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[Tristam]

I guess I'll weigh in now since I said I would.

I was a fat kid. There's no way around that. I want to find an old picture of me when I was in 8th or 9th grade. I'll hunt one down at some point...Just for argument sake, I was 240 pounds in 9th grade. That's what, 14 years old? I as BIG.

My after school snacks were a package of poptarts and a twinkie or a 1/3 of a package of Oreos or a half-bag of chips. This was always accompanied by a soda. It was bad and I knew it...I was actually sneaking food into the basement to eat before dinner.

My mother was doing Herbalife sometime during my freshman year of HS. I approached her and said I wanted to try it because I wanted to lose weight. She was on it because she must have thought she was overweight (she wasn't). But she agreed to let me try it after she had been on it for a few months to make sure it wasn't terrible for you.

Well, months later, I actually DID loose a LOT of weight - I was down to ~140 pounds. My breakfasts were these breakfast bars (they remind me of Quest bars in texture) that she made using the shake powder they give you mixed with oatmeal and peanut butter and milk? I don't remember, but they were actually really good. My lunch was usually a sandwich, some fruit, a bottle of water, and a small one of those breakfast bars for dessert (it was sweet and I love sweets). Dinner was a meal shake.

Anyways, I don't know if Herbalife actually WORKS, but at the time, it did for me. When I was on it, they were still using ephedra. So...But there were a LOT of pills that you took. I'm not even sure what they all were, but I took like 5 or 6 with each meal. I also didn't really change my activity habits during the time I was on it.

However!

Mentally, I was approaching my eating habits a LOT differently. I went from way too many carbs, calories, and grams of fat a day to SIGNIFICANTLY less. So part of me says the system was a sham and only put me in a mental state to eat less and stick with it. I mean hell, a month before my honey moon, I cut down my carb intake to like, 20g a day and lost like 15 pounds without even trying (I ate low carb tortillas, lots of nuts, salads, chicken, steak, and bacon). So it's clear that I can loose weight by cutting out sugars and carbs, but I think we already knew that.

So that's how I take it. I don't like the company and don't agree with the whole MLM/pyramid scheme thing. I think it's shit and completely terrible for folks who are easily sucked into it. Having said that, the product (of the late 90's early 2000's) DID change my life. I would never do it again nor ask anyone to do it today, though...I think there are cheaper, better, and safer ways to loose weight than taking a bunch of pills that may or may not be doing anything.

And I've already text my mother to see if she can't scan me a pic of me in 8th/9th grade so I can show how different I looked, ha.

Don't you think your drastic change in diet influenced your weight loss? As far as the nutritional bars, the point is that you could have accomplished the same thing with another (likelier cheaper) set of bars. EDIT: I see you mostly addressed these points, but it's still a leap to credit the change in your life to the product in and of itself. You more or less concede that implicitly even while explicitly saying it changed your life.

 

[backflip10019]

How anyone can defend a pyramid scheme that feeds off of people who are just looking to work hard at a job and make some money baffles me.

I was fooled into going on an "interview" for one of these jobs in high school. The company I met with, "MPH Advertising" had an opening for a "marketing intern." I say this loosely because what it turned out to be was an on-the-job "training session" where we drove around to nearby areas and sold grilling equipment to people. They could still technically call it "marketing" because they were promoting products through word of mouth -- the sales themselves "were only secondary."

I was taken around by this poor sonofabitch who had caviar dreams. He kept saying things like "I've been working here for 5 months... just one more month til I make my 80k." I asked how much he made now, and he said "around $300/week." I don't know if he could do the math, but that's not even close to 80k. He took me to stores all over the place where we tried to sell customers and people working behind the counter these shitty grilling products (not even sure how this is legal). I had to carry around a ~50 lb bag of the stuff all afternoon. There were several others who were in the running for this "internship", and I got a "second interview" later that day. Pretty much, all I did was sit down with one of the higher up dudes who interviewed me. By the end of the day, I was exhausted and beyond pissed off that I wasted my time with these assholes, so I just tanked it on purpose so I could leave.

In short, fuck all these pyramid schemes and the people who buy into them. Anyone who has worked a real job knows that these companies are toxic to the job economy.

 

[Exotoro]

she's trapped into a pyramid scheme

dunno what you can possibly do but by all means try and get her the fuck out of it

 

[blackflag]

Herbalife is the biggest joke, I had a friend on FB that started pushing this stuff. One day he told me he wanted to do a survey on me and when I questioned him more he wanted to start pushing Herbalife on me.

I looked into this junk and they selling products for hundreds of dollars that are no better than other stuff you can just get at bodybuilding.com or whatever.

This dude tells me...."This is pharmaceutical grade Whey. You'll get bigger".....Ok first there's no such thing...2nd..I'm (was) 235 lbs 12% bf and can bench 355....I don't think your joke of a product gonna help me do anything.

We haven't talked since.

 

[xnipx]

[Citation needed]

Ok. Herbalife costs $67 to join as a distributor. Signing up someone you see no money until they start selling product in volume.

You make 25% commission on all sales. Average sale is over $350 per month.

Once you sell over a certain amount your commission increases up to 50%

Of course you get downstream income from people under you but the basic premise of herbalife is to sell product not sign up health coaches.

 

[xnipx]

Lmao another brainwashed Herbalife lemming appears! This is an awesome thread.

So I'm brainwashed because I saw the results first hand and tried it for a month? Lol you got it kiddo.

I know people in true pyramid schemes who threw away all of their money chasing a carrot. Herbalife is direct sales and distribution through an individual channel. And it helps people get healthy. Can't hate on that.

 

[backflip10019]

Ok. Herbalife costs $67 to join as a distributor. Signing up someone you see no money until they start selling product in volume.

You make 25% commission on all sales. Average sale is over $350 per month.

Once you sell over a certain amount your commission increases up to 50%

Of course you get downstream income from people under you but the basic premise of herbalife is to sell product not sign up health coaches.

Except that once you sign people up under you, your work is done. Money would theoretically keep flowing in. Recruitment seems like a much more attractive offer than peddling overpriced products that nobody wants. That's why these things work.

 

[Maluf360]

I do recommend this video from the brazilian blogger 'Otário' (sucker) - there's english sub in there:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyuN-xUdCG4

 

[xnipx]

Except that once you sign people up under you, your work is done. Money would theoretically keep flowing in. Recruitment seems like a much more attractive offer than peddling overpriced products that nobody wants. That's why these things work.

Except you don't make that much money that way. The top producers I know in Herbalife make their money from their own sales not downstream. Which is why most of their time is spent in client acquisition not finding new "health coaches".

But feel free to lump them in with all the other pyramid schemes. Makes me no difference I don't use or sell it. I was just trying to correct some misinformation.

 

[Esch]

It's a pyramid scheme because that's what the media and other uneducated people will tell you and so we all believe it. I myself have gotten great results on Herbalife and so have the people I've also turned the products on to. They are happy and are enjoy the shakes and everything else and that means a lot more to me than the money. Like everything with building a business it will take hard work to make some money.

Herbalife has been in business for 34 years and in 94 countries around the world so if they were doing something dishonest or illegal, they probably would have been brought down long ago.

 

[Kinitari]

Except you don't make that much money that way. The top producers I know in Herbalife make their money from their own sales not downstream. Which is why most of their time is spent in client acquisition not finding new "health coaches".

But feel free to lump them in with all the other pyramid schemes. Makes me no difference I don't use or sell it. I was just trying to correct some misinformation.

Well, just because anecdotally the top sellers you know don't make most money from recruiting doesn't change the fact that

1. There is essentially a membership fee, and the higher your "rank" the higher that monthly fee.

2. That fee is in the form of a required purchase of product. So for every person you recruit, the more you make, especially if you encourage them to be "supervisor" level, which requires thousands of dollars in monthly purchases, and which also results in a higher percentage of commission for whomever recruited this supervisor.

 

[Aquamarine]

It's a pyramid scheme because that's what the media and other uneducated people will tell you and so we all believe it. I myself have gotten great results on Herbalife and so have the people I've also turned the products on to. They are happy and are enjoy the shakes and everything else and that means a lot more to me than the money. Like everything with building a business it will take hard work to make some money.

Herbalife has been in business for 34 years and in 94 countries around the world so if they were doing something dishonest or illegal, they probably would have been brought down long ago.

You're in the cult, man. It's a real shame a GAFfer is caught up in the middle of a lousy pyramid scheme. :-(

 

[nicoga3000]

Don't you think your drastic change in diet influenced your weight loss? As far as the nutritional bars, the point is that you could have accomplished the same thing with another (likelier cheaper) set of bars. EDIT: I see you mostly addressed these points, but it's still a leap to credit the change in your life to the product in and of itself. You more or less concede that implicitly even while explicitly saying it changed your life.

What I said is that the product changed my life, but I guess I should have the clear enough on that. The product HELPED change my life is the better way to put that. As I said:

So part of me says the system was a sham and only put me in a mental state to eat less and stick with it.

But the product is honestly what got me to be that way. Now that I'm NOT 14 years old, I understand (or can convince myself) that it wasn't the pills or the shakes, it was the change of diet (carbs, sugars, calories) that had a major impact on my life.

 

[DrFunk]

It's a pyramid scheme because that's what the media and other uneducated people will tell you and so we all believe it. I myself have gotten great results on Herbalife and so have the people I've also turned the products on to. They are happy and are enjoy the shakes and everything else and that means a lot more to me than the money. Like everything with building a business it will take hard work to make some money.

Herbalife has been in business for 34 years and in 94 countries around the world so if they were doing something dishonest or illegal, they probably would have been brought down long ago.

Funny you say that: FTC investigation could topple Herbalife's alleged pyramid scheme

 

[bcl0328]

If anyone hasn't seen this, you should definitely watch.

Penn & Teller: Bullshit - Easy Money [NSFW]

All about pyramid schemes.

 

[samus i am]

Interesting, I have a friend that does the same thing. Is it a cult or something?

 

[LevityNYC]

About Sept of last year. I was looking for new employment, and applying everywhere. I get a phone call out of the blue of a company I didn't apply to asking me to do a phone interview right at that moment. I thought it was weird, but I did it, then did an in person interview where the entire interview was me asking them questions. WTF.

Then they claimed that I could make 2000 per week by doing nothing and that if I recruit more people I get half of their commission. When I left I was so mad that I got suckered into wasting a day that it helped push me to go back to school to get a special education credential. So at least there was some good to come out of it.

Also, fuck you American Income Life.

AIC almost got me before NYL did. Pretty much all financial service companies are BS.

 

[Forsythia]

I have a friend who does the same thing, 99% of her posts are about Herbalife. It's ridiculous.

 

[rokkerkory]

Ok. Herbalife costs $67 to join as a distributor. Signing up someone you see no money until they start selling product in volume.

You make 25% commission on all sales. Average sale is over $350 per month.

Once you sell over a certain amount your commission increases up to 50%

Of course you get downstream income from people under you but the basic premise of herbalife is to sell product not sign up health coaches.

How many recruits do you need in order to make $ from recruit commissions? How much products must you move per month to keep 25 or 50% commissions?

 

[SquiddyCracker]

It's a pyramid scheme because that's what the media and other uneducated people will tell you and so we all believe it. I myself have gotten great results on Herbalife and so have the people I've also turned the products on to. They are happy and are enjoy the shakes and everything else and that means a lot more to me than the money. Like everything with building a business it will take hard work to make some money.

Herbalife has been in business for 34 years and in 94 countries around the world so if they were doing something dishonest or illegal, they probably would have been brought down long ago.

But what about Google?

 

[xnipx]

How many recruits do you need in order to make $ from recruit commissions? How much products must you move per month to keep 25 or 50% commissions?

0 and 0.

Once you sign up for $67 you get a 25% discount. So essentially anybody you sell it to from ur website has a marked up price by 25% and you keep the rest. You get a larger discount the more you sell.

 

[backflip10019]

If anyone hasn't seen this, you should definitely watch.

Penn & Teller: Bullshit - Easy Money

All about pyramid schemes.

Whoa, might wanna throw a NSFW tag up there, buddy.

Great video, though. Also, great tits.

 

[Alligatorjandro]

This guy my cousin is married to is always posting things about ACN. Some wealth building company.

 

[speculawyer]

Evidence that the Herbalife pyramid is coming close to collapse?

 

[Purple Cheeto]

My friend is a scientist for Herbalife who helps make sure all the products are legal and even she thinks the way they distribute and sell shit is illegal.

 

[Cyan]

How many recruits do you need in order to make $ from recruit commissions? How much products must you move per month to keep 25 or 50% commissions?

Since the guy doesn't seem to want to give a straight answer, did a little googling. There's an "annual processing fee" to stay in the program. As long as you pay that, you get your 25% commission (which it really isn't--it's a 25% discount on product, which you then must turn around and sell at full price in order to get that commission). But! There are of course different levels of discount that you can get. The more you order per month, the more discount, maxing out at 50% with a high enough volume (this is based on "Volume Points" which appear to be used for obfuscation purposes--I can't find a solid answer on how much product you have to buy to get a certain number of "Volume Points."). Naturally, incoming Herbalifers are implicitly encouraged to buy plenty of product upfront to maximize their discount--no worries, the cost will all be made up when they sell this amazing product to all of their friends.

You also earn money from your "downline" people, though this can disappear if you don't buy enough product each month. You can permanently lose your downline this way and have to rebuild. Presumably this is what happened with the relative of the person upthread: whoever was above them didn't buy enough product one month and lost their downline.

On top of all this, you are of course encouraged to buy books and tapes and attend seminars that will indoctrinate you further into the cult teach you how to be a better salesperson.

All of this was found via googling, but it's pretty predictable. This is absolutely bog-standard MLM stuff.

 

[SilentSoldier]

I have a friend who's totally into that stuff too and she almost roped me into it too. Until I saw the prices of the products that they offered. With the exception of the prices, the people who are a part of herbalife do a lot of good outreach stuff too. They promote a healthy lifestyle and support those who try to improve their lifestyle, even if it isn't through the herbalife products. I won't ever buy the stuff, but I do support the values they promote. Or at least, the people that are part of it in my area.

I believe the products themselves are legit and supported through a ton of research, I just don't like how they're sold.

 

[pants]

Ive bought from a dealer before, he seemed super desperate to sell and I felt sorry for him. I ended up thinking the shakes werent too bad.

 

[SenatorBot]

I lost a lifelong friend because I called Herbalife a pyramid scam. Now he won't talk to me again, I can't help but feel that this is something that happened to a lot of people.

From what I've seen, he's been attending more herbalife seminars and getting deeper into it's culture. The products seem like average health products sold by supplement stores, researching the things they sell it seems to have an extremely high markup just for no reason. I feel really sad that a friendship is ruined because of this and I hope he wakes up from this.

 

[LevityNYC]

I lost a lifelong friend because I called Herbalife a pyramid scam. Now he won't talk to me again, I can't help but feel that this is something that happened to a lot of people.

From what I've seen, he's been attending more herbalife seminars and getting deeper into it's culture. The products seem like average health products sold by supplement stores, researching the things they sell it seems to have an extremely high markup just for no reason. I feel really sad that a friendship is ruined because of this and I hope he wakes up from this.

Why did you 2 stop being friends? He got angry because you wouldnt buy from him or join the pyramid?

 

[Jeff Albertson]

Herbalife is different from other mlms IMO because it's an actual product that works and you make more money from actually selling the product than signing up new coaches under you.

I know someone who lost over 200 pounds using it and he swears by it and I can't knock him. That type of transformation would have me drinking the koolaid too.

I tried it for a month but I like food too much to only eat once a day. I did lose 20 pounds tho.

Far from a typical pyramid scheme tho. Just my opinion. Wake up now is the worst and preys on naive college kids.

This post implies you just know some people who sold it and a bit about it but the super defensive tone of the follow up posts suggests you are another one absorbed in it.

Is it really making you good money? Or just the promise of good money somewhere down the line?

I've never heard of the product as I'm English but ironically my wife did lose weight on a product called Juice plus which I think sounds like the equivalent, it was all mental though I think she had decided it was time to lost weight and this was the diet method she wanted to try (along with gym classes and cutting out some crap.....) She never sold it though thinking about it I'm sure the girl she bought it from tried to get her to sign up.

Edit - seems it is an English thing as well I just never noticed it

 

[huxley00]

My friend is a scientist for Herbalife who helps make sure all the products are legal and even she thinks the way they distribute and sell shit is illegal.

To be fair, that sounds like every company in the workout/fitness arena.

 

[RionaaM]

If anyone hasn't seen this, you should definitely watch.

Penn & Teller: Bullshit - Easy Money [NSFW]

All about pyramid schemes.

This is a fantastic episode, and it should be mandatory to show it on schools.

The latter is kind of a joke, but the episode is truly interesting. I love P&T.

 

[n64coder]

Just came across this article from SeekingAlpha.com that talks about Herbalife. This little chart really shows how MLMs are a big scam:

The entire article can be found at: http://seekingalpha.com/article/2119733-is-it-april-fools-day-at-the-ftc-herbalife-thinks-so?ifp=0

 

[Cyan]

The entire article can be found at: http://seekingalpha.com/article/2119733-is-it-april-fools-day-at-the-ftc-herbalife-thinks-so?ifp=0

Well, half of it. Then they apparently want you to sign up for their site.

Bah.

Great chart, though.

 

[n64coder]

Well, half of it. Then they apparently want you to sign up for their site.

Bah.

Yeah, I don't see any way around this. I did sign up because I wanted to review some company's quarterly earning transcript. So they send me daily news briefings which aren't too bad but doesn't bother me because I did setup a filter in gmail.

 

[Lionheart1337]

Someone I know got sucked into one of these by an ex. Tried to recruit me (lol) and a bunch of others. Dude is losing friends left and right and is clearly consumed in the pyramid nonsense. Hard to watch but I know better than to try and pull someone away from their brainwash. Oy vey!

 

[Ourobolus]

Just came across this article from SeekingAlpha.com that talks about Herbalife. This little chart really shows how MLMs are a big scam:

The entire article can be found at: http://seekingalpha.com/article/2119733-is-it-april-fools-day-at-the-ftc-herbalife-thinks-so?ifp=0

I would love to see this data for ACN.

 

[mackattk]

Why did you 2 stop being friends? He got angry because you wouldnt buy from him or join the pyramid?

They probably teach you to cut out detractors from your life, including your friends/family. If they don't buy into Herbalife then you don't need them, they will only bring you down.

 

[LosDaddie]

Anybody ever heard of AdvoCare? One of my FB friends tends to "like" a ton of their pictures & stuff. I haven't looked into it, but I'm guessing it's another MLM scam.

You're in the cult, man. It's a real shame a GAFfer is caught up in the middle of a lousy pyramid scheme. :-(

Eh, GAF is big enough that there's bound to be a few suckers amongst us. But yes, it's a shame that anyone falls for the scam

 

[Space Bro]

Just came across this article from SeekingAlpha.com that talks about Herbalife. This little chart really shows how MLMs are a big scam:

The entire article can be found at: http://seekingalpha.com/article/2119733-is-it-april-fools-day-at-the-ftc-herbalife-thinks-so?ifp=0

Those payments are all gross too, so they dont include buying all the shit yourself.

Now the people making 100k+ are clearly making that because of guys underneath them, but the people making a few thousand and less are probably paying for most of that stuff themselves and can even be at negative net profit.

EDIT: Didn't mean to necro, completely forgot this was the old thread, there's a new thread about the same kind of thing and I had both open at the same time

 

[Skinny Pete]

A girl I know is now part of this cult. Seems like once you are in you become brain washed and do nothing but promote herbalife 24/7 on social media.

 

[Saganator]

I have an old high school acquaintance who is always posting about Advocare. Is that a pyramid scheme? The way he talks about it makes it seem like one, but the dude is always posting pictures of himself and his beautiful wife in exotic lotions doing fun stuff. Maybe he got in on the ground floor or something.

 

[MC Safety]

I like the idea of these schemes greasing the wheels by making their members pay a yearly subscription/entrance/maintenance fee. That's pretty clever. So not only do you have to buy your sales materials, you have to pay to be able to buy them.

 

[KingGondo]

I have an old high school acquaintance who is always posting about Advocare. Is that a pyramid scheme?

Yes.

 

[JimtotheHum]

A new one I have seen pop up on my Facebook is Nerium. Anyone else seeing this?

 

[breakYODAy]

I got sucked into one of these pyramid schemes about 10 years ago, by a salesman that knew the right buttons to push to intice a naïve young person into joining (fast wealth, fast cars, freedom to do whatever you want, etc). The scam was called MonaVie, which was a concentrated fruit juice in a wine bottle, that was pitched as the cure to all human ailments.

I ended up losing $1,500 before wising up, but I don't regret it. I learned a valuable lesson about the psychology people will use to extract money and take advantage of you early in life, and I won't ever forget it.

I have a friend now who joined the Advocare cult and posts about it on Facebook constantly. It's sad to see these businesses are legal still, but the rich control economic regulation, so it's not all that surprising, unfortunately.

 

[LiquidSword]

This and other pyramid schemes like it are basically financial cults.

 

[Herne]

I don't know anyone who has ever joined one of these things, but it certainly makes for fascinating reading.

 

[Box of Kittens]

I have an old high school acquaintance who is always posting about Advocare. Is that a pyramid scheme? The way he talks about it makes it seem like one, but the dude is always posting pictures of himself and his beautiful wife in exotic lotions doing fun stuff. Maybe he got in on the ground floor or something.

It's possible he's one of the very small percentage of people who actually make good money in MLM. I wouldn't rule out the possibility that he's faking/exaggerating his success to entice people to join (spending money earned at a real job, going into debt, etc.)