is hyperbolic. In this case it seems the book is historical and not pro kkk so it's fine. However, we have literally watched in the last 10 years as right wing propaganda has caused a massive upsurge in neo-nazi and white supremacists movements in country after country. Modern events shows us there NEEDS to be a better way to handle freedom of speech then the way the USA does currently with everything allowed because of slippery slope arguments. We can see where that leads us.

Germany's use of censorship while still maintaining a free media and entertainment culture without eliminating their own past sins with censorship is the shining example that every Western democracy should be trying to imitate. Unregulated free speech no longer works with the pervasive nature of news and entertainment in the internet age. There has to be control of hate speech and fake news or eventually society will explode on itself as reality is forgotten.

 

[Izuna]

I've seen similar displays during Black History Month. Do you find those distasteful?

This is year round.

 

[OG Shaka Zulu]

Further underscores how deep of a movement the KKK was and is. I'd be curious to look at this stuff.

 

[hateradio]

Looking at the author's work, he also published books on:
- Suffragist (Suffragette) sheet music
- Presidential sheet music
- American political music
- A collection for the Teddy Roosevelt library on songs and music related to TR
- He is currently working on a book of historical music from Florida

So it's pretty obvious the author's angle is that he is an ethnomusicologist of American political music. Although his PhD is in Public Admin, but he's apparently working on a separate PhD in Music.

I don't think there is an ill-intent in producing the book.

Personally, I don't think it should be removed. It would be interesting to read, but probably should just be removed from the public's view as to not create vast outrage like this.

 

[More_Badass]

I don't think there is an ill-intent in producing the book.

Personally, I don't think it should be removed. It would be interesting to read, but probably should just be removed from the public's view as to not create vast outrage like this.

The outrage was from the contextless picture and how the book was presented. The person in the library likely would read through the jacket or summary at least, as well as have the context of the section where the book was found

 

[Xe4]

This is hyperbolic. In this case it seems the book is historical and not pro kkk so it's fine. However, we have literally watched in the last 10 years as right wing propaganda has caused a massive upsurge in neo-nazi and white supremacists movements in country after country. Modern events shows us there NEEDS to be a better way to handle freedom of speech then the way the USA does currently with everything allowed because of slippery slope arguments. We can see where that leads us.

Germany's use of censorship while still maintaining a free media and entertainment culture without eliminating their own past sins with censorship is the shining example that every Western democracy should be trying to imitate. Unregulated free speech no longer works with the pervasive nature of news and entertainment in the internet age. There has to be control of hate speech and fake news or eventually society will explode on itself as reality is forgotten.

Suppose hypothetically that this was a racist propaganda book. Do you think that it should be removed from the public library and burned? Or censored that no public library can get it in the first place? No doubt there is a history of people using written works to promote discrimination and racism (among other disgusting things).

However, there is an equally large and equally wrong history of books being banned, or worse, burned because they contained ideas that were thought wrong. One cannot ignore this when discussing the elements of racism in society. Making an argument that racist books should be removed from our libraries is similar to making an argument that the Confederate flag should be removed from museums. Both represent removing the symbols a sickening undercurrent of American society that continues to this day so that people cannot learn of them.

Removing them will help neither reduce the problem nor contribute to a more open and free society. All it will do is tuck the problems away so that we can pretend that there were no such disturbing works created in the first place. And that is not something that I can support.

 

[jorma]

This is hyperbolic. In this case it seems the book is historical and not pro kkk so it's fine. However, we have literally watched in the last 10 years as right wing propaganda has caused a massive upsurge in neo-nazi and white supremacists movements in country after country. Modern events shows us there NEEDS to be a better way to handle freedom of speech then the way the USA does currently with everything allowed because of slippery slope arguments. We can see where that leads us.

Germany's use of censorship while still maintaining a free media and entertainment culture without eliminating their own past sins with censorship is the shining example that every Western democracy should be trying to imitate. Unregulated free speech no longer works with the pervasive nature of news and entertainment in the internet age. There has to be control of hate speech and fake news or eventually society will explode on itself as reality is forgotten.

A good first step would perhaps be to ban suggestions to do away with free speech.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

ITT we saw who was too lazy to read a book (despite the link provided) that mostly contained songs mocking the kkk.

 

[Glass Shark]

All you have to do is read the author's note at the beginning to realize this isn't something celebrating KKK music, it's documenting it for posterity. I mean, the author compares the Klan directly to Nazism, there is absolutely no ill intent.

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

ITT you had people saying it should be removed, others that it should be locked up in a basement, or that it shouldn't be allowed to be checked out out of the library, or that it should be in a specific category of undesirables, and so on.

Absolutely fucking embarrassing.

If you're ever interested in history or study history you should be the sideways looks a lot of people give you when they see you read historical books. It's even more interesting because most of the people with these reprehensible views are too stupid to read, to learn, to inform themselves. Most aren't becoming their way from reading too many books, they're doing it from their own shitty bias or from what someone they are close to believes, etc., most people don't reach their conclusions by reading too many books. Like I'd really love a statistic of Christians who have read the bible cover to cover or other similar stuff.

 

[Sun Bather]

burn all books except games fan fiction imo

 

[The Fatal Englishman]

Keep it in the library, but put it in a special section and maybe not let it be loaned out? That'd be my thought process on the matter. You wouldn't necessarily want a 10 year old accidentally picking a book like that up, but there is no reason why someone doing research on history shouldn't have access.

Should we place histories of Fascism in the restricted sections too? Should scholarly analyses of Islamist fundamentalism be hidden from the public eye?

The book is a critique of KKK propaganda. It is not propaganda itself.

Human history is not a safe space and one of the purposes of studying it in the first place is to understand and educate the public about how awful things happen.

 

[DrSlek]

I'm conflicted.

I don't think it should be destroyed, but it's potentially a dangerous influence. Perhaps lock it up in archives and have it only available upon special request.

 

[Sun Bather]

I'm conflicted.

I don't think it should be destroyed, but it's potentially a dangerous influence. Perhaps lock it up in archives and have it only available upon special request.

You think we should do this to mein kampf also?

You do realize that most of this and lots of other similar shit can be found just with a Google search right?

I don't think the book is dangerous at all. It's a historian documenting this, not glorifying it in anyway. If anything I think this could make people second-guess their racist views, however I doubt that as well. But my point is, if you are searching out books about kkk music, chances are you are already pretty fucking racist and into that kind of music, or probably like the majority :just have an interest in the history of racism.