Support NeoGAF

[planar1280]

The man behind the design of the Product which made Apple the most successful Tech company in history

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/sir-jonathan-ive-the-iman-cometh-7562170.html

Full interview in link

I am only going to quote the important stuff

Q: What makes design different at Apple?

A: We struggle with the right words to describe the design process at Apple, but it is very much about designing and prototyping and making. When you separate those, I think the final result suffers. If something is going to be better, it is new, and if it’s new you are confronting problems and challenges you don’t have references for. To solve and address those requires a remarkable focus. There’s a sense of being inquisitive and optimistic, and you don’t see those in combination very often.

Q: How does a new product come about at Apple?

A: What I love about the creative process, and this may sound naive, but it is this idea that one day there is no idea, and no solution, but then the next day there is an idea. I find that incredibly exciting and conceptually actually remarkable.

The nature of having ideas and creativity is incredibly inspiring. There is an idea which is solitary, fragile and tentative and doesn’t have form.

What we’ve found here is that it then becomes a conversation, although remains very fragile.

When you see the most dramatic shift is when you transition from an abstract idea to a slightly more material conversation. But when you made a 3D model, however crude, you bring form to a nebulous idea, and everything changes - the entire process shifts. It galvanises and brings focus from a broad group of people. It’s a remarkable process.

Q: What makes a great designer?

A: It is so important to be light on your feet, inquisitive and interested in being wrong. You have that wonderful fascination with the what if questions, but you also need absolute focus and a keen insight into the context and what is important - that is really terribly important. Its about contradictions you have to navigate.

Q: What are your goals when setting out to build a new product?

A: Our goals are very simple - to design and make better products. If we can’t make something that is better, we won’t do it.

Q: Why has Apple’s competition struggled to do that?

A: That’s quite unusual, most of our competitors are interesting in doing something different, or want to appear new - I think those are completely the wrong goals. A product has to be genuinely better. This requires real discipline, and that’s what drives us - a sincere, genuine appetite to do something that is better. Committees just don’t work, and it’s not about price, schedule or a bizarre marketing goal to appear different - they are corporate goals with scant regard for people who use the product.

Q: Has that led to new products within Apple?

A: Examples are products like the iPhone, iPod and iPad. That fanatical attention to detail and coming across a problem and being determined to solve it is critically important - that defines your minute by minute, day by day experience.

Q: How to you know consumers will want your products?

A: We don’t do focus groups - that is the job of the designer. It’s unfair to ask people who don’t have a sense of the opportunities of tomorrow from the context of today to design.

Q: Do consumers really care about good design?

A: One of the things we’ve really learnt over the last 20 years is that while people would often struggle to articulate why they like something - as consumers we are incredibly discerning, we sense where has been great care in the design, and when there is cynicism and greed. It’s one of the thing we’ve found really encouraging.

Q: Users have become incredibly attached, almost obsessively so, to Apple’s products - why is this?

A: It sound so obvious, but I remember being shocked to use a Mac, and somehow have this sense I was having a keen awareness of the people and values of those who made it.

I think that people’s emotional connection to our products is that they sense our care, and the amount of work that has gone into creating it.

 

[Cheebo]

One of the most genius moves Apple took was scrapping focus testing and trying to find out what consumers want. Consumers believe it or not are pretty terrible at explaining or realizing what they want in a tech product.

I wonder why more companies haven't followed Apple's lead in this way.

 

[numble]

I am glad he chose white iPads/iPhones as the lead SKUs to market.

 

[CliqWriter]

Our goals are very simple - to design and make better products. If we can’t make something that is better, we won’t do it.
^^^^
All of the designers at other phone companies should abide by this also.

 

[planar1280]

I am glad he chose white iPads/iPhones as the lead SKUs to market.

I think the white is used because it looks good, it attracts people to the product because of its looks. Black is more functional.

 

[numble]

I think the white is used because it looks good, it attracts people to the product because of its looks. Black is more functional.

For reading, white is much more functional. I had a black iPad 1st gen and white iPad 2, you definitely notice the 1-inch thick bezel less when you're reading with the white iPad. Nobody reads from a huge picture frame.

Look how the bezel is often less noticeable throughout this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp5MBiEYLQE

 

[Kosmo]

Our goals are very simple - to design and make better products. If we can’t make something that is better, we won’t do it.
^^^^
All of the designers at other phone companies should abide by this also.

They would be out of jobs.

 

[RubxQub]

Ives is a cool dude. I wish we saw a lot more of him publicly instead of having him make some statements in the canned product demo videos.

To just be in the room when everyone is hashing out the designs would be such a crazy learning experience.

 

[mrkgoo]

I also cannot stand something being new or different just for the sake of being new or different.

 

[lunarworks]

I also cannot stand something being new or different just for the sake of being new or different.

I shake my head and then laugh when people complain that the new iPad or iPhone "looks the same".

 

[planar1280]

For reading, white is much more functional. I had a black iPad 1st gen and white iPad 2, you definitely notice the 1-inch thick bezel less when you're reading with the white iPad. Nobody reads from a huge picture frame.

Look how the bezel is often less noticeable throughout this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp5MBiEYLQE

if you want to be immersed in what is on screen, black is always better. its like a window or frame into the information. you notice the blend in white.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

That’s quite unusual, most of our competitors are interesting in doing something different, or want to appear new - I think those are completely the wrong goals. A product has to be genuinely better. This requires real discipline, and that’s what drives us - a sincere, genuine appetite to do something that is better. Committees just don’t work, and it’s not about price, schedule or a bizarre marketing goal to appear different - they are corporate goals with scant regard for people who use the product.

Awesome quote. Rings very true in even my own experience.

 

[mrkgoo]

if you want to be immersed in what is on screen, black is always better. its like a window or frame into the information. you notice the blend in white.

I don't think one can always claim that to be true. Think of a painting for example - yes, often it is much better framed. But some paintings look really good stretched over a fame and presented frameless.



Also, on the point of Apple Design, what boggles my mind sometimes is how some strive to 'better' Apple, wondering how they do it, when time and again, they really do lay it out simply, telling everyone what they do.

 

[numble]

if you want to be immersed in what is on screen, black is always better. its like a window or frame into the information. you notice the blend in white.

Only if you are looking at something with a black background. Otherwise you're reading a webpage in a 1-inch thick picture frame.

White is quintessentially Jonny Ive and Apple's design trait--they don't even make their power cables or earbuds any other color:

 

[planar1280]

I don't think one can always claim that to be true. Think of a painting for example - yes, often it is much better framed. But some paintings look really good stretched over a fame and presented frameless.




Also, on the point of Apple Design, what boggles my mind sometimes is how some strive to 'better' Apple, wondering how they do it, when time and again, they really do lay it out simply, telling everyone what they do.

If its about being a painting, why don't tv manufacturers have any other color other than black?

Only if you are looking at something with a black background. Otherwise you're reading a webpage in a 1-inch thick picture frame.

White is quintessentially Jonny Ive and Apple's design trait--they don't even make their power cables or earbuds any other color:

I see it as White being a more attractive color which is why they use it primarily, They could have chosen a completely white iPhone from the start as well. iPhone and iPod touch was their first non-white product.


I see the perfect example is how they have set up showing off apps in the iPad page

http://www.apple.com/ipad/from-the-app-store/

The MAIN picture on top to attract you is all white

The bottom pictures with all the app examples are all black ipads.

 

[which1spink]

If its about being a painting, why don't tv manufacturers have any other color other than black?



I see it as White being a more attractive color which is why they use it primarily, They could have chosen a completely white iPhone from the start as well. iPhone and iPod touch was their first non-white product.

white = most unintrusive color, "melts with the background", becomes invisible of you don't need it, product seen as tool to create content, has it's roots in the Snow White design language developed by frog design in the early 80s ("no paint means greener products") and Dieter Rams (Braun).

entertainment-only products (iPods) = optional color finish

iPhone, iPad = the screen/screen content is the most important design feature of those products. The device itself is seen as a "frame" (of the pictured content), if you will. Oh, and that's why they originally came in black.

 

[planar1280]

white = most unintrusive color, "melts with the background", becomes invisible of you don't need it, product seen as tool to create content, has it's roots in the Snow White design language developed by frog design in the early 80s ("no paint means greener products") and Dieter Rams (Braun).

entertainment-only products (iPods) = optional color finish

iPhone, iPad = the screen/screen content is the most important design feature of those products. The device itself is seen as a "frame" (of the pictured content), if you will. Oh, and that's why the originally came in black.

combine that with this

http://uncrunched.com/2012/02/02/apple-tells-developers-to-stop-using-white-iphone-images/

Apple asked developers to stop using white iPhone images for their marketing

 

[mrkgoo]

Let's not make this another black/white discussion. It was lame in the other thread!

I did remember TVs coming in silver, which looked awesome. TVs are inherently pictures, and do look nice framed. Not all content is suited to being framed. I'd prefer working content such as reading and so forth to be 'unframed'.

 

[polyh3dron]

white = most unintrusive color, "melts with the background", becomes invisible of you don't need it, product seen as tool to create content, has it's roots in the Snow White design language developed by frog design in the early 80s ("no paint means greener products") and Dieter Rams (Braun).

entertainment-only products (iPods) = optional color finish

iPhone, iPad = the screen/screen content is the most important design feature of those products. The device itself is seen as a "frame" (of the pictured content), if you will. Oh, and that's why the originally came in black.

I think you accidentally a word.

 

[Technosteve]

What I want to know is who decided to go with glass as a structural material

 

[numble]

combine that with this

http://uncrunched.com/2012/02/02/apple-tells-developers-to-stop-using-white-iphone-images/

Apple asked developers to stop using white iPhone images for their marketing

That has little to do with anything. They asked 1 developer to change their marketing image, while the white iPhone and iPad are the lead marketing SKUs by Apple.

 

[noah111]

God dammit I clicked this thread thinking there would be video. Nothing Jonathan Ive says matters if I can't look into his eyes as he says it.

 

[kruis]

One of the most genius moves Apple took was scrapping focus testing and trying to find out what consumers want. Consumers believe it or not are pretty terrible at explaining or realizing what they want in a tech product.

I wonder why more companies haven't followed Apple's lead in this way.

Using focus groups is a safety net for scared managers. If a product goes wrong, the management team can point at the focus group results and say "Hey, that's what the public wanted! Don't blame us for the diluted design and the bad sales".

 

[Utako]

Really great read. Looking forward to seeing an Apple product that can wow me again. The iPhone 4 was the last one, but it's OK because "better" definitely takes years in the tech world, while "new" takes seconds.

Our goals are very simple - to design and make better products. If we can’t make something that is better, we won’t do it.
^^^^
All of the designers at other phone companies should abide by this also.

You would have, like, 3 devices in every market, in that case.

There is money to be made in this world if you can muster up some "greed and cynicism."

 

[noah111]

Ok here's an idea for Ive. New iPod Shuffle device that relies completely on the cloud. Small ball/marble/elongated sphere shape that has a single button, microSIM slot, and headphone jack.

Just plug and play, wear it as a necklace that dangles from your headphone jack. Jonny: GO.

 

[Sir Abacus]

Ok here's an idea for Ive. New iPod Shuffle device that relies completely on the cloud. Small ball/marble/elongated sphere shape that has a single button, microSIM slot, and headphone jack.

Just plug and play, wear it as a necklace that dangles from your headphone jack. Jonny: GO.

At that point don't you really just have a radio?

 

[noah111]

At that point don't you really just have a radio?

People use radio? My point was designing a product that relies entirely on iCloud and the enviable streaming future that it brings. So much can be done if/when that becomes the norm across iDevices.

 

[Utako]

Ok here's an idea for Ive. New iPod Shuffle device that relies completely on the cloud. Small ball/marble/elongated sphere shape that has a single button, microSIM slot, and headphone jack.

Just plug and play, wear it as a necklace that dangles from your headphone jack. Jonny: GO.

Truly cool idea, with the only problem being that cellular data is costly and unreliable.

 

[vicissitudes]

Awesome, I've been looking for more articles about Ive.

Now that Steve has passed I feel like Jony has been getting more spotlight in the media.

 

[noah111]

Awesome, I've been looking for more articles about Ive.

Now that Steve has passed I feel like Jony has been getting more spotlight in the media.

As he should. He is truly the only one at Apple that holds a candle to what Jobs was at his core; someone who cared about the details and design.

It's unfortunate that he has no type of leadership capabilities in terms of leading the entire company and multiple branches, or else I would have loved for him to become CEO.

And by becoming CEO, I basically just mean have him do all of Apple's keynotes.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

As he should. He is truly the only one at Apple that holds a candle to what Jobs was at his core; someone who cared about the details and design.

It's unfortunate that he has no type of leadership capabilities in terms of leading the entire company and multiple branches, or else I would have loved for him to become CEO.

And by becoming CEO, I basically just mean have him do all of Apple's keynotes.

You personally know the big wigs over at Apple?

 

[noah111]

Truly cool idea, with the only problem being that cellular data is costly and unreliable.

That's ever-changing though, wouldn't be surprised to see how ubiquitous even 4G could be within a few years.

And price wise, considering it'd be so damn small and have no real internal storage, that leaves it ridiculously cheap and the bulk of the cost just on the cellular fees.

You personally know the big wigs over at Apple?

I don't need to. There's no one more zealous for design and the beauty factor in a deeply human-technological connectivity type of way, than Ive.

 

[Cheebo]

As he should. He is truly the only one at Apple that holds a candle to what Jobs was at his core; someone who cared about the details and design.

It's unfortunate that he has no type of leadership capabilities in terms of leading the entire company and multiple branches, or else I would have loved for him to become CEO.

And by becoming CEO, I basically just mean have him do all of Apple's keynotes.

I think Ive has said before he isn't comfortable speaking in front of audiences, which is why he almost only ever appeared at press events via video.

Cook is a fantastic CEO, its hard to remember but basically the last few years before he retired Jobs was in and out of medical leave constantly. Cook has been guiding the ship more or less the past few years and has been doing nothing but a stellar job.

 

[RivalCore]

My make-a-wish dream would be to spend time with Johnny and his team going around their design and research lab. I bet that place is a Wonderland of failed product concepts, prototypes and designs for future devices.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I don't need to. There's no one more zealous for design and the beauty factor in a deeply human-technological connectivity type of way, than Ive.

You don't need to know them to state things about their personalities and leadership skills as fact?

 

[noah111]

I think Ive has said before he isn't comfortable speaking in front of audiences, which is why he almost only ever appeared at press events via video.

Cook is a fantastic CEO, its hard to remember but basically the last few years before he retired Jobs was in and out of medical leave constantly. Cook has been guiding the ship more or less the past few years and has been doing nothing but a stellar job.

I don't doubt Cook's CEO capabilities. I think he's great, it's just speaker performance wise, Ive is far more attention-grabbing in how deep he is. I wish he would show up more, I never heard that he was 'shy'.

This makes me want to YouTube any of his past video interviews/on-stage showings.

You don't need to know them to state things about their personalities and leadership skills as fact?

Where was I talking about their leadership capabilities?

 

[Bombadil]

I think the reason why Apple products look better is because there is a sense of uniformity in the design.

In contrast, when I look at my HP netbook, there are so many conflicting features on the product that don't mesh well together upon critical inspection. The power adapter is generic and could have come from a Gateway or a Dell or Asus. But with Apple products, even the power adapter is designed to resemble an Apple product. Everything that comes from Apple looks as though it comes from Apple, and no where else. From 200 feet away, I can't tell the difference between a Dell laptop and an HP laptop, but from the same distance, I always know when it's an Apple.

And that's really what this Ives guy is aware of. He's basically saying that they take a lot of time in designing everything in their product including the cables and adapters and buttons, but he's wrapping it up in some kind of melodramatic, artistic language. The truth is, Apple's products are easily recognizable.

They are unique because they all follow the same designs. Two different models of HP laptops have different designs, but two different models of Apple laptops have the same principle architecture. It's all about uniformity; it brings about a sense of cleanliness.

Another problem I have with HP laptops is the manufacturing process that goes into them is clearly of an inferior quality. When I hold up my netbook, I hear this weird cracking sounds because there are many separate components that make up the body, whereas Apple has makes more unibody products.

Apple's products have clean surfaces, all white or all black or gray, unlike the competition which tends to emphasize customization and little artistic doodads. My HP netbook has a black, glossy shell on the outside with an artistic print, and a gray inside shell (keyboard).

Example:

As you can see, the face of the computer has a design print on it.

In contrast, Apple products are all "clean."

The competitors' design philosophies are fragmented. Apple is not.

It is in somewhat stark contrast with Apple's philosophy from the 1980s.

In their 1984 ad, a woman launches a sledgehammer into a screen depicting a dictator of a world in which everyone is uniformly the same (they dress the same, have the same haircuts, etc).

It is ironic, therefore, that Apple found its success in making all of their products the same.

Very ironic.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Where was I talking about their leadership capabilities?

Post #30, which I quoted.

 

[vicissitudes]

As he should. He is truly the only one at Apple that holds a candle to what Jobs was at his core; someone who cared about the details and design.

It's unfortunate that he has no type of leadership capabilities in terms of leading the entire company and multiple branches, or else I would have loved for him to become CEO.

And by becoming CEO, I basically just mean have him do all of Apple's keynotes.

Yeah I don't care about him being CEO (and really he's not as well-suited for the position) but would love to see him do some keynotes.

 

[AstroNut325]

A: We don’t do focus groups - that is the job of the designer. It’s unfair to ask people who don’t have a sense of the opportunities of tomorrow from the context of today to design.

A-friggin-MEN! I strongly believe in this too! Design by committee is NOT the way to go in consumer electronics!

 

[Deleted member 17706]

It is ironic, therefore, that Apple found its success in making all of their products the same.

Very ironic.

It's not ironic at all. "Think Different" was used in regards to their competition.

They are different than their competition as you just illustrated in that large post. They care about good design, cohesiveness, quality, and intuitive user experiences. Their competition does not.

 

[noah111]

Post #30, which I quoted.

"As he should" was in reference to Ive getting more media spotlight lately, which I was quoting. I was saying that it's unfortunate that Ive is not in the position to lead or be a CEO nearly as well as Cook can.

I don't think I need to sit down with everyone at Apple or know either Ive or Cook personally to make this assessment.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

"As he should" was in reference to Ive getting more media spotlight lately, which I was quoting. I was saying that it's unfortunate that Ive is not in the position to lead or be a CEO nearly as well as Cook can.

I don't think I need to sit down with everyone at Apple or know either Ive or Cook personally to make this assessment.

Ah, I interpreted "leadership capabilities" as "leadership skills". My mistake.

 

[lunarworks]

It is in somewhat stark contrast with Apple's philosophy from the 1980s.

In their 1984 ad, a woman launches a sledgehammer into a screen depicting a dictator of a world in which everyone is uniformly the same (they dress the same, have the same haircuts, etc).

It is ironic, therefore, that Apple found its success in making all of their products the same.

Very ironic.

When were you born? Apple had a very clear design language back in the '80s. All of their products looked the same back then, too. Between the Mac launch in 1984 and the Bondi Blue iMac, there were maybe two distinct design languages used, and even those were fairly similar to each other.

 

[Jijidasu]

Would much rather have this recorded. That guy has a really relaxing voice.

 

[noah111]

Ah, I interpreted "leadership capabilities" as "leadership skills". My mistake.

Poor wording on my part.

Would much rather have this recorded. That guy has a really relaxing voice.

Yeah, it's a crime to have an interview with this guy and not have it either on video or audio.

Still an insightful read, though.

 

[adamsappel]

What I want to know is who decided to go with glass as a structural material

Who else? Steve Jobs.

The first iPhone was apparently all ready to hit the market and had a plastic face. Jobs carried a prototype in his pocket with his keys and saw that the face got scratched (and I'm sure it wouldn't take much of a scratch to set off the mercurial Jobs). Unacceptable, he said. It has to be glass. And it has to be ready in six weeks. They contacted glass manufacturers and found a suitable material (Gorilla Glass?) from Corning, an American company. But, this is the part that is "only possible in China." The Chinese were able to build a factory (hell, they built it on spec before Apple gave them the contract) and supply the tens of thousands of workers who would just be working on cutting and polishing and installing the glass screen.

 

[adamsappel]

It's not ironic at all. "Think Different" was used in regards to their competition.

They are different than their competition as you just illustrated in that large post. They care about good design, cohesiveness, quality, and intuitive user experiences. Their competition does not.

I think many are unaware of just how uniformly bland PCs used to be. They were all made in the same beige-white color. I think Job's NeXT computer was the first black computer I'd ever seen. The candy-color Macs may look ridiculous now, but it really was a sea-change from everything else that was available (including previous Macs).

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

It’s unfair to ask people who don’t have a sense of the opportunities of tomorrow from the context of today to design.

This is a pretty awesome quote right here. Partially why I hate focus groups as well.

 

[Bombadil]

It's not ironic at all. "Think Different" was used in regards to their competition.

They are different than their competition as you just illustrated in that large post. They care about good design, cohesiveness, quality, and intuitive user experiences. Their competition does not.

That's a matter of opinion. When I was younger iMacs came in a variety of colors. It was part of the whole rainbow-spectrum design that Apple was rocking. They've since begun phasing that out except in rare cases (iPod Nanos and first gen Ipads).

But in most cases, Apple computers looked just like any other computer. They weren't staggeringly different from PCs.

I remember a large, bulky, beige-colored Apple computer in my classroom labs at school.

Whether they do things differently from the competition is not the main point. Over time, as Apple becomes more and more popular, they will fall into the same cycle that PCs like IBM did. The uniformity they're pushing now will make them resemble the dystopian future they depicted in their 1984 ad.

It is ironic, therefore, that Apple's "same-ness" approach to their product line is what makes them stand out. They are unique in that all of their products look the same.

The lack of choice is what makes Apple products appealing.

It's like this: Apple products don't make up 50 percent of the marketshare, but they've always made up 50 percent of the argument. "Are you getting a Mac or a PC?"

Dozens of tech companies are shuffled under the umbrella of "PC." Apple stands alone.

If I say I want a PC, I haven't even begun my journey into purchasing one. Do I get a Samsung, an Acer, an Asus, a Dell, a Toshiba, a Sony, a Lenovo, an HP, a Gateway, an IBM, a Panasonic, a ViewSonic, or an LG?

People don't want to deal with that many options, and most people who buy Apple products aren't deeply interested in the technical aspect. They want it because it's popular, it's stylish, and it does what they want. They don't really care about the performance.