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Americans, please explain G.I. Joe to me
- Thread starter oti
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yeah she definitely gave me a type.
I'm just trying to understand a show that could have never ever being developed in Germany due to obvious reaons. Is that a bad thing?
FriedConsole
Banned
OK what cartoons are not propaganda then?
Transformers - technology is your friend
JEM - womem empowerment
Care Bears - power of love
Every cartoon has a message so every cartoon is propaganda?
Are you comparing "power of love" with "REAL AMERICAN HERO"?
Are those two things really the same to you?
you seem to keep harping on the Real American Hero, part.
you're going to have to get over that.
You're off on a few of those.
Transformers - buy Transformers toys
JEM - buy JEM toys
Care Bears - buy Care Bears toys
He has to get over the literal name of that part of the franchise's history? That entire era is called "Real American Hero" by Joe fans to distinguish it from other versions of the brand. It's the defining element of the '80s Joe line.
But.. but
I can see this whole America thing not being an integral part of the show and all but it's still there, isn't it? Captain America might not be the biggest "AMERICA FUCK YEAH" dude but his name is still Captain America.
But.. but
I can see this whole America thing not being an integral part of the show and all but it's still there, isn't it? Captain America might not be the biggest "AMERICA FUCK YEAH" dude but his name is still Captain America.
Rule number 1 in corporate America:
Never abandon good brand recognition
gutter_trash
Banned
history is important, to understand why this or that country react differently towards patriotism, nationalism
freenudemacusers
Member
sounds like you have it figured out
IdreamofHIME
Member
Dude, Germany had GI Joe, so what's to explain? It was just rebranded as Action Force and some of the characters were given different nationalies so the team was more international and less UScentric.
In Germany, Cobra characters had many changes to them to make them look less like Nazi's (removal of skulls was one i perosnally remember as a kid).
In Germany, Cobra characters had many changes to them to make them look less like Nazi's (removal of skulls was one i perosnally remember as a kid).
I guess it just boils down to this in the end. This concept of a "real American" hero just doesn't exist for Germany. And again, I`m not saying it`s bad that it does in the US. It just feels really foreign to me.
Non-American having trouble understanding American culture? Who would have thought.
yes. especially if he's interpreting it to have some kind of deeper message to entrench the military industrial complex and American military exceptionalism into the minds of American children.
The Joe fans could just as accurately call the RAH era "the time back in the 80s when GI Joe didn't suck." there is no underlying philosophy or propaganda that worked anyway. You want that, you go to Rambo and our movie media which was super effective in teaching us about the evils of Communism and the superiority of America and our beliefs.
GI Joe was just good guys shooting laser guns and flying around in jetplanes and tanks. It was bubblegum childrens fluff when 60% of our media was made of the real stuff, and was actual propaganda that was geared towards and worked on adults.
But.. but
I can see this whole America thing not being an integral part of the show and all but it's still there, isn't it? Captain America might not be the biggest "AMERICA FUCK YEAH" dude but his name is still Captain America.
the America part is completely incidental. They could all be Australian for all the kids care. "Whats with the flag?" "Oh they're Americans, is all." "Oh."
Hell, the days when GI was a common term associated with Americans, General Issue Joe from WW2 is long long passed. They had to codify some things, like the fact that these guys aren't Russians, and then they moved on with things.
gutter_trash
Banned
each culture is different.
Take Portugal for example, their culture is rooted in nostalgia of the past and they obsess about that nostalgia of better days past.
They idolize past historical figures and events but complain about the Present and are pessimistic about the Future.
It's not new, it's just the way Portuguese culture is, they even have a type of music that longs about the past called Fado.
QualityPixel
Banned
All I know is Porkchop Sandwiches (NSFW - Language)
IdreamofHIME
Member
How old are you? Did you grow up in the 80's? Because it was a thing in Germany in the 80's and it was fucking huge
like I said before, it was just rebranded.
How old are you? Did you grow up in the 80's? Because it was a thing in Germany in the 80's and it was fucking huge
like I said before, it was just rebranded.
nein
Calamari41
41 > 38
America was founded on certain ideals, specifically the whole life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness thing. This is taught to kids from a young age, so it's easy to point to someone and say that they're a "real" American hero, in that they exemplify the traits that the kids have been taught America is supposed to represent.
It should be noted that the concept of "real German hero" did indeed exist, and more strongly than it ever has for America. It was a large basis for the ability of the Nazis to gain power. Don't forget who specifically the ubermensch was supposed to be.
That's because Germany lost breh.
Princess Viola
Member
yo joe!
Don't be a sauerkraut, brah.
Bruh, trust me, I know. If you grew up in Germany you know this stuff. There's no way to not know it.
So to summarize:
1. Well of course you don't get it, you're German - That's fair
2- It's just tv show for kids, relax, no propaganda detected - I don't know about that tbh
3. BUT OTHER SHOWS DO THAT TOO - Come on... really?
And again, I'm not trying to say that G.I. Joe was dumb or anything. I just wanted to know how you felt about the show and if you were ok with your kids watching the REAL AMERICAN HERO season/era of the show today. I know cultures are different but they also change. I thought this could've been the case here as well but I guess not.
Thanks for the responses all. Also interesting post about the Portuguese culture. As a Greek I can really relate to being stuck and longing for the glorious past. ;_;
How old are you? Did you grow up in the 80's? Because it was a thing in Germany in the 80's and it was fucking huge
like I said before, it was just rebranded.
Yay, ACTION FORCE!!!
I'm not judging or anything if that's what you're implying.
Yeah to me GI Joe is just a natural part of the eighties. Rambo, Commando, GI Joe, Reagan. The Empire of evil was going to drop the bomb or at best enslave western Europe, and the only one who could save us (or go down with us) was the USA. They were fighting for our freedoms, never giving up, always there. I'm surprised Western Germany didn't have GI Joe (at least not in original form), but maybe East Germany was too close. It was huge in other European countries. Well it was in mine at least.
and lots of wildly impractical vehicles.
Hazelhurst
Member
Wow, I didn't realize this was on Blu-ray. I gotta get this!
The video quality is surreal. I think I first watched this when I was seven years old on a 13" color tv.
Nikkuthulu
Member
GI Joe is a wonderful 80s cartoon about a brilliant thinking man who thinks outside of the box when it comes to world politics. Cobra Commander has trillions of dollars and even more loyal people who could easily have conquered the world by just playing a legitimate business adventure and branching out into every part of the world and thing to sell.
Rather, Cobra Commander wants to dream bigger and decide no. If he's going to take over the world, he's going to do it in style and dream big with weather dominators, zombie puppy armies. His loyal henchmen are oozing with a lot more style then those dumb Joes. (Except Snake Eyes. Damn he's a cool dude.)
Seriously. It's just a goofy cartoon based on a reboot of an old time action figure that had more. There's just a lot of stuff about TRUTH, JUSTICE, FREEDOM FOR ALL type of stuff, while providing you excuses to have dudes shoot laser weapons at robots, producers trying to invent more cool characters to buy their figures and whatever goofy vehicles they drove to sell more toys.
Same way Transformers was always about pushing the next toy line etc. It's gone through a bunch of reboots that never took off as much as the original 80s cartoon, some bad, some good. Just the sort of same thing you see when shows get reboots and spin-offs, but it's all about the toys like all these shows are at the end of the day,
Rather, Cobra Commander wants to dream bigger and decide no. If he's going to take over the world, he's going to do it in style and dream big with weather dominators, zombie puppy armies. His loyal henchmen are oozing with a lot more style then those dumb Joes. (Except Snake Eyes. Damn he's a cool dude.)
Seriously. It's just a goofy cartoon based on a reboot of an old time action figure that had more. There's just a lot of stuff about TRUTH, JUSTICE, FREEDOM FOR ALL type of stuff, while providing you excuses to have dudes shoot laser weapons at robots, producers trying to invent more cool characters to buy their figures and whatever goofy vehicles they drove to sell more toys.
Same way Transformers was always about pushing the next toy line etc. It's gone through a bunch of reboots that never took off as much as the original 80s cartoon, some bad, some good. Just the sort of same thing you see when shows get reboots and spin-offs, but it's all about the toys like all these shows are at the end of the day,
Awesome. Saving this for the next time America does something really great or really stupid.
I still say no. The entire show's imagery is plastered in red, white, and blue. An entire generation of children instinctively sang "A Real American Hero" immediately after the name "G.I. Joe." The most iconic piece of animation from the franchise shows the team saving the Statue of Liberty from terrorists and planting a gigantic American flag on her crown in victory.
Was it a propaganda tool? Of course not, it was a bunch of writers trying to sell toys to kids. But it was absolutely jingoism, and undeniably a part of the "Rah rah go America!" sentiment of the Reagan era, utterly blind to the implications of such a simplified viewpoint. The massive changes the line had to undergo in branding to be sold overseas is evidence enough of that, changes so drastic that many don't even realize that Action Force and G.I. Joe are the same thing.
It's a symptom, not the disease, but I definitely see where the OP is coming from. G.I. Joe was a weird "only in the '80s" kind of thing in terms of how the RAH reinvention worked. It's probably not coincidental that, in this time of massive '80s nostalgia, in which the top selling lines include '80s staples like Star Wars, Transformers, and My Little Pony, the RAH incarnation of G.I. Joe has been a notorious failure, despite the numerous attempts to bring it back. There is currently no G.I. Joe toyline being produced, and hasn't been since the tepid movie tie-in figures from two years ago.
Why have all these other brands thrived while G.I. Joe has stalled out? I'd say it's in part due to the nature of the RAH incarnation of the brand eliciting a reaction similar to the OP's from most people today.
You really have to understand that in america, solders are automatically heroes and we celebrate them. It's always been that way. We are simply a very patriotic country. The G.I. Joe line of toys and years later, the cartoon profited off of this.
Solder worship has slid a bit in the recent decade but you still there. I wouldn't have a problem with my kids watching honestly.
Solder worship has slid a bit in the recent decade but you still there. I wouldn't have a problem with my kids watching honestly.
PeskyToaster
Member
The original GI joes (a G.I. is slang for an American solider) were pretty large dolls that came with a bunch of equipment you could dress them up with. They actually coined the term action figures for the original GI Joes because boys wouldn't play with dolls. They were much more realistic in terms of military equipment. They had grenades, rifles, helmets, MREs and all sorts of stuff. The 80s saw the show and a new line of 4 inch figures that had cobra commander, lasers, ninjas and stuff like that. They sort of separated from a relation to the actual military. The early ones I think had a lot of Vietnam era equipment because that war was around the time the figures were introduced but they had to distance themselves from it because the war sucked. I never really got into the cartoon ones as a kid born in 93 but I had a Destro figure and a Cobra tank. I did have a 12 inch one that was pretty cool. It was part of a reintroduction of the old style, more military than sci fi. The dolls probably played a big role in my passion for history.
old manatee
Banned
Sounds like op is jelly because Germany doesn't have any real heroes.
GJ Joe was popular because they were the GOAT action figures. The cartoon was incidental.
Lonewolf_92
Member
I <3 Baroness
I always preferred the Cobra toys to the Joes, maybe I'm weird, but the Joes seemed like generic army dudes vs. the Vipers in their colorful outfits and designs. My favorite design was the Night-Viper (from 1990) and Dr. Mindbender (cira 1986), that 'stashe man!
redmetal86
Member
Funny enough, one version of the theme's lyrics are changed from "Real American Hero" to "International Heroes".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCV00cXG7YE
Also, for no reason, I just feel like posting this hilarious 90s version of the intro.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIjANMSs880
Duke, Duke, take command.
Heavy Duty, on the scene.
Snake Eyes, hand to hand.
Long Range, lean and mean.
Scarlet, ready to fight!
TUNNEL RAT IGNITE!
I like how they gave Corba Commander a cape. Other than that, eh....
Speaking of other G.I Joe versons, does anyone remember G.I. Joe Extreme?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCV00cXG7YE
Also, for no reason, I just feel like posting this hilarious 90s version of the intro.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIjANMSs880
This is the one that aired when I was a kid.
I tried watching it but it was just straight up crap.
Duke, Duke, take command.
Heavy Duty, on the scene.
Snake Eyes, hand to hand.
Long Range, lean and mean.
Scarlet, ready to fight!
TUNNEL RAT IGNITE!
I like how they gave Corba Commander a cape. Other than that, eh....
Speaking of other G.I Joe versons, does anyone remember G.I. Joe Extreme?
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
To be honest I never got into GI Joe. I remember people at the arcade wore the shirts and kids had the toys when I was younger. I just didn't get into it. I had the green army men and I enjoyed Exosquad.
I had this Kaz Takagi Exo Fighter when I was young. I liked the more scifi look to the planes. I think what helped was that I played Phalanx on SNES every week for a very long time. I wanted magic or something. GI Joe was too grounded.
They were always talking about doing good deeds and the characters were never really interesting. I did like the ninja, but that was about it. Maybe that's why I don't get along with a lot of people about these types of things. I don't get the hype one bit.
I had this Kaz Takagi Exo Fighter when I was young. I liked the more scifi look to the planes. I think what helped was that I played Phalanx on SNES every week for a very long time. I wanted magic or something. GI Joe was too grounded.
They were always talking about doing good deeds and the characters were never really interesting. I did like the ninja, but that was about it. Maybe that's why I don't get along with a lot of people about these types of things. I don't get the hype one bit.
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Nein.
Just trust me, Nein.
Ask any German out there.
Just the thought is ridiculous.
And just for the record, Germany does have mutliple heroes I am very proud of, here are just two examples:
MarkMclovin
Member
I wouldn't be proud of the German army, but you should admire what they managed to pull off.
Apart from the evil shit, obviously.
Apart from the evil shit, obviously.
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