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[Piecake]

For at least a few decades, Americans have been drilled in the superiority of tote bags. Reusable bags are good, we’re told, because they’re friendly for the environment. Disposable bags, on the other hand, are dangerous. Municipalities across the country have moved to restrict the consumption of plastic shopping bags to avoid waste. Many businesses have stopped offering plastic sacks, or provide them for a modest but punitive price. Bag-recycling programs have been introduced nationwide.

But canvas bags might actually be worse for the environment than the plastic ones they are meant to replace. In 2008, the UK Environment Agency (UKEA) published a study of resource expenditures for various bags: paper, plastic, canvas, and recycled-polypropylene tote bags. Surprisingly, the authors found that in typical patterns of use and disposal, consumers seeking to minimize pollution and carbon emissions should use plastic grocery bags and then reuse those bags at least once—as trash-can liners or for other secondary tasks. Conventional plastic bags made from high-density polyethylene (HDPE, the plastic sacks found at grocery stores) had the smallest per-use environmental impact of all those tested. Cotton tote bags, by contrast, exhibited the highest and most severe global-warming potential by far since they require more resources to produce and distribute.

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/09/to-tote-or-note-to-tote/498557/

 

[jchap]

I still go to a store that offers paper sacks. Paper sacks for life

 

[ThreePiMatt]

I usually have a big ole pile of the plastic bags and either recycle them or my mom comes to visit and takes them since she volunteers at a dog shelter and they need them to pick up dog shit on walks.

 

[xxracerxx]

I still go to a store that offers paper sacks. Paper sacks for life

My city doesn't even allow plastic bags anymore.

I usually have a big ole pile of the plastic bags and either recycle them

I hope you are not just throwing them in your recycle bin.

 

[luoapp]

Speaking of which,

consumers seeking to minimize pollution and carbon emissions should use plastic grocery bags and then reuse those bags at least once—as trash-can liners

where can I find trash can made specifically with this in mind, all I can find use much bigger trash bags.

 

[old manatee]

consumers seeking to minimize pollution and carbon emissions should use plastic grocery bags and then reuse those bags at least once—as trash-can liners

o shit I've been doing this for like 15 years because it always seemed the most sensible to me. I smell like a genius.

 

[Krev]

Isn't the whole point of tote bags that you can reuse them nearly infinitely?
You can't take your plastic bags back to the supermarket to hold your groceries.

 

[InfiniteBento]

Speaking of which,


where can I find trash can made specifically with this in mind, all I can find use much bigger trash bags.

Ikeas trash cans are perfect for this. I use one in my bathroom then reuse plastic bags with it.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

The point of re-usable bags was to prevent plastic pollution in the environment, not prevent the production of green-house gasses...

Unless I missed something.

 

[Sectorseven]

I reuse plastic bags as stuffing for packages.

 

[SatoAilDarko]

All the small trash bins in my family's house use plastic bags.

 

[Machine]

plastic bags are great for cleaning the litter box too

 

[luoapp]

Ikeas trash cans are perfect for this. I use one in my bathroom then reuse plastic bags with it.

Which one? I'd imagine one with two hooks so I can hang the grocery bag easily.

 

[Vanillalite]

Speaking of which,


where can I find trash can made specifically with this in mind, all I can find use much bigger trash bags.

They work for bathroom like trash cans.

Also dog owners know. Save them bags to pick up doggie poo.

 

[kirblar]

They completely missed the worst part about them: they make people sick because people don't wash the bags: papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2196481

 

[Syncytia]

Wat

Besides, she adds, it's too nice to load up with diapers or dripping chicken breasts.

 

[AdventureRacing]

Is this because people don't reuse them enough? I've had my 3 recyclable bags for about 5 years now and they're still doing the trick. They have save me getting hundreds of plastic bags, I don't see how that doesn't reduce waste in they environment (which was the intention).

In terms of reusing plastic bags as bins, I do that if I end up with them. At this point I get all my rubbish bins from my work. I work at a hospital and when I unpack out weekly stores for emergency we get dozens of plastic bags which just get chucked out. I just take them home which easily covers me for the week.

 

[RumblingRosco]

This article completely ignores reusable polypropylene bags, which is what most reusable bags are made out of, at least that I've seen.

“Polyethylene bags need to be used four times, a polypropylene bag must be used at least 11 times and a cotton bag must be used at least 131 times,” according to the UK Environment Agency.

Cotton bags are shit, but polypropylene smash the crap out of your standard polyethylene bag, IMO.

 

[SuperChoco]

Is this because people don't reuse them enough? I've had my 3 recyclable bags for about 5 years now and they're still doing the trick. They have save me getting hundreds of plastic bags, I don't see how that doesn't reduce waste in they environment (which was the intention).

Correct. From the article

So long as their owners don’t throw them away, their negative impact remains minimized, at least—they might yet be used 327 times. Ecologically speaking, the best practice for tote bags might be one of two extremes: use them all the time, or not at all.

Tote bags over a long period of time is beneficial to the environment, however there is an oversaturation of them and people are not using them (perhaps out of habit or perceived ubiquity) that it is currently is not helpful to the environment.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

The results come from a UK agency 10 years ago, when the UK has since imposed a tax plastic bags for groceries and put encouragment on totes....

 

[InfiniteBento]

Which one? I'd imagine one with two hooks so I can hang the grocery bag easily.

This one is only $2 and the bag fits perfectly around it

 

[CrocMother]

There are so many layers that this study doesn'tns touch on. Does it take into account the impact on municipal solid waste systems?

 

[Leunam]

This article completely ignores reusable polypropylene bags, which is what most reusable bags are made out of, at least that I've seen.



Cotton bags are shit, but polypropylene smash the crap out of your standard polyethylene bag, IMO.

Was going to mention the same thing. I haven't seen people use cotton bags in years.

 

[Piecake]

They completely missed the worst part about them: they make people sick because people don't wash the bags: papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2196481

This article completely ignores reusable polypropylene bags, which is what most reusable bags are made out of, at least that I've seen.

Cotton bags are shit, but polypropylene smash the crap out of your standard polyethylene bag, IMO.

If what Kirblar linked is true, I kinda doubt that any sort of reusable bag is going to be better for the environment than plastic bags

 

[norm9]

I still go to a store that offers paper sacks. Paper sacks for life

Or plastic bags even. I just like free bags because I use them.

Eta- just line a twelve pack's box with a plastic bag. Free trashcan.

 

[OnionPowder]

Wat

I have a normal trash bag filled with these for when my wife finally gets pregnant. They're amazing for disposing of diapers.

 

[Zhengi]

Isn't the whole point of tote bags that you can reuse them nearly infinitely?
You can't take your plastic bags back to the supermarket to hold your groceries.

Except you can't because tote bags break or they get messy and you need to wash them. So more resources spent.

 

[God Dayumm]

Reusable bags do seem kind of a waste when I have to wash them after every few uses anyway, otherwise they become a den of bacteria. But on the other hand, they go with the rest of my laundry so it's an insignificant amount of water and energy they consume to be washed.

 

[Quick]

I use the bags as trash bin liners. More stores (usually groceries) are charging for bags, so I have a lot of bags from clothing stores instead. As mentioned, the IKEA bins work pretty well, but as long as the bag can roll over the rim of the bin, it's fine.

Even just hooking up the bag works. They're fairly low maintenance.

Which one? I'd imagine one with two hooks so I can hang the grocery bag easily.

There are trash bins made to work with grocery bags, but as long as you can roll it over the rim and secure it (tie it up to tighten) that'll do - like so:

 

[SuperChoco]

Except you can't because tote bags break or they get messy and you need to wash them. So more resources spent.

Anecdotally, I haven't needed to do additional loads due to reusable bags. Just toss em with your clothes and they'll be fine.

 

[Breads]

Back when I was hella broke I used to buy those $.05 plastic tote backs from save alot.

That was years ago.

They are still in use.

 

[davepoobond]

The point of re-usable bags was to prevent plastic pollution in the environment, not prevent the production of green-house gasses...

Unless I missed something.

You did. Global warming is a bigger issue

 

[User 479360]

We reuse plastic bags all the time, as trash can liners. I prefer them over tote bags because I don't like reusing bags for shopping (especially if I buy something I want to stay clean). But it's annoying having to pay 5-10 cents for them.

 

[ThreePiMatt]

My city doesn't even allow plastic bags anymore.


I hope you are not just throwing them in your recycle bin.

Of course not. Stuff them all up together and stick them in the bin at the grocery store.

 

[emag]

Giant has shifty plastic bags that always have holes in them by the time you get home. They are the worst of both worlds.

 

[Fuchsdh]

I reuse the plastic bags I get for trash liners but recycling them is a pain, so I'd rather not have them. The canvas bags we've got have lasted three years this far and unless you're overloading them I don't see how they will fall apart. That's around 140ish uses down thus far.

The issue with reusing versus disposable stuff isn't easy to capture, but a lot of it comes down to the fact that we really need to train people not to toss things so easily, and given the cheapness of new goods it's a hard sell.

 

[CrocMother]

You did. Global warming is a bigger issue

The impact of plastic bags on global warming is negligible at best, while the impact on waste management and pollution is significant.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Well fuck. I do use reusable bags and used them tons, but it's true that I have spare ones lying around that I don't use (given for free at some event or other).

In other words, you either contribute to environment pollution, or greenhouse emissions. Fuuuuuu

 

[buy teh haloz]

Tote bags are way way way more comfortable to use.

 

[CrocMother]

Well fuck. I do use reusable bags and used them tons, but it's true that I have spare ones lying around that I don't use (given for free at some event or other).

In other words, you either contribute to environment pollution, or greenhouse emissions. Fuuuuuu

The impact on greenhouse emissions of bags is microscopic. But you are making a tangible impact on your local environment by not using plastic bags.

 

[KarmaCow]

Tote bags are way way way more comfortable to use.

Yea, I've been making an effort to walk around more and carrying groceries in plastic bags fucks up my fingers.

 

[Nesotenso]

I take paper when I have bought less things and usually go plastic. But I usually recycle the plastic ones for small trash bins like it says in the article.

 

[WedgeX]

The UKEA study calculated an expenditure of a little less than two kilograms of carbon per HDPE bag. For paper bags, seven uses would be needed to achieve the same per-use ratio. Tote bags made from recycled polypropylene plastic require 26, and cotton tote bags require 327 uses

So I use typically one tote bag for groceries every week. If I did not use this bag it would be at least three plastic bags. Four years of use so far and about 200 uses. At a minimum, really. Which would, since plastic grocery bags don't make their way back to the grocery store, be about 600 plastic bags. Trash goes out once a week, so that's 200 of those 600 bags that get reused. Leaving 400 other bags needing reuse.

It seems like a rare attempt at gotcha journalism from The Atlantic. A shame.

 

[CrocMother]

To put this in perspective, NYC alone collects 10 BILLION plastic bags per year. That's a lot of trash bin liners.

 

[Stumpokapow]

I think some of my oldest reusable bags are around 7-8 years old and have been used once a week or so, so I suspect that yes, that's better than going through a plastic bag every week.

 

[bman94]

I just watched a We Bare Bears episode about this topic a few days ago. Basically the main characters were guilt tripped into buying Tote Bags and went way overboard thinking they were helping the environment.

Funny I never knew that people bought them caus they believed they were helping the environment, I always thought people bought them so they wouldn't have to add to their massive collection of plastic bags at home and this was the simpler solution.

 

[SciencePilot]

The key here with this article is that it's talking about typical use. It says many people end up collecting lots of tote bags and then never using them.

I suspect that if you use tote bags the way they're intended -- only have as many as you need and re-use them over and over -- it would be fine. But it doesn't look like the article provides the numbers on that. It would be helpful if they told you how many times you would have to use a tote bag for it to be worth it.

 

[blame space]

how do we carry all this shit we buy

 

[God Dayumm]

The impact of plastic bags on global warming is negligible at best, while the impact on waste management and pollution is significant.

That's a good point.

 

[AdventureRacing]

For those looking for plastic bag sized bins I find old popcorn tins are a perfect size. I just have a couple of those I use for trash bins.