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[JaggedSac]

Just to point something out, It's actually more likely this would be true for PS4 than xbox one as xb1 uses esram and the original article doesn't really provide any info what so ever other than it uses HLSL, which isn't exactly absent in the PS4 Development, it's just slightly different (PSSL). It is of course extremely unlikely for either.

I literally cannot believe this is going to turn into the next secret sauce going by what some people are posting on here...It's ridiculous.

This wouldn't be secret sauce regardless of if it were true or not. The Bone will be using a low level API either way.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

No, it means that making Mantle / XBox One games is going to be similar, they still have to develop for non-AMD cards on PC, which means DirectX, which is the same as it is now.

Xbox One has mantle and Direct X though does it not? It should still make things a bit easier no?

What is the point of it, if it doesn't do anything.

 

[cyberheater]

So just speculation at this point.

 

[QaaQer]

Xbox One has mantle and Direct X though does it not? It should still make things a bit easier no?

What is the point of it, if it doesn't do anything.

It allows AMD to market their cards since they are losing the tech battle with Nvidia.

 

[Bundy]

So just speculation at this point.

Yep, no informations or confirmations.
Only speculation and "guesses".

 

[Skeff]

This wouldn't be secret sauce regardless of if it were true or not. The Bone will be using a low level API either way.

you know that, I know that, everyone with technical knowledge on the subject knows it, but just wait, it's coming....

 

[ConteZero76]

So what's inside the PS4?

Sony is less interested in console->PC porting.

 

[cyberheater]

Yep, no informations or confirmations.
Only speculation and "guesses".

That sounds familiar. Most of the 'power' threads about Xbox One has the same.

 

[Josh7289]

Hopefully this means PC versions of lots and lots of next-gen games.

 

[AdmiralPain]

But will Nvidia pick up the mantle?

Spoiler

sorry

 

[TechnicPuppet]

It allows AMD to market their cards since they are losing the tech battle with Nvidia.

There was a Mantle thread earlier and it seemed to be very positive, like it was a good thing, so now it's just marketing?

 

[cyberheater]

Hopefully this means PC versions of lots and lots of next-gen games.

I'm hoping that PC will be the lead platform from here on in.

 

[QaaQer]

& this just made things more expensive and complicated for multiplats. Amd's market share is around 30% and I get that they need a hail mary, but having devs split the PC code for amd/non-amd cards...well I guess if you are really into frostbite3 games.

It does hint at some interesting politics behind the scenes though, can't wait for the story to come out.

 

[IN&OUT]

Isn't this kind of obvious guys?

Mantle must work on windows environment therefore to achieve low-level api access for PC means that Mantle would be similar to XboxOne API derived from direcX.

 

[Nethaniah]

But will Nvidia pick up the mantle?

Spoiler

sorry

Valid question regardless, let's just hope they don't start making something similar which only works for them, split the community even more.

Shame they couldn't force MS to turn Directx into this.

 

[velociraptor]

Isn't this kind of obvious guys?

Mantle must work on windows environment therefore to achieve low-level api access for PC means that Mantle would be similar to XboxOne API derived from direcX.

That doesn't make any sense.

 

[jwhit28]

Hopefully this means PC versions of lots and lots of next-gen games.

PC versions won't be any less or anymore likely. Any PC game released will still work with DirectX as usual. It CAN mean that what ever games do come from Xbox One are more likely to be Mantle compatible and perform better on AMD hardware.

 

[QaaQer]

There was a Mantle thread earlier and it seemed to be very positive, like it was a good thing, so now it's just marketing?

It's not just marketing, but getting at a real understanding of things will be harder because of marketing. And making PC devs use 2 sets of APIs is going to do nothing to make things cheaper for them.

 

[Bundy]

That sounds familiar. Most of the 'power' threads about Xbox One has the same.

Phil Harrison even continued with the "powah of the cloud" talk.... a few minutes ago:

“The cloud will keep consoles relevant.”

Power of cloud: Better graphics, better lighting, better physics.

Horrible

 

[Finalizer]

Xbone provides something good for gamers for once. [/snark]

dismantled

 

[TheKayle]

you know that, I know that, everyone with technical knowledge on the subject knows it, but just wait, it's coming....

but if true (and i dont think it is) this would put pc (and directly xb1) as lead platforms

 

[satam55]

but if true (and i dont think it is) this would put pc (and directly xb1) as lead platforms

PC version was already gonna be the lead platform.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

Phil Harrison even continued with the "powah of the cloud" talk.... a few minutes ago:




Horrible

What does that have to do with this topic?

 

[QaaQer]

PC version was already gonna be the lead platform.

ah, but AMD pcs or Nividia pcs?

 

[Neander]

So, is this dat truth that major nelson couldn't wait to drop? I must say, this is pretty saucy if true.

 

[IN&OUT]

That doesn't make any sense.

Maybe I didn't word my post correctly. I mean Mantle is a low-level API for PC. in order to achieve great market penetration it needs to be compatible with DirectX "Windows", therefore similarities to X1 low level API is expected since X1 API is derived from DirectX already.

by doing that AMD can achieve similar console low access for PC + easier porting between platforms.

 

[Skeff]

Why Would Microsoft help create a DirectX competitor exactly?

 

[QaaQer]

What does that have to do with this topic?

It's an example of how marketing obfuscates things.

 

[Terbinator]

...since AMD have just proven it's possible...

But such a thing has always been possible (AFAIK). The only reason it has come to light now is that AMD have their fingers in the necessary pies and all the pies are based on the same (GCN) filling.

 

[QaaQer]

Maybe I didn't word my post correctly. I mean Mantle is a low-level API for PC. in order to achieve great market penetration it needs to be compatible with DirectX "Windows", therefore similarities to X1 low level API is expected since X1 API is derived from DirectX already.

by doing that AMD can achieve similar console low access for PC + easier porting between platforms.

Only for the tiny percentage of the PC market that will have AMD 7000+ series gfx cards.

 

[Salvor.Hardin]

So, is this dat truth that major nelson couldn't wait to drop? I must say, this is pretty saucy if true.

Could you explain why it's saucy? Not sure I understand the importance of this 'revelation' if it's true.

 

[Bundy]

What does that have to do with this topic?

He said something (Cloud, etc.) and I replied to his post.

Back on Topic:

Digital Foundry - Mantle appears to have much in common with the GNM API used in PS4

 

[Toski]

It allows AMD to market their cards since they are losing the tech battle with Nvidia.

AMD hasn't lost any "tech" battle, GCN is competitive with Kepler. Mantle is AMD leveraging their console contracts into the PC realm. IF they can get the low level optimizations made on the PS4 and X1 onto the PC, they hope that they can use this to beat Nvidia on benchmarks and performance. I wouldn't be surprised if MS uses Mantle as a starting point for DirectX 12 and tries to cutdown on DirectX overhead.

 

[DieH@rd]

Why is it Dice and AMD working on it then instead of Microsoft?

Microsoft is way more focused on OS development. Changing on DirectX landscape was not important to them as long every GPU vendor supports it, and now they found themselves in situation that AMD holds 100% of hardware in two nextgen consoles and have vision of unified PC hardware for the future.

Add to that developers who are not satisfied with slow PC DirectX... and Mantle is born.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

He said something (Cloud, etc.) and I replied to his post.

Back on Topic:

Digital Foundry - Mantle appears to have much in common with the GNM API used in PS4

Haven't you said many, many times that DF talk nonsense?

 

[Neander]

Could you explain why it's saucy? Not sure I understand the importance of this 'revelation' if it's true.

wouldn't that make the XB1 the lead platform for multiplats?

 

[Bundy]

Haven't you said many, many times that DF talk nonsense?

Yes -> *click*
What does that have to do with my post?

 

[Finalizer]

There was a Mantle thread earlier and it seemed to be very positive, like it was a good thing, so now it's just marketing?

Depends who you ask, heh. I think most folks are just curious to see what it actually ends up bringing to the table, though I'd imagine nVidia fans will prefer it to ultimately end up irrelevant.

As to how all the news fits into place, there's just way too much dust being kicked into the air to get a clear picture. MS could be perfectly cool with Mantle as an additional API for Windows to help market games on the PC. On the flip side, they could be opposed if SteamOS heavily leverages Mantle and Steambox ends up taking off thanks in part to something like that. Or some other combination of factors.

Main point is, there's a ton of questions in the air with these developments. How everything will actually play out has to remain to be seen, really.

wouldn't that make the XB1 the lead platform for multiplats?

Not in itself, no. It would just make porting an Xbone game to Mantle on the PC easier, but devs would still have to work out a DirectX version as well for full PC support. What this does mean, in part, is that PC gamers with AMD hardware can looks forward to possibly better optimized software for their systems.

"Lead platform" will still mostly be up to the individual developers.

 

[Ce-Lin]

does this mean almost "straight" ports from at least XB1 games to PC ? my next upgrade will be AMD again for sure, seems a no-brainer ?

 

[TechnicPuppet]

Yes -> *click*
What does that have to do with my post?

How does posting a link to a different topic put a discussion back on topic?

 

[Raytow]

Secret sauce returns! yes I'm sure this news will make the power disparity go in favour of the xbone....

 

[Bundy]

How does posting a link to a different topic put a discussion back on topic?

Because my post (DF) was me being sarcastic.
Got it? It has nothing to with me believing DF is right here.
PM me, if you have more questions.
Will help you asap!

 

[Laughing_Man__]

How does posting a link to a different topic put a discussion back on topic?

I think it could mean both systems have the Mantle API.

 

[Raydeen]

So does this officially mean.

Xbone >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PS4?

ESDRAM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GDDR5

CERNY AM SMILE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CERNY AM CRY?

SHAPE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WILLIAM SHATNER

 

[Skeff]

How does posting a link to a different topic put a discussion back on topic?

It's the same topic, think about it.

 

[Nightengale]

The elephant in the room is 'will Mantle support Linux?'

Because I cannot fathom either console company doing this if Mantle is going to be supported by Linux/Steambox, unless this is all an AMD's Montreal Screwjob of copying as much of both console's API for their own.

 

[Brad Grenz]

So does this officially mean.

Xbone >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PS4?

ESDRAM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GDDR5

CERNY AM SMILE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CERNY AM CRY?

SHAPE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WILLIAM SHATNER

Nope, just that Anandtech is being dumb.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

I think it could mean both systems have the Mantle API.

Let's hope so.

 

[Igo]

I thought AMD's future cards were supposed to have more in common with what the PS4 is running than the One. Why then would Mantle be derivative of the One's API's instead of Sony's?

 

[DieH@rd]

Valid question regardless, let's just hope they don't start making something similar which only works for them, split the community even more.

Shame they couldn't force MS to turn Directx into this.

Nobody could force MS to significantly change DirectX....