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American Idol Season 8 discussion thread

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Yeah, I agree, Mercury is far superior.

As the judges always said, "This is a singing show. It's about the singing." And I don't know how you can make the case that Kris is a better singer than Adam, I just really don't see any leg you can stand on to make that argument. Especially in terms of technical vocal ability, Adam just kills Kris, it's not even close.
 
DJ_Tet said:
edit: If we're judging on pure talent (which we aren't, it's completely subjective and people are going to vote grudges etc) then Adam definitely deserved to win. If this was 1982 he'd have a huge career in front of him. As it is, I'm curious to see what happens. I think Brian May would be wise to snap him up and take him on a Queen reunion tour.


Gary Whitta said:
I was getting a great Mercury vibe off Lambert when he was performing with Queen last night. If I was Brian May I'd recruit him and bring my band back from the dead. :D


:arr


edit: he definitely doesn't have the nuance that Mercury had, but perhaps that can be learned
 
I didn't watch a single episode of AI, and never really have, but seriously: I've seen some youtube videos, and how the fuck did most AI watchers pick boring Kris Allen over Adam Lambert? How is it even possible?! :lol Kris Allen sounds like generic, uninspired mainstream pop. Adam is almost on a Freddy Mercury level vocally, and to be honest, the first AI contestant that actually made me go "wow". I never thought I'd be remotely interested in an AI vocalist but this guy is fucking awesome.

If people voted against Lambert because he's gay and has a strange sense of style, shame on American Idol watchers.

I'm guessing Lambert will be like another Jennifer Hudson or something, depending on what he does with his career.
 
Diablos said:
If people voted against this guy because he's gay and has a strange sense of style, shame on American Idol watchers.
People voted against him because he turns every song into a shrieking contest. It's annoying when all the women have to get in their highs in every fucking song regardless of context, it's insane when a guy does it.

This week and last week he's taken two very good performances and flat out ruined them with that shit. "One" and "A Change Is Gonna Come" specifically.
 
Mr. Allen and Lambert right now:

iTunes Top 100:

#2 Kris Allen - No Boundaries
#5 Kris Allen - Heartless
#7 Adam Lambert - Mad World
#9 Kris Allen - Ain't No Sunshine

iTunes Top Music Videos:

#1 Kris Allen - Heartless
#3 Adam Lambert - A Change Is Gonna Come
#4 Adam Lambert - Mad World [Top 2]
#5 Adam Lambert - Mad World [Top 8]
#6 Kris Allen - No Boundaries
#8 Adam Lambert - No Boundaries
#9 Kris Allen - Ain't No Sunshine
#10 Adam Lambert - Tracks of My Tears
 
MIMIC said:
Mr. Allen and Lambert right now:

iTunes Top 100:

#2 Kris Allen - No Boundaries
#5 Kris Allen - Heartless
#7 Adam Lambert - Mad World
#9 Kris Allen - Ain't No Sunshine

iTunes Top Music Videos:

#1 Kris Allen - Heartless
#3 Adam Lambert - A Change Is Gonna Come
#4 Adam Lambert - Mad World [Top 2]
#5 Adam Lambert - Mad World [Top 8]
#6 Kris Allen - No Boundaries
#8 Adam Lambert - No Boundaries
#9 Kris Allen - Ain't No Sunshine
#10 Adam Lambert - Tracks of My Tears


Dizzam.. The No Boundaries studio actually isn't bad honestly..

People like Adam's performances so he leads in videos.. people like Kris' singing so he leads in music? :P
 
Son of Godzilla said:
This week and last week he's taken two very good performances and flat out ruined them with that shit. "One" and "A Change Is Gonna Come" specifically.

I wasn't too hot on "One" but I friggin LOVED "A Change Is Gonna Come"
 
agrajag said:
And Mercury didn't have Lambert's pipes. People have different strengths.


Let's not get crazy now. Adam is a vocal phenom but there that and then there is Mercury.

I was just noting that Adam seems to carry the same bag of stage presence tricks on a certain level.
 
I'm just pissed that Kris' studio version of Heartless SUCKS compared to the live version. Really disappointing.

That's probably why Heartless is #1 in the video section.
 
krypt0nian said:
Let's not get crazy now. Adam is a vocal phenom but there that and then there is Mercury.

I was just noting that Adam seems to carry the same bag of stage presence tricks on a certain level.

Let's get serious. Freddy Mercury is a legend. He was an incredibly charismatic voice and great melodies and he could make his voice soar. But he was technically more flawed than Lambert. He didn't have as good of a control over his voice, had lesser range (Lambert's falsetto allows him to go way higher), and sometimes had shaky vibrato. Mercury was a favorite of mine growing up, still is (Show Must Go On is one of the greatest spine-chilling songs ever). He's one of the top rock vocalists to ever hold a microphone, but rock vocals by their very nature imply some level of grit and imperfection. Lambert might be more pop in that regard. He sure doesn't have the subtlety that Mercury does, as was correctly mentioned by someone above. He doesn't know when to tone it down sometimes, but I suspect that will come in time. Of course he will never reach the heights of Mercury. He will never be as iconic or as important to the music world.

Also, another thing to remember that people have different voice "colors." While one vocalist might technically be better, another might have a more pleasing tone. I think this is the case here, where Freddy found that perfect balance of ability and just plain old nice sounding voice. They could sing the same note and Freddy's would probably sound better to most people (myself included). But Adam can sing more notes. Know what I'm saying?
 
This is what I thought about Lambert whilst watching almost every episode:

"Oh wow you can hit that note, that's pretty amazing"

"Oh looks there's that note again, it wasn't a fluke"

"Oh hey look that note, I get it"

"Wait a minute, wtf are you singing that note in this song"


The guy has no subtly in his performances at ALL. He has no sense of being able to build momentum in a song or in his voice.
 
Also, another thing to remember that people have different voice "colors." While one vocalist might technically be better, another might have a more pleasing tone. I think this is the case here, where Freddy found that perfect balance of ability and just plain old nice sounding voice. They could sing the same note and Freddy's would probably sound better to most people (myself included). But Adam can sing more notes. Know what I'm saying?

It took you all of that just to describe how absolutely generic Adam Lambert is.

I can't beleive he is even being brought up with Freddy Mercury in the same post. What's next? White Snake vs. Led Zep?

Insanity.
 
Jesus Carbomb said:
It took you all of that just to describe how absolutely generic Adam Lambert is.

I can't beleive he is even being brought up with Freddy Mercury in the same post. What's next? White Snake vs. Led Zep?

Insanity.

Uh, David Coverdale is leagues better than Robert Plant.

edit:

Lambert is not really generic at all. He's more of an anomaly than anything. With that said, I guarantee you I won't be buying any of his albums and not likely to buy any of the former AI contestants' albums. Not my thing.
 
I still have issue with your claim that Lambert has greater vocal ability. I think the subtlety is far more important of a technical achievement by Freddie Mercury than being able to hit high notes. Adam has also shown on many occasions to be less than pitch perfect (his last performance of Mad World in particular had several wonky notes).
 
Zeni said:
I still have issue with your claim that Lambert has greater vocal ability. I think the subtlety is far more important of a technical achievement by Freddie Mercury than being able to hit high notes. Adam has also shown on many occasions to be less than pitch perfect (his last performance of Mad World in particular had several wonky notes).

Fair enough. I think that "subtlety" is more of a personal decision rather than ability. With his vocal control, Adam could be as subtle as he choses. It's just that his delivery is not as artful, but he has all the tools.
 
And I was just kidding when I said people thought Adam was the very definition of perfect... he's better then Freddy Mercury now? :lol
 
harSon said:
And I was just kidding when I said people thought Adam was the very definition of perfect... he's better then Freddy Mercury now? :lol

Technically, yes. Far from perfect. The problem is that you put Freddy Mercury on some unimaginable pedestal when he wasn't technically a vocal god.
 
agrajag said:
Technically, yes. Far from perfect. The problem is that you put Freddy Mercury on some unimaginable pedestal when he wasn't technically a vocal god.

I don't even like Freddy Mercury :lol I think you're right except you need to replace "you" with "Adam Lambert fans" and Freddy Mercury with Adam Lambert.
 
I don't think Adam lost cause he was gay or anything.

And to be honest, the people who win these things always have the handicap of having to sing the awful winner songs.

Most reasonable theory: He got Melinda'd. Supposed "ZOMG BEST EVER, NEVER BAD" contestant peaks too early and America got bored.

This is probably it, but I think Adam peaked 2 weeks ago, unlike Melinda who peaked way early.

Melinda also had no likability factor and looked like a troll.
 
agrajag said:
Technically, yes. Far from perfect. The problem is that you put Freddy Mercury on some unimaginable pedestal when he wasn't technically a vocal god.


Freddy is a rock god, something Adam will NEVER be. You have lost your freaking mind to compare the two.
 
Xenon said:
Freddy is a rock god, something Adam will NEVER be. You have lost your freaking mind to compare the two.

I'm not comparing the two. Sigh. You're an idiot.


harSon: both the people who post shit like "adam is teh Gawd" and the people that post "glam rock/screetching lawl" are idiots. He's simply a very good singer, that's the bottom line.
 
BADDOW!

karabikini1-498x600.jpg

karabikini2-424x600.jpg
 
Blader5489 said:
sharpkneesnerd.jpg

Kara has a better body than her, fact. I'm not saying she's below my standards or some such nonsense, but take a stroll through any South Florida beach at any time and you'll see much hotter chicks than bikini girl.
 
agrajag said:
He didn't have as good of a control over his voice, had lesser range (Lambert's falsetto allows him to go way higher), and sometimes had shaky vibrato. Mercury was a favorite of mine growing up, still is (Show Must Go On is one of the greatest spine-chilling songs ever). He's one of the top rock vocalists to ever hold a microphone, but rock vocals by their very nature imply some level of grit and imperfection. Lambert might be more pop in that regard. He sure doesn't have the subtlety that Mercury does, as was correctly mentioned by someone above.

Have to disagree with you there. I think Mercury had a slightly greater range (think his natural speaking voice was a baritone?) and a different tonal quality but he did not have the control or subtelty. People like to point to Adam's love for hitting the glory notes as a sign he didn't have subtelty. Thats an easy copout. His songs are laced with immense subtelty and varied inflection (he imbued Mad World with many shades beyond Jules) and he used that ability in most of his songs. People are tone deaf if they can't hear the subtle changes in note and inflection he makes to most of his performances. Freddy and Adam definitely both share a love for the flamboyant and theatric which is a rare commodity these days.

Sometimes even Adam's glory note was subtle. He hit a friggin C6 (momentarily and it was one of his only "missed" notes the entire season) in Mad World before dropping back to a perfectly centered B5 at barely over a whisper. Some sopranos dream of doing that. That is insanely harder than hitting the glory note at high volume. Far easier to 'scream' that out.

Part of why I think he lost is that his voice isn't the contemporary voice. The contemporary voice is usually a strained baritone. Their entire songs are laced with this 'strain' (ref kurt allen) that has an 'emotional connection' to whatever the artist is performing. Adams voice is basically anti-strained - it swoops, it soars, it dives, it explodes and it whispers but its never strained. He blends his chest and throat voices in just mindblowing ways and his voice has this odd ethereal quality to it completely unlike what is popular today.

I honestly think queen is too pidgeon-holed for him. He'll be constantly compared to Mercury (which is impossible for anyone) and he won't have the freedom to go after more subdued, non-hardrock material (and, yes, a change is going to come was fucking brilliant).

One day after he wins and nobody is talking about Cris :lol .
 
I could make an argument that Kris is more talented than Adam. He plays two instruments well and rearranges songs pretty damn good. Just saying..........
 
Good post, offtopic, although I disagree about the range. But I can't be bothered to sift through all of Queen's songs to find Freddie's lowest and highest notes and the same for Lambert. So let's agree to disagree on this one.

Cooter: have you ever heard the expression "jack of all trades, master of none?" Adam's instrument is his voice and he plays it better than whatever instruments Kris plays. Also, American Idol contestants don't arrange their own song, they have someone working on their songs with them at all times.
 
Cooter said:
I could make an argument that Kris is more talented than Adam. He plays two instruments well and rearranges songs pretty damn good. Just saying..........


I would rather be excellent at one thing than be average at 3 :lol
 
Gene Simmons on Adam: "Respectfully, I don’t think Adam is a rock singer. He sounds much more convincing singing ballads, and Broadway shows. His voice doesn’t seem to have a ‘rock quality.’ But, I’m sure he’s going to do just fine."

lolz

But seriously...that's what he SHOULD be doing. He'd kill on Broadway more than he would in a recording studio, IMO.
 
MIMIC said:
Gene Simmons on Adam: "Respectfully, I don’t think Adam is a rock singer. He sounds much more convincing singing ballads, and Broadway shows. His voice doesn’t seem to have a ‘rock quality.’ But, I’m sure he’s going to do just fine."

lolz

But seriously...that's what he SHOULD be doing. He'd kill on Broadway more than he would in a recording studio, IMO.

Eh? Sorta clashes with:

It's highly doubtful that "American Idol" runner-up Adam Lambert will have trouble finding a singing gig.

But just in case, he can always perform with KISS. Gene Simmons made it clear to "Extra" that he is a big Adam fan.

“Adam was fantastic," the KISS frontman told the TV show. "What a powerful and attractive man he is."

Gene made it clear that he thinks Adam could totally rock out with the band. But he'd have to be strong to win over Kiss fans, Simmons said.

"He can come on tour whenever he’d like," said Simmons. "Of course he’d have to put his armor on because the fans, especially the KISS fans, take no prisoners. You gotta go big. Gotta be strong. You gotta be a rock, baby!”

We can't think of a better group for the bigger-than-life Lambert. And it sounds like he sees the opportunity there, too.

“That would be amazing… I would love that," Lambert told Mario Lopez of "Extra." "That’d be such an honor. I had so much fun.

"To perform with KISS, I would love that. What a wonderful compliment. Thank you, Gene. That was very, very nice of him.”

zomg even a source!
http://www.kansascity.com/stargazing/story/1210586.html
 
Clay Aiken posted a rather lengthy, but well-thought out analysis of what he thought happened and why:

(oh yeah...he can't stand Adam :lol)

Now that it's all over, and for the record.... I couldn't be happier about the way AI ended this year. I only turn the show on once a season, and only to see what the set looks like each year. This year, I happened to turn it during the minute that Adam Lambert was singing "Ring of Fire" and, at that moment, thought my ears would bleed. Contrived, awful, and slightly frightening! I wasn't really a fan and found myself surprised whenever folks told me that they liked him. Granted, I never saw another performance (and many folks who I trust said that he was great) but I can't imagine I would have enjoyed it. Just not my cup of tea at all. To each his own. I never saw Kris sing on the show, but whether he was good or not is really relative. It's usually a matter of taste, right? But Idol is not always a matter of musical taste only. It's about the person you like. From what little I saw, Kris seemed likable. (That's not to say that Adam isn't just as likable as anyone.. maybe more so... I don't know) When Ruben and I were standing next to each other every night (many years ago) you had two equally talented, equally unlikely, equally unpolished contestants.... so it really was a matter of taste as to who was voted for. While some may argue that one of us was hyped more than the other, I don't feel that was the case. However, this year, there was an obvious bias. Not even having watched the show, I can tell you that I was WELL aware of the bias from the judges as to who should win. In my opinion, that is awfully unattractive. I don't think I am alone

In my opinion, it all often comes down to that last night of voting. Until the finale, folks are voting for the contestant that they want to see continue. But, I believe that on that last night, the dynamic changes. No longer forced to choose one person that they want to see win, the audience can effectively vote AGAINST the person that they don't want to see win. In the case of season two this might have happened. There may have been some folks who voted for myself or Ruben because they didn't like the other of us. I was the nerdy little girly boy who some didn't want to see win, so they may have voted for Ruben. I don't know. .. But again, I feel that Ruben and I were fairly matched. We both had our detractors and negatives, but I feel we were both very worthy of being on that stage in that moment, and either of us would have been worthy of winning. The show was different then, and folks made it in seasons 1-3 because they were "real" people who happened to sing/entertain well. But, somewhere along the way, AI stopped being about real people.

In a battle between David and Goliath, my money is on David!

I think many voters got sick of being "told who to vote for". I think many were turned off by the blatant favoritism shown towards one contestant. Therefore, on that last night, they used their votes against a contestant that they were tired of hearing about and for the contestant who had been written off. And, at the same time, I think they voted AGAINST an American Idol that has, for four years now, been more about the slick productions and polished contestants than it has been about finding the raw talent that it did in its first three seasons.

Those votes for Kris were also votes to return the show to its roots of finding "real" contestants with undiscovered talent and giving them the chance to grow and shine. They were votes that said "we're tired of seeing contestants who already seem to know it all".

Will American Idol choose to listen to the resounding and clarion call that those voters gave them?.... "Enough with the pretention. More Rubens, more Clays, more Fantasias and Tamyras and Kellys please." My faith has always been in the voters. I think they have gotten it right every year (mine included). It's now up to American Idol to decide if it will finally REALLY listen to the folks that keep it on the air.
http://gawker.com/5265268/clay-aiken-trashes-american-idol-adam-lambert

Pretty much echoing what I've been saying. I agree 100% with everything he said
 
MIMIC said:
Clay Aiken posted a rather lengthy, but well-thought out analysis of what he thought happened and why:

(oh yeah...he can't stand Adam :lol)


http://gawker.com/5265268/clay-aiken-trashes-american-idol-adam-lambert

Pretty much echoing what I've been saying. I agree 100% with everything he said
First the context of the statement - dude wanted to hook up with lambert to do a duet but fox threw him out of the building. :lol This was a few weeks after he supposedly hated ring of fire. Clay has burned his bridges with fox/19 and is basically just a hater at this point. His career is done.

Secondly, if people voted for the less talented contestant because the judges liked adam then they are petty little douchebags. How about not caring who the judges like? Its not about them. I was saying david v. goliath as soon as gokey was booted. And your average american douchebag isn't going to vote for goliath. Like the metaphor I used earlier - if someone runs a poll asking people for which football player they like better - rudy or ray lewis then rudy is going to win. Thats about the talent gap we are looking at here as well.
 
MIMIC said:
Clay Aiken posted a rather lengthy, but well-thought out analysis of what he thought happened and why:

(oh yeah...he can't stand Adam :lol)


http://gawker.com/5265268/clay-aiken-trashes-american-idol-adam-lambert

Pretty much echoing what I've been saying. I agree 100% with everything he said

Wow. Honest but still...

Ok, I calmed down a bit over the shock, and thinking about it, it wasnt really about the gay issue, and more closer to what Clay stated. That being said Fox/19 (really Its more like Fox/19/JRecords and what ever music studio picks up which act since they are still under contract)

Now, that being said, I might have overstepped my words on Adam just a little. But was raised on Pop for the most part and i see it now and the business as a whole and its just broken - and despite all the itunes and the ipod/shuffle/etc the whole pop scene just doesnt feel... orgainic. It feels Generic. I mean Em may have sold 750,000 copies in one week near the end of the summer in a year where the industry continues to fall and fall and fall and Em's best days maybe behind him. Despite Hudsons best work, she will never be as poplar as Beyonce and all she has is some semblance of Stage Presence. Underwood sells enough but she uses way too many R&B infulucances and her country is wonky at best. Adam just has the best package of anybody I seen since MJ, but he might not sell because they overproduce everything now, the dynamic range is bad to horrible on most CD's produced today, UNTIL very recently the Itunes Tracks were such a low quality. And people are shocked that Pop aint moving like it was 15 years ago.

But I really believe that Adam is bigger than that Industry - He should be acting (Broadway maybe, Hollywood Defantly), he should be hosting (maybe he should take over Ryan after next season because Simon and Paula are gone next season; because boy, Ryan was really scared shitlesswhen Bikini girl game out and Adam really (i mean really) likes Ihara (at least i seem to think so) so that puts the gay issue at rest. (we hope)

I think that America loves the David's of the world (so I dont understand why Kings didnt do well) because for most of many americans lifes (i.e. High School) they were picked on, teased, felt they were not good enough - but when they see the new hype - even if they KNOW hes better - they will pick the David because they were David - and we all know what Happend to David.
 
As soon as I read that headline, I was thinking, "OK, if I don't see a quote from Clay about wanting to hook up with Adam, then this story is bullshit." Because of Adam wanted to get with Adam so bad, he's probably tell someone in the media, since everyone else has. Sure enough, no quote. I mean, it's just too convenient to blame Clay's rant on recent bitterness.

I never heard the story about Clay being thrown out of the building, but if it indeed did happen, then I stand corrected.

Secondly, if people voted for the less talented contestant because the judges liked adam then they are petty little douchebags.

Once Kris sang Heartless, it was pretty clear that all votes for Kris were simply not a "FIGHT THE POWER" vote. He was a legitimate contender, just an egregiously overshadowed one. He was pretty good on the final 2 finale.

Oh yeah...Kris's song is #1 on iTunes. Good him.
 
MIMIC said:
:lol
Mr. Simmons,

Much like yourself, I am a highly creative person.

RESPECTFULLY, THAT'S NOT FOR YOU TO SAY.

I am a tireless worker, multi-talented in a number of fields (music, film, publishing, apparel, etc.)

"MULTI TALENTED" (!!!). FASCINATING. WONDER IF YOU HAVE ACTUALLY DONE SOMETHING WITH YOUR TALENT. LIKE MAKE MONEY (TO PAY YOUR BILLS) WITH YOUR TALENT. OR, IS IT SIMPLY "TALENT".

and plan on starting a multimedia empire of my own,

AN "EMPIRE"? REALLY...

catering to various demographic groups.

MIGHT I BE SO BOLD AS TO RESPECTFULLY SUGGEST YOU DO SOME RESEARCH FOR YOU TO FIGURE OUT WHAT DEMOGRAPHICS MEANS, AND/OR IF WHAT PRODUCT YOU'RE INVOLVED IN MIGHT FIT.

Here's my question: Should I concentrate on one area now and expand later, or take the "throw it all against the wall and see what sticks" approach?

I GIVE UP. YOU TELL ME.

Thank you for your time.

YOU'RE WELCOME.

John
 
MIMIC said:
I never heard the story about Clay being thrown out of the building, but if it indeed did happen, then I stand corrected.

Once Kris sang Heartless, it was pretty clear that all votes for Kris were simply not a "FIGHT THE POWER" vote. He was a legitimate contender, just an egregiously overshadowed one. He was pretty good on the final 2 finale.
Not all the votes were "fight the power" but certainly enough. So petty.

http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/zwecker/1568484,CST-FTR-zp12.article

You are corrected ;).
 
offtopic said:
Not all the votes were "fight the power" but certainly enough. So petty.

http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/zwecker/1568484,CST-FTR-zp12.article

You are corrected ;).

Since he's doing better than Adam on iTunes, I'll go out on a limb and say that Kris has more mass appeal than Adam immediately currently, which means that more people actually wanted him to win. That, or people are still being "petty" -_-

I could understand that if Kris won, and then bombed on iTunes. But....that's not what's happening.

And yes, I read that article. I said I was looking for a QUOTE.
 
No. You said you never heard the story.

Don't put too much stock into itunes at present. Kris is riding a surge of interest and people are checking him out. Probably mostly going "wtf he won?". :lol Also current lists are hard to interpret as I'm not sure what sort of window they represent. With "Glee" being in there I'm guessing its a window of the last week or so. Is there a way to view year-to-date downloads?
 
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