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Buddhism/Shinto/Daoism in Japanese games

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ivysaur12

Banned
I'm currently having to do a research paper for a religions of Japan class, and one of the possible topics was religion in video games. I thought it would be interesting to pursue this area, but I'm coming up short on games that deal explicitly with Buddhism, Shinto, Daoism, Confucianism, Animism, or maybe even Christianity. I still will somehow need to create a thesis about all of this, but for now I just need to get a good list.

Okami jumped out at me first, as it is distinctively Shinto. Persona 3 and 4 also seemed like good games, since they show the life of a typical(?) Japanese school student including festival days, shrines, and the like. Many of the persona are also named after Japanese kami. I also felt that Xenosaga (I know, I know) would be an interesting take on Christianity from a Japanese perspective (again, I know it's wildly pretentious stuff, but it's still extremely overt and useful for a paper).

Can anyone think of any other examples? I guess other games such as Terranigma might be good, but I sort of want to stray away from Christianity (except maybe for Xenosaga) and focus more on the major religions of Japan. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
(I'm not an expert) But I think the disturbing meditation scene with Poo from Earthbound was I believe Buddhist in nature.

Also the Suikoden series has some religious links, the 128 stars come from 128 being a holy number.
 
inner-G said:
Also the Suikoden series has some religious links, the 128 stars come from 128 being a holy number.
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It's 108 :P

But yes, the original tale is rooted in Daoism.
 
Okami is probably the closest you're going to get with such overt themes from those particular philosophies/religions.
 
Ohenrosan on GameCube - some deep shit yo.

149w7y8.jpg

2ebcpxs.jpg

20kdftv.jpg
 
If I could offer you one piece of advice, it would be this: Concern yourself less with the superficial trappings of the religions (visual symbolism, names of gods, specific scenes/places that reference a religion) and ask yourself, what are the fundamental tenets of these religions and how might they be expressed in games that have no overt references to religion?
 
Kobun Heat said:
If I could offer you one piece of advice, it would be this: Concern yourself less with the superficial trappings of the religions (visual symbolism, names of gods, specific scenes/places that reference a religion) and ask yourself, what are the fundamental tenets of these religions and how might they be expressed in games that have no overt references to religion?
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It wasn't that subtle, but Rez's Area 5 was somewhat Buddhistic.
 
I always got a sense that the original Katamari Damacy was flirting with Buddhism rolled up in a satire on consumption culture. I don't believe that thought was very unique either.
 
Kobun Heat said:
If I could offer you one piece of advice, it would be this: Concern yourself less with the superficial trappings of the religions (visual symbolism, names of gods, specific scenes/places that reference a religion) and ask yourself, what are the fundamental tenets of these religions and how might they be expressed in games that have no overt references to religion?
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Interesting.

There's the theory of the Japanese tea ceremony and how its appreciation of simple objects and sounds were inspired by Zen Buddhist thought and the practice of meditation. It would take a bit of familiarity with Buddhist and specifically Zen thought to understand why this is... but in short, there is a lot of the same kind of beauty in simplicity in MANY Japanese games and in Japanese design in general.

Many games would apply, but my initial thoughts are: Electroplankton, Last Blade 1 and 2, Mario Paint, Rez, Bushido Blade, WiiSports and the Wii/DS concept in general.

Also, in terms of Taoism, the yin/yang concept of opposites tends to lead to relative and mutually complimenting themes of protagonist/antagonist, rather than the ultimate good vs. ultimate evil heroes inspired by western religion (ie. God vs. Satan tend to inspire villains such as in Disney films, where bad guys like Jafar or Scar are irredeemably bad and worthy of ultimate condemnation). Look for game stories with relatively evil villains as opposed to innately evil villains. I always thought Japanese stories were more sympathetic to the motivations of villains and it COULD be a Taoist influence there.


And if you're looking for specific symbols, unlike what Kobun was implying, there sure are a lot of shinto shrines and Buddha statues in the background of Capcom or SNK fighting games! (personal favorites are Capcom vs. SNK 1 and Last Blade 2)
 
Ganbare Goemon (A.K.A Mystical Ninja) throws in a lot of really goofy off-the-wall cartoon fantasy, but you can probably find several elements of Shinto and maybe possibly Buddhism, especially in the older games.

Awesome series anyway-- you should play it.
 
One angle you could take is how Japanese games have historically had a very open attitude toward Christian symbols that were then censored upon western release (NES era, especially). It's kind of a easy shot (and you want more focus on Japanese religion), but it could be a good opening paragraph or something.
 
Duane Cunningham said:
One angle you could take is how Japanese games have historically had a very open attitude toward Christian symbols that were then censored upon western release (NES era, especially). It's kind of a easy shot (and you want more focus on Japanese religion), but it could be a good opening paragraph or something.
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Of course they could feature Christian symbols because there's no taboo behind it.... no one to offend. They tended to reference Christianity in a kind of objectified kitchy way... where crosses are for killing vampires and churches are for refilling health.

Then again, no westerner would bat an eye at a Buddhist monastery being essentially "mystical asiany martial arts training center". Not that it would be much of a taboo in asian countries either, due to the differing nature of the faith, but we would still objectify it in a similar kitchy way.
 
teruterubozu said:
Ohenrosan on GameCube - some deep shit yo.

149w7y8.jpg

2ebcpxs.jpg

20kdftv.jpg
Click to expand...

IIRC there was another game where you did some famous pilgrimage walk that a monk did many years ago. IIRC the limited edition of the game came with a walking stick GC controller and a pedometer. Or maybe this is the same game.
 
Kobun Heat said:
If I could offer you one piece of advice, it would be this: Concern yourself less with the superficial trappings of the religions (visual symbolism, names of gods, specific scenes/places that reference a religion) and ask yourself, what are the fundamental tenets of these religions and how might they be expressed in games that have no overt references to religion?
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Beautiful response

If you're looking for the embodiment of Shintoism I think Shadow of the Colossus fits perfectly.

edit: not videogames, but Studio Ghibli films are exemplars of Shintoism as well.
 
genjiZERO said:
Beautiful response

If you're looking for the embodiment of Shintoism I think Shadow of the Colossus fits perfectly.

edit: not videogames, but Studio Ghibli films are exemplars of Shintoism as well.
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though maybe what you're actually doing in SotC is the opposite? like GTA but instead of destroying society, you're destroying some of the ideas behind shinto-buddhism? :lol
 
Kobun Heat said:
If I could offer you one piece of advice, it would be this: Concern yourself less with the superficial trappings of the religions (visual symbolism, names of gods, specific scenes/places that reference a religion) and ask yourself, what are the fundamental tenets of these religions and how might they be expressed in games that have no overt references to religion?
Click to expand...

That was the idea... except that Shinto doesn't necessarily have any tenets to speak of. I guess Buddhist philosophy in game design would be the natural evolution of my question.

Ronabo said:
IIRC there was another game where you did some famous pilgrimage walk that a monk did many years ago. IIRC the limited edition of the game came with a walking stick GC controller and a pedometer. Or maybe this is the same game.
Click to expand...

The 88-temple walk? Huh.

And I guess I could see Shadow of the Colossus dealing with Shinto and Buddhism. Destroying nature, the past, entering sacred places and de-purifying them. Yeah, I can see that.
 
ivysaur12 said:
That was the idea... except that Shinto doesn't necessarily have any tenets to speak of. I guess Buddhist philosophy in game design would be the natural evolution of my question.
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how would it not have any tenets and still be distinguishable as "Shinto Buddhism." I don't know a whole lot about it, but reverence for the divine presence in nature is something that approaches a tenet. and its a type of buddhism, which definitely has tenets.
 
Mamesj said:
though maybe what you're actually doing in SotC is the opposite? like GTA but instead of destroying society, you're destroying some of the ideas behind shinto-buddhism? :lol
Click to expand...

I think both SoTC and Shintoism are about absolute grey morality.
 
Mamesj said:
how would it not have any tenets and still be distinguishable as "Shinto Buddhism." I don't know a whole lot about it, but reverence for the divine presence in nature is something that approaches a tenet. and its a type of buddhism, which definitely has tenets.
Click to expand...

Shinto is not part of Buddhism. Shinto is the native "religion" of Japan, if you can call it that. The mystery of nature and sacred space is really all that it has. There is no founder, no central books, no devotion... most people in Japan are "Shinto" just because it is part of their culture and they practice it, not necessarily because they actually believe in the kami. Shinto would not be here today if it wasn't for Buddhism to provide an actual philosophy.

genjiZERO said:
I think both SoTC and Shintoism are about absolute grey morality.
Click to expand...

Eh. Shinto doesn't have morals, really. There is the mixture of the profane and sacred, but that's not really a moral.
 
ivysaur12 said:
Shinto is not part of Buddhism. Shinto is the native "religion" of Japan, if you can call it that. The mystery of nature and sacred space is really all that it has. There is no founder, no central books, no devotion... most people in Japan are "Shinto" just because it is part of their culture and they practice it, not necessarily because they actually believe in the kami. Shinto would not be here today if it wasn't for Buddhism to provide an actual philosophy.



Eh. Shinto doesn't have morals, really.
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I agree Shintoism is more than just kami no michi. If you practice Japanese culture then you are practicing Shintoism. I disagree that it doesn't have morals thought. In modern times it has become rather environmental. And if you read the Nihongi or Nihon Shoki there are seemingly over messages about the nature of the Gods, earth and humans.

edit: I think that the "morals" of Shintoism is that morality is necessarily grey. This is different from the morals of Buddhism which says that there are no morals
 
whoops, just read the wiki and didn't realize shinto and buddhism were syncretic. I never picked that up in the few eastern religion courses I took (which mentioned shinto in passing.) my bad!
 
ivysaur12 said:
The mystery of nature and sacred space is really all that it has.
Click to expand...
For a couple thousand years now, people in Japan have believed in the divinity of nature, the "gods in all things," and this is from where so much of the country's culture is derived -- it's not so easy to dismiss it. Read this.
 
Kobun Heat said:
For a couple thousand years now, people in Japan have believed in the divinity of nature, the "gods in all things," and this is from where so much of the country's culture is derived -- it's not so easy to dismiss it. Read this.
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that looks like a great book. I'll pick up when I save a bit more!

I bought this one a few weeks ago (I only paid 15$ for it!). Skimming through it it seems pretty good.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001YWWRMC/?tag=neogaf0e-20
 
Kobun Heat said:
For a couple thousand years now, people in Japan have believed in the divinity of nature, the "gods in all things," and this is from where so much of the country's culture is derived -- it's not so easy to dismiss it. Read this.
Click to expand...

I'm not dismissing it, the point that I was trying to make was that it doesn't necessarily have the tenets that one would expect from a Western's perception of religion (which I should have elaborated on). To even define it as a religion is hard enough, it's culture more than anything else. Do people go to the shrine and bow because they believe in the kami enshrined there? They probably don't even know what kami is enshrined there, but they do it out of practice and respect. For most westerners, they wouldn't even view this as a religion. So I guess the sacred aspect of nature would be the "morals" of Shinto, though it is less of a way to get to a heavenly area then it is to respect the kami so they can help.

Now, in terms of game design, Shadow of the Colossus is probably a really good example of the sanctity of nature and sacred space. But I can't necessarily think of any other games off the top of my head that are necessarily Shinto or Buddhist in their game design rather than overt examples like Okami. This is my current issue.
 
ivysaur12 said:
I'm not dismissing it, the point that I was trying to make was that it doesn't necessarily have the tenets that one would expect from a Western's perception of religion (which I should have elaborated on). To even define it as a religion is hard enough, it's culture more than anything else. Do people go to the shrine and bow because they believe in the kami enshrined there? They probably don't even know what kami is enshrined there, but they do it out of practice and respect. For most westerners, they wouldn't even view this as a religion. So I guess the sacred aspect of nature would be the "morals" of Shinto, though it is less of a way to get to a heavenly area then it is to respect the kami so they can help.

Now, in terms of game design, Shadow of the Colossus is probably a really good example of the sanctity of nature and sacred space. But I can't necessarily think of any other games off the top of my head that are necessarily Shinto or Buddhist in their game design rather than overt examples like Okami. This is my current issue.
Click to expand...

I think you should try to view it from the perspective of Shintoism or Japanese culture and not from a Western cultural perspective.

Games that seemed rather Shinto (or about Japanese culture) to me: SoTC, FF10, FF7, Katamari Damacy, Zelda TP, (I'll try to think of some more)

Buddhist: Rez, Wii Fit

I think the question you should ask yourself is, "If I play a game can I tell it's Japanese just by experiencing it? If so then why is that?"
 
ivysaur12 said:
I'm not dismissing it, the point that I was trying to make was that it doesn't necessarily have the tenets that one would expect from a Western's perception of religion (which I should have elaborated on). To even define it as a religion is hard enough, it's culture more than anything else. Do people go to the shrine and bow because they believe in the kami enshrined there? They probably don't even know what kami is enshrined there, but they do it out of practice and respect. For most westerners, they wouldn't even view this as a religion. So I guess the sacred aspect of nature would be the "morals" of Shinto, though it is less of a way to get to a heavenly area then it is to respect the kami so they can help.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I've had a fair number of Shinto-related conversations over dinner in Japan resulting from the "ita daki masu" thing. The reverence for life and the power of nature in that phrase seemed religious, but in a slippery, hard to define way, even though to many Japanese, it's so common it's more like a "let's eat" kind of thing.
 
genjiZERO said:
I think you should try to view it from the perspective of Shintoism or Japanese culture and not from a Western cultural perspective.

Games that seemed rather Shinto (or about Japanese culture) to me: SoTC, FF10, FF7, Katamari Damacy, Zelda TP, (I'll try to think of some more)

Buddhist: Rez, Wii Fit

I think the question you should ask yourself is, "If I play a game can I tell it's Japanese just by experiencing it? If so then why is that?"
Click to expand...

Ambiguously gendered characters and ellipses, of course
kidding.
But that is a really good question. Take away the art style, how would you know a game is Japanese? I will ponder this.
 
vireland said:
Yeah, I've had a fair number of Shinto-related conversations over dinner in Japan resulting from the "ita daki masu" thing. The reverence for life and the power of nature in that phrase seemed religious, but in a slippery, hard to define way, even though to many Japanese, it's so common it's more like a "let's eat" kind of thing.
Click to expand...
To be fair, "God is great, God is good, let us thank him for this food." is also pretty much devoid of any meaning.
 
The Fatal Frame series, especially Fatal Frame 2: Crimson Butterfly, use Shintoism as the basis of the plot and some of its gameplay.

The Siren games are also worth a look but it's more of a mix of Christianity, Buddhism, and Shintoism.
 
Johann said:
The Siren games are also worth a look but it's more of a mix of Christianity, Buddhism, and Shintoism.
Click to expand...

Care to elaborate? Syncretism is really important in Japanese religions so this might exactly what I'm looking for.
 
Greedism? Enslavism of Animals to fight for you? What kind of religion are you suggesting for Pokemon?

Back on topic, Japanese RPGs are chockfull of a wild mix of everything. Often the Christian god, also toss in some Shinto Kami, animism often comes in a handy package with that, a dash of Confucianist honour and loyalty and season with some light wisdom from various Buddhist schools. Finished is your typical JRPG dialogue, sounds very mystic and spiritual, but mostly lacks understanding it's influences.

When I wasn't aware of that, I LOVED JRPG dialogue. Nowadays I wished the characters would be more down to earth and think about the stuff they say. Still, if you look for something that basically draws from all sources, take a look at nearly all JRPGs. It's a wild world.
 
ivysaur12 said:
But I can't necessarily think of any other games off the top of my head that are necessarily Shinto or Buddhist in their game design rather than overt examples like Okami. This is my current issue.
Click to expand...
So again, I'd recommend doing some reading on animism, particularly in terms of how that outlook on the world has shaped other elements of Japanese culture (haiku, ukiyo-e, manga) and try to see if there are any parallels to games.

Writing about overt references to religion is one thing, but that's not really understanding how systems of thought like Shintoism or Buddhism influence a culture.
 
Kobun Heat said:
So again, I'd recommend doing some reading on animism, particularly in terms of how that outlook on the world has shaped other elements of Japanese culture (haiku, ukiyo-e, manga) and try to see if there are any parallels to games.

Writing about overt references to religion is one thing, but that's not really understanding how systems of thought like Shintoism or Buddhism influence a culture.
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Good idea.

I started to write a bit on how Japanese game the focus is less on the player but more on the player taking part in the story set out by the game designer. In many Western games, you make choices, but in Japanese games, the choices are made for you (most of the time). This seemed related to how Japanese culture is not about you, but about the community and relationships with others (a direct reference to Confucianism).
 
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