I don't disagree, but it creates a gulf between gameplay/interactivity and story. The gameplay alone would not be enough to hold up the game, and there are better mediums to tell a good story. I think if story is going to be the strongest part of a game, then the game needs some way to tie the player's actions into that story.
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Bioshock Infinite, overrated and repeative [spoilers]
- Thread starter Nilaul
- Start date
I don't disagree, but it creates a gulf between gameplay/interactivity and story. The gameplay alone would not be enough to hold up the game, and there are better mediums to tell a good story. I think if story is going to be the strongest part of a game, then the game needs some way to tie the player's actions into that story.
XANDER CAGE
Member
Infinite's gunplay is a million times better than the original game's. It might not do much new, but I certainly found it to be a well-made and entertaining shooter. The powers are all really entertaining, and for whatever reason the whole gun/magic combo is relatively rare in shooters at the moment.
I enjoyed my time with it. It didn't wow me in quite the same way Bioshock did, but I'm also one of those weirdos that really enjoyed Bioshock 2 (and certainly Minerva's Den) so I may just be really enthralled by the world of Rapture. Columbia was a pretty close second, which automatically makes the game great in my eyes. I don't think it's going to change the way games are made, but I do look forward to what Levine has in store for us. Unless that something is retirement or a foray into mobile gaming.
I very strongly disagree.
Whether a game does this should wholly depend on its goals not some mandate that player action must factor into the story.
I think it is okay to experience games similarly to how we do movies, books, etc. We just have to remember that this is not the ONLY way to do so.
First playthrough was 1999 mode and I beat him without using the skylines. Took a few tries... mostly because I didn't notice I could use them. I wasn't paying attention.
It's not that it's a shooter that bothers me... it's just a really generic one (outside of the few multi-approach battles). Yeah, vigors are pretty cool but even in 1999 mode they don't feel essential at all to finishing the game. Just shoots guys from behind cover, let your shields recharge, rinse and repeat. Yeah, on occasion I did setup some kind of nice vigor/trap/skyline combo but I died much more attempting those kind of things then just falling back on cover shooting.
Game just needs to have much lower enemy count, less ammunition and some stealth element so that encounters don't start with enemies knowing exactly where you are. Some of the encounter spots are quiet large and they would lend themselves well to a more open approach.
It's really disappointing that a game with such an interesting story and concept gets paired with some of the most bland gameplay.
Agreed. I think I still would have preferred the first person pov though.
My biggest disappointment of the year by a fair margin. I can't believe how hyped I was for this game. Way too linear and repetitive. Skyhooks was the biggest wasted potential, they just go round in circles. Was a grind to finish. I never want to re-visit the linear city of Colombia ever again. How does a game like this average 95 on metacritic? Besides the story it was a shallow experience.
Uno Venova
Banned
I thought it had great gameplay, and a lot of fun vigors to mess around with. The gameplay itself does not get old. Unfortunately I did not care for the story and the first had a better realized world, and since I expected an improvement in those areas it was a disappointment in that sense.
I beat 1999 on my first playthrough (via Konami code). I'd say the game was much more enjoyable this way. Many peoples qualms with the game are lessened the higher the difficulty goes. Harder modes require much more finesse and strategy, especially if you are not using the dollar bill vending machine on 1999 mode. Vigor combos are a nice touch that they added.
I had a blast experiencing it on the hardest mode immediately out the gate. Since I did not know any better (about how easy the other modes are/were) I was able to better cope with the difficulty shift. I try to do this with most games, as I feel the easier modes are often times not how the designers "meant" the game to be played.
I had a blast experiencing it on the hardest mode immediately out the gate. Since I did not know any better (about how easy the other modes are/were) I was able to better cope with the difficulty shift. I try to do this with most games, as I feel the easier modes are often times not how the designers "meant" the game to be played.
I don't consider it a mandate, but rather a feature of the medium. Player interaction is the thing that makes a game a game and not a movie. To me, the ideal game story would be one that works with the game play...something where the work couldn't exist as a movie or book without losing a large part of what made it what it is.
Maybe asking for player action to factor in isn't the wright thing...and this certainly doesn't apply to just Infinite.
AstroZombie
Banned
OP, play System Shock 2. Be healed!
Doc Holliday
SPOILER: Columbus finds America
Bioshock was better, and i thought that was overated. Getting tired of reviewers and gamers for that matter putting story/setting over gameplay. The game would have played better as an adventure game with tons of puzzles and some platforming.
I was listening to weekend confirmed you would they were discussing a movie and not a game.
I was listening to weekend confirmed you would they were discussing a movie and not a game.
The gameplay isn't the most inventive but this is extremely dismissive. The mobility of the game through the skyhooks and the item spawn system through tears definitely make it stand out.
Basileus777
Member
Everything involving the Vox Populi was trash, in terms of combat, narrative, and characterization. It's this game's equivalent of Mass Effect 3's Cerberus parts.
Unfortunately agreed. The entire Vox Populi sub-plot is handled extremely poorly. When I beat the game I was like... wait, there's so much more they should have done.
They really could have done a lot more with that, it feels almost tacked on.
What is this about? Is there an achievement/trophy related to not using Dollar Bill vending machine?
Yes, that's the only reason why you would avoid doing so.
maniac-kun
Member
I like the setting but the gameplay bores me to death.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Beautiful world, neat little story, fun combat. Just like the first game, doesn't deserve a lot of the praise it gets. I enjoyed it more than 1 though, just because of the combat. Story felt like two stories patched together and it didn't succeed enough as a metaphor to make me feel like the two really fit together, more like the first was abandoned in favor of the second.
Honestly I couldn't say repetitive would be one of my complaints. It had a lot of location variety, and the combat was open ended enough that you could basically get out what you felt like putting into it. I have little doubt you could get through most of the game with nothing but crows and a shotgun if that's all you felt like, on normal difficulty anyway.
Honestly I couldn't say repetitive would be one of my complaints. It had a lot of location variety, and the combat was open ended enough that you could basically get out what you felt like putting into it. I have little doubt you could get through most of the game with nothing but crows and a shotgun if that's all you felt like, on normal difficulty anyway.
I'm like 8 hours in and I find that I agree with the OP about the gameplay. Its just kind of repetitive. And the Handyman enemies are annoying. They are super agile and stun you so you can't run and put distance between you, they soak up all kinds of damage, etc.
The story has me though. I love the setting, the characters, and sights waiting to be seen. I will finish the game for those reasons. However, the gameplay totally isn't anything revolutionary and I feel like the praise heaped on at the game's launch (mostly by the press) its a bit exaggerated.
But hey, it certainly doesn't suck and is by no means a bad game (gameplay wise). And you know what? Sometimes that has to be enough.
The story has me though. I love the setting, the characters, and sights waiting to be seen. I will finish the game for those reasons. However, the gameplay totally isn't anything revolutionary and I feel like the praise heaped on at the game's launch (mostly by the press) its a bit exaggerated.
But hey, it certainly doesn't suck and is by no means a bad game (gameplay wise). And you know what? Sometimes that has to be enough.
fuck gameplay.
Atmosphere and narrative is why I return back to video games.
That's why Ratchet and Clank, Jack and Daxter, and Even Uncharted are some of my favorite francises to date.
The gameplay is standard faire, but the characters, the world, the unique atmosphere, are soooo special, and so memorable.
Memorable gameplay like Bayonetta, or Vanquish just don't have that same special umph.
Just like the 1st bioshock..the reason is resonates so well with reviewers is:
A. The gameplay isn't bad. It's not great, but it's not bad. There's nothing wrong with it, so it's really difficult to complain about, but it could be better.
B. The narrative and characters, and just general atmosphere of the world of columbia is so damn special. I mean you gotta understand. This type of narrative, this type of atmosphere is just a rare feat. in the AAA industry today.
What infinite did, what levine did, what irrational as a team did was create a game with a heart of a Indie Studio, with the budget of a AAA activision studio. It's just rare to see in the AAA industry THAT type of atmosphere, and THAT type of narrative in the AAA genre.
It is severely overrated. The gameplay sucks and is a stepback from Bioshock 1+2, let alone the greatness of System Shock 2.
Really, it's all on the story, and even that's not all that good or original if you've consumed any similar Sci-Fi type media over the past few years like a Lost or Fringe. Never a good sign when the game creatively/artistically peaks in the first few hours before you shoot anything.
Really, it's all on the story, and even that's not all that good or original if you've consumed any similar Sci-Fi type media over the past few years like a Lost or Fringe. Never a good sign when the game creatively/artistically peaks in the first few hours before you shoot anything.
Buckethead
Banned
It is overrated.
There are some great ideas in there but too unfocused both narratively and with the dev cycle to make a strong impact.
There are some great ideas in there but too unfocused both narratively and with the dev cycle to make a strong impact.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
I feel that the game itself got in the way of the superb storytelling. I didn't even bother with 3/4 of the collected weapons or the vigours and fighting the enemies was a bit mehworthy to be honest. I loved the setting, the characters (except for Daisy), and of course the story - but the gameplay itself was a bit of an uninspired mess for me.
If I had to score it I'd be deciding between a 7.5 to an 8.5 - I'd have to give it a good think.
If I had to score it I'd be deciding between a 7.5 to an 8.5 - I'd have to give it a good think.
RobotMafia
Banned
I liked the game, but I like Bioshock much much more. I also can't see myself going back to play this again. Once was enough, where with Bioshock I played it 3 time on two different systems.
Really? You return to games for the story and not the gameplay? I think you're doing it wrong.
I watch movies multiple times if I like them enough, and I'll replay games a lot too, but when I replay games it's usually for the gameplay. Games as a whole have stories that aren't quite up to par with movies, so I see myself playing games again less for their stories and more for their gameplay.
I still put in Vanquish every once and a while to experience the awesome gameplay again, but I almost never replay a game for the story, ESPECIALLY when you have to get through the gameplay to experience the story.
Why not just watch the cutscenes on YouTube if you want to re-experience the story?
I've already written at length on my specific likes and disappointments with Infinite in the OT.
But briefly:
+Incredible introductory section
+Beautiful environments
+Love the skyrails
-Ridiculous story
-Inconsistent political backdrop
-Dull shooting mechanics
I think as more and more people got a chance to finish the game, the opinions started to sour overall. Some folks still like it, but the overwhelming opinion seems to be "meh, overrated." I agree. But it's at least interesting in how it fails. Like Comstock himself, hubris was Irrational's downfall.
But briefly:
+Incredible introductory section
+Beautiful environments
+Love the skyrails
-Ridiculous story
-Inconsistent political backdrop
-Dull shooting mechanics
I think as more and more people got a chance to finish the game, the opinions started to sour overall. Some folks still like it, but the overwhelming opinion seems to be "meh, overrated." I agree. But it's at least interesting in how it fails. Like Comstock himself, hubris was Irrational's downfall.
BadAss2961
Member
Haven't played it yet, but overrated and repetitive sounds a lot like the original to me.
That's, um, complete detached from reality.
Actually, no, it doesn't. I'm guessing this will rank highly in GAF's GOTY awards.
Wanted to care about the story, but the actual game part of the game made me not want to slog through to see the rest of it. IMO, they should have gotten rid of guns entirely. Focus on having lots of fun powers. Make it more about stealth and survival than murdering everything in Columbia.
It makes sense in another dimension.
I'm not sure where your getting this from, the majority of gaf loved infinite.
Liquid_Bike
Member
When I first completed the game I loved it. But as the weeks go by and I reflect on it I can't help but feel disappointed. Its not a bad game but it really shouldn't be a shooter(like EL said).
I agree with everyone who says Bioshock 1 was better as well.
The gameplay is put to the casual extreme in Infinite, and the atmosphere and story was much more coherent in the original as well.
The original had a good twist that wasn't overcomplicated. Infinite is trying to pull a twist so over the top that it just because ludicrous.
People who give this game a 10/10 are the some people who give the Dark Knight and Inception a 10/10. Just stop.
The gameplay is put to the casual extreme in Infinite, and the atmosphere and story was much more coherent in the original as well.
The original had a good twist that wasn't overcomplicated. Infinite is trying to pull a twist so over the top that it just because ludicrous.
People who give this game a 10/10 are the some people who give the Dark Knight and Inception a 10/10. Just stop.
Have you played Dishonored?
How the hell did you come to that conclusion?
I love Infinite, but think the Dark Knight and Inception are merely okay.
We'll see. But the trend has been toward threads exactly like this one in what I've noticed. And come early 2014 (when we all vote), I imagine the opinion will only turn more meh-like, especially in the wake of the new consoles.
And if it does end up high on the GAF list for 2013, it will only be a testament to a weak year overall. It's a fine game, but it's far from a great one.
I agree. I had to really struggle to finish it. The story was nice enough, the art direction was wonderful, great sound direction, good voice acting, but the actual gameplay blew. It felt like all the creative juices went solely to the setting and story, and the gameplay was a complete afterthought.
One of my biggest disappointments this gen.
One of my biggest disappointments this gen.
Trent Strong
Banned
It's an overrated game for sure. Is rooting around trash cans for money and food supposed to be exploration? It's just not fun. Plus, the world and story don't make a coherent whole and don't make an impact like the first Bioshock did.
I didn't think it was really a great game when I played it, and my opinion has cooled from there now that I've had a while to properly digest and distance myself from the game, but I don't know if I'd really call it "overrated". It's not like there are droves of people who just won't shut up about it, or tons of people overstating its quality everywhere, or anything - at least that I've noticed. I mean, day one/week one, when it was The New Thing and Metacritic was getting updated and everyone was playing it and super enamored with it, yeah, sure, but that's the same with basically every hugely publicized game ever.
A few weeks out, and it's just sort of a game that everyone played, and most people think it's pretty good, but apart from a few die-hard superfans who are still super into it, it's sort of just faded into the background, and people are forgetting it, like any other game - or at least that's my impression of it. Maybe I'm just not looking in the right places.
A few weeks out, and it's just sort of a game that everyone played, and most people think it's pretty good, but apart from a few die-hard superfans who are still super into it, it's sort of just faded into the background, and people are forgetting it, like any other game - or at least that's my impression of it. Maybe I'm just not looking in the right places.
AgentOtaku
Member
I'm curious how kind time will be to Bioshock: Infinite.
I get the impression it won't
I enjoyed the hell out of the world and setting. Found the shooting ultimately just sort of there most of the time.
Playing in 1999 Mode made me realize that I'm not sure if I find playing games on Insane-esque difficulties is what I'd consider "fun."
Almost made me hate the game.
I get the impression it won't
I enjoyed the hell out of the world and setting. Found the shooting ultimately just sort of there most of the time.
Playing in 1999 Mode made me realize that I'm not sure if I find playing games on Insane-esque difficulties is what I'd consider "fun."
Almost made me hate the game.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
As someone who played Infinite and was blown away, I just went back to play Bio 1 for the first time. Not nearly as interesting IMO. I think there's a little bit of rose-colored glasses going on there (it has been 6 years)... And the appeal of each game seems to be completely different anyway.
Personally I don't think it's really fair to compare the two games, but if ya did, I would say Infinite is far and away the more interesting experience.
Personally I don't think it's really fair to compare the two games, but if ya did, I would say Infinite is far and away the more interesting experience.
Confirmation bias?
You'll be in for some sour times come January when this is hitting the top of the GOTY lists. The Last of Us is the only game I'm seeing in the next 6 months with the potential to even come close to challenging it.
I think context matters enormously. The first Bioshock set the stage for high-concept AAA games. Six years later, that's become the norm. The effect the first game had doesn't hold up, but that doesn't diminish the important role it played in changing what we all expect from blockbuster games.
In contrast, Infinite did nothing to change our expectations going forward. Instead, it merely confirmed the status quo.
A good poster
Banned
The detail in the world and voxophones justify any effort of exploration.