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[Laughing Banana]

I believe you do. You have to beat Yharnam, and that requires a lot of Chalice Dungeon farming.

It also requires Defiled Watchdog of the Old Lords ;_;

Nahh. If you explore all the required Chalice thoroughly, you don't have to farm since they gave you all the necessary ingredients to unlock the next Chalice stages all the way to the queen.

Fuck that dog and what came afterwards, ahahahah.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Nahh. If you explore all the required Chalice thoroughly, you don't have to farm since they gave you all the necessary ingredients to unlock the next Chalice stages all the way to the queen.

Fuck that dog and what came afterwards, ahahahah.

Oh ok. I would still consider that farming a little bit as there are a few ones you have to go through but eh.

The first Dark Souls or DkS3?

The first

 

[Artdayne]

lol..... people have beaten a lot of BB/DS3 bosses on their first try, its not impossible. You're vastly overestimating the difficulty of the bosses.

Of course it's possible to beat a number of bosses in BB/DS3 on your first try. But to say you beat every boss in DS3 on your first try, except for NK which you claim to have beaten in three attempts, that is a pretty bold claim that you are making without any evidence.

It's also possible that you are just a huge Bloodborne fan and are exaggerating the difficulty of some BB fights and underplaying the difficulty of some DS3 fights in order to appeal to the game you like more.

 

[Persona7]

I don't know where he got that, it feels nothing like Dark Souls 2 to me....

Got a source or are we relying on feelings now?

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/02/26/dark-souls-2-engine-created-with-next-gen-in-mind

 

[Holundrian]

Un..like..the...god...damn..... proof... of...concords.....and....wolf...grass.... grahh.

I'm with you the longer it goes the surer I am that DS III has the absolutely worst plat. Like nothing was this bad not farming harpies in DS I, not going too NG++ for certain Spells in DS II not farming pure bladestone in DeS. Nothing to complain about in BB that plat was great, you kind of get it if you do everything fun the game has to offer.
Beginning to hate the number 30. Also shackles......

 

[SarusGray]

Of course it's possible to beat a number of bosses in BB/DS3 on your first try. But to say you beat every boss in DS3 on your first try, except for NK which you claim to have beaten in three attempts, that is a pretty bold claim that you are making without any evidence.

It's also possible that you are just a huge Bloodborne fan and are exaggerating the difficulty of some BB fights and underplaying the difficulty of some DS3 fights in order to appeal to the game you like more.

Oh god you really are trying.

 

[SarusGray]

Got a source or are we relying on feelings now?

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/02/26/dark-souls-2-engine-created-with-next-gen-in-mind

Is that last part really necessary? I'm not attacking you or anyone. Let's stop being so defensive over nothing.

 

[Cyrano]

Well you don't need to farm Chalice Dungeon at least for the Platinum trophy. If you explore properly all the ingredients required to unlock the next stages of Chalice can be gotten in a single playthrough with no farming required.

Un..like..the...god...damn..... proof... of...concords.....and....wolf...grass.... grahh.

Concords are easy if you do them early but yeah, wolf grass... couldn't figure out a way to do that one easily. Plus I'm not a fan of DS3's swamp.

 

[copelandmaster]

http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=199410372&postcount=636

I've tried finding a source about Bloodborne using a "new engine" and can't find anything reliable. However there are multiple interviews with from software employees stating the Dark Souls II engine was developed for next gen use.

Jumping in here to say that it might all be the same thing.

Remember that hacker guy from a couple weeks ago? Here he is exploiting leftover code from Dark Souls 1 in Dark Souls 3. Humanity... in a game without humanity.

Why on earth would a legacy function from several games ago from a supposedly different engine make it all the way to the newest title?

Maybe da 'truf is that they've modified the same engine since Demons'.

 

[Jawbreaker]

Of course it's possible to beat a number of bosses in BB/DS3 on your first try. But to say you beat every boss in DS3 on your first try, except for NK which you claim to have beaten in three attempts, that is a pretty bold claim that you are making without any evidence.

It's also possible that you are just a huge Bloodborne fan and are exaggerating the difficulty of some BB fights and underplaying the difficulty of some DS3 fights in order to appeal to the game you like more.

Or perhaps they're better than you at the game?

Seriously, can we not do this? People experience these games differently as evidenced by the diversity of opinions.

 

[SarusGray]

Jumping in here to say that it might all be the same thing.

Remember that hacker guy from a couple weeks ago? Here he is exploiting leftover code from Dark Souls 1 in Dark Souls 3. Humanity... in a game without humanity.

Why on earth would a legacy function from several games ago from a supposedly different engine make it all the way to the newest title?

Maybe da 'truf is that they've modified the same engine Demons'.

Demon Souls engine confirmed to be the original engine of it all.

 

[Laughing Banana]

Oh ok. I would still consider that farming a little bit as there are a few ones you have to go through but eh.

The first

Much better than killing silver knights over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over...

Of course it's possible to beat a number of bosses in BB/DS3 on your first try. But to say you beat every boss in DS3 on your first try, except for NK which you claim to have beaten in three attempts, that is a pretty bold claim that you are making without any evidence.

It's also possible that you are just a huge Bloodborne fan and are exaggerating the difficulty of some BB fights and underplaying the difficulty of some DS3 fights in order to appeal to the game you like more.

How does one provide evidence that they beat bosses in a single try? Unless that person livestreams their play that is, but for regular players, how can they provide proof?

In a world where there are crazy people out there who can beat Nameless King NG+6 using a level 1 character why is it so hard to believe that there are people capable of breezing through DS3 bosses in a single try?

Concords are easy if you do them early but yeah, wolf grass... couldn't figure out a way to do that one easily. Plus I'm not a fan of DS3's swamp.

The "easiest" way to do that is to use the Ruins Keep bonfire and kill the three swamp enemies right near you on the bridge since they can drop wolf grass. And then just use the bonfire to reset them to repeat the process over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over....

 

[Rozart]

The first

Ah... So, the best one then.

Just curious, which boss did you find to be the most challenging?

Spoiler

It's the Firesage Demon for me.

 

[Kai Dracon]

To me Bloodborne enforces one particular playstyle that can be found in Dark Souls and is difficult for some, easy for others. So depending on how you handle the "dance of death" aka the all-singing, all-dodging agility builds in Dark Souls, Bloodborne can seem way harder.

 

[copelandmaster]

Demon Souls engine confirmed to be the original engine of it all.

Real talk, the Debug menu from DS1 is exactly the same as Demon's.

Spoiler

6th archstone confirmed????

 

[Morrigan Stark]

All Soul's games/Bloodborn are equally awesome.

Truest statement of the goddamn thread.

This thread is rather discouraging. I wrote a pretty detailed post explaining why I think it's foolish to claim one game is easier (let alone "WAY EASIER LOL") than the others, and all I see before and after that post are people saying "Nah Bloodborne is way easier" and then retorts going "lol no Dark Souls 3 is way easier" and "Nameless King is just as easy as Cleric Beast really" and...

Well at least I know my perspective is a bit more informed than most because I played each games several times over.

Edit:

To me Bloodborne enforces one particular playstyle that can be found in Dark Souls and is difficult for some, easy for others. So depending on how you handle the "dance of death" aka the all-singing, all-dodging agility builds in Dark Souls, Bloodborne can seem way harder.

Good point. This is what many "X is obviously and objectively easier than Y!" people are missing.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Ah... So, the best one then.

Just curious, which boss did you find to be the most challenging?

Spoiler

It's the Firesage Demon for me.

That one was tough but I got it on the second or third try due to already fighting Stray (and my God was I stuck on that one for a LONG time).

Personally though it was O&S. Took me 4-5 hours.

Jumping in here to say that it might all be the same thing.

Remember that hacker guy from a couple weeks ago? Here he is exploiting leftover code from Dark Souls 1 in Dark Souls 3. Humanity... in a game without humanity.

Why on earth would a legacy function from several games ago from a supposedly different engine make it all the way to the newest title?

Maybe da 'truf is that they've modified the same engine since Demons'.

I mean Ubisoft are still using the AC2 engine if you want to get technical but the tools used to create Unity and Syndicate are massively different to the ones used to create AC2. "New engine" doesn't have to mean "we restarted everything from scratch."

If the dev team takes a significant time to overhaul the engine tools and implement new features then it is perfectly valid to consider that a "new engine", and most studios would agree.

 

[Cyrano]

The "easiest" way to do that is to use the Ruins Keep bonfire and kill the three swamp enemies right near you on the bridge since they can drop wolf grass. And then just use the bonfire to reset them to repeat the process over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over....

When the game's PvP stuff is working it's not really an issue, but yeah, the All Rings is pretty miserable (as is all spells - wish they would have just hidden them, especially since some of the spells are pretty valuable abilities for certain playstyles - Great Deep Soul particularly so).

 

[Holundrian]

Of course it's possible to beat a number of bosses in BB/DS3 on your first try. But to say you beat every boss in DS3 on your first try, except for NK which you claim to have beaten in three attempts, that is a pretty bold claim that you are making without any evidence.

It's also possible that you are just a huge Bloodborne fan and are exaggerating the difficulty of some BB fights and underplaying the difficulty of some DS3 fights in order to appeal to the game you like more.

Not really that bold of a claim my experience have been similar breezing through all the bosses(mostly first tries a few with a few second tries) and NK in 4 tries, the forth I switched to the dragon slayer shield and it kind of made it pretty easy.

I mean the context is people kind of have the experience of 4 other Souls like games now on their side and it just shows again that the difficulty of these games is soooooo overplayed. Souls is mainly about knowledge.

I mean we're talking normal game I doubt that most veterans struggle all that much.
For us the challenge comes in NG++.

Also easy bosses isn't even necessarily a slight against these games, at least not for me since I understand that nothing will touch my first time with these games, but there's more to appreciate to these games than the bosses. Like DS III areas and level design are soooo good. They're like top tier for me and I say this as someone that absolutely adored Yharnam and loves how DS I handled their area design and champions it as the peak of the series(DeS and DS II did very little for me).

 

[Persona7]

Jumping in here to say that it might all be the same thing.

Remember that hacker guy from a couple weeks ago? Here he is exploiting leftover code from Dark Souls 1 in Dark Souls 3. Humanity... in a game without humanity.

Why on earth would a legacy function from several games ago from a supposedly different engine make it all the way to the newest title?

Maybe da 'truf is that they've modified the same engine since Demons'.

Interesting. I wonder if they thought about implementing that feature at some point in development.

 

[Laughing Banana]

When the game's PvP stuff is working it's not really an issue, but yeah, the All Rings is pretty miserable (as is all spells - wish they would have just hidden them, especially since some of the spells are pretty valuable abilities for certain playstyles - Great Deep Soul particularly so).

Well (this is getting off topic but whatever, hahaha) I can give you all the rings in the game if you want, assuming you play on PS4 that is, so you can skip farming for Tongues and Wolf Grass if the rings are all you want from Rosaria and Farron. Oh and you don't have to go NG++ too.

Unfortunately spells can't be traded so there is no workaround to get Warmth and Darkmoon Blade other than to collect Shackles and Concord the old fashioned way.....

 

[Artdayne]

Much better than killing silver knights over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over...



How does one provide evidence that they beat bosses in a single try? Unless that person livestreams their play that is, but for regular players, how can they provide proof?

In a world where there are crazy people out there who can beat Nameless King NG+6 using a level 1 character why is it so hard to believe that there are people capable of breezing through DS3 bosses in a single try?



The "easiest" way to do that is to use the Ruins Keep bonfire and kill the three swamp enemies right near you on the bridge since they can drop wolf grass. And then just use the bonfire to reset them over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over....

About the only way to provide evidence is with a let's play, twitch archive or something.

Nameless King NG+6 at SL1 is more believable honesty. It's because Soulsborne bosses are generally methodical, they are about knowing the patterns. A person doing Nameless King NG+6 at SL1 is believable because first of all there's video evidence of it, but really once you know the patterns the games become dramatically easier. They are do not have high execution requirements.

Going through and beating nearly every boss in your first try, you don't know the patterns of those fights because its your first time seeing them. Yes, certainly some bosses can be beaten on your first try, I've done that and you can believe me or not, makes no difference to me. But in my opinion, some of the more difficult fights will require more than one attempt of seeing the boss to fully understand the mechanics and beat it. Sometimes people get lucky too and just don't see the more difficult combos that a boss does on their first attempt. But again, this is the same person that said fights like BSB and Cleric Beast were difficult so I'm a bit skeptical. Anyway, I've been pretty bored of this conversation for awhile, there's little reason to carry on with it.

 

[SarusGray]

About the only way to provide evidence is with a let's play, twitch archive or something.

Nameless King NG+6 at SL1 is more believable honesty. It's because Soulsborne bosses are generally methodical, they are about knowing the patterns. A person doing Nameless King NG+6 at SL1 is believable because first of all there's video evidence of it, but really once you know the patterns the games become dramatically easier. They are do not have high execution requirements.

Going through and beating nearly every boss in your first try, you don't know the patterns of those fights because its your first time seeing them. Yes, certainly some bosses can be beaten on your first try, I've done that and you can believe me or not, makes no difference to me. But in my opinion, some of the more difficult fights will require more than one attempt of seeing the boss to fully understand the mechanics and beat it. Sometimes people get lucky too and just don't see the more difficult combos that a boss does on their first attempt. But again, this is the same person that said fights like BSB and Cleric Beast were difficult so I'm a bit skeptical. Anyway, I've been pretty bored of this conversation for awhile, there's little reason to carry on with it.

Not really that bold of a claim my experience have been similar breezing through all the bosses(mostly first tries a few with a few second tries) and NK in 4 tries, the forth I switched to the dragon slayer shield and it kind of made it pretty easy.

I mean the context is people kind of have the experience of 4 other Souls like games now on their side and it just shows again that the difficulty of these games is soooooo overplayed. Souls is mainly about knowledge.

I mean we're talking normal game I doubt that most veterans struggle all that much.
For us the challenge comes in NG++.

Also easy bosses isn't even necessarily a slight against these games, at least not for me since I understand that nothing will touch my first time with these games, but there's more to appreciate to these games than the bosses. Like DS III areas and level design are soooo good. They're like top tier for me and I say this as someone that absolutely adored Yarnam and loves how DS I handled their area design(DeS and DS II did very little for me).

Just to add.. I've played souls games for a longgggg time so I'm probably more experienced and prepared than I need to be for these types of game. Bloodborne was completely new and different and required me to be more aggressive. Seriously in the end the difficulty will vary depending on playstyle and who you are as a gamer. I'm not throwing shade DS3. I bought it first day, love it and still play it. Yes thank you for ending the conversation, your input was appreciated.

 

[Cyrano]

Well (this is getting off topic but whatever, hahaha) I can give you all the rings in the game if you want, assuming you play on PS4 that is, so you can skip farming for Tongues and Wolf Grass if the rings are all you want from Rosaria and Farron. Oh and you don't have to go NG++ too.

Unfortunately spells can't be traded so there is no workaround to get Warmth and Darkmoon Blade other than to collect Shackles and Concord the old fashioned way.....

No worries, I farmed them. I hated it, but the reason I'll probably never get the plat is because I get bored with NG+ and NG++. Dunno why but the scaling in them feels weird. And you're right we're pretty off-topic at this point. Thanks for the offer though!

On-topic: Bloodborne and Souls-series are strong in some areas and weak in other areas. Let the controversy begin!

 

[Holundrian]

Let's talk about the important things, I feel justified saying that DS III is the worst fashion Souls game. Like most of the amazing sets are actually old ones.

Majorly disappointing.

Also context BB wins fashion on style(sry but nothing will ever beat me going around with the pizza cutter and mushroom head in the white executioner robes + cainhurst parts) for me, DS II wins on amazing variety of great sets(that game has a set for every mood).

 

[copelandmaster]

I mean Ubisoft are still using the AC2 engine if you want to get technical but the tools used to create Unity and Syndicate are massively different to the ones used to create AC2. "New engine" doesn't have to mean "we restarted everything from scratch."

If the dev team takes a significant time to overhaul the engine tools and implement new features then it is perfectly valid to consider that a "new engine", and most studios would agree.

Well, yeah. I just saw the convo and thought I'd jump in with a little video and speculation.

I'd say it would be more accurate to call the whole thing a "modified" engine, but I can understand them wanting to dumb it down and dress it up for curious press who asked.

If Durante spec'd out that DS3's not that much different than DS2, DS3 has leftover stuff from DS1, the supposition of press & gamers (has From said anything concrete?) is that Bloodborne was also "new" and that DS3 ran on that engine, and DS1 runs on the Demon's engine....

...I mean, the nomenclature from the horse's mouth for DS2 was "new engine built on DX11." More like, 'we wrote enhanced DX11 features/the backend into what we had, wrote a new lighting engine, and changed and created some new shaders'. Surface level stuff [save for the DX11 part], really...

...Which is weird, considering that users had to actually pay for a Remixed version of DS2 to get DX11...

 

[spliced]

3 things make the bosses harder.

1. Poor camera and big bosses make it hard to see what the heck is going on sometimes.
2. Bosses have huge health pools and or better defense, it's hilarious going back to DS1 after BB to see how fast the bosses health bars go down.
3. larger move sets make it harder to learn and read boss attacks.

The Chalice Dungeons are tough for all the wrong reasons though(tedious, boring and cheap).

I'd say vanilla is just slightly harder and the DLC is hardcore DS.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Well, yeah. I just saw the convo and thought I'd jump in with a little video and speculation.

I'd say it would be more accurate to call the whole thing a "modified" engine, but I can understand them wanting to dumb it down and dress it up for curious press who asked.

If Durante spec'd out that DS3's not that much different than DS2, DS1 has leftover stuff from DS1, the supposition of press & gamers (has From said anything concrete?) is that Bloodborne was also "new" and that DS3 ran on that engine, and DS1 runs on the Demon's engine....

...I mean, the nomenclature from the horse's mouth for DS2 was "new engine built on DX11." More like, 'we wrote enhanced DX11 features/the backend into what we had, wrote a new lighting engine, and changed and created some new shaders'. Surface level stuff [save for the DX11 part], really...

...Which is weird, considering that users had to actually pay for a Remixed version of DS2 to get DX11...

It probably would be more accurate tbh ah well. But yeah, that's pretty weird about DS2.

3 things make the bosses harder.

1. Poor camera and big bosses make it hard to see what the heck is going on sometimes.
2. Bosses have huge health pools and or better defense, it's hilarious going back to DS1 after BB to see how fast the bosses health bars go down.
3. larger move sets make it harder to learn and read boss attacks.

The Chalice Dungeons are tough for all the wrong reasons though(tedious, boring and cheap).

I'd say vanilla is just slightly harder and the DLC is hardcore DS.

The camera on big bosses is seriously an issue. People say things like "oh well just don't lock on during boss fights" but then you have to do some weird ass Monster Hunter claw thing to be able to attack, dodge + manipulate the camera all at once.

 

[Laughing Banana]

Seriously, Nameless King wouldn't be so difficult *if* the camera is not as wonky as it is right now especially during the 1st phase.

 

[MrOogieBoogie]

Seriously, Nameless King wouldn't be so difficult *if* the camera is not as wonky as it is right now especially during the 1st phase.

If you use lock-on you should experience ZERO camera issues in this fight, including the first phase. I didn't even know the camera was a thing until I came here.

 

[KHlover]

It probably would be more accurate tbh ah well. But yeah, that's pretty weird about DS2.

The camera on big bosses is seriously an issue. People say things like "oh well just don't lock on during boss fights" but then you have to do some weird ass Monster Hunter claw thing to be able to attack, dodge + manipulate the camera all at once.

Actually pretty comfortable if you play DS3 with a WiiU Pro Controller.

 

[Hypron]

If you use lock-on you should experience ZERO camera issues in this fight, including the first phase. I didn't even know the camera was a thing until I came here.

I never had camera issues with the second phase, but it definitely goes to shit in the first phase depending on what the dragon is doing.

 

[Imperfected]

http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=199410372&postcount=636

I've tried finding a source about Bloodborne using a "new engine" and can't find anything reliable. However there are multiple interviews with from software employees stating the Dark Souls II engine was developed for next gen use.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-dark-souls-3-bloodborne-engine-on-xbox-one

I searched "Bloodborne game engine" and it took all of four results from the top to find an article about how Dark Souls 3 would be the first chance to see how the Bloodborne engine runs on X-Box One. That obviously would not be the case if the three games were using Dark Souls 2's engine, given that we would have already seen Scholar of the First Sin running on XB1.

I have no idea what Durante's on about. There are very clear similarities between the DS3 and BB engines in the way they handle everything from hitboxes and edge collisions to applying "blood" effects onto cloth, to the way the cloth itself moves.

Dark Souls 2 is different in all of these things from either. In fact, in some of them, it's actually further removed than even Dark Souls 1 was. I'm sure From made use of some of the existing code in places, because when you're building an engine it's almost never truly "from scratch", but it honestly looks like they jettisoned more than they kept.

 

[Arondight]

Dodging is so much better than shields, I even stopped using shields in DS. You are given so much range, stamina in bloodborne that you shouldn't even feel the need for it.

No regenerating items is made up by the fact that you have 20 vials at all times based on percentages, there's a regain system where you can get most your health back when hit making BB probably much easier than Dark souls in terms of general combat.

I will say that areas in DS3 were much harder but BB bosses were more difficult. I struggled through Cleric, Orphan Kos, Headless bloodletting beast, Defiled Amy. I didn't quite run into the same issues in the DS3 (only DS i've played).

I thought it was a new engine? Same as DS3's?


Oh yeah..The quality of the sound production is the highest too.

This was immediately obvious when compared to Dark Souls 3.Where as BB seems to employ some live performers(or at least does a damn good job of emulating it), DS3 does not.

Agreed.

Most disappointing listening experience. Feels so much different which is shame because there's some very great music in there.

There's also a pretty big difference between DS2 and BB in terms of production values it's dishonest to say BB is anywhere similar let alone a low budget affair. Some levels that were designed in BB were pretty impressive like central Yharnam and how later areas connected back and the way the trick weapons have just so much ideas and thoughts put into them and how they'd work and animate makes weapons much above my weapon experience in DS3.

 

[Persona7]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-dark-souls-3-bloodborne-engine-on-xbox-one

I searched "Bloodborne game engine" and it took all of four results from the top to find an article about how Dark Souls 3 would be the first chance to see how the Bloodborne engine runs on X-Box One. That obviously would not be the case if the three games were using Dark Souls 2's engine, given that we would have already seen Scholar of the First Sin running on XB1.

I have no idea what Durante's on about. There are very clear similarities between the DS3 and BB engines in the way they handle everything from hitboxes and edge collisions to applying "blood" effects onto cloth, to the way the cloth itself moves.

Dark Souls 2 is different in all of these things from either. In fact, in some of them, it's actually further removed than even Dark Souls 1 was. I'm sure From made use of some of the existing code in places, because when you're building an engine it's almost never truly "from scratch", but it honestly looks like they jettisoned more than they kept.

Someone posted this exact thing before and it is nebulous at best.

 

[Imperfected]

Someone posted this exact thing before and it is nebulous at best.

I don't know what you want. You're working from a single-line, off-hand comment by Durante and an article that was released saying that the DS2 engine was "next-gen" back when they were trying to convince people that it was worth re-buying the game for Scholar of the First Sin to be able to play it on new consoles.

(It wasn't. They never even got back to their target renders from before the pre-release downgrade. The lighting is still mostly flat and there's very little in the way of the IQ seen in BB/DS3. It's really just a PS3 game at higher framerate.)

Like, your original supposition is beyond nebulous, it's basically a fairy-tale.

 

[SarusGray]

I don't know what you want. You're working from a single-line, off-hand comment by Durante and an article that was released saying that the DS2 engine was "next-gen" back when they were trying to convince people that it was worth re-buying the game for Scholar of the First Sin to be able to play it on new consoles.

(It wasn't. They never even got back to their target renders from before the pre-release downgrade. The lighting is still mostly flat and there's very little in the way of the IQ seen in BB/DS3. It's really just a PS3 game at higher framerate.)

Like, your original supposition is beyond nebulous, it's basically a fairy-tale.

I breezed through Bloodborne easily. I think only one boss required more than one try and even then I think it was a second try win. I guess being easier comes along with being dumbed down and streamlined compared to Dark Souls. Definitely a low budget affair.

Streamlined gameplay mechanics compared to dark souls, low difficulty, lacks armor sets, weapons, shitty covenants and the chalice dungeons are vapid filler. I believe this happened because they had a vastly lower budget compared to a multiplatform title. Lacks quality and quantity.

The chalice dungeons in Bloodborne are pure filler and they only exist because the main game lacks content and they needed something to fill the gap.

I don't think they hold BB in a really positive light. He attacked me for no reason lol.

Got a source or are we relying on feelings now?

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/02/26/dark-souls-2-engine-created-with-next-gen-in-mind

In the end someone already said it best, difficulty is subjective.

 

[RevenWolf]

I don't know what you want. You're working from a single-line, off-hand comment by Durante and an article that was released saying that the DS2 engine was "next-gen" back when they were trying to convince people that it was worth re-buying the game for Scholar of the First Sin to be able to play it on new consoles.

(It wasn't. They never even got back to their target renders from before the pre-release downgrade. The lighting is still mostly flat and there's very little in the way of the IQ seen in BB/DS3. It's really just a PS3 game at higher framerate.)

Like, your original supposition is beyond nebulous, it's basically a fairy-tale.

Im sorry but bloodborne image quality is terrible, particularly because of aliasing, SOTFS definitely beats it in image quality.

Level of detail, geometry etc I agree it's nowhere near as close but image quality in bloodborne is just terrible and makes me wish a pc version existed.

 

[kewlmyc]

Eh, I still feel that Ludwig and Orphan are probably two of the hardest fights in the "Soulsborne" series. Then again, I haven't finished DS3 yet.

Also, can we just agree that the first one you start off with is going to be your hardest. For me, it was Bloodborne since it was my first, and DS1 was the easiest of the bunch so far since it's the one I completed last, but I know it's the complete opposite for a lot of people.

 

[Persona7]

I don't know what you want. You're working from a single-line, off-hand comment by Durante and an article that was released saying that the DS2 engine was "next-gen" back when they were trying to convince people that it was worth re-buying the game for Scholar of the First Sin to be able to play it on new consoles.

(It wasn't. They never even got back to their target renders from before the pre-release downgrade. The lighting is still mostly flat and there's very little in the way of the IQ seen in BB/DS3. It's really just a PS3 game at higher framerate.)

Like, your original supposition is beyond nebulous, it's basically a fairy-tale.

If I am going to trust someone to determine this information in place of my limited knowledge about this topic it will probably be Durante. Not sure where the SOTFS comment is coming from. That link about next gen development was released about a month before Dark Souls 2 originally came out. The "next gen" version of Dark Souls 2 came out over a year after that article was posted. I can't reasonably believe that they developed two brand new engines and released four games in a short period of time without sharing technology.


Another post : http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=203218633&postcount=124

I don't think they hold BB in a really positive light. He attacked me for no reason lol.

Feel free to dig deeper into my post history. I have disliked BB from the day it came out for various reasons. I couldn't even play it for six months because the heavy chromatic aberration, poor image quality and and lack of anti-aliasing combination gave me severe eye strain to the point that I would feel dizzy and nauseous.

 

[SarusGray]

If I am going to trust someone to determine this information in place of my limited knowledge about this topic it will probably be Durante.


Another post : http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=203218633&postcount=124

I thought we all agreed the whole series is running on demon souls engine.

 

[daniels]

Makes me remember rooms with several witches/bell maidens with max curses on the dungeons. That's actually the most bullshit these games ever got. Like did anyone have a legit strategy to tackle those kind of rooms? I would always just run past them.

Straight up running to the bell maidens and ignoring anything else in the hopes of not getting swarmed with spiders was my "strategy" lol

 

[Gbraga]

My personal opinion:
Also, when you say "base Bloodborne", do you include the Chalice bosses? Because they *are* part of base Bloodborne, you know. The Watchdog and Amygdala Cursed Chalice fights for me outclasses each and every DS3 boss fight in terms of difficulty, in my opinion.

But that's because of the health gimmick, not because of a relentless moveset. The boss is the same as the ones we fight before, on normal conditions. They just kill you with one hit. You can replicate that on any boss by playing with low health without RTSR.

I died several times against Yhorm, because I'm playing with 12 Vigor, and most of his attacks one shot me. He has like three attacks. It's not a super hard boss, I just had low health.

Watched ENB fight him after my fight and he could take several hits, and he needs several estus to heal him. One estus gives me 100% health ever since +3, IIRC, currently at +8.

Spoiler

Laurence on NG++ was still harder than any Chalice Boss, though. Fuck that guy >_<

Definitely the hardest fight I've ever did on a Souls game.

Not a super fun boss, though. Died A LOT against Ludwig and Orphan, but loved them.

 

[Bloodporne]

Makes me remember rooms with several witches/bell maidens with max curses on the dungeons. That's actually the most bullshit these games ever got. Like did anyone have a legit strategy to tackle those kind of rooms? I would always just run past them.

I don't think there's even a way to best those without smart rolling/evasion and killing the asshole bell maidens first. Maybe some of the jerkiest rooms in any videogame I've ever played haha.

 

[StylusX]

I've only played BB but can someone who knows these game tell me how hard are those shark dude in the BB DLC compared to other 'normal' enemies in the soul games. I found the second shark fucker (the one just before the save) harder then most of the bosses in vanilla BB.
That's what was getting me so pissed, I kept dying over and over again to this fucker and all i could think was 'this dude is giving me more trouble then the bosses'. Got to the point where my GF was telling me to stop playing haha. Only way I got past it was running to a safe distance then cheesing it with back stabs and running again.

The two down the well; I haven't even bothered trying to fight them yet.

 

[silva1991]

I've only played BB but can someone who knows these game tell me how hard are those shark dude in the BB DLC compared to other 'normal' enemies in the soul games. I found the second shark fucker (the one just before the save) harder then most of the bosses in vanilla BB.
That's what was getting me so pissed, I kept dying over and over again to this fucker and all i could think was 'this dude is giving me more trouble then the bosses'. Got to the point where my GF was telling me to stop playing haha. Only way I got past it was running to a safe distance then cheesing it with back stabs and running again.

The two down the well; I haven't even bothered trying to fight them yet.

The giant shark dudes are harder than any normal enemy in the other games.

the only enemies that were as hard were the giant knights in the dragon area in DS2, but they got nerfed so hard after a while and become easy as hell.

 

[Gbraga]

I've only played BB but can someone who knows these game tell me how hard are those shark dude in the BB DLC compared to other 'normal' enemies in the soul games. I found the second shark fucker (the one just before the save) harder then most of the bosses in vanilla BB.
That's what was getting me so pissed, I kept dying over and over again to this fucker and all i could think was 'this dude is giving me more trouble then the bosses'. Got to the point where my GF was telling me to stop playing haha. Only way I got past it was running to a safe distance then cheesing it with back stabs and running again.

The two down the well; I haven't even bothered trying to fight them yet.

They are definitely way harder than most enemies, but I feel like their difficulty is overstated because people don't even think about parrying such a huge enemy. But, like most enemies in the series, parry->riposte deals with them without too much trouble.

About the two down the well,

Spoiler

Shaman Bone Blade will make them fight each other, and you'll only have to deal with one of them.

A general rule would be "if a normal enemy is really giving you as much trouble as a boss, you should rethink your strategy". No enemy in any of the games is made like that on purpose. It's either just broken and will be patched or you just didn't figure it out.

The giant shark dudes are harder than any normal enemy in the other games.

the only enemies that were as hard were the giant knights in the dragon area in DS2, but they got nerfed so hard after a while and become easy as hell.

This is why it's so much fun to talk about difficulty in these games, even if no one will ever reach an agreement, I find it fascinating to see how people's experiences differ from mine. I would never compare the two, the sharks are on a whole different league, to me. The giant knights were ok, only really assholes when you were trying to run past them, but that's just Dark Souls II in general.

But I only played the PC version, didn't play them on consoles, so if they were already nerfed by then, like Shrine of Amana, then I don't really know how hard they used to be.

 

[schlynch]

Funny because I think BB is easier than any of the souls games.

Yes, it is.

Some few bosses are kinda tough, but especially the normal areas are very easy compared to Souls.

 

[Greddleok]

I've finally gotten around to playing this game, and everything about it screams it's a game meant for people who thought Dark Souls was too easy:

1) No shields

Spoiler

(ok there is one, but it is practically useless)

2) No spells/ranged weapons (guns are only good in low to mid ranges, and the ammo is expensive).

3) no regenerating healing items - there are no estus flasks here - if you run out of healing items - no bonfire will save you here.

I disagree, the things you've mentioned are pretty surface level, especially the estus flask. You can easily farm healing items to the point you'd never run out.
You don't have to use shields in souls...

I found it easier because:

1) An incredibly generous number of i-frames in the dodge

2) An incredibly generous window for parries (it's practically impossible to miss parries) and multiple bosses where a viable strategy is just to wait, parry, wait, parry, win.

3) Some of the easiest bosses in the series.

 

[Mendrox]

They are definitely way harder than most enemies, but I feel like their difficulty is overstated because people don't even think about parrying such a huge enemy. But, like most enemies in the series, parry->riposte deals with them without too much trouble.

About the two down the well,

Spoiler

Shaman Bone Blade will make them fight each other, and you'll only have to deal with one of them.

A general rule would be "if a normal enemy is really giving you as much trouble as a boss, you should rethink your strategy". No enemy in any of the games is made like that on purpose. It's either just broken and will be patched or you just didn't figure it out.



This is why it's so much fun to talk about difficulty in these games, even if no one will ever reach an agreement, I find it fascinating to see how people's experiences differ from mine. I would never compare the two, the sharks are on a whole different league, to me. The giant knights were ok, only really assholes when you were trying to run past them, but that's just Dark Souls II in general.

But I only played the PC version, didn't play them on consoles, so if they were already nerfed by then, like Shrine of Amana, then I don't really know how hard they used to be.

Parrying these fuckers? Of course that was possible, but their attack animations were utter bullshit. Changing from fast to very fast, hitting you everywhere, not being able to time a parry etc.

Worst fuckers in every Soulsborne game. Just thinking about them destroys me.

Also abusing that tactic for the two of them felt lame. But otherwise I guess almost nobody killed them legit. Harder than 90% of Bloodborne bosses.