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Bad attempts at Attractive Character Design

Wait, did he just call Tekken girls generic?

Weird...

Though I hate the designs for the "new characters" poll for Tekken Revolution.

tekken-revolutione280hypzr.jpg

Eeeeyup.
 
About "hating breasts". It's funny you should say that. Because while I am attracted to women, I don't find breasts sexually attractive at all. In fact, I don't find wide hips sexually attractive, either. Which is great for me because I can complain about sexualization and large breasts and people will think that I'm just being an anti-objectification fanatic who doesn't like fanservice. No one suspects a thing, usually.

And it's true, I do think that women are unfairly represented. Apart from what I like and don't like, the fact that men are typically designed for utility and for reasons other than sex appeal, while women are usually designed for sex appeal is unfortunate. That being said, it's a lot easier to do so when such things personally don't appeal to you either, haha. They can put all the curvy women in video games they want to, and that won't every sexually excite me. If that's what they're going for.

Makes it really easy to look more moral than I am. Until people find out my ulterior feelings, and then I look like the opposite of moral. And then I look super selfish, creepy, lolicon, shallow, objectifying, and body policing. But it's fun while it lasts.


I'm just playin HB, you'll always be welcome in my threads. Or else. That was a good post that provided some insight on female fighters. (although I will always love the chest and back meat.)

I also like seeing cuties too. Vanguard Princess will always be my favorite fighter of this generation. Even up there with Garou and 3S.
 
Is it just me but are some of the female Tekken character models in the recent Tekken games have been hit or miss? Like in Tekken Tag 2, some look good but some don't look so great.

And it's kind of silly to see some of the characters trying to act all cutesy and goofy when they look so serious or an attempt at trying to be realistic. It doesn't work for some reason.

But Soul Calibur looks good. I wonder why it's not consistent.

Oh and Dragon Age II female characters weren't so great.
 
NCjfazP.jpg


I cant stand the way the main character looks in second son and it's the main reason I will never buy the game.
It's a ridiculous and STUPID reason, but I kinda have the same problem with that guy. He looks like a whimsical loser trying to hide behind some badass anarchy mask... that's probably exactly what Sucker Punch is going for here though and giving us the chance to become either the salt-of-the-earth-HERO-with-grown-balls OR the REALLY-badass-danger-for-mankind-antichrist... BUT will I be able to stand that guy long enough to see it?!?
 
Silliness isn't the charm of all fighting games. And significantly hurts the appeal of fighting games like Dead or Alive in comparison to Tekken.

And what about Arcana Heart, is too much cuteness wrong for a game? I probably feel in a similar fashion as you do when people are complaining about moe. I'd much rather see cuteness than sexualization.

And some fighting games aren't meant to be silly. Some of them have attempted to be semi serious martial arts games. The female characters, realistically, ought to be muscular just like the male characters. Like Makoto from Street Fighter. She looks like a capable fighter and isn't petite in comparison to her big muscular male counterparts.

Also, breasts bouncing is painful for women. Also, women with large breasts would be at a significant disadvantage in almost any sport, especially fighting. That's why you see few Olympic female athletes with large breasts. In fact, in many sports there's a tendency for many women to become completely flat chested or almost completely flat chested, because by continually pushing their bodies, they lose most body fat, including the body fat on the chest. It would be good for fighting games to reflect that, rather than to have the men have ridiculous six-packs, while the women have D cup breasts and slender stomach, arms and thighs.

I don't want the men in fighting games to have giant muscular pecs and arms and legs, and then the female characters have giant bouncing breasts, of non-muscular, fragile fat, a tiny stomach, tiny back, tiny arms, and tiny legs. That isn't the build of a strong female fighter.

I'd like to see more female characters built like Makoto.

About "hating breasts". It's funny you should say that. Because while I am attracted to women, I don't find breasts sexually attractive at all. In fact, I don't find wide hips sexually attractive, either. Which is great for me because I can complain about sexualization and large breasts and people will think that I'm just being an anti-objectification fanatic who doesn't like fanservice. No one suspects a thing, usually.

And it's true, I do think that women are unfairly represented. Apart from what I like and don't like, the fact that men are typically designed for utility and for reasons other than sex appeal, while women are usually designed for sex appeal is unfortunate. That being said, it's a lot easier to do so when such things personally don't appeal to you either, haha. They can put all the curvy women in video games they want to, and that won't every sexually excite me. If that's what they're going for.

Makes it really easy to look more moral than I am. Until people find out my ulterior feelings, and then I look like the opposite of moral. And then I look super selfish, creepy, lolicon, shallow, objectifying, and body policing. But it's fun while it lasts.

Your post just sounds like you have a superiority complex. Sorry, but your sexual preferences aren't more "moral" than others just on account you're more attracted to smaller breasted women, and I'm sure big breasted women just love the stigma of "not being cute" and being sexualized.

I find the attitude of small boobs= real and proper, while above average boobs= objectifying, sexist, etc kind of gross and it far too often manisfests its self in the real world. Why is it that a small chested woman can wear an outfit and be looked at as "cute" and "innocent", while a large breasted woman couldn't dare wear the same outfit without feeling stigmatized as being "dirty" "slutty", etc? Making a distinction between one body type being "proper" and anything that isn't that being "not proper" is a real issue.

Also can we please just throw out the notion of "realism" being an actual thing in fighting games When you have characters with flaming skulls, hearts coming out of chests, lizard people, etc. A female fighter having above average breasts shouldn't be some huge outlier on the "realism" scale. Would I like to see more realistically muscular proportions on female fighters? Sure, but that doesn't mean I find every fighting game character that deviates from that "realistic" preset to be some gross abomination. Or deserves criticism on account of "not being real." The notion that fighting games need to succumb to natural rules and laws seems kind of silly.

And just some anecdotal experience, women seem to enjoy and play fighting games more than any other genre I know, and not once have I ever had a female friend feel awkward or offended as a result of any female fighter, in fact they gravitate more towards those characters than others, or they are telling me how hot Killik and MItsirugi are and persist to stip them down to their underwear. Sexualization goes both ways, and anybody who tries to deny that is just being naive and trying to earn brownie points. So this issue just always comes across as men wanting to be the "moral" and "sexist" police for women and it just comes across as being super phony.

You don't like big boobs, than fine. You want more female fighters to be grounded in reality, than fine. But don't play some moral highground to justify your personal biases, as if they are somehow more right.
 
Your post just sounds like you have a superiority complex. Sorry, but your sexual preferences aren't more "moral" than others just on account you're more attracted to smaller breasted women, and I'm sure big breasted women just love the stigma of "not being cute" and being sexualized.

I find the attitude of small boobs= real and proper, while above average boobs= objectifying, sexist, etc kind of gross and it far too often manisfests its self in the real world. Why is it that a small chested woman can wear an outfit and be looked at as "cute" and "innocent", while a large breasted woman couldn't dare wear the same outfit without feeling stigmatized as being "dirty" "slutty", etc? Making a distinction between one body type being "proper" and anything that isn't that being "not proper" is a real issue.

Also can we please just throw out the notion of "realism" being an actual thing in fighting games When you have characters with flaming skulls, hearts coming out of chests, lizard people, etc. A female fighter having above average breasts shouldn't be some huge outlier on the "realism" scale. Would I like to see more realistically muscular proportions on female fighters? Sure, but that doesn't mean I find every fighting game character that deviates from that "realistic" preset to be some gross abomination. Or deserves criticism on account of "not being real." The notion that fighting games need to succumb to natural rules and laws seems kind of silly.
I agree. I do hate that females with bigger busts are scrutinized.


And just some anecdotal experience, women seem to enjoy and play fighting games more than any other genre I know, and not once have I ever had a female friend feel awkward or offended as a result of any female fighter, in fact they gravitate more towards those characters than others, or they are telling me how hot Killik and MItsirugi are and persist to stip them down to their underwear. Sexualization goes both ways, and anybody who tries to deny that is just being naive and trying to earn brownie points. So this issue just always comes across as men wanting to be the "moral" and "sexist" police for women and it just comes across as being super phony.

You don't like big boobs, than fine. You want more female fighters to be grounded in reality, than fine. But don't play some moral highground to justify your personal biases, as if they are somehow more right.

Woooah. Please respect his opinion though. I wouldn't go that far because I'm sure he has his own reasons and tastes.

Please do before Lime appears.
 
Aye.

Compare Maria Renard's (as a child) art from Harmony of Despair (done by Ayami Kojima, who is responsible for what was arguably the series' most recognizable artwork) and Judgement, (from Obata, responsible for Death Note's art)


Maria_-_Harmony_of_Despair.PNG
Maria_Renard_New.jpg

Yeah, that looks like complete trash.

Kojima's Maria on the other hand is incredible. One of my favorite game related images.
 
Your post just sounds like you have a superiority complex.
Well, I disagree and I think you misunderstand me. But at least you didn't worse things.
I appreciate your civility and intellectual-ness about the whole matter.

Sorry, but your sexual preferences aren't more "moral" than others
Well, you're certainly very correct about that.

I find the attitude of small boobs= real and proper, while above average boobs= objectifying, sexist, etc kind of gross and it far too often manisfests its self in the real world.
I don't think there is real and proper. Women come in all shapes and sizes.

Though it does seem like a lot of video games lean towards only representing certain types of female figures. And usually those are skinny, as in having a small waist, and curvy, as in having large breasts and hips and buttocks than the average woman on average.

The average woman's breast size leans somewhere between B and C, particularly in the Western first world where obesity rates are high. But a lot of video games characters seem to lean rather from C to D rather than B to C. In some parts of the world, A to B are the most common type.

It's absolutely a good idea to depict women in a variety of body types. There is nothing wrong with depicting large breasted women. But it becomes a bit problematic when the majority of women in particular types of fiction like video games are large breasted.

I think that diversity is the best path to take.

Why is it that a small chested woman can wear an outfit and be looked at as "cute" and "innocent", while a large breasted woman couldn't dare wear the same outfit without feeling stigmatized as being "dirty" "slutty", etc?
I don't know that that's the case. If a small breasted or flat chested women wore some very showing or revealing clothing, and a video game gave a lot of camera attention to her chest, I think it would very much be seen as sexual, rather than just "cute".

But it does seem like there is indeed a dual culture-wide breast fetishism and breast taboo. And the two seem to go hand in hand. And women with large breasts are often given horrible slut shaming stereotypes. So this I disagree with.

I think it is related to breast taboos and society seeing breasts as a by default sexual objects. Especially in society where there is sexual repression and sex itself still remains somewhat taboo and only privately between heterosexual married couples. Along with stereotyping people based upon body type and slut shaming.

Making a distinction between one body type being "proper" and anything that isn't that being "not proper" is a real issue.
I don't think that any body type is proper or improper. That would be body policing.
I'm sorry, I don't mean to advocate that at all. I think that body policing and body shaming is wrong.

There is no body type that is wrong or right to have.
 
Also can we please just throw out the notion of "realism" being an actual thing in fighting games When you have characters with flaming skulls, hearts coming out of chests, lizard people, etc. A female fighter having above average breasts shouldn't be some huge outlier on the "realism" scale.
You're right that fighting games don't have to be realistic. And much of the stuff in games doesn't many any more sense that women with jiggling E cups being just as strong as the characters without jiggling E cups.

I do find it to be a double standard that male fighting game characters usually get to look like big bulking muscular men. While female characters are given quite the opposite figure of a body builder. If we're going to throw that kind of logic out the window, great. It would be great to see more fighting games where strong male fighters are less muscular. I honestly don't like the fact that most male characters in fighting games are huge and muscular. Slender men in most fighting games are almost non-existant.

Would I like to see more realistically muscular proportions on female fighters? Sure, but that doesn't mean I find every fighting game character that deviates from that "realistic" preset to be some gross abomination. Or deserves criticism on account of "not being real." The notion that fighting games need to succumb to natural rules and laws seems kind of silly.
Well, I never said anything about such fighting games being a gross abomination.
I'm quite looking forward to buying Vanguard Princess on Steam. And it has more jiggle physics than almost any fighting game.

You don't like big boobs, than fine.
Well, at least you don't think I'm a terrible person for not being into big boobs.
 
Wow, that looks real. That's CG? Honestly though, this is thread is very subjective.

It's the uncanny valley, not every person is repulsed by it. I personally think it looks fantastic, and I welcome the fact that the character model looks like a real person and not a lingerie model.
 
Eliot came before Leo.
This had me loling, I love that people forget that.
Eliot's a boy.
Robotnik was never a looker but

337px-ASR_Eggman.png

went from this....

500px-sonic-the-hedgehog-art-3.png

to this....

egg.png

WTF
Man Eggman sexcii as fuck, leave his gold nipples alone!

Well, I never said anything about such fighting games being a gross abomination.
I'm quite looking forward to buying Vanguard Princess on Steam. And it has more jiggle physics than almost any fighting game.
.

Don't do that to Vanguard Princess!! lmao I know Luna has some big knockers but her and Natalia are no where near SC/DOA proportions of jigglies.
 
I find the attitude of small boobs= real and proper, while above average boobs= objectifying, sexist, etc kind of gross and it far too often manisfests its self in the real world. Why is it that a small chested woman can wear an outfit and be looked at as "cute" and "innocent", while a large breasted woman couldn't dare wear the same outfit without feeling stigmatized as being "dirty" "slutty", etc? Making a distinction between one body type being "proper" and anything that isn't that being "not proper" is a real issue.
That's not the issue, though. The issue is that not only large-breasted women are disproportionately featured in fighting games (and arguably in other types of games as well), but they are not remotely believable large-breasted women. Their breasts are often exaggeratedly large (not even D or E cup, but even bigger, sometimes their breasts are way larger than their heads), they invariably sport massive cleavage or skintight outfits and a lot of attention is drawn on their breasts, and very few large-breasted women are super skinny with a wasp-sized waist yet this is pretty much all you see in terms of large-breasted women in games. If games featured female characters with large breasts and believably proportioned bodies to match, it wouldn't be so annoying.

See also: http://eschergirls.tumblr.com/ -- which is a good fit for the OP, really, though the blog is mostly oriented towards comics. Still, examples from games are featured every now and then.

Sexualization goes both ways,
lol? It really doesn't, not on a consistent basis. In a minority of games at very best. What an absurd claim. Men are not remotely sexualized to the same degree as women are, not in games, not in any media. I get that this doesn't bother you, but enough with the denials of reality already please?

and anybody who tries to deny that is just being naive and trying to earn brownie points. So this issue just always comes across as men wanting to be the "moral" and "sexist" police for women and it just comes across as being super phony.
Yeah... no. But thanks for calling me phony because I find Ivy and Taki to be absurd and gross and how much better they'd look if they had more normal proportions. e_e
 
Yeah, that looks like complete trash.
Maria_-_Harmony_of_Despair.PNG


Kojima's Maria on the other hand is incredible. One of my favorite game related images.

This one is weird, she has boobs and a curvy waist but she looks like an 8 year old. Is she supposed to be 11-14? The artwork is amazing, that complain aside. Also I don't mind the judgement design is over the top but coherent.
 
That's not the issue, though. The issue is that not only large-breasted women are disproportionately featured in fighting games (and arguably in other types of games as well), but they are not remotely believable large-breasted women. Their breasts are often exaggeratedly large (not even D or E cup, but even bigger, sometimes their breasts are way larger than their heads), they invariably sport massive cleavage or skintight outfits and a lot of attention is drawn on their breasts, and very few large-breasted women are super skinny with a wasp-sized waist yet this is pretty much all you see in terms of large-breasted women in games. If games featured female characters with large breasts and believably proportioned bodies to match, it wouldn't be so annoying.

See also: http://eschergirls.tumblr.com/ -- which is a good fit for the OP, really, though the blog is mostly oriented towards comics. Still, examples from games are featured every now and then.


lol? It really doesn't, not on a consistent basis. In a minority of games at very best. What an absurd claim. Men are not remotely sexualized to the same degree as women are, not in games, not in any media. I get that this doesn't bother you, but enough with the denials of reality already please?


Yeah... no. But thanks for calling me phony because I find Ivy and Taki to be absurd and gross and how much better they'd look if they had more normal proportions. e_e

I think it'd be interesting to see a discussion about women's breast size in fighting games.
---------------
and VF Sarah......yeeeeeeeeah. lol
 
The newest Assassin's Creed protagonist looks baaaad:

QkpXsbDcbKScNsKZ5cslpaLh8iz5B9C3_Trailer_AssassinsCreed4_EdwardKenwayStory_20131015_640x360.jpg
AssassinsCreedBF_THUMB.jpg
Edward-Kenway-assassins-creed-iv-black-flag.jpg


With each game they keep going back and forth between a more realistic and a more cartoonish style, landing somewhere near an unhappy medium.
 
The newest Assassin's Creed protagonist looks baaaad:

QkpXsbDcbKScNsKZ5cslpaLh8iz5B9C3_Trailer_AssassinsCreed4_EdwardKenwayStory_20131015_640x360.jpg
AssassinsCreedBF_THUMB.jpg
Edward-Kenway-assassins-creed-iv-black-flag.jpg


With each game they keep going back and forth between a more realistic and a more cartoonish style, landing somewhere near an unhappy medium.

Whoa, weirder than I remember. Yeah, his teeth are too white, his beard is too blonde, and he's completely overdone his eyeliner.
 
Are y'all just pretending to hate big boobs or something? I'd understand scantily clad women being weird in a game like the Last of Us, but in fighting games I don't really see the big deal. Silliness is part of the charm.

Trying to be more sexy than you need to Keeps ruining skull girls for me.
 
lol? It really doesn't, not on a consistent basis. In a minority of games at very best. What an absurd claim. Men are not remotely sexualized to the same degree as women are, not in games, not in any media. I get that this doesn't bother you, but enough with the denials of reality already please?


Yeah... no. But thanks for calling me phony because I find Ivy and Taki to be absurd and gross and how much better they'd look if they had more normal proportions. e_e

Absurd and gross? Because they don't have normal proportions? I can understand someone not liking the character design, but taking it to some high ground moral level and calling it "absurd" and "gross" just seems crazy to me. I don't understand what is so "absurd" and "gross." Do you find real life women who don't fall under your "normal proportions" to be just as equally absurd and gross?

And again with the realism argument, it doesn't hold any ground in a fighting game. The idea that people would keep bringing this up is absurd. You want to play the "realism" side? Then why aren't you complaining about all the fantasy elements to just about every fighting game? What about falling off buildings and just getting back up and continuing to fight? Women with large breasts is about the last thing I would think of when evaluating what's unrealistic in a fighting game. Not to mention women in real life can have large breasts, sometimes even bigger than the ones in videogames. I know it's shocking, and being an athlete also doesn't stop you from having large breasts.
 
The newest Assassin's Creed protagonist looks baaaad:

QkpXsbDcbKScNsKZ5cslpaLh8iz5B9C3_Trailer_AssassinsCreed4_EdwardKenwayStory_20131015_640x360.jpg
AssassinsCreedBF_THUMB.jpg
Edward-Kenway-assassins-creed-iv-black-flag.jpg


With each game they keep going back and forth between a more realistic and a more cartoonish style, landing somewhere near an unhappy medium.

ya I don't know how they fucked up so bad, was it a smaller budget from AC3? I
Connor looked pretty normal

connor-kenway.png
 
Trying to be more sexy than you need to Keeps ruining skull girls for me.

Wasn't that the point? Attractive/sexy girls in a whimsical cartoon aesthetic?

What's wrong with that? Usually all girls fighting games have an attractive cast in one way or another. I'm okay with that.
 
That's not the issue, though. The issue is that not only large-breasted women are disproportionately featured in fighting games (and arguably in other types of games as well), but they are not remotely believable large-breasted women. Their breasts are often exaggeratedly large (not even D or E cup, but even bigger, sometimes their breasts are way larger than their heads), they invariably sport massive cleavage or skintight outfits and a lot of attention is drawn on their breasts, and very few large-breasted women are super skinny with a wasp-sized waist yet this is pretty much all you see in terms of large-breasted women in games. If games featured female characters with large breasts and believably proportioned bodies to match, it wouldn't be so annoying.

See also: http://eschergirls.tumblr.com/ -- which is a good fit for the OP, really, though the blog is mostly oriented towards comics. Still, examples from games are featured every now and then.


lol? It really doesn't, not on a consistent basis. In a minority of games at very best. What an absurd claim. Men are not remotely sexualized to the same degree as women are, not in games, not in any media. I get that this doesn't bother you, but enough with the denials of reality already please?


Yeah... no. But thanks for calling me phony because I find Ivy and Taki to be absurd and gross and how much better they'd look if they had more normal proportions. e_e
Thank you. That's exactly what I was trying to say. I agree completely.

There's no wrong body type in my opinion. But it is indeed problematic that there isn't a variety of body types for women in this. Most women don't have that large of breasts, and yet that chest size is featured ever so prominently in such games. Heck, I'd find it more sensible for such women to have large breasts if they had a larger stomach to go with it. But instead, the women often tend to be unrealistically skinny.

And not only are the size of their breasts unusually large more often than should be expected. But clothing and camera angles do a lot to focus on their breasts. The outfits often seem tailored to show as much cleavage as possible. And are often given strange, unrealistic poses and jiggle physics, and cameras angles specifically made to draw attention to their breasts. How often do you see a close-up on a man's thigh in a video game?

As for a comparison of sexualized men, this this is closer to an example than how most men are portrayed in video games. They're muscular, just like the guys in a lot of video games. But the "gaze" is much different. When people talk of the "male gaze", by which they mean the (heterosexual) male gaze. This video is much more similar to how female characters are often portrayed.
 
This one is weird, she has boobs and a curvy waist but she looks like an 8 year old. Is she supposed to be 11-14? The artwork is amazing, that complain aside. Also I don't mind the judgement design is over the top but coherent.

Maria's 12 as she appears there. Yeah she's a bit overdeveloped but I still love that image.

As for the hyperbole, I normally like Obata's art but I hated every single design in CV:J. They were just baaaaaddddd.
 
Surprisingly outside of the comics not many people get Wonder Woman's design right. I thought her DCAU Justice League look was perfect, but even her DC animated movie had her looking...well not as good.

Maybe I'm just spoiled by her Justice League design.

Bruce Timm's artwork makes everything else look like crap.

No shit, I finished this in Co-op a while back and during the end cutscene while in total silence a buddy who had not really been paying attention said "holy shit her faces looks like a shoe" The rest of the party spent a good 10 mins laughting

I'm dyin' right now.
 
Trying to be more sexy than you need to Keeps ruining skull girls for me.
Skullgirls at least has variety. Ms. Fortune and Cerebella are both sexualized, but have completely different body types and fighting styles. That's not even going into the weird ones like Painwheel or Double. Because the entire cast is made of female characters, none of them are forced into the cliche female fighter styles (lots of kicks and no punches, low health, fast, no crazy shit because only males can be the weird ones).

I honestly don't mind sexualized females if there is a nice variety of female characters both sexy and not sexy to choose from. "Female" should not be a character's unique trait. If I want to play as a curvaceous woman in fetish garb, let me. If I want to play as a badass with armor covering her entire body, let me. Just stop making every single female character the same big-boobs, wasp-waist scantily-clad fuck fantasy, because it's boring.
 
Would people stop posting pictures of Jet Force Gemini please, their dead souless eyes are going to give me nightmares.
 
Jet Force Gemini
Eh, I can see what they were trying to go for. It's clear that they were aiming to successfully created characters in the anime aesthetic. And I appreciate that there are companies willing to do that.

Though I do think they rather failed at their task. It doesn't look like something a Japanese creator would create at all. Though I suppose I'd rather see some companies try and fail than not try at all. I notice that a lot of Western companies that try doing something in the anime aesthetic don't quite get it or use Western animation and comic design to fill in the gaps of what they know about anime design. And it ends up not looking very good. And definitely doesn't pass for what's considered "anime".

WayForward generally succeeds quite stunningly at bringing "anime" design into their games. And I'm appreciative at Western companies who do. Though they also tend to give most of their characters exaggerated breasts, which I don't like.
 
Though they also tend to give most of their characters exaggerated breasts, which I don't like.

I think you already mentioned that. Western developers are probably not going to put sexualized little girls in their games just for you. It's already appalling that Japan shamelessly caters to pedophiles.
 
I think you already mentioned that. Western developers are probably not going to put sexualized little girls in their games just for you. It's already appalling that Japan shamelessly caters to pedophiles.
I was waiting for someone to assert not making a character with large breasts and making a "sexualized little girl" were the same thing.

Thanks.
That's totally not what I said at all.

How about we have more adult characters who don't have large breasts?
And who said the character needed to be sexualized to begin with?
 
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