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[Dre_G_Writer]

Even if they have end game content. They aren't going to give it for free with the base game.

You will be buying dlc.

"Thanks for the DLC ideas"

Yup. My thoughts exactly. I rented the game on PS4, completed the story, and will be picking up the ultimate edition with all the dlc included next year.

 

[bonchooski]

I just want them not require that I play through the story missions to unlock all the planets when I start a new character.

 

[eoa-swam]

All part of the plan.

I remember them having an interview about the weapon rolls before launch and how Luke Smith said the team didn't know how to make getting multiple weapons fun. Hopefully they figure it out, because that is a big problem for the hardcore.

No idea why they didn't keep the random rolls, at least it makes each duplicate drop interesting. Now it's just a chore of instantly deleting them over and over and over.

 

[ChubbleDucks]

I thought VoG had not aged well after playing it again when the challenges came around.
Surprisingly I had A TON of fun with Crota.

Right now I´d rank them like this:

1. WotM
2. Leviatan
3. Crota
4. VoG
5. Oryx

Note that the range is not good to bad, but fantastic to good.

It's good seeing other peoples preferences.

I didn't get round to doing WotM (got LL400 but didnt do raid) but from what i watched it did appear to be moving away from the standard boss encounters that the previous 3 had.
I enjoy doing Leviathan but personally wouldn't put it that high up. The round robin/tic tac toe/stealth elements are too far from what i enjoyed from Vog and Oryx.
I know those elements were part of those raids in certain ways but they were sections inbetween the large boss battles (totems for example in Kings Fall was a round robin but before a boss fight)

 

[2real4tv]

D1 year 3 was a near perfect game dont undrrstand why they would blow the game up and rebuild as if it was a failure.

I blame investors aka activision.

 

[Strakt]

At this point, they should do everyone a favor, give the Destiny IP to Blizzard and close down

Because frankly they're manchildren who have short term memories and can't learn anything even if their fucking miserable lives depended on it

Haha uses the word manchildren and makes a post like this. So mad!

 

[GlamFM]

D1 year 3 was a near perfect game dont undrrstand why they would blow the game up and rebuild as if it was a failure.

I blame investors aka activision.

It was also kind of a frankenstein game at this point. I get why they would want a clean foundation to build upon.

 

[Gator86]

The mod system is straight up garbage in its current iteration though.

It's completely, 100% pointless until you get the +5 mods. It's the most marginal customization imaginable and feels like something they stuffed in a week before the game shipped.

 

[2real4tv]

It was also kind of a frankenstein game at this point. I get why they would want a clean foundation to build upon.

I disagree. Its more of a frankenstein now.

 

[Gator86]

At this point, they should do everyone a favor, give the Destiny IP to Blizzard and close down

Because frankly they're manchildren who have short term memories and can't learn anything even if their fucking miserable lives depended on it

While this post is pretty abrasive and unnecessarily personal, I do wonder what Destiny would look like if helmed by a better developer. I'd love to see the shooting and base gameplay handed over to the Diablo team to see what they put together. Obviously not a thing that would ever happen, but hey, why not wonder?

 

[CookTrain]

It's completely, 100% pointless until you get the +5 mods. It's the most marginal customization imaginable and feels like something they stuffed in a week before the game shipped.

And it has such potential as well. They could put all manner of insane mods in. Laser bullets, heat vision scope, fire all bullets at once, homing shots. Really just go to town with possibilities and give them Isaac style synergies.

That would just be superb, emergent gameplay.

 

[gfdoom]

Some streamers will make reasonable requests, and some won't. The real trap is in trying to reconcile the direction they want to take with the game with the rationale hardcore players use to justify their continued playing. Everything Bungie has done up to this point with Destiny 2 is to simplify the experience to better control it, and limit problems they have had in the past with Destiny 1.

Fixed rolls on weapons is a solution to a problem Destiny 1 had. I can only attribute the demands from players who wan't this particular thing back to selective memory and revisionism. God rolls were not cool in Destiny whether you had one or not. I don't look back upon my grind for a God roll Eyasluna as a fun time. It was fucking painful. Did it keep me playing the game? Sure. But if they had *any* better reason to play, I would have much sooner attached myself to that.

There are a million ways Bungie can rework and add to the end game without reverting to essentially Destiny 1. If they *do* go back to the way so much of Destiny 1 works, we will all be sitting here essentially saying they've learned nothing. The reason so many hardcore players' ideas of how to "fix" D2's endgame is by bringing up the ways in which D1 did things is because they have effectively 0 creative output of their own.

If people want something to chase, give them something to chase. Doesn't have to be godrolls. How about random exotic mods that drop in strike chests? Mods that drop in PvP. Better yet, how about giving people something they can spend their (at this point) thousands of legendary marks? Let us buy skins with them. Let us purchase from our favorite vendor weapons we are missing from our collection for the cost of 400 of these things. That's grind. I'll give you 100 EDZ tokens if you can offer me something for those tokens worth getting. Make things expensive, make them take time to get, but don't use shitty RNG systems that we all complained about in D1 to hide the fact that you don't know what you're doing.

Got 10 Better Devils? How about breaking them all down into a "Better Devils +1" that has marginally better stats than the regular Better Devils? Or maybe that just gives you a super custom skin, or emblem.

RNG systems are bad but necessary in a loot game. The token system is designed to alleviate the pain of suffering of it all. There's a clear direction Bungie is attempting to take here, but we should be pushing them forward, not trying to take them where we've already been. Any streamers that are pushing for random rolls I just have to vehemently disagree with. Last thing we need is to be back where we started, cursing people who have the Luck in the Chamber, or Rangefinder equivalents that even if we set out to earn ourselves, we just have to pray to RNG gods to get.

This!!! All of this!!! These are some great suggestions that also might not be hard for them to implement.

 

[MrS]

I want more raids like King's Fall, which is to say raids that actually feel like raids and take your fireteam on a journey. Leviathan is Crota-level and whoever thought it'd be a good idea to have 4 "encounters" in the Castellum is misinformed. Baths is laughably bad too. Endgame and token systems clearly need a rethink too as they're sucking the enjoyment out of the game. IB has been fun and Prestige NF is the best content in the game. I'd like to see random rolls return as it's nice to have something to chase.

 

[Gator86]

And it has such potential as well. They could put all manner of insane mods in. Laser bullets, heat vision scope, fire all bullets at once, homing shots. Really just go to town with possibilities and give them Isaac style synergies.

That would just be superb, emergent gameplay.

Absolutely, it would be so good! The problem is Bungie seems to hate emergent gameplay. They want you to play things the way they want and will change whatever you're doing if you step outside that box.

Also, the design of D2 is purposely focused on removing customization and emergent gameplay in the sake of balance. Bungie couldn't, and knows it couldn't, balance something like the awesome thing you, and others, have suggested. They're just not capable of doing it. Complicating things even more is their desperate need for balance everything for both modes at the same time - the most fundamental issue in the franchise.

 

[Seth Enosh]

I want more raids like King's Fall, which is to say raids that actually feel like raids and take your fireteam on a journey. Leviathan is Crota-level and whoever thought it'd be a good idea to have 4 "encounters" in the Castellum is misinformed. Baths is laughably bad too. Endgame and token systems clearly need a rethink too as they're sucking the enjoyment out of the game. IB has been fun and Prestige NF is the best content in the game. I'd like to see random rolls return as it's nice to have something to chase.

The castellum

Spoiler

encounters are all skippable and the optimal route for speed runs skips them

. Personally I like the baths although it is just a riff on a previous Kings Fall encounter.

 

[CookTrain]

Absolutely, it would be so good! The problem is Bungie seems to hate emergent gameplay. They want you to play things the way they want and will change whatever you're doing if you step outside that box.

That's a really big downer to read about the makers of the Halo sandbox. I wonder what changed.

 

[RowdyReverb]

Of course the players hardcore enough to post to Bungie’s forums will be asking for the game to be better suited to the hardcore audience. I have time to play the game maybe 5-6 hours a week and I have been pretty satisfied with my progression.
It’s fine if they want to add more things for these folks to do, but I’m afraid it will come in the form of severely stunting your progression through the later levels, which will suck for more average players like myself. I just got to 280 on my single character and that took plenty of time. I doubt I’ll ever get to the end of the endgame

 

[cilonen]

Of course the players hardcore enough to post to Bungie’s forums will be asking for the game to be better suited to the hardcore audience. I have time to play the game maybe 5-6 hours a week and I have been pretty satisfied with my progression.
It’s fine if they want to add more things for these folks to do, but I’m afraid it will come in the form of severely stunting your progression through the later levels, which will suck for more average players like myself. I just got to 280 on my single character and that took plenty of time. I doubt I’ll ever get to the end of the endgame

You're there to be brutally honest. You can make the numbers go slightly higher but it doesn't make any difference to gameplay.

 

[MrS]

The castellum

Spoiler

encounters are all skippable and the optimal route for speed runs skips them

. Personally I like the baths although it is just a riff on a previous Kings Fall encounter.

Yeah, I'm aware they are which sort of proves my point about how meaningless they are as encounters. The raid only takes 40 minutes with a good team if you skip the Castellum. That's terrible for 'premium content' imho. KF has considerably more bang for your buck.

 

[RowdyReverb]

You're there to be brutally honest. You can make the numbers go slightly higher but it doesn't make any difference to gameplay.

Maybe so, but there’s still lots of content in the game I’m working through. I’m going through the side missions and adventures now, doing the weekly Nightfall, and I haven’t even seen the Raid yet. I’ve got engrams that I’m doing quests to unlock, and I’m still improving my character just like I’ve been doing since hitting 200

 

[Gator86]

That's a really big downer to read about the makers of the Halo sandbox. I wonder what changed.

Also, I thought about your idea some more. Someone would put the fire all bullets at once mod into the highest capacity auto rifle weapon then make a video instant-killing a bunch of people in crucible. Bungie would then panic and reduce the magazine size of all auto rifles by half, thus solving the problem in the most ham-handed way and breaking a ton of other stuff in the process.

Player creativity is the bane of their existence and most of D2 is designed to suppress it.

 

[CookTrain]

Also, I thought about your idea some more. Someone would put the fire all bullets at once mod into the highest capacity auto rifle weapon then make a video instant-killing a bunch of people in crucible. Bungie would then panic and reduce the magazine size of all auto rifles by half, thus solving the problem in the most ham-handed way and breaking a ton of other stuff in the process.

Player creativity is the bane of their existence and most of D2 is designed to suppress it.

You're probably right. But it'd be nice if they put enough assortment of mods in, I mean really bonkers stuff, that there would always be a counter in some insane way or another. 27th dimensional rock paper scissors

 

[Ryuuga]

I'll start giving feedback once they've settled on what they want Destiny to be. It'd be easy to predict another systemic overhaul in the not too distant future. Any feedback they get now is only undoing issues they created themselves.

 

[Masonica33]

Honestly, I have very little issue with D2's end game. But, I think there could be a middle ground between what they have now, and what they had going in D1, which was more of a long term loot/mats grind.

I never got heavy into D1's grind, and I think D2 does a far better job of keeping you hooked by giving you the constant dopamine hit with the endless flood of engrams.
The problem comes once you hit 265-270 and 95% of engrams you get are suddenly useless. Weekly milestones are all well and good, but you can grind through those an evening or two.

It would be really nice if they added some grinds that took a lot longer and rewarded you with the most high fashion items and shaders in the game. Or if they generally varied the amount of time you have to grind for certain rewards.

So let's take uh.. Gunsmith engrams for example. You can get one of those every fucking half hour. I realise that's because you end up dismantling all your loot from ALL your engrams, but bear with me, just for example's sake. So, since gunsmith engrams are easy to get, I don't have an issue with them no longer giving me anything useful past a certain point.

Contrast that with say.. Crucible or Strike engrams. They take a fair bit longer to get. That's fine, but give me a set that I can't get anywhere else for my trouble, and maybe use how long it takes to get an engram for that vendor as a reference point for the power level of the engram.


Anyway, granted, I'm not as hardcore a Destiny player as a lot of people, but I found the game so disgustingly, ruthlessly compelling and addictive for the first... Hm, 2 weeks, that it's basically all I did with my life. And then it became all about weekly milestones. Now I've basically stopped playing altogether. I think what could rope back in is some grinds that would take longer. Give me something to WORK towards now that I've exhausted the easy, quick loot grind.

Either way, I think they've taken very positive steps forward with Destiny 2 in many regards.

 

[Gator86]

You're probably right. But it'd be nice if they put enough assortment of mods in, I mean really bonkers stuff, that there would always be a counter in some insane way or another. 27th dimensional rock paper scissors

Or if they split PvE and PvP, two things they can barely balance individually, much less together. It will forever be an albatross on the franchise.

 

[Snkfanatic]

At this point, they should do everyone a favor, give the Destiny IP to Blizzard and close down

Because frankly they're manchildren who have short term memories and can't learn anything even if their fucking miserable lives depended on it

lol

Holy hell this sums up the stupid entitled shit gamers can say pretty well. I hope this is satire. I really do.

 

[AllIsOneIsNone]

Here's a back of the napkin idea I've talked about with friends.

Separate PVE and PVP loot pools. You can't take one to the other. It allows them to simply balance the PVP weapons specifically and gives them the ability to create some real power fantasy nonsense for PVE.

Shaxx + the gun manufacturers become PVP exclusive vendors. Each get armor and weapons. Static perks. The narrative is the Crucible is a training ground, why not lean on that narrative reason to separate the loot tables? Hakke, Omolon, Suros would be the obvious choices to pull for the vendors. I don't know how they handle balancing in the game. However, my idiot reasoning sees this as a separate spreadsheet/database to move sliders and values around on so they don't nerf PVE weapons in the process.

Now you get true exotics in the PVE arena, total power fantasy weapons that would kill the balance in Crucible. Dead Orbit, New Monarchy, and Future War Cult continue to be the vendors for PVE. Outbreak Prime should have been like the Bullseye in Resistance; tag, shoot, and all bullets track to target. You can get crazy with perks and armor. It might even be.. fun.

I also agree with the set loadout being another solution like Souldestroyer suggested.

I think this is a good idea.

I've supported Bungie's idea to do what they've been doing because I like Multiplayer PvP games and I love the idea of seamless loot carry between modes, but at this point I give up; Bungie just cannot make it work.

I know people say they don't like random rolls, but I believe it's absolutely necessary for them to bring it back unless they literally triple their loot output or make loot way more unique with more properties that open up the possibility of real ability synergy along with an actual passive skill tree.

People that do not like random properties, please respond: Do you understand how random rolls work in games like Path of Exile where there is a pool of affixes (properties) that can roll? You'll still have better and worse of the same item, sure, but having the roll come from a specified and well thought out pool of properties designed with a weapon type in mind will limit the shittiness as well as super OP stuff. I can't comprehend why people are saying rolls are a bad idea when all of the other best loot games do it. You keep the exotics the same, that's why they're exotics. They also need to add sets, not sure why that hasn't happened yet.

When it comes down to it though, it's not just not having random rolls that is killing the loot grind, it's that theres only one real gameplay changing property per weapon in congruence with the fact that non weapon Gear has absolutely nothing to offer but mods which do nothing notable or gameplay-changing. Synergy needs to enter Bungie's vocabulary. Whether it's by adding a passive skill tree or doing any of the other stuff I've mentioned, combinations of properties need to have interesting and clear effects on the gameplay. I want to feel like a mad scientist conjuring up crazy ideas and finding the loot to realize it. Exotics give you a taste of that but it's not enough.

 

[CookTrain]

Or if they split PvE and PvP, two things they can barely balance individually, much less together. It will forever be an albatross on the franchise.

The easiest way forward, at least in the short term, would be to just disable mods in PvP. That way you have a fixed collection of weapons to balance to your hearts content and the Crucible types have the precision they want while I'm taking down Cabal with explosive doves.

 

[Kill3r7]

Maybe so, but there’s still lots of content in the game I’m working through. I’m going through the side missions and adventures now, doing the weekly Nightfall, and I haven’t even seen the Raid yet. I’ve got engrams that I’m doing quests to unlock, and I’m still improving my character just like I’ve been doing since hitting 200

Agreed. Although to be fair, the majority of the vocal crowd have been sitting at 300+ since week one, after rushing to get their characters raid ready. For these folks, myself included, there is less of a carrot to chase. That said, I have even less time today to play Destiny than I did 3 years ago. The shooting mechanics and the gameplay are still great and playing with friends is always what makes it a fantastic experience. Bungie has "flattened" the PVE experience and ruined crucible. The 4 v 4 is just a bad idea for a game that has you spend the bulk of your time playing in groups of 3 or 6.

 

[sneaky77]

Maybe so, but there’s still lots of content in the game I’m working through. I’m going through the side missions and adventures now, doing the weekly Nightfall, and I haven’t even seen the Raid yet. I’ve got engrams that I’m doing quests to unlock, and I’m still improving my character just like I’ve been doing since hitting 200

I agree with this point of view. If you have poured 100's of hrs into this game in a month, then yes, you're probably running out of stuff.. but thats ok. I think thats good value for the money. I find D2 better than D1 in basically every level in terms of able to progress and level and is also keeping me more engaged coming back once or twice a week, do a few milestones, clear and adventure or two and keep going that way.

 

[alt27]

I thought VoG had not aged well after playing it again when the challenges came around.
Surprisingly I had A TON of fun with Crota.

Right now I´d rank them like this:

1. WotM
2. Leviatan
3. Crota
4. VoG
5. Oryx

Note that the range is not good to bad, but fantastic to good.

1. WOTM
2. VOG
3. Crota
4. Oryx
.
.
.
.5 Leviathian

Leviathian is not a good raid at all imo. Just seems like all the encounters are a big rehash to me of the older raids. It also looks like a palace out of persona 5, which is not a good thing for a destiny raid

 

[GlamFM]

Leviathian is not a good raid at all imo. Just seems like all the encounters are a big rehash to me of the older raids. It also looks like a palace out of persona 5, which is not a good thing for a destiny raid

Really?

I find the encounters pretty fresh. Especially the gauntlet is entirely different from anything we´ve seen before.

I don´t understand the Persona reference, but this stuff is highly subjective anyway.

Visually I absolutely love the raid - especially when you also take the underbelly into account.

 

[The ๖ۜBronx]

Raid order for me:

• VoG
• Leviathan
• Wrath of the Machine
• King's Fall
• Crota

Yup. My thoughts exactly. I rented the game on PS4, completed the story, and will be picking up the ultimate edition with all the dlc included next year.

You mean in three years? Which would be a bad idea, and you should expect a worse time as a result. For all the issues with the game there's no doubt at all that playing Destiny after-the-fact is a massively diminished experience.

 

[spectator]

I just want to know when the HDR update will hit.

 

[Deku Tree]

I hope they add an end-game and reasons to level past 280. I don't mind how that manifests but it really needs to happen.

Prestige Nightfall, Trials, and Prestige Raid are the only reasons currently in the game.

 

[GlamFM]

Prestige Nightfall, Trials, and Prestige Raid are the only reasons currently in the game.

Wait? I thought level advantages were disabled in Trials?

Or was that only the first week?

 

[EL CUCO]

You can put Leviathon in the very bottom of the Raid list...and bury it there. I would've preferred a rehashed VOG. The enitre thing feels like a glorified Prison of Elders to me, minus the good boss fight.

I honestly dont have a problem with the Callus fight itself, but its the ONLY boss fight in the activity and it ticks all the predictable Destiny Raid boss mechanic boxes.

 

[Kill3r7]

Since everyone is doing it.

Raid power rankings, I did a blind run of VoG, Crota and Leviathan.

1. VoG
2. Oryx
3. Leviathan
4. WoM
5. Crota

Leviathan is not a bad raid but it feels like one giant puzzle before you face a formidable boss.

 

[MrS]

1. KF
2. VOG
3. WOTM
4. Leviathan
5. Crota

 

[Irishonion]

Visually I absolutely love the raid - especially when you also take the underbelly into account.

Underbelly is actually one of my favorite parts.

 

[shimon]

D1 year 3 was a near perfect game dont undrrstand why they would blow the game up and rebuild as if it was a failure.

I blame investors aka activision.

Apparently they like rebuilding. Or they have other reasons for creating shitty experiences that later they can "fix".

 

[GhaleonEB]

I disagree. Its more of a frankenstein now.

I took a new character through the campaign of Destiny 1 after every expansion. This is utter nonsense.

The seams of the various expansions and systems grafted together were everywhere. You could do The Taken King missions before The Dark Below, and have no idea who Crota was and why you kept getting told you killed his son. You'll get year 1 rewards when you are way over the power level to use them during the House of Wolves campaign. The Ghost is suddenly mute for the entirely of The Dark Below and House of Wolves campaigns. Kayde and the Ghost suddenly gain a personality when The Taken King starts. Large numbers of the original campaign just pop up unannounced, devoid of context, and without any connection to any other mission. The mission quality between the vanilla game and RoI changes dramatically. Some gear can't be infused at all, while some can be infused up to a certain level (year 1). There are a hajillion currencies that are semi-fungible with swaps across different vendors. Items are offloaded into kiosks and collections scattered around the tower in random locations. You gotta trek across three social spaces concurrently to gather up bounties and rewards.

Destiny 2 is very tightly integrated with seamless transitions between spaces and activities, a butter smooth power curve through 265 and a consistent (in unexciting) approach to weapon and gear progression/infusion. The campaign has an actual story and a beginning, middle and end, with Adventures all building out lore, much of which ties directly into the campaign. Superfluous systems and currencies are streamlined or removed, collections are integrated into the vault, and you can do one stop shopping in the Tower rather than hopping across three social spaces for the endgame.

There are definitely problems with what we have now, but calling it more of a frankenstein than the first doesn't make sense.

 

[ZeoVGM]

I have yet to use a single shader. The only colors I've liked are ones for which I only have 3, so I don't want to use them. And I'm still cycling through gear, so I don't wan to waste it. So I'm just paralyzed into collecting them while I look like a vaguely stylish mismatched trashcan. It's a horrid system.

At any rate, more than the endgame, the weapon load out system and lack of horizontal progression has hampered my desire to keep chasing loot.

Pretty much the same here. I've used a few but only if I had a large stack.

But now I've reached an annoying point where my shader stock is full. So I'm deleting some common/rare ones or moving them to the vault. ...But then I get them again from a chest and run into inventory issues again.

As for the endgame, it basically doesn't exist for me. No Heroic strikes, and I *hate* what they did to the Nightfall, which used to be one of my favorite activities. I'm never running one again so long as the time limitation and accumulation systems exist.

The time limit idea made absolutely no sense. I mean, as a random modifier every few weeks? Sure. But weekly? Hell no. That's not fun. Just let me and my friends play a hard strike but at our own pace.

My "endgame" consists of flashpoints and re-running a mission now and then. (I'd actually play more campaign missions, but they're missing from the map for some inexplicable reason.)

They need to change how missions are replayed:

- Add the normal difficulty ones to the map once you beat the campaign. Just select it from the map to begin.

- Take away the idea of "Meditations" from Ikora and add a Heroic Story Playlist that you can select from the director. This would have an optional matchmaking feature that you can toggle on or off before hitting the 'Launch' button (because it's more fun to play the story with people, Bungie, even randoms). And through this, you would get tokens for Ikora.

 

[ZeoVGM]

Leviathian is not a good raid at all imo. Just seems like all the encounters are a big rehash to me of the older raids. It also looks like a palace out of persona 5, which is not a good thing for a destiny raid

I thought if there was anything people could agree on it was that the Raid is brilliant visually. It's beautiful and one of the most unique settings in Destiny so far.

 

[murdochmystery]

So here's something I found interesting given the recent negative comments about the game.

So apparently the Destiny 2 team was composed of ~1000 people.

Here's a picture of the WoW dev team, being about ~250 people. https://twitter.com/englishguy/statu...34191046283264

While I don't want to compare apples to oranges too much but it simply blows my mind that 1000 people can make such a shallow game (what did these people do? Art/assets? Systems?) compared to what we are seeing in WoW legion.

While there is obviously a difference between a FPS and an established MMORPG like WoW, it seems like some things are comparable. Wonder if it's a case of mismanagement, engine issues (again), a case of too many cooks in the kitchen.

Just wanted to hear people's thoughts on this.

 

[Nydius]

I hope they're not listening to the people that want random rolls back, or want less frequent loot, or want to remove clan rewards.

If any of that happens, I'm out.

I could live without random rolls but if they bring it back I'd prefer they streamline the amount of possible options available so the god roll grind isn't so tedious.

Exotic engram drops DO need to be lessened. The drop rate now is MUCH higher than it ever was under the Three of Coins system back in D1 and that is a contributing factor to making exotic gear feel less interesting (the other factor is the watering down of exotic perks, Peacekeepers as an example: I can... passively reload SMGs while wearing this! WOOO, I guess?).

Clan rewards NEED to go. It was a dumbass idea to begin with and anyone who played WoW back when Blizzard put in guild rewards saw this coming a mile away. Back when Blizzard put it in WoW, it led to mega guilds, people wouldn't consider joining guilds unless they were max level or had specific rewards, or only wanted guilds with specific guild wide achievements unlocked for specific reward items. That's already happening with D2 and a quick glance at the official D2 Clan Recruitment illustrates this perfectly: People looking for clans but only wanting higher leveled clans with 3/4 or 4/4 weekly engram completions and clan recruitment posts highlighting their level and weekly rewards rather than their goals or activity types.

It's a silly idea to give people rewards for an activity they might not even play that week and inevitably turns into a small group of clanmates carrying everyone else for free loot. Erstwhile, the tiered clan perks puts smaller, newer clans at a significant disadvantage to recruiting new players who now expect to be rewarded for clan participation. Blizzard realized this system was bad and opted to gut it entirely a couple years after initially putting it in. Bungie will eventually come to the same conclusion.

Edit: I'll join in on the raid power rankings for the hell of it:
1. KF (E2: Seems I'm in the minority here, but I really enjoyed all of the encounters in KF except for the hive ship jumping puzzle.)
2. WOTM
3. VOG
4. Crota
5. Leviathan

 

[Z3M0G]

D1 year 3 was a near perfect game dont undrrstand why they would blow the game up and rebuild as if it was a failure.

I blame investors aka activision.

I legit want to know if there has at all been a wave of players returning to D1 after peaking in D2... for the PVP I wouldn't be surprised, but mainly for the PVE...

Edit: Datto: "Destiny 2: Do We Need MORE Guns? Should Random Rolls Return?"

 

[Niceguydan8]

So here's something I found interesting given the recent negative comments about the game.

So apparently the Destiny 2 team was composed of ~1000 people.

Here's a picture of the WoW dev team, being about ~250 people. https://twitter.com/englishguy/statu...34191046283264

While I don't want to compare apples to oranges too much but it simply blows my mind that 1000 people can make such a shallow game (what did these people do? Art/assets? Systems?) compared to what we are seeing in WoW legion.

While there is obviously a difference between a FPS and an established MMORPG like WoW, it seems like some things are comparable. Wonder if it's a case of mismanagement, engine issues (again), a case of too many cooks in the kitchen.

Just wanted to hear people's thoughts on this.

I think they set out to do different things. They were never going to make a game like WoW, so it would make sense that they didn't focus on it.

I think they put out a high quality product overall, I just think it's not a great RPG when it comes to systems (Most of the systems are woefully shallow in my opinion) despite having very solid gunplay.

The disappointment for me comes with them throwing away a lot of the progress they made in managing the grind as the original game aged. Destiny 1 year 3 was nowhere near vanilla Destiny when it came to unreasonable grind. There is a good middle ground there to appease veteran players while still allowing new players to progress, and instead of embracing that, it seems like they threw almost all of that out and focused solely on the shorter-term length. That's fine if they want to go that way, but I think the game presenting itself as an RPG and being so underwhelming in that regard is unfortunate.

 

[The Technomancer]

after hearing everybody talk about this game for a month i'm glad they delayed the PC version because otherwise i might have been tempted to buy it

Same, honestly. I don't say that happily :/

 

[cilonen]

I legit want to know if there has at all been a wave of players returning to D1 after peaking in D2... for the PVP I wouldn't be surprised, but mainly for the PVE...

I've had a couple of hours roaming around D1. The weapon assignments are objectively better with primary, secondary and heavy rather than kinetic, energy and power.

Sniper rifles actually are useful in D1.