I don't know if it even matters who's good and who's bad. I'd say what matters is who the coolest guy is, and we all know that's Heihachi.
Jinpachi - Heihachi - Kazuya - Jin
Great grandfather - Grandfather - Father - Son
Protagonists becoming antagonists.
Tekken 1: Kazuya is protag and Heichachi is antag
Tekken 2: Heihachi is protag and Kazuya is antag
Tekken 3: Jin is protag and Heihachi is antag
Tekken 4: Jin/Kazuya is protag, Heihachi is antag
Tekken 5: Jin is protag, Jinpachi is antag, Heihachi and Kazuya are side characters
Tekken 6: Kazuya and Heihachi are somewhat side characters, Jin is antag
Tekken 7 might be Kazuya is protag and Heihachi is antag all over again, but we'll see.
I say protag and antag instead of good and bad because it's hard to say that these guys are really good guys or fully bad guys. Jin was closest to purely being good from 3-5, but even that changed.
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Best use of returning protagonist in a role other than protagonist
- Thread starter SolVanderlyn
- Start date
I like Phoenix in AA4, but a lot of fans won't agree. See:
I think Phoenix's characterization was perfect considering the circumstances. That AA5 regressed him back to less intelligent and generally more clueless was worse for me.
reminiscingLemon
Neo Member
It flat out tells you in Hyrule Historia
..The spirit of links ancestor, the Hero of Time, teaches him his secrets..
But the other evidence being that hero of time is last seen entering the lost woods at the end of Majoras Mask and every song he teaches you to howl is from OoT or MM iirc
as well as a bunch of his dialogue, basically he regrets not being able to pass down his legacy so he gives it to the next link in line, and TP is after MM on the timeline even refers to him as son too
Ogre Battle -> Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together
Lans Hamilton returns as Lanselot the Holy Knight of Xenobia. He is part of the story but also trying not to get involved in the main conflicts of the land as he has his own mission here.
This was also pretty depressing. Luckily we have the coda segments.
Come to think of it, didn't the protagonist of Orge Battle also return in Orge Battle 64?
Seven Force
Banned
Also, Mobius 1 (The main Ace Combat 4 pilot) showing up as an optional boss fight in subsequent games is pretty cool, though that's purely from a gameplay perspective.
giga-ganon
Banned
Red in pokemon Gold silver
Spoiler from a really recent vita game : "
"
X in the Megaman Zero serie
Snake in Mgs2
I'm sure i can find other exemples, but nothing comes to mind right now
Spoiler from a really recent vita game : "
makoto, byakuya and kirigiri in danganronpa 2
X in the Megaman Zero serie
Snake in Mgs2
I'm sure i can find other exemples, but nothing comes to mind right now
UnluckyKate
Member
what ? When where how ?
Was gonna say that. One of the few things Drakengard 2's story did well.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Dante showing up as your enemy in Shin Megami Tensei Nocturne was so cool. You're a demon, so here comes gaming's most famous demon hunter gunning for your ass.
Nope, chessmaster Phoenix Wright was an excellent evolution of his character. Perhaps unnecessary if he wasn't supposedly forced to be in AA4, but a great progression of his character. AA5 happened, so it's not like he was permanently screwed with, and his AA5 self is pretty much how he would end up with or without AA4's events.
theSlacker
Member
Pretty much the only good parts of Drakengard 2 had Caim in them.
Orbis Tabula
Member
Ah, neat. That's pretty cool, thanks!
RurouniZel
Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
I won't spoil the game, but if you've played it, you know what I'm talking about.
Korialstrasz
Member
I'd say phoenix wright in AA4. Wanting to know his story was the only motive to keep playing that game.
I won't spoil the game, but if you've played it, you know what I'm talking about.
Dammit. @_@
I won't spoil the game, but if you've played it, you know what I'm talking about.
Yeah, I was going to post this, even though I think this is a spoiler for those just starting the second game of the franchise.
BudokaiMR2
Member
There is one one correct response.
Nose Master
Member
Raiden getting some redemption in MGS4 was pretty neat.
You stole the good one in the OP, jerk.
Seven Force
Banned
Just thought of one more: Richter Belmont in Symphony of the Night.
Bringing back the protagonist of a previous game as a decoy antagonist isn't anything new these days, but Richter's definitely one of the earliest examples I can think of. And although he was being mind controlled when he brought it up, I did find it interesting that he played up the whole angle of not wanting to fall into obscurity after fulfilling his role as a Belmont of defeating Dracula that century, opting for a cycle of killing him, reviving him, and killing him on his own again.
Castlevania in general does it a lot, thanks to the nature of the series. Trevor having a role in Curse of Darkness, Wind in Portrait of Ruin being revealed to be
, etc.
I know for certain you could take him on in AC0 under certain conditions. I think he might have shown up in a few others, too. I forget which game it is that puts you up against all of the pilots in the series up to that point, but I think he was in that one, too.
Bringing back the protagonist of a previous game as a decoy antagonist isn't anything new these days, but Richter's definitely one of the earliest examples I can think of. And although he was being mind controlled when he brought it up, I did find it interesting that he played up the whole angle of not wanting to fall into obscurity after fulfilling his role as a Belmont of defeating Dracula that century, opting for a cycle of killing him, reviving him, and killing him on his own again.
Castlevania in general does it a lot, thanks to the nature of the series. Trevor having a role in Curse of Darkness, Wind in Portrait of Ruin being revealed to be
Eric Lecarde's spirit
I know for certain you could take him on in AC0 under certain conditions. I think he might have shown up in a few others, too. I forget which game it is that puts you up against all of the pilots in the series up to that point, but I think he was in that one, too.
KyanMehwulfe
Member
i wanted to say something from Suikoden, but now that i've actually double checked, almost every character I thought of was either a protagonist each time or a supporting character each time... the focus or importance may change but they never really switch gameplay roles.
so... instead, maybe Ogre Battle Saga
in Ogre Battles, Lanselot Hamilton is basically just another protagonist and playable knight. nothing particularly notable and almost forgettable in terms of story, but a great early knight so he becomes a fan favorite through gameplay.
but Lans in Tactics Ogre, he becomes a main supporting character and probably one of the best anchors for emotion in the game.
so... instead, maybe Ogre Battle Saga
in Ogre Battles, Lanselot Hamilton is basically just another protagonist and playable knight. nothing particularly notable and almost forgettable in terms of story, but a great early knight so he becomes a fan favorite through gameplay.
but Lans in Tactics Ogre, he becomes a main supporting character and probably one of the best anchors for emotion in the game.
yeah it was an amazing scene. definitely one of the best imo.
we think alike hahaOgre Battle -> Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together
Lans Hamilton returns as Lanselot the Holy Knight of Xenobia. He is part of the story but also trying not to get involved in the main conflicts of the land as he has his own mission here.
This was also pretty depressing. Luckily we have the coda segments.
Suikoden 1 -> Suikoden 2
Tir returns as a helper in Suikoden 2. It is great to see him again and it was fantastic to see him not demoted to a side character. Instead he is just there relaxing and you can go ask for his help. He never "joins" your forces officially and is not part of your stars of destiny as he is his own hero. In combat he is as good if not better than Riou and he has a unite attack with Riou also.
Kageshinzo
Member
Dante showing up as your enemy in Shin Megami Tensei Nocturne was so cool. You're a demon, so here comes gaming's most famous demon hunter gunning for your ass.
This isn't what the OP was talking about though. He is talking about protagonists in the same game series, not in two separate game titles/series, unless Dante was a protag in a previous SMT game.
TeddyShardik
Banned
Kain in Soul Reaver 1 and 2.
Ryouji Gunblade
Member
Maybe not the best, but I always loved seeing Isaac again in The Lost Age.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
He didn't specify that. And I don't see why that matters at all.
Besides, protagonists returning as villains in other series is actually far more interesting. And there are few of them.
Mario as villain in Donkey Kong Jr. Deal with it.
I won't spoil the game, but if you've played it, you know what I'm talking about.
Makes me wish for Zero Escape 3...
Such a cool battle.
Y'know, I never really stopped to think about this because I was so young at the time. I never thought of it much more than a final boss battle back then, but now, it's incredible to think about. It really is such a mindfuck moment. Like, the kind of moment that, if I encountered it for the first time today, would give me legit chills and make me set my fucking handheld down, taking several minutes to process what is happening.
It's the kind of mindblowing experience you'd never really expect from a happy-go-lucky game like Pokemon.
I won't spoil the game, but if you've played it, you know what I'm talking about.
YES. This. Holy fuck at that ending route.
AntiFacebook
Member
LoZ: Twilight Princess
heh
In retrospect, is it possible that Hero's Shade is actually a manifestation of a sword, like Fi and
Ghirahim
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Kudos to those who mentioned Lanselot Hamilton. However, I think Alphonse Tartaros had a more impactful "returning role", even if Knight of Lodis was released as a prequel.
The other Lanselot, Lanselot Tartaros, who received the title at the end of Knight of Lodis. His growth from boyhood -> manhood is one of the better character transformations I've seen, and it was made to be entirely believable. He's the protagonist in KoL and a primary antagonist in Let us Cling Together.
The other Lanselot, Lanselot Tartaros, who received the title at the end of Knight of Lodis. His growth from boyhood -> manhood is one of the better character transformations I've seen, and it was made to be entirely believable. He's the protagonist in KoL and a primary antagonist in Let us Cling Together.
Why did I have to browse this thread ;_;
Can't be considering Fi's role.
2 does also has a short sequence where you play as Altair.
Romars202129
Member
I'm gonna say Mario in Luigi's Mansion. Or Red in Pokemon Silver was pretty good too.
Squall in Kingdom Hearts was kinda cool.
Squall in Kingdom Hearts was kinda cool.
Pathfinder
Member
Red in Pokemon GSC and it's not even close. A final battle with the supposedly best trainer in the world and your previous character. It doesn't get any better than that. People were talking about that in school for weeks once someone reached that point in the game and spread the news around.
Gotta agree with the Red/Ash fight atop Mt. Silver. Blew my mind when you first go and just see how strong his Pokemon actually were as well. This was the pre-leak era too where everything is known before launch.
Other instances are few and far in between or as memorable as that.
Other instances are few and far in between or as memorable as that.
Kageshinzo
Member
He didn't specify that. And I don't see why that matters at all.
Besides, protagonists returning as villains in other series is actually far more interesting. And there are few of them.
Mario as villain in Donkey Kong Jr. Deal with it.
Because in your example, that would be a simple crossover cameo, not what the OP (and every one else in the thread before yours) meant. So yeah, deal with it.
Metal Gear Solid 2 would have worked better if Solidus and Solid had shared voice actor like they did in Japan. The intention was to confuse them at first!
I echo these. My favourite return of a character in a game.
As a kid, finding Red in Mt. Silver in Pokemon Gold and Silver was a pretty fucking incredible moment
Such a cool battle.
I echo these. My favourite return of a character in a game.
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