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Anyone else think Miyazaki films are overrated?

Is Hayao Miyazaki an overrated director?

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Considering how influential they have been throughout anime history, absolutely not
 
At least your heart is in the right place about Howl's. (Even though it's still a masterpiece from the technical standpoint and better than most Disney's output)
 
Wasn't a fan of Ponyo, but other than that they're all pretty fantastic.

The plots can be a bit light, for sure, but the characters, worlds, and imagination usually make up for that.
 
Nope. Best anime movies around, least typical anime tropey as well. And I don't think it is a coincidence they are by far the most successful internationally.
 
UncleSporky said:
I'm not a huge fan of Spirited Away. I would assume to fully appreciate it you need to have an intimate understanding of Japanese mythology/characters/youkai or whatever.

I was told "oh this is a good movie, it's like a Japanese take on Alice in Wonderland!" and it absolutely was not. Characters and their motivations make even less sense than in something like Alice, because they're neither said to be mad/crazy nor do they act that way. They act wrong, though. What is the story behind No-Face, why does he act the way he does? What's up with Yubaba's twin sister and transforming the weird baby and bird and what's with the heads stacked on each other etc. etc.? I guess it makes sense and is poignant if you're Japanese? "Oh those three green heads are a well-known mythological figure from the Edo period and symbolize Yubaba's inquisitiveness."
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I feel like you're unevenly comparing the two, especially in regards to your assumptions that everything in Spirited Away must be based on some mythology you just don't know.

Alice in Wonderland wasn't exactly based on English folklore. There's definitely a very pervasive "Japanese-ness" to Spirited Away, but it operates on a very similar whimsical nonlogic, and while there are some small references to Japanese folklore most of the major players (like No Face, who you mentioned) are completely original. You're assuming there's a lot of deep cultural meaning behind Spirited Away that you needed to but couldn't possibly understand, but don't apply the same standard to Alice in Wonderland (because you probably already understand that most of the latter is fantasy silliness just not the former).

Most of the characters in Alice in Wonderland don't have a deep backstory for why they are, either. Nobody is going around asking for the long and storied history behind the Queen of Hearts or the White Rabbit or the Mad Hatter. You don't ask why the caterpillar smokes hookah. Nobody needs to know why the Cheshire Cat can do the wacky things it does. You accept at face value that these things just are what they're presented to be. It doesn't really take any more suspension of disbelief to get the concept of an evil witch, a good witch, a giant baby, and wacky rolling head creatures.

I've honestly not heard the comparison between Spirited Away and Alice in Wonderland before, but it's actually a pretty good one. Both are weird, fantastic stories about a young girl stuck in a strange ethereal world with unusual rules and nonsensical creatures. Both are structured as a series of barely connected mini-stories before eventually resolving at the end, rather than a more traditional story structure. I think when it comes to Spirited Away you're really just looking for things that aren't there tbh.
 
Krev said:
If there's an overrated Miyazki film I'd say it's Mononoke.
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I don't like the word "overrated" because it implies that you think people are wrong about what they, themselves, think of the film, since ratings reflect the entirely subjective and individual opinions of the individual reviewing the film. If you say "this deserves a three" and I give it a four, who are you to tell me I'm wrong? Maybe you can convince me to notice some flaws that I didn't notice before, but you're unlikely to be able to do that on a macro scale.

Anyway, I have always found Ghibli films to have borderline nonsensical plots. They're still beautiful films visually and they're often touching, but the... six of them that I've seen have all largely not left me with much to think about. Having said that, I don't have any particular affection for Disney either, so perhaps "made for kids but fun for adults" just isn't the genre for me.
 
ecosse_011172 said:
I haven't watched any, where should I start ?
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Some of the films were made that were answering various social questions at the time as well as answering some cultural questions about Japanese social history. They will also contain themes of the courage of women and that the hero's journey is not only for the men.


I would start with the early stuff and work my way forward. Then you can understand why some of the films were made the way they were and the time they were made in.

Although all the films in my mind are timeless, I like many other get a sense of longing for something in the past that I cannot quite put my finger on. The real emotions that some of the scenes plus the music from Hisaishi combined, draws up these memories as if it is like I have lived another life in a dream somewhere and I a have forgotten what it is like. Some of the films actually have these themes in there.

Look at the Ghibli films as a body of work and maybe watch future boy conan first and castle of cagliostro to see how the studio and the people involved would eventually evolve. from there you can appreciate the masterpieces that come later and the peak as well as the decline in the studio but its not a big decline by any means but there is a slight dip.
 
No, but I could understand why someone wouldn't care for Miyazaki's films, still I happen to think most of his films from top to bottom are usually excellent to very good. Howl's Moving Castle is probably the film that everyone including his films thinks meets the least sense, but I still enjoy it quite a bit myself.
 
Regginator said:
I've only seen two of his films, Spirited Away and Princess Mononoke. One I that loved and one I enjoyed. As far as I know, those two are considered the best of his films. Are the other ones good as well? Which ones would y'all recommend?
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If you like the more whimsical yet grounded fantasy stories, I can't recommend My Neighbor Totoro and Kiki's Delivery Service enough. They're secretly slice of life stories that happen to feature some fantastic elements to them (forest spirits in the former, witches being a commonly known and even desired commodity in the latter) that also happen to center around young girls as they deal with some real life drama. I think what makes them really special is that they don't really resort to escalating the drama to absurd heights, and instead deal with very human fears and anxieties as they prepare to deal with a much larger world while having a very positive outlook. They're genuinely uplifting in a way a lot of films don't quite measure up to, even in the world of animation.
 
I think overrated is too strong of a word but I don't like Spirited Away nearly as much as most people it seems. Mononoke is light years ahead of it.
 
Fugu said:
I don't like the word "overrated" because it implies that you think people are wrong about what they, themselves, think of the film, since ratings reflect the entirely subjective and individual opinions of the individual reviewing the film. If you say "this deserves a three" and I give it a four, who are you to tell me I'm wrong? Maybe you can convince me to notice some flaws that I didn't notice before, but you're unlikely to be able to do that on a macro scale.
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I agree with this. I wrote a post saying that Mononoke is the 'overrated' one, but I don't mean to take away from anyone that enjoys it. It's completely subjective.
 
Speaking of, anyone that has a theater that runs Fathom Events programming should know that they're showing Castle in the Sky tonight in a subtitled version, as well as a screening on Wednesday night for the dub. One of my friends is a Ghibli nut and says it's her favorite of all of Miyazaki's films, so I'm really excited to find out for myself just how good it is.
 
EGM1966 said:
No. Between this and the HL2 threads on gaming side seems the minority's crowd seeking validation are out in force.

It's fine to not like something but your individual view has no real bearing on the materials overall critical status in the medium.

And to be blunt with views like this I question your actual detailed understanding of the medium.
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.
 
Fugu said:
I don't like the word "overrated" because it implies that you think people are wrong about what they, themselves, think of the film, since ratings reflect the entirely subjective and individual opinions of the individual reviewing the film. If you say "this deserves a three" and I give it a four, who are you to tell me I'm wrong? Maybe you can convince me to notice some flaws that I didn't notice before, but you're unlikely to be able to do that on a macro scale.

Anyway, I have always found Ghibli films to have borderline nonsensical plots. They're still beautiful films visually and they're often touching, but the... six of them that I've seen have all largely not left me with much to think about. Having said that, I don't have any particular affection for Disney either, so perhaps "made for kids but fun for adults" just isn't the genre for me.
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Not even The Wind Rises?
 
Not really.XD His later films might have been a bit on the weak side (Ponyo and The Wind Rises), but he made so many classics. Don't think Howl's Moving Castle was one of his best, but it was enjoyable still.
 
It took forever for those movies to even catch on in the US, and at least some of them are masterpieces. I don't know how you can act like they've received more than their share of recognition in a world where Sausage Party exists.
 
Wind Rises still ultra divisive I see.
I like that I'm seeing more people speaking for its greatness.
 
Look. You are totally free to have this poll and I personally think he was a great director with interesting stories to tell.

With that said, why are we asking ourselves this when we are being inundated with awful, crap-tier super hero movies with nonsense plots made for every single pair of eyeballs on the planet.

3 Spider-Man reboots in, like,15 years? Let's maybe try something else. Anything else. Please.
 
Some of the later ones are. Earthsea sucked. Animation quality is always solid, but god damn anything Earthsea source material related just seems to blow and require some kind of required reading or something.

Loved Spirited Away, Laputa is one of my favorite of all time films, Nausica is fucking legend tier great, Who didn't like Princess Mononoke, Howls moving castle was fantastic, Im still traumatized for life by Grave of the Fireflies, Ponyo was great save for the fucking weird kids rapping at the end in the english credits (da fug?), and I even enjoyed Pom Poko legit for what it was and not just because lol balls.

Later Ghibli stuff though...ehhhhhhhh. I never watched arietty, earthsea sucked, My Neighbor the yamadas was terribly drawn sketch comedy jokes that went nowhere (damned overbudget interns), and I'm kind of still waiting for something that isn't slice of life from them again and is back to the more high fantasy stuff. Kaguya has potential I think.

For a studio to have so many top films though is crazy. They're bound to have a few duds. Im more than happy with how consistent they've been. They're tone has just been more rooted in realism lately and I think they thrived better in stories that were more fantasy interrupts reality situations.
 
Zukkoyaki said:
I think overrated is too strong of a word but I don't like Spirited Away nearly as much as most people it seems. Mononoke is light years ahead of it.
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I also enjoy Mononoke more than Spirited away, but Spirited away is still a beautiful movie with a lot of memorable characters and scenes.

My Neighbor Totoro is a goddamned masterpiece, also.
 
I am not keen on Howl's Moving Castle it is simply not as good as Spirited Away which is one of the best animated movies ever made.

Are Miyazaki films overrated, the consensus is no, I can not like or enjoy a film but I can appreciate the film and the acting, direction etc that has gone in to it.
 
Howl's Moving Castle is my least favorite, but everything else I've seen was utterly amazing; even Ponyo!

Earthsea is trash of course, and not his work.
 
shaowebb said:
Some of the later ones are. Earthsea sucked. Animation quality is always solid, but god damn anything Earthsea source material related just seems to blow and require some kind of required reading or something.

Loved Spirited Away, Laputa is one of my favorite of all time films, Nausica is fucking legend tier great, Who didn't like Princess Mononoke, Howls moving castle was fantastic, Im still traumatized for life by Grave of the Fireflies, Ponyo was great save for the fucking weird kids rapping at the end in the english credits (da fug?), and I even enjoyed Pom Poko legit for what it was and not just because lol balls.

Later Ghibli stuff though...ehhhhhhhh. I never watched arietty, earthsea sucked, My Neighbor the yamadas was terribly drawn sketch comedy jokes that went nowhere (damned overbudget interns), and I'm kind of still waiting for something that isn't slice of life from them again and is back to the more high fantasy stuff. Kaguya has potential I think.

For a studio to have so many top films though is crazy. They're bound to have a few duds. Im more than happy with how consistent they've been. They're tone has just been more rooted in realism lately and I think they thrived better in stories that were more fantasy interrupts reality situations.
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1) There are Ghibli films that are not directed by Miyazaki, even though Miyazaki has tended to overshadow the other talent who worked there such as his colleague Takahata and the younger director Yonebayashi.

2) "Overbudget interns"? Really?
 
duckroll said:
Not really an excuse at all. Howl's is entirely his movie, he didn't inherit any of the work Hosoda did on the project. When Hosoda worked on the film, the script was written by Reiko Yoshida, and entirely storyboarded by Hosoda. But Ghibli's animators constantly clashed with Hosoda and Kondo just didn't like working with him. When Miyazaki took over he scrapped everything and decided to write and storyboard the new film himself. So it being a bad movie is entirely on Miyazaki. He's a bad father and a bad director.
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so Howls moving castle is bad now? Unbelievable.
 
While I love many/most of Miyazaki's films, I will say that I don't know what people see in Howl's Moving Castle. What I saw was a bizarre mishmosh of events that didn't make any sense or appear to follow a consistent plot. I stopped watching a little over half way through.

Spirited Away, Totoro, Ponyo, Kiki, Wind Rises, etc etc are all excellent though.
 
I'll own up to the fact that I don't love em as much as most do, at least the ones I've seen. I recall that Spirited Away did nothing for me.

Castle of Cagliostro is still my favorite feature-length anime of all time though.
 
I think some are overrated. Howl's may get more love than it deserves because it's Miyazaki. However, Mononoke, Spirited Away, Totoro, Kiki's even Cagilostro and Porco Rosso are all great and not really overrated at all, in my mind.
 
No he is not overrated spirited away, porco rosso and the wind rises are all masterpieces. Takahata and satoshi kon are underrated as hell though
 
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