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[Half and half]

Whats your opinion on it?

Well, since the daughter's getting married and not the father, the father has no say in the matter.

 

[George Claw M.D.]

Like many things, in life, it depends. Not all parents expect it, and would be surprised at being asked for their blessing/permission. Others would take great offense, at not being approached, before the proposal. I had been with my gf, for so long, before we finally got married, that I was already considered part of the family, with her parents both calling me their son-in-law. So, I already knew I had their blessing to wed their daughter. Asking them would've just been a formality. Personally, I know they would have appreciated it, and I would have loved to ask for their blessing, as inconsequential as it may have been. However, I had no confidence in her mom, to keep it a secret, before I popped the question. I didn't want the moment to be spoiled, for my gf. It was our moment, after all, not her parents'. After seeing her eyes light-up, and burst into joyful tears, I was convinced I made the right decision. It just wouldn't have been the same, had the info leaked from her mom, or someone else, and she had to feign surprise.

Now, in my personal situation, I knew I could get away with that, without repercussion. However, if her parents were really old-fashioned and felt strongly enough, over the matter, I'd have gone ahead and asked for their blessing. I just think it would be the wise thing to do. It's not serious-enough, to start the marriage on a bad note, with the family. My gf might not get to experience that surprised moment, but it would be a better than the stress she'd feel from all the flack her family would have given her. Even if I didn't believe in such an archaic tradition, resisting it, for the sake of modern progress, isn't worth the grief to my wife. It's not like I'm being asked to sacrifice a goat, or something.

If the parents hate you enough to actually deny their blessing/permission, then the question doesn't matter, anyway. You know they hate your guts, and you're gonna propose to their daughter, whether they like it, or not. So, whatever.

Those are my thoughts, on the matter.

 

[Mr. E. Yis]

Can you answer the other question? Did your wife ask your parents for permission?

Did your wife propose to YOU instead of the other way around?

Did she keep her last name after marriage?

Did she walk down the aisle alone?

Unless you answered yes to ALL 3 of these questions, you are being hypocritical. You can't pick and choose which 'archaic' male-dominated wedding traditions you follow while allowing the rest.

If you don't want to ask a blessing or give a heads-up to the father before a proposal, that's fine. But don't think your 'modern' view is the norm in regular marriage traditions. Hell, every single element in a wedding is a tradition, unless you're eloping in Vegas.

 

[Orayn]

I did ask. But it was only a formality, whatever he said never mattered anyway. Best to treat it as such. We are not living in that society anymore. Women now want and have to take care of themselves. No place for the parents to offer anything else than advice.

Then why bother? To me, that just sounds disingenuous. I don't have any problem with telling both of her parents and getting some idea of whether or not they approve, but asking her father alone? Count me out of that particular tradition, I live in the 21st century.

Did your wife propose to YOU instead of the other way around?

Did she keep her last name after marriage?

Did she walk down the aisle alone?

Unless you answered yes to ALL 3 of these questions, you are being hypocritical. You can't pick and choose which 'archaic' male-dominated wedding traditions you follow while allowing the rest.

If you don't want to ask a blessing or give a heads-up to the father before a proposal, that's fine. But don't think your 'modern' view is the norm in regular marriage traditions. Hell, every single element in a wedding is a tradition, unless you're eloping in Vegas.

:lol

To address some specifics from my own perspetvie: An egalitarian view on the proposal would be that EITHER party could propose. I, personally, have no problem with that. I would also not require or even ask my wife to take my last name. Weeding specifics... Eh. Dunno.

 

[CornBurrito]

Did your wife propose to YOU instead of the other way around?

Did she keep her last name after marriage?

Did she walk down the aisle alone?

Unless you answered yes to ALL 3 of these questions, you are being hypocritical. You can't pick and choose which 'archaic' male-dominated wedding traditions you follow while allowing the rest.

If you don't want to ask a blessing or give a heads-up to the father before a proposal, that's fine. But don't think your 'modern' view is the norm in regular marriage traditions. Hell, every single element in a wedding is a tradition, unless you're eloping in Vegas.

I am 18 years old and a gay male. So I can safely answer no to all three of those questions without being a hypocrite.

BUT

If I were straight and going to get married:

1. I guess who proposes to who depends on who works up the courage first. I've never seen the problem with a woman proposing to a man.

2. If she wanted to then sure. I wouldn't push her to take my last name either. I could not care less.

3. Walking down the aisle alone? Who does the wife normally walk with?

 

[VonRehausen]

Then why bother? To me, that just sounds disingenuous. I don't have any problem with telling both of her parents and getting some idea of whether or not they approve, but asking her father alone? Count me out of that particular tradition, I live in the 21st century.

Yeah well it was her standing next to me in a light hearted occasion and I asked mostly so we could drink proper engagement beers together. He couldnt have really refused anyway. A light hearted silly old tradition, she is distant to her father anyway.

tell you the truth i was a bit lost with the post soviet traditions anyway. For a citizens of the 1st world its sometimes hard to make up the ways of the atheistic 2nd world. I mean they have these Marriage Palaces you know

 

[Mr. E. Yis]

I am 18 years old and a gay male. So I can safely answer no to all three of those questions without being a hypocrite.

Lol, i didn't know. So you're arguing as devil's advocate. Well, then my post was directed at everyone else who thinks it's archaic.

 

[VonRehausen]

I am 18 years old and a gay male. So I can safely answer no to all three of those questions without being a hypocrite.

BUT

If I were straight and going to get married:

1. I guess who proposes to who depends on who works up the courage first. I've never seen the problem with a woman proposing to a man.

2. If she wanted to then sure. I wouldn't push her to take my last name either. I could not care less.

3. Walking down the aisle alone? Who does the wife normally walk with?

What keeps you from having a normal wedding with 2 brooms?

 

[Anton Sugar]

Did your wife propose to YOU instead of the other way around?

Did she keep her last name after marriage?

Did she walk down the aisle alone?

Unless you answered yes to ALL 3 of these questions, you are being hypocritical. You can't pick and choose which 'archaic' male-dominated wedding traditions you follow while allowing the rest.

If you don't want to ask a blessing or give a heads-up to the father before a proposal, that's fine. But don't think your 'modern' view is the norm in regular marriage traditions. Hell, every single element in a wedding is a tradition, unless you're eloping in Vegas.

I would be fine if my girlfriend proposed to me--we've discussed it before, as we both know one or the other is going to surprise the other.

She is keeping her last name as well.

Walking down the aisle is her choice. Both families will be paying for the wedding and I'm not spending a shit-ton on an engagement ring either.

Her dress is going to be *gasp* off-white, too!

 

[Lionheart1337]

What keeps you from having a normal wedding with 2 brooms?

...

 

[VonRehausen]

Did your wife propose to YOU instead of the other way around?

Did she keep her last name after marriage?

Did she walk down the aisle alone?

Unless you answered yes to ALL 3 of these questions, you are being hypocritical. You can't pick and choose which 'archaic' male-dominated wedding traditions you follow while allowing the rest.

If you don't want to ask a blessing or give a heads-up to the father before a proposal, that's fine. But don't think your 'modern' view is the norm in regular marriage traditions. Hell, every single element in a wedding is a tradition, unless you're eloping in Vegas.

I proposed but we had been talking about it for a while ayway.

We are thinking of getting a new family name altogether. A portmonteau or something new. It doesnt matter how we walk the aisle she isnt even christian so getting her to a church is challenge enough.

 

[VonRehausen]

...

2 husbands? What?

 

[Valnen]

The only person's permission I need to marry the girl I love is the girl I love. Fuck everyone else.

 

[VonRehausen]

The only person's permission I need to marry the girl I love is the girl I love. Fuck everyone else.

Yeah but when you grow up and want to have civilized and cordial relationships with your parents in law you dont want to throw that attitude to their face. I mean imagine if it was your daughter getting married to some dude.

 

[CornBurrito]

What keeps you from having a normal wedding with 2 brooms?

I just went "WTF?" there for a second and then realized you probably meant to type grooms.

I don't know how a traditional wedding would work between two husbands.

We are thinking of getting a new family name altogether. A portmonteau or something new.

That's actually a very sweet idea.

 

[VonRehausen]

I just went "WTF?" there for a second and then realized you probably meant to type grooms.

I don't know how a traditional wedding would work between two husbands.

That's actually a very sweet idea.

hah! Sorry yes of course I mean 2 grooms.

I suppose you guys would have some choises to make. Marry in civil some other state for example. Or marry in a Lutheran congregation willing to marry gay couples. Fly to Europe and have wonderful honeymoon as well in the gay friendly capitals we boast these days. You might even be able to find a catholic priest to marry you.

 

[Hobbestetrician]

Did your wife propose to YOU instead of the other way around?

Did she keep her last name after marriage?

Did she walk down the aisle alone?

Unless you answered yes to ALL 3 of these questions, you are being hypocritical. You can't pick and choose which 'archaic' male-dominated wedding traditions you follow while allowing the rest.

If you don't want to ask a blessing or give a heads-up to the father before a proposal, that's fine. But don't think your 'modern' view is the norm in regular marriage traditions. Hell, every single element in a wedding is a tradition, unless you're eloping in Vegas.

There was no 'proposal' but she broached the idea of getting married to avoid many issues that had gotten in the way of us seeing each other. So we avoided that archaic man-gets-down-on-a-knee picture.

Yes she did. Something both her and I wanted to do well before we met each other. This is a whole other thread but women changing their name is also ridiculously archaic and sexist. It irritates us to no end when someone sends us a letter addressed to Mr. and Mrs. My Name.

We walked down the 'aisle' (in her parent's living room) together.

So I feel that I can comment on archaic wedding traditions without being hypocritical. I don't even wear a wedding ring. I didn't invite my grandparents. Eloping in Vegas is a tradition, as well. The only real reason people stick to all these wedding traditions is not because they like them but because it is what everyone does and it is just easier that way.

 

[VonRehausen]

That's actually a very sweet idea.

Yes since its Hella and Ihermann an obvious one would be Hellman

 

[Fox318]

What keeps you from having a normal wedding with 2 brooms?

You only need 1.

 

[Valnen]

Yeah but when you grow up and want to have civilized and cordial relationships with your parents in law you dont want to throw that attitude to their face. I mean imagine if it was your daughter getting married to some dude.

In that case she'd be an adult and wouldn't need my permission to get married because I'm not a controlling asshole.

 

[VonRehausen]

have kids yet?

 

[Devolution]

There was no 'proposal' but she broached the idea of getting married to avoid many issues that had gotten in the way of us seeing each other. So we avoided that archaic man-gets-down-on-a-knee picture.

Yes she did. Something both her and I wanted to do well before we met each other. This is a whole other thread but women changing their name is also ridiculously archaic and sexist. It irritates us to no end when someone sends us a letter addressed to Mr. and Mrs. My Name.

We walked down the 'aisle' (in her parent's living room) together.

So I feel that I can comment on archaic wedding traditions without being hypocritical. I don't even wear a wedding ring. I didn't invite my grandparents. Eloping in Vegas is a tradition, as well. The only real reason people stick to all these wedding traditions is not because they like them but because it is what everyone does and it is just easier that way.

The father walking the bride down the aisle is archaic as well when you think about it.

 

[VALIS]

If your girlfriend gets along with and likes her father, then why not. It's pretty irrelevant what he says, it's just a courtesy and a tradition. My fiance doesn't really care for her father, though, so I didn't ask him first.

 

[CornBurrito]

I suppose you guys would have some choises to make. Marry in civil some other state for example. Or marry in a Lutheran congregation willing to marry gay couples. Fly to Europe and have wonderful honeymoon as well in the gay friendly capitals we boast these days. You might even be able to find a catholic priest to marry you.

I most likely would not get married in a church, or other religious building. Where do secular people get married?

 

[mbmonk]

Respect is by definition "an act of giving particular attention". By honoring their wishes you are showing respect. You are giving particular attention to them. That is why asking them is a sign of respect.

 

[VonRehausen]

In the city magistrate? Or the Marriage Palace if you are Russian.

 

[Hobbestetrician]

The father walking the bride down the aisle is archaic as well when you think about it.

It most certainly is, which is why the thought of doing that never crossed our mind. Nor was he offended or upset at how any of it went down. Her parents, before she met me, always kind of wanted her to meet someone more traditional (not in some of the ways discussed in this thread, just more likely to not do something off-the-wall) but then she got married to someone much less traditional than her with me. I doubt her parents are upset about it.

Placating older generations in order to not offend them prevents progress in a lot of areas.

 

[Anton Sugar]

Respect is by definition "an act of giving particular attention". By honoring their wishes you are showing respect. You are giving particular attention to them. That is why asking them is a sign of respect.

Wrong.

Act of giving particular attention = going out of your way to tell them.

Asking for permission is, by definition, asking for "Consent; authorization"

 

[ShadyMilkman]

Is the tradition of the father walking the bride down the aisle sexist as well?

 

[Devolution]

Is the tradition of the father walking the bride down the aisle sexist as well?

Yes. It's still about passing of ownership from man to man.

 

[mbmonk]

Wrong.

Act of giving particular attention = going out of your way to tell them.

Asking for permission is, by definition, asking for "Consent; authorization"

Right!

EDIT: I was more addressing the recurring question about why asking/notifing was indeed a sign of respect. Some in the thread said they didn't see how it was a sign of respect. I was just clarifying that.

 

[VonRehausen]

Wrong.

Act of giving particular attention = going out of your way to tell them.

Asking for permission is, by definition, asking for "Consent; authorization"

It doesnt have to such a philosophically determinant moment. "asking for permission" is wholly different than needing a permission to marry.

 

[Count Dookkake]

I most likely would not get married in a church, or other religious building. Where do secular people get married?

Anywhere you want to: beach, park, museum, Disneyland, etc.

 

[VonRehausen]

Yes. It's still about passing of ownership from man to man.

Amd what if it was the Mother? Wouldnt that be sexist as well? Well someone has to walk her thru the aisle, what about an ibot, or the mexican maid who actually raised her.

Whoever is agreed to walk her down the aisle will do that as his/her honour.

 

[mbmonk]

Anywhere you want to: beach, park, museum, Disneyland, etc.

Amd what if it was the Mother? Wouldnt that be sexist as well? Well someone has to walk her thru the aisle, what about an ibot, or the mexican maid who actually raised her.

Whoever is agreed to walk her down the aisle will do that as his/her honour.

This sounds like a dream wedding. I might have to renew our vowels next year..

 

[Devolution]

Amd what if it was the Mother? Wouldnt that be sexist as well? Well someone has to walk her thru the aisle, what about an ibot, or the mexican maid who actually raised her.

Whoever is agreed to walk her down the aisle will do that as his/her honour.

Don't know what you're getting so butthurt about when I'm just talking about where the tradition stems from. If the bride is fine with it, then she's fine with it.

 

[ShadyMilkman]

Yes. It's still about passing of ownership from man to man.

Wouldn't anyone walking her down the aisle be sexist by that definition?

Edit: Just saw your post, I gotcha now, I think I misunderstood.

 

[Devolution]

Wouldn't anyone walking her down the aisle be sexist by that definition?

No? Historically women were owned by their closest male relative. When it comes to marriages if a father couldn't walk them, a brother or uncle would. The ownership of said woman would pass to the husband. It's essentially "I'm passing this property onto you."

 

[MontTrain]

No? Historically women were owned by their closest male relative. When it comes to marriages if a father couldn't walk them, a brother or uncle would. The ownership of said woman would pass to the husband. It's essentially "I'm passing this property onto you."

Or maybe a nicer way to think about it in modern times would be passing the responsibility of loving and caring for her from the person who provided everything to her up until this point including likely paying for the whole ceremony / reception to her new family till death do they part.

 

[Devolution]

Or maybe a nicer way to think about it in modern times would be passing the responsibility of loving and caring for her from the person who provided everything to her up until this point including likely paying for the whole ceremony / reception to her new family till death do they part.

Sure but it could just as easily be her mom in that case too. Or both parents.

 

[Anton Sugar]

Sure but it could just as easily be her mom in that case too. Or both parents.

Not a single person in this thread has had an answer for this point yet.

 

[bengraven]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnVAE91E7kM




I like the concept, but the bullshit between the father and fiance makes me sick.

 

[MontTrain]

Sure but it could just as easily be her mom in that case too. Or both parents.

I've been to weddings where the bride has one parent on each arm or just her mum as well. It depends on the family dynamic - not everyone has a nuclear family. It's just typically the father as he is generally considered the default leader of a family.

 

[Schmitty]

Youre asking for a BLESSING not permission. BLESSING is what youre asking for. I think youre all taking this too literally.

This all the way. Typical GAF overreaction. Just say something like " I plan to ask your daughter to marry me and I wanted to ask for your blessing ". Most fathers would like it I presume. It may have come from old traditions of ownership of women but it doesn't have those connotations anymore.

 

[Valnen]

have kids yet?

I hope that when I do I have enough respect for them to allow them to live their lives without my permission when they're adults.

 

[Das Boot]

I most likely would not get married in a church, or other religious building. Where do secular people get married?

I got married at a winery, which seems to be a popular option here in California.

I've had friends do destination weddings and get married on beaches all over the world. Another got married on a yacht in Newport Harbor. In fact, when I think about it, I've only been to one wedding where they got married in a church.

In my experience, most people don't get married in a church.

 

[Sobriquet]

I got married in a movie theater

 

[Byakuya769]

Whats your opinion on it? I certainly don't believe in it. My gf's sister was getting bitched at by her parents about this because her husband didn't and I popped in how I don't plan on it and her dad said would kick my ass and her mom said that i had to because that's how it's done and I said I don't believe in it and then she like then I wont be marrying and I lol'd and said she couldn't control her daughter.

OP, you're off to an incredible start at bringing two families together.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

I lol'd and said she couldn't control her daughter.

Nice! I think anyone who asks my father about marrying my sister will get torn a new one for asking him. He didn't ask his future father-in-law's opinion on the matter: "There was only one person whose opinion I cared about, and it sure as shit wasn't his."

I intend to carry on with this tradition of only caring about what my prospective wife thinks, but my partner and I have no plans to get married, so it's moot right now.

How is it "respectful" to ask someone for permission in something that's not his choice in any way? If anything, it's disrespectful of your fiance's autonomy.

Exactly.

God... marriage is such a chore...

We skipped it entirely and bought a house instead. 15-25 years of debt together is a nice commitment, I think.

 

[Yaboosh]

I didn't ask my father in law before asking my wife to marry me. I find it somehow demeaning to my wife, and my wife didn't disagree.

But I also don't know that it was really a big deal to him. If he had given me the impression that it was expected of me, I probably would have made an attempt to do it.

Marriage is hard enough without having her family against you. You need all the allies you can get in a marriage.