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[massoluk]

Should just let the pro do the narrating alone, the other commentator is no good

 

[jellies_two]

THE GUY ON THE LEFT is trying to make it interesting for regular people like me. He's not too bad

I'm a regular person have no clue on Go
still want less of Chris and more of the smarter guy. Because he actually has insight into who is ahead in real time.

edit: and he should stop playing with his freaking phone on camera while getting his question answered.

 

[xRaizen]

My only exposure to Go was the manga in Shonen Jump about a decade ago.. Hikaru no Go.

That manga got really intense and amazing even if 9 year old me had no idea how to play Go.

 

[jediyoshi]

THE GUY ON THE LEFT is trying to make it interesting for regular people like me. He's not too bad

Regardless of how well he's doing, he's pretty directly taking on the role of being the bridge between random people watching and actual players.

edit: and he should stop playing with his freaking phone on camera while getting his question answered.

He's taking in questions.

 

[Fugu]

I'm a regular person have no clue on Go
still want less of Chris and more of the smarter guy. Because he actually has insight into who is ahead in real time.

edit: and he should stop playing with his freaking phone on camera while getting his question answered.

Should just let the pro do the narrating alone, the other commentator is no good

The guy on the left is an amateur 3d and therefore still stronger than a huge percentage of all Go players. He can't really talk up to Michael Redmond but he'd still rather easily demolish any one of us.

This bottom left corner is insane. I don't even know.

 

[jellies_two]

it's david vs goliath!

david = 3lbs of meat using 150 watts provided by its own portable power supply
goliath = a data center the size of a football field sucking down half a megawatt of power.

 

[Fugu]

it's david vs goliath!

david = 3lbs of meat using 150 watts provided by its own portable power supply
goliath = a data center the size of a football field sucking down half a megawatt of power.

Which one is which?

 

[1st Course]

So who's winning so far?

 

[cpp_is_king]

I don't know honestly. AlphaGo is holding its own though, and I've gone back and forth about who was ahead a couple of times

 

[cpp_is_king]

Q10 was an amazing move from white btw

 

[GameAddict411]

it's david vs goliath!

david = 3lbs of meat using 150 watts provided by its own portable power supply
goliath = a data center the size of a football field sucking down half a megawatt of power.

But, that's what people said about computers 60 years ago. In ten years, you will have that processing power in your pocket.

 

[bobbytkc]

But, that's what people said about computers 60 years ago. In ten years, you will have that processing power in your pocket.

Nope, the limits of transistor size is already being reached. Moore's law is already broken.

 

[Dr.Acula]

Nope, the limits of transistor size is already being reached. Moore's law is already broken.

For a hot minute we reached the limit of vacuum tubes, who's to say some alternate technology to the silicon transistor won't pop up?

 

[bobbytkc]

For a hot minute we reached the limit of vacuum tubes, who's to say some alternate technology to the silicon transistor won't pop up?

Who's to say something will? That's the real problem.

Also, the limits of vacuum tubes are limits of engineering. The limit of silicon transistors is one of physics. That is a whole order of magnitude more difficult to crack.

 

[ChouGoku]

For a hot minute we reached the limit of vacuum tubes, who's to say some alternate technology to the silicon transistor won't pop up?

Graphene?

 

[eyeball_kid]

Who's to say something will? That's the real problem.

Also, the limits of vacuum tubes are limits of engineering. The limit of silicon transistors is one of physics. That is a whole order of magnitude more difficult to crack.

There is already research going into silicon alternatives which get around the heat problem. With an industry in the billions that hinges on finding a solution to this, my bet is that humanity will.

 

[nubbe]

operator has the moves

 

[Psyren]

I really should get my board out, and start learning to play this game properly...

Spoiler

Can't even beat GNUGo on the lowest difficulty level lol!

 

[eyeball_kid]

I have absolutely no idea how to play Go, but this is the first real test of an AI against a human and it somehow feels historic.

 

[killer rin]

This expert is an amazing comentator. Thanks to him I feel like I know how to play even though I only learned this game exists a week ago

 

[Siphorus]

Man, this would be so hard to compute. So many combinations and permutations you'd have to search (and heuristics to run).

 

[scottnak]

All I can tell is that this is really complex... and i'm still probably underestimating the complexity.

 

[cheezcake]

There is already research going into silicon alternatives which get around the heat problem. With an industry in the billions that hinges on finding a solution to this, my bet is that humanity will.

Heat isn't even the main issue, its quantum tunneling. And yeh that's a fundamental physical effect that happens as we try build transistors on the quantum scale. Quantum computing is the future of computational power.

 

[jellies_two]

For a hot minute we reached the limit of vacuum tubes, who's to say some alternate technology to the silicon transistor won't pop up?

I think the problem is we're trying to achieve acceptable artificial intelligence via a still flawed route. Throwing more transistors at it doesn't help. It isn't like a turing-candidate AI works acceptably if we give it weeks instead of seconds to think about its responses.

 

[Austriacus]

I have absolutely no idea how to play Go, but this is the first real test of an AI against a human and it somehow feels historic.

Actually this AI already beat the euro champion so no, its not the first real test.

Its the biggest one its ever had tho.

 

[Fugu]

Man, this would be so hard to compute. So many combinations and permutations you'd have to search (and heuristics to run).

Imagine how humans feel when they play this game.

Speaking of which, if anyone wants to learn/play some go, I highly recommend it and can teach the basics and stuff.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

I have absolutely no idea how to play Go, but this is the first real test of an AI against a human and it somehow feels historic.

AIs have been obliterating humans at complex games since the 90s. Go is just a tougher one.

 

[ChouGoku]

I really hope it beats the human

 

[eyeball_kid]

AIs have been obliterating humans at complex games since the 90s. Go is just a tougher one.

Yes, but from what I understand, Go is a magnitudes more difficult game than say chess, and I remember 10 or 15 years ago people wondered if a computer could ever play Go competitively because moves can't be determined by the kind of normal decision tree that would be used for a chess kind of game.

 

[Fugu]

AIs have been obliterating humans at complex games since the 90s. Go is just a tougher one.

The best AIs have been... not great at Go for such a long time that it's a big deal.

 

[Eferim]

I really hope it beats the human

Traitor!

No seriously though I hope AlphaGo wins at least one match. I don't think it's going to win this one though. Not that I have any knowledge of Go but listening to two streams' commentary I get the feeling Lee is at a strong advantage.

 

[NetMapel]

I think the AI just messed up a move, haha. The commentators are like, "uhhhhh"

 

[Askani]

As someone who knows nothing about how to play Go, I hate how these announcers are going into deep conversations about how the end game would work and missing the actual plays. I wish they would focus more on what's actually happening, but admittedly it's probably hard to fill the time just doing that.

 

[killer rin]

Man, Alphago is really running its clock

 

[Random17]

Man, Alphago is really running its clock

I'm assuming it takes the clock into account as well?

 

[Pocks]

Is there a reason Column I is incorrect on Michael Redmond's board?

 

[nubbe]

bluescreen

 

[cpp_is_king]

Wish the guy on the left would focus on the game instead of talking incessantly about how nervous he is

 

[killer rin]

I'm assuming it takes the clock into account as well?

I was wondering that myself. Does it even know the clock exists? Because one would assume it would be programmed to cut down on how deep it computes as the time gets lower

Actually, what happens once the clock ends? Does the game just end for both people, or does the other person get some free reign to rack up points?

 

[Fugu]

As someone who knows nothing about how to play Go, I hate how these announcers are going into deep conversations about how the end game would work and missing the actual plays. I wish they would focus more on what's actually happening, but admittedly it's probably hard to fill the time just doing that.

They're reading ahead to tell you what the implications of the moves are, since they're not clear to anyone except the highest level of professional.

Traitor!

No seriously though I hope AlphaGo wins at least one match. I don't think it's going to win this one though. Not that I have any knowledge of Go but listening to two streams' commentary I get the feeling Lee is at a strong advantage.

I think the game's a bit unpredictable right now, but again, I'm no expert. As far as I can tell, Lee Sedol is ahead but not by much.

 

[commedieu]

I was wondering that myself. Does it even know the clock exists? Because one would assume it would be programmed to cut down on how deep it computes as the time gets lower

...actually, what happens once the clock ends; does the game just end for both people, or does the other person get some free reign to rack up points?

The sack of meat is taking a while too it seems. And we know this thing is going to be at least 2x, understating this, soon.

 

[kuroneko0509]

I was wondering that myself. Does it even know the clock exists? Because one would assume it would be programmed to cut down on how deep it computes as the time gets lower

Actually, what happens once the clock ends? Does the game just end for both people, or does the other person get some free reign to rack up points?

once you used the allocated time, you have to put your next move within 60 seconds i think... i forgot a lot of go rules

 

[eyeball_kid]

You would think these guys would at least have an earpiece to let them know when moves are played.

 

[cpp_is_king]

I was wondering that myself. Does it even know the clock exists? Because one would assume it would be programmed to cut down on how deep it computes as the time gets lower

Actually, what happens once the clock ends? Does the game just end for both people, or does the other person get some free reign to rack up points?

3 60 second byo yomi periods. It keeps resetting as long as you move in inder 60 seconds

If you go over 60 seconds more than 3 times you forfeit

 

[Tesseract]

wtf i wish i was playing

btw this camera work is boners

oh shi-, rekt

 

[nubbe]

funny now how the human play with experience and the AI need to evaluate every move

 

[killer rin]

once you used the allocated time, you have to put your next move within 60 seconds

So the times listed are a bank of time you can pull out of when making your moves, but if you run out of banked time, you are just forced to respond within 60 seconds? It doesn't force the game to end?

3 60 second byo yomi periods. It keeps resetting as long as you move in inder 60 seconds

If you go over 60 seconds more than 3 times you forfeit

... and then if you go over 60 seconds 3 times you forfeit?

 

[kuroneko0509]

So the times listed are a bank of time you can pull out of when making your moves, but if you run out of banked time, you are just forced to respond within 60 seconds? It doesn't force the game to end?

kinda, cpp_is_king explained it better.

 

[2MF]

funny now how the human play with experience and the AI need to evaluate every move

What do you mean?

The AI also plays from experience, since AlphaGo is heavily based on machine learning methods (key word being learning).

 

[Timedog]

How long do they typically think before doing a move? How long do games take? What is this? How did that?