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Breaking: WH releases Obama's original birth certificate

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Crumpet Trumpet said:
I haven't read this whole thread so sorry if this has been asked, but has Obama been the only president whom has had his natural citizenship questioned? And if so, doesn't this speak to some sort of subconscious racism from those in the Birther movement? I'm too young to remember any controversy in the past about this.
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He is the first.
 
Dali said:
Do you think the general populace sees Obama as an individual - as any past white President has been seen - or a representation of Black people as a whole? I'm almost positive it's the latter and as a result any missteps he's made will (unfairly) be put on any future Black candidates. The next black president won't have to put up with as much of this shit because by the time another black candidate is given a fair shake most of the country will be brown anyway.
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Well there's a chance of that, but we got out first black president way faster than I thought so who knows when the next is. Regardless of when, I think it's the 'shock' that wears off. The next time, no matter the racial makeup of the country is, these same people (or their kids) aren't going to have the same anger and objection to throw around. There will be less attention to these extremes given by moderates as well.
 
For us Europeans with a slightly less insane political system, what does Obama's birthplace have to do with anything?
 
threenote said:
Already people on my facebook saying Obama's birth certificate is a fake.
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Stephen Colbert really nailed the conservative mindset with his portrayal of conservatives seeing truth 'with their gut' and measuring things on 'truthiness'.


The hardcore conservative mindset doesn't find truth in objective evidence. They find it in subjective emotional feeling. It is explains birtherism, higher amounts of racism on the right, evolution denial, climate change denial, etc.
 
What do you guys think is going to happen when the US gets its first Female President? Gender certificate? Will people attack her for having premarital sex? Bra size?
 
speculawyer said:
Stephen Colbert really nailed the conservative mindset with his portrayal of conservatives seeing truth 'with their gut' and measuring things on 'truthiness'.


The hardcore conservative mindset doesn't find truth in objective evidence. They find it in subjective emotional feeling. It is explains birtherism, higher amounts of racism on the right, evolution denial, climate change denial, etc.
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meh. It's really no different than 9/11 Truthers. People will believe what they want to believe.

People make up their own realities. Create their own simulacra.
 
speculawyer said:
Stephen Colbert really nailed the conservative mindset with his portrayal of conservatives seeing truth 'with their gut' and measuring things on 'truthiness'.


The hardcore conservative mindset doesn't find truth in objective evidence. They find it in subjective emotional feeling. It is explains birtherism, higher amounts of racism on the right, evolution denial, climate change denial, etc.
Click to expand...
there will always be conspiracy theorists. I know people who still won't believe the first moon landing was real. I think it has little to do with political ideology.
 
2th said:
couldnt care less honestly. i just hope obama is a one term president.
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if that were to happen, it would mean one of these guys on the Right become President. I have yet to see a single one who's serious about running who's worth a damn, much less a shot at the Presidency.
 
Aurora said:
For us Europeans with a slightly less insane political system, what does Obama's birthplace have to do with anything?
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In America there is a rule that to be elected President, you need to be 35 and you need to have been born in America. Obama was obviously 35 (OR WAS HE?!?!!?!?) when he was elected, but some people claimed he was not born in America. Which would make his election illegal.

Those people were crazy, of course, but that's the explanation as to why it is important.

Personally I think the rule is a silly holdover from a bygone era, but until the rule is changed, US Presidents do need to be US-born.
 
Aurora said:
For us Europeans with a slightly more sane political system, what does Obama's birthplace have to do with anything?
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If he's not a "natural-born citizen" he cannot be President. It's a clause in the Constitution, one of the requirements for office. The definition of "natural-born citizen" is defined by law as legislated by Congress. At the time Obama was born the definition had a complicated exception for women under the age of 18 blah blah blah, so he wouldn't be a citizen if he were born outside the US (or on a US base or at an embassy) despite his mother's citizenship.
 
threenote said:
there will always be conspiracy theorists. I know people who still won't believe the first moon landing was real. I think it has little to do with political ideology.
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Have we had a lot of conspiracy theories that relate directly to politics, historically speaking?

I know we have a lot of stuff about the moon landing, and aliens/extraterrestrials, and 9/11, and so on...but do we have a lot of stuff relating to politics/political machinations? Elections, candidates, policies, military actions, etc?
 
Dreams-Visions said:
meh. It's really no different than 9/11 Truthers. People will believe what they want to believe.

People make up their own realities. Create their own simulacra.
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Oh, I agree that it happens on both sides . . . but it happens way more on the conservative side. Where is the center of truthers? Alex Jones who is pretty much a far-far-right conservative.

Did you see any Democrat presidential candidates running on truther stuff the way you've seen many GOPer presidential candidates talk about birther stuff? No.

The only Dem that took the truther stuff seriously was Cynthia McKinney and she was run out of the party pretty much.


I think a more left-wing conspiracy theory would be the vaccince/autism conspiracy. That is a shameful conspiracy theory but it has largely died.
 
captmcblack said:
Have we had a lot of conspiracy theories that relate directly to politics, historically speaking?

I know we have a lot of stuff about the moon landing, and aliens/extraterrestrials, and 9/11, and so on...but do we have a lot of stuff relating to politics/political machinations? Elections, candidates, policies, military actions, etc?
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During Abraham Lincoln's presidency, there were conspiracies of him being a Catholic.
 
2th said:
couldnt care less honestly. i just hope obama is a one term president.
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To make that a reality, the Republican field needs to do a better job of not looking like a clown parade. People who probably should be getting a lot more attention, like Mitch Daniels, etc., barely register in the polls.
 
captmcblack said:
Have we had a lot of conspiracy theories that relate directly to politics, historically speaking??
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Read up on the John Birch Society. Learn how flouridated water is a communist plot. Eisenhower was a communist. The whole Red Scare with Joseph McCarthy.

There is a long history of political conspiracy theories.
 
Now that I think more about it, I wouldn't be surprised if this was planned by the WH to elevate Trump (or any birther) in the the GOP primaries. Wouldn't this make more likely a nut will be nominated? Obama going for the Harry Reid strategy?
 
Dreams-Visions said:
if that were to happen, it would mean one of these guys on the Right become President. I have yet to see a single one who's serious about running who's worth a damn, much less a shot at the Presidency.
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while im kind of with you there im a pretty conservative republican type person. though i am not full blown right wing insane. i just hate obama. the guy is nothing more than a puppet and id rather we get a president with an actual backbone. but we all know that wont happen with politics being a career. my hatred of politics is a debate for another day though.


Stumpokapow said:
In America there is a rule that to be elected President, you need to be 35 and you need to have been born in America. Obama was obviously 35 (OR WAS HE?!?!!?!?) when he was elected, but some people claimed he was not born in America. Which would make his election illegal.

Those people were crazy, of course, but that's the explanation as to why it is important.

Personally I think the rule is a silly holdover from a bygone era, but until the rule is changed, US Presidents do need to be US-born.
Click to expand...


you know i have to disagree with you on the rule being a holdover. i think it should stay simply because being born american almost ensures patriotism. i mean if you dont have patriotism for the country you are elected to govern how can you do a proper job?
 
Even if he wasn't born a US citizen, he'd still probably win any election against the current stream of Republican hopefuls and you would presume that itself is more of a pressing concern for them? These are the same vocal groups who, when not declaring he is not an American in an attempt to 'uphold the Constitution', claiming that he is Muslim in an ironic reversal. The sad thing is, if there was a black man with an Arab middle name, who represented all their political, social and cultural beliefs - he would himself also be dismissed.
 
Stumpokapow said:
In America there is a rule that to be elected President, you need to be 35 and you need to have been born in America. Obama was obviously 35 (OR WAS HE?!?!!?!?) when he was elected, but some people claimed he was not born in America. Which would make his election illegal.

Those people were crazy, of course, but that's the explanation as to why it is important.

Personally I think the rule is a silly holdover from a bygone era, but until the rule is changed, US Presidents do need to be US-born.
Click to expand...
Oh, I didn't know that was the case. That really does seem archaic.
 
2th said:
you know i have to disagree with you on the rule being a holdover. i think it should stay simply because being born american almost ensures patriotism. i mean if you dont have patriotism for the country you are elected to govern how can you do a proper job?
Click to expand...

I don't know what to tell you if you think that everyone born on American soil is patriotic, and someone who is born in the UK and moves to the US when they are 3 cannot possibly be patriotic.

I also don't know what to tell you if you actually think there's a single politician ever who hasn't been "patriotic" in their own way, based on their own definition of what America's unique strengths are.
 
Hokuten said:
Sorry, but you will get neither hope nor change in 2012.
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lol

I think you've just given us a glimpse of the GOP's 2012 slogan.

"Change you can really believe in (for real)."
 
2th said:
while im kind of with you there im a pretty conservative republican type person. though i am not full blown right wing insane. i just hate obama. the guy is nothing more than a puppet and id rather we get a president with an actual backbone.
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I hear you. But for whom is he a "puppet"?

Also, when you say "backbone", do you mean more aggressiveness on domestic issues?
 
Why did they release it? They should have played along with it so it would have been easy to see who the crazies were. I shake my everytime birthers go on the news but I got the feeling most Americans were secretly laughing at them.
 
Stumpokapow said:
In America there is a rule that to be elected President, you need to be 35 and you need to have been born in America. Obama was obviously 35 (OR WAS HE?!?!!?!?) when he was elected, but some people claimed he was not born in America. Which would make his election illegal.

Those people were crazy, of course, but that's the explanation as to why it is important.

Personally I think the rule is a silly holdover from a bygone era, but until the rule is changed, US Presidents do need to be US-born.
Click to expand...

The rule is that you have to be a natural born citizen, not that you have to be born in the US.

(Obama would not be a US citizen if he was born outside of the US, however).
 
FunkyPajamas said:
What do you guys think is going to happen when the US gets its first Female President? Gender certificate? Will people attack her for having premarital sex? Bra size?
Click to expand...
First transgender president (is the shorter T-word banned?) is when shit's gonna hit the fan. Oh boy, i hope i live to see that.
First atheist president would be a riot too.
 
Why is "African" for his father's race even an issue? They've had years to process this as it was on his Certificate of Live Birth that was released during the campaign:
birth.jpg
 
titiklabingapat said:
Why did they release it? They should have played along with it so it would have been easy to see who the crazies were. I shake my everytime birthers go on the news but I got the feeling most Americans were secretly laughing at them.
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they already know who they are. they'll still be birthers after today.
 
Got to love the Foxnews.com headline for this:

"White House releases what it says is President Obama's Long From Birth Certificate."

What it says?

*facepalm*
 
sangreal said:
The rule is that you have to be a natural born citizen, not that you have to be born in the US.

(Obama would not be a US citizen if he was born outside of the US, however).
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Yes, I was reducing the qualifications of natural born citizen to "born in the US" because it's much easier to convey to someone who isn't from the US, doesn't really care a whole lot, and just wants a simple yes/no answer :p
 
e_i said:
Got to love the Foxnews.com headline for this:

"White House releases what it says is President Obama's Long From Birth Certificate."

What it says?

*facepalm*
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but remember, some of our posters believe that Fox News has been doing what it can to dispel the notion! so get back on your meds!
 
Stumpokapow said:
I don't know what to tell you if you think that everyone born on American soil is patriotic, and someone who is born in the UK and moves to the US when they are 3 cannot possibly be patriotic.

I also don't know what to tell you if you actually think there's a single politician ever who hasn't been "patriotic" in their own way, based on their own definition of what America's unique strengths are.
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I think the rule lessons the probability of infiltration tbh. It makes sense to me. We have no restrictions of birth place on mayors or governors - only the top dogs.
 
2th said:
you know i have to disagree with you on the rule being a holdover. i think it should stay simply because being born american almost ensures patriotism. i mean if you dont have patriotism for the country you are elected to govern how can you do a proper job?
Click to expand...

Wow, and all it took was some jackass on the internet to tell me I'm not patriotic despite living in this country 23 of my 26 years of existence. I barely know my birth country. Where's my allegiance then?

Fuck, I'm one of them not-real-Americans.
 
Foxy Fox 39 said:
I think the rule lessons the probability of infiltration tbh. It makes sense to me. We have no restrictions of birth place on mayors or governors - only the top dogs.
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Risk of infiltration from who? A foreign power?

Let's assume for a second that there's a foreign power, Soviet Islamochina, that really wants to destroy America. Let's assume they're able to essentially machinate and manipulate someone's entire life up to and including to rig the presidential election results.

... and they can't fly a pregnant woman onto US soil?

This is cartoon villain stuff.
 
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