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[excelsiorlef]

Members of the Black Lives Matter Toronto group briefly halted the Pride parade today, holding up the marching for about 30 minutes.
The parade didn't re-start until after Pride Toronto executive director Mathieu Chantelois signed a document agreeing to the group's demands.

The organization was given the status of Honoured Group for the parade, which is the grand finale of Pride Month. It did not give Pride Toronto advance notice of their planned sit-in.

...

"It's always the appropriate time to make sure folks know about the marginalization of black people, of black queer youth, black trans youth, of black trans people," she said.

"We are not taking any space away from any folks. When we talk about homophobia, transphobia, we go through that too ... It should be a cohesive unit, not one against the other. Anti-blackness needs to be addressed and they can be addressed at the same time, in the same spaces," she said.

"We didn't bully our way into Pride ... we made space for ourselves in a place where we have been erased," Williams added.

In a news release, the group said Pride Toronto "has shown little honour to black queer/trans communities, and other marginalized communities. Over the years, Pride has threatened the existence of black spaces at Pride that have existed for years."

The group released a list of demands, including a commitment to increase representation among Pride Toronto staff, and to prioritize the hiring of black transgender women and indigenous people.

Some of the other demands Chantelois agreed to are that the parade will no longer have police floats, and the organization will hold a public town hall with groups such as Black Lives Matter Toronto within six months.

Pride Toronto, in response to the sit-in, said it welcomes the opportunity to "continue the conversation" with Black Lives Matter Toronto.

"During the parade, BLM-TO started a conversation with us to explore how we can create an even more inclusive and safe festival. We, like BLM-TO have a commitment to ensure our most marginalized communities feel safe and welcome at the festival."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/pride-parade-toronto-1.3662823

This is how you do it folks. Shit got done. Voices were heard, parade organizers listened. Hopefully Toronto Pride does in fact work towards a more racially inclusive pride.

 

[Tagyhag]

Well done, this is the protesting I like to see.

 

[dream]

BLM-TO always seems to do everything right, and I think the way they handled Toronto Pride is an example that other protestors should follow.

 

[MikeDip]

I was there. Was a fun day

 

[Slayven]

Good....but "Conversation" is code for "we will not be talking about this"

 

[akira28]

It's almost like their float was the sit-in. show up, get in, show people how to do it, get moving.

Good....but "Conversation" is code for "we will not be talking about this"

in America. In Canada they can keep up pressure and might actually get that conversation. But they will still have to "make them" do anything.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Good....but "Conversation" is code for "we will not be talking about this"

Oh I know

Still it's something I guess.

 

[Divvy]

Surprised to see Pride capitulate after BLM crashed that mural unveiling for the LGBT community last month.

 

[dream]

Good....but "Conversation" is code for "we will not be talking about this"

You know the director of Pride Toronto signed BLM-TO's list of demands, right?

 

[Slayven]

You know the director of Pride Toronto signed BLM-TO's list of demands, right?

People say and sign a lot of things when the cameras are on, it's the follow through when no one is watching that counts

 

[User1608]

Good, inclusion and unity should be fucking common sense.

 

[dream]

People say and sign a lot of things when the cameras are on, it's the follow through when no one is watching that counts

Sure, but when BLM-TO was invited to the parade, given the status of Honored Group, and the director signed the list of demands after the protest, I think there's a pretty clear sign of good faith going on here, and I don't know how productive cynicism would be in this situation.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Surprised to see Pride capitulate after BLM crashed that mural unveiling for the LGBT community last month.

This one?

Black Lives Matter protesters chanting “No pride in police” crashed a Toronto Police news conference Friday, where Chief Mark Saunders unveiled a mural honouring the local LGBTQ community.

The mural, in the gay village near the corner of Church and Wood Sts., is meant to celebrate the history, diversity and strength of Toronto’s LGBTQ community, according to a police news release.

But the protesters claim the media event, like the Toronto police chief’s public apology this week for the 1981 bathhouse raids, was a publicity stunt.

They are “PR tools used to mask the reality of police relations amongst the queer and trans community: black people, indigenous people, sex workers et cetera,” said Black Lives Matter co-founder Rodney Diverlus, 26, after disrupting the unveiling.

The reverend and gay rights activist, Brent Hawkes, tried to mediate between Black Lives Matter and the police, to no avail, according to the queer activist and journalist, Andrea Houston, who live tweeted the encounter.

Black Lives Matter is still waiting for the police to meet the demands it made after its tent city protest outside police headquarters on College St. this spring, Diverlus added.

At the time, the protesters called for a face-to-face meeting with Saunders and an overhaul of the Special Investigations Unit, the civilian agency that investigates serious crimes allegedly committed by officers.

I hope you're not opposing what they did here.

The mural was being unveiled by the Police in response to injustices they committed 30 years ago, injustices that they continue to commit in varying degrees to commit against racial minorities.


https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...-pride-mural-unveiling-by-toronto-police.html

What I've learned today is that BLM-TO is organized as hell. Love it.

 

[ThisGuy]

Are the police in Canada as bad as the police in America? The no police float surprised me. I thought Canada had its stuff together.

Glad it was a major success, we need to hear this in America.

 

[Syriel]

Why the demand to exclude police from the parade?

I didn't think that Canada had the same issues as the US in that regard.

Is that just the result of a US focused group protesting across the border or is there a history of "shoot first, ask questions later" going on up north as well?

It may be because I'm in the US, but it just seems like we hear negative news about US police and Mexican police, but anytime Canadian police make the news it's positive. You rarely hear them held out in a bad light.

 

[akira28]

You know the director of Pride Toronto signed BLM-TO's list of demands, right?

a non-binding piece of paper when it comes down to it. But they did put their name on it and if their name means anything then they'll be there.

In America though with enough lobbyists you can change a name or a legal definition if necessary.

Why the demand to exclude police from the parade?

I didn't think that Canada had the same issues as the US in that rega

this is a case of being close to a brighter star. you just aren't aware of the issues in Canada because American media is what it is, and Canadian media is what it is. Do you read Canadian media? Does American media often report on Canadian local news events? I've heard of a few cases of brutality and I have no doubts that the lgbt and indigenous communities in Canadian cities face more than their fare share of police attention.

 

[Slayven]

Sure, but when BLM-TO was invited to the parade, given the status of Honored Group, and the director signed the list of demands after the protest, I think there's a pretty clear sign of good faith going on here, and I don't know how productive cynicism would be in this situation.

Like I said we will see

Got to stay woke

 

[HStallion]

Maybe he was just helping solve that one final quote in the crossword puzzle. Those can be a real pain in the ass.

 

[Divvy]

This one?


I hope you're not opposing what they did here.

The mural was being unveiled by the Police in response to injustices they committed 30 years ago, injustices that they continue to commit in varying degrees to commit against racial minorities.


https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...-pride-mural-unveiling-by-toronto-police.html

What I've learned today is that BLM-TO is organized as hell. Love it.

I'm not opposed, I don't think I'm educated to form an opinion one way or the other on this. It's just that there has been a certain amount of animosity between the two communities lately. If they can bury the hatchet and work together, then that's best for everyone

 

[kswiston]

Are the police in Canada as bad as the police in America? The no police float surprised me. I thought Canada had its stuff together.

They don't kill as many people, but I am sure there's still a ton of problems with racism and racial profiling. Canada has a larger native population (percentage wise) than the US, and the treatment that Native Canadians have received in the past few decades hasn't been very good.

 

[excelsiorlef]

I'm not opposed, I don't think I'm educated to form an opinion one way or the other on this. It's just that there has been a certain amount of animosity between the two communities lately. If they can bury the hatchet and work together, then that's best for everyone

Only if you define the queer community as TO Pride, I mean many of BLM TO are LGBT themselves sooo.

 

[dream]

They don't kill as many people, but I am sure there's still a ton of problems with racism and racial profiling. Canada has a larger native population (percentage wise) than the US, and the treatment that Native Canadians have received in the past few decades hasn't been very good.

The one thing that BLM-TO did that really impressed me was giving a shout out to the Indigenous population for holding it down, basically saying that their causes are one and the same. BLM-TO seems to understand the benefits of adopting an inclusive rhetoric, which is great to see.

 

[akira28]

a quick google has plenty of unfortunate things to say

https://www.buzzfeed.com/laurenstra...etter-on-police-violence-against-black-people

Inviting those police to the town hall might be a good move too. Instead of isolating them, forcing them to re-socialize with "we the people" to remember who they serve. Does us no good having them all paranoid with their guns in their blue and brick bunkers muttering "the people don't have our backs anymore"

 

[unpopularblargh]

I'm glad the response is fairly positive here. All I see on my Facebook is just people complaining about BLM ruining everything.

Thankfully Pride organizers responded positively.

 

[Breads]

Is this a win? I mean... it was a pride parade.

 

[sphagnum]

Good.

Is this a win? I mean... it was a pride parade.

Black LGBT people often have their issues overlooked so yes, it's a win.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Why the demand to exclude police from the parade?

I didn't think that Canada had the same issues as the US in that regard.

Is that just the result of a US focused group protesting across the border or is there a history of "shoot first, ask questions later" going on up north as well?

It may be because I'm in the US, but it just seems like we hear negative news about US police and Mexican police, but anytime Canadian police make the news it's positive. You rarely hear them held out in a bad light.

BLM-TO are people local to TO, they're Canadians.

Is this a win? I mean... it was a pride parade.

?

And?

Yes it's a win. How could it not be a win?

 

[Dai101]

Why the demand to exclude police from the parade?

They don't want hate groups around?

 

[Breads]

They don't want hate groups around?

It that how their police conduct themselves? Not concern trolling - I literally know nothing about Canadian/ Toronto police. If so then yeah I can see why this is a win.

?

And?

Yes it's a win. How could it not be a win?

I'm sure you meant well but that explained nothing about what the situation was before they intervened.

Black LGBT people often have their issues overlooked so yes, it's a win.

Gotcha. Thought there was something more specific to Tonronto I didn't know was going on. The police thing got me curious to how things are over there.

 

[Kinitari]

a quick google has plenty of unfortunate things to say

https://www.buzzfeed.com/laurenstra...etter-on-police-violence-against-black-people

Well... it's important to hold the police to a higher standard, but the police in Canada are significantly better if we use measures like... police brutality, murders, corruption, accountability, etc - basically every stat you normally use to judge the quality of a police force in regards to it's treatment of some sort of minority.

They could still certainly do better though.

They don't want hate groups around?

I am not really super into the police or anything, if anything I get nervous when I see anyone with a gun nearby, but I don't know by what metric the toronto police can be called a hate group.

I say this as a black guy living in Toronto, who used to live in Scarborough, his whole life - who's family is black and knows quite a few black people - some are even my friends.

 

[akira28]

Well... it's important to hold the police to a higher standard, but the police in Canada are significantly better if we use measures like... police brutality, murders, corruption, accountability, etc - basically every stat you normally use to judge the quality of a police force in regards to it's treatment of some sort of minority.

They could still certainly do better though.

I would instead of turning to stats because you happen to be situated next to the shambolic criminal justice system that is the US and say "they could do better certainly", just admit there is a problem instead of trying to couch it.

Ask a First Nations person.

 

[Kinitari]

I would instead of turning to stats because you happen to be situated next to the shambolic criminal justice system that is the US and say "they could do better certainly", just admit there is a problem instead of trying to couch it.

By saying 'they could do better, certainly' I tacitly admit there is room for improvement. But a 'problem' in any grand phrasing? I wouldn't agree with that. At least not from personal experience or from what I know regarding the information I have read. If there is like... something I am missing, information I am not privvy to, I'd certainly change my mind given enough of it + time.

But right now? You have to fight against nearly 3 decades of nothing but positive experiences with the police while living either in what would be called the 'ghetto' or in the middle of the tech district downtown.

 

[Trojita]

Is Pride Toronto is Anti-black like claimed?

Alexandra Williams, a co-founder of Black Lives Matter Toronto, told CBC's Natasha Fatah that they held the sit-in because they wanted to hold Pride Toronto accountable for what she called "anti-blackness."

Williams defended the group's actions.

 

[excelsiorlef]

It that how their police conduct themselves? Not concern trolling - I literally know nothing about Canadian/ Toronto police. If so then yeah I can see why this is a win.



I'm sure you meant well but that explained nothing about what the situation was before they intervened.

Dude with all do respect your statement said nothing.

Quotes in my OP literally lay out why they were protesting, and so yes what they achieved was a win.

This was not entirely or even mostly about the police btw.

 

[Kinitari]

Is Pride Toronto is Anti-black like claimed?

'anti-black'? I don't know what that means really. But I was at pride this weekend in Toronto, am reasonably black, saw a lot of black people. Some seemed to be enjoying themselves. They even gave BLM the star float in the parade as a sort of "hmm, maybe we're not doing enough for the black community" this year.

What would anti-black look like?

 

[MikeDip]

I accidentally bumped into a cop today to get closer to that BLM van thing and he said "sorry man" even though it was my fault.

Kinitari where were you? We should have met up

 

[devilhawk]

Always a good idea to ostracize and isolate the police from positive and voluntary interactions with disenfranchised members of the community.

Such a huge win.

 

[Breads]

Dude with all do respect your statement said nothing.

Quotes in my OP literally lay out why they were protesting, and so yes what they achieved was a win.

This was not entirely or even mostly about the police btw.

I didn't make a statement. I asked a question because what I lack is insight.

I read their list of demands. Now I ask for insight and you offer none. I'll keep reading this thread but my response to you ends here. Engaging with you isn't productive.

 

[akira28]

Is Pride Toronto is Anti-black like claimed?

well...they didn't dispute the claims made against them, and they signed the paper. The question to ask is are they willing to change?

they say that black representation in pride activities and local community have been encroached upon. Gentrification is happening everywhere, so its not hard to believe.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

Is this a win? I mean... it was a pride parade.

Their concerns about black LGBT being overlooked are apt. Last year in the DC area there was a huge rash of hate crimes against black transwomen that barely got any attention.

 

[Trojita]

'anti-black'? I don't know what that means really. But I was at pride this weekend in Toronto, am reasonably black, saw a lot of black people. Some seemed to be enjoying themselves. They even gave BLM the star float in the parade as a sort of "hmm, maybe we're not doing enough for the black community" this year.

What would anti-black look like?

I don't know either, that was why I was asking. It was in the article but was omitted from the OP.

I just read through the demands, they don't seem unreasonable. A lot of requests on helping funding and certain groups. They had a pamphlet with the demands on them.

The only thing I'm confused about is this "spaces" thing they kept on asking about. Is this like having group meetings, public halls, private meetings, or the safe spaces thing?

 

[Saucy_XL]

Always a good idea to ostracize and isolate the police from positive and voluntary interactions with disenfranchised members of the community.

Such a huge win.

Ya they were on PBS talking about protesting SFs because police were going to be there because of Orlando and the car they stopped in LA. Not only was police presence common sense, it was welcome. AND it was an opportunity to repair trust between police and community - yet BLM wanted to protest.

 

[excelsiorlef]

I didn't make a statement. I asked a question because what I lack is insight.

I read their list of demands. Now I ask for insight and you offer none. I'll keep reading this thread but my response to you ends here. Engaging with you isn't productive.

They are fighting for better representation and solidarity in and from the Pride organization, they've gotten Pride to agree (in theory) to work towards that.

Hence why it's a win.

 

[kswiston]

By saying 'they could do better, certainly' I tacitly admit there is room for improvement. But a 'problem' in any grand phrasing? I wouldn't agree with that. At least not from personal experience or from what I know regarding the information I have read. If there is like... something I am missing, information I am not privvy to, I'd certainly change my mind given enough of it + time.

But right now? You have to fight against nearly 3 decades of nothing but positive experiences with the police while living either in what would be called the 'ghetto' or in the middle of the tech district downtown.

I don't have your first hand experience, but I think some of the difference comes from the fact that the black community in Canada is mostly comprised of recent immigrants from the Caribbean and Africa. There are about 1 million black Canadians now, but during the 1971 census, that number was 35 thousand. You don't have the same level of targeted institutionalized racism as seen in the United States, because there barely were black people in Canada until recently.

As several people have mentioned, Canada's institutionalized racism was mostly directed at our First Nations population.

EDIT: That said, any country with a large ethnic majority is going to have racism problems. Go an hour or so North of the GTA and you get into red neck territory pretty quickly.

 

[Trojita]

Ya they were on PBS talking about protesting SFs because police were going to be there because of Orlando and the car they stopped in LA. Not only was police presence common sense, it was welcome. AND it was an opportunity to repair trust between police and community - yet BLM wanted to protest.

BLM isn't a group with a central leadership. They are united under a common banner and name but what one group does in one city isn't the same as another group in another city.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Always a good idea to ostracize and isolate the police from positive and voluntary interactions with disenfranchised members of the community.

Such a huge win.

The police are not performing poorly due to people excluding or ostracizing them. Ostracizing is a response to poor behavior. Such ostracization will cease when the police are better.

 

[KodaRuss]

Not really sure why Toronto Pride would want to deny any police floats but I guess BLM got what they wanted by their sit in/protest.

Have they had floats in the past?

 

[BudokaiMR2]

Always a good idea to ostracize and isolate the police from positive and voluntary interactions with disenfranchised members of the community.

Such a huge win.

I won't pretend to understand what issues exist for minorities in the LGBT communities, but that part really caught me off guard. Not sure what their goal is in denying police a part in the event.

And seeing people in here blanket generalizing police as a 'hate group'.....

Meeting ignorance with ignorance wouldn't be how I would go about trying to change things....

 

[old manatee]

I didn't know that Canadians hate their police as much as we do in the US. I thought it was going a little better up there.

 

[MikeDip]

I didn't know that Canadians hate their police as much as we do in the US. I thought it was going a little better up there.

We don't and it is.