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Bungie's Internal Culture Problems

VAVA Mk2

VAVA Mk2

Member
Apparently Bungie is having problems similar to Activision with their culture. Anyone else remember when the Bungie Princess was a thing?

The Battle for Bungie's Soul: Inside the Studio's Struggle for a Better Work Culture
ign.com

The Battle for Bungie's Soul: Inside the Studio's Struggle for a Better Work Culture - IGN

IGN has spoken to 26 current and former Bungie employees whose accounts of the studio's work culture span overt sexism, boys' club culture, crunch, and HR protection of abusers, as well as more complex stories of microaggressions, systemic inequalities, and more recent stories of a slow but...
ign.com ign.com
 
"Culture problems"

jennifer lawrence ok GIF
 
Yeah i need some receipts here, boys club behaviour is what mods on reeee use to ban people and microaggressions are literally an attack move in the south park rpg...

I don't trust whoever use those terms in a serious way to describe a problem.

and i don't even give 2 fucks about bungie as a developer...
 
Seems like these culture wars are going to keep popping up as companies diversify more. This is the new normal.

Writers wouldn't learn about changes to their work until after voice lines had already been recorded. When people objected, he told them they needed thicker skins.
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Imagine working on a massive project and being this entitled.

The narrative team worked 60, 70, 80, even 100 hour weeks during some expansions, frequently with no breaks in between crunch periods.
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Crunch bad. How new and exciting.

One member of leadership emailed Reddit comments about these women to other company leaders in a seeming bid to tear down the narrative team because players didn't like the story.
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Wow, customers didn't like your crappy story and leadership were made aware of that? What a shocker.

"I could go on for a long time about all the ways women have been made to stand by as the men on the team have written characters in baffling, unrecognizable ways."
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Ok?

"They have that core value that they don't tolerate assholes even if they're rockstars but they totally do...Those are the values they want to get to, but they're not enforcing them."
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Assholes in the workplace? Why I never.
 
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Fascinating to see this unfold and not surprised. The Activision stuff is bad, but lets not forget theyre not unique in this, just under the most scrutiny. Wonder when dirt around Luke Smith will come to light, or other Bungie OG's. Id be shocked if they're all bastions of morality and tolerance.
 
GymWolf said:
Yeah i need some receipts here, boys club behaviour is what mods on reeee use to ban people and microaggressions are literally an attack move in the south park rpg...

I don't trust whoever use those terms in a serious way to describe a problem.

and i don't even give 2 fucks about bungie as a developer...
Click to expand...
You cared enough to post about it? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
Poplin said:
Fascinating to see this unfold and not surprised. The Activision stuff is bad, but lets not forget theyre not unique in this, just under the most scrutiny. Wonder when dirt around Luke Smith will come to light, or other Bungie OG's. Id be shocked if they're all bastions of morality and tolerance.
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Luke was not an OG. He came on partway through Halo 3's dev and started as a community manager and then went into writing and cinematics. You think he is one of the "frat boy" types this refers to?
 
Salty Popsicle said:
Should have stayed with Microsoft. Looks like some of Activision's stench rubbed off on them while they were there.
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If you read the article, Bungie's 'mentioned' problems in the article, go all the way back to when they were with Microsoft and has to do with people who worked on the Halo games.
 
Bungie used to be so great. I was active on their forums as a young teen 15-odd years ago and it was such a tight community with tons of fan interaction.

Such a shame, the way they went.
 
Okay, read it now.

Seems like garden variety shitty workplace. I did not read anything egregious or out of the ordinary. It sucks, but seems like any sucky, hyper-competitive environment.
 
sainraja said:
If you read the article, Bungie's 'mentioned' problems in the article, go all the way back to when they were with Microsoft and has to do with people who worked on the Halo games.
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You think most gaffers read? Kekw giving too much credit bro!
 
"Many people I spoke to were familiar with a story of him throwing a chair at a window because he felt others were ruining his creative vision of the game."

thumbs-thumbs-up-kid.gif


The stuff that sounds particularly damning in the article is just wild unprofessionalism. It's not exactly cool to scream at people at work on a regular basis, to not be organized or professional when creating basic narrative for the game, or to bypass everyone and give voice actors totally different lines at the last minute and not tell anyone lol. That just sounds like a clown club.

A lot of the complaints listed though sound like total BS like you would expect. Not a terrible article though. Honestly, I don't know what some of these people expect. I definitely couldn't get away with acting like that at work, but I'm also glad I don't work with some of these people that exaggerate everything for reporters.
 
"Crunch was exacerbated by the constant need for revisions and last-minute changes, often worsened by constant conflicts over who had control of the story. Creative direction, overall, was fraught due to the pull of different groups and powers at the studio. Some of Bungie's old guard were especially precious about the vision of Destiny 1, and reluctant to change anything about the tone, characterizations, or direction of the story as the game moved into Destiny 2 and its subsequent expansions. This was especially frustrating for the team in cases where that vision had never been explicitly defined in the game or elsewhere, but only existed as ideas in the heads of people who no longer worked in narrative.

Another issue was with the development of cinematics, which were considered a prestige project. Largely written separately from the main writing team in a "star chamber," the cinematics team frequently tried to operate independently from the main narrative team, resulting in disconnects between established lore, planned quest narratives, and major story beats. The cinematic team's decisions, Hiponia and others recalled, would override decisions made by the narrative team, forcing last-minute rewrites and more crunch."

Clown club.
 
"The clashes of these different interests caused further troubles as underrepresented writers and allies on the team endeavored to make Destiny's story more inclusive and thoughtful in its portrayals. Those familiar with the writing team were aware of numerous scenarios where higher-up male narrative team members wanted to portray women in ways that were degrading, tone deaf, or casually sexist. The non-lead writers — both women and allies — would push back, fighting to tell the kinds of hopeful and empowering stories with Destiny's women that were so often told through its male characters."

Clown world.
 
"Another example of a time when the diverse members of the writing team were not listened to is in the instance of Devrim Kay, a scout players meet in the European Dead Zone location who provides missions and talks about his love of food and tea. At one point in Destiny 2's development, a member of the writing team added in a tiny piece of dialogue for Devrim referring to missing his "partner." It was a single, small line among many other lines intended to be said by both Devrim and many other characters, who would comment on similar circumstances about their relationships, thoughts, and feelings. The line passed multiple edits and checks and was put into a build of the game before someone high up at the studio noticed it and demanded it be taken out — or else they couldn't ship the game in Russia or China because of the mere implication of a gay romance."

Clown universe.
 
Punished Miku said:
a member of the writing team added in a tiny piece of dialogue for Devrim referring to missing his "partner." It was a single, small line among many other lines intended to be said by both Devrim and many other characters, who would comment on similar circumstances about their relationships, thoughts, and feelings.
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walking-dead-get-the-fuck-outta-here.gif
 
It's almost like these companies shouldn't continue to hire solely based on diversity and inclusivity cause in the end you solve nothing and spend more time having to construct mission statements and apology letters on how you'll "do better".
 
"In all of these situations, the members of the writing team who fought for change would routinely be told they were difficult to work with, not supportive enough of their leaders, or were aggressive or abrasive and needed to be better at taking criticism. These criticisms were often used as feedback when the team pushed for promotions after each new challenging release period, with several being turned down time and again.

Hiponia specifically was told she couldn't get promoted because she "wasn't good enough at the game," despite the fact that her core narrative responsibilities were unrelated to gameplay design. But when she asked to be given time at work to play and improve, even offering to tie those hours into a specific work task, her request was denied.

She also said that her own stress levels skyrocketed during her time at Bungie, increasing her need for anti-anxiety medication and therapy, and ultimately resulting in stress-related gastrointestinal issues that required surgery."

Clown multiverse.
 
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Yeah this doesn't seem even remotely close to the Activision situation. It reads more like ultra feminist cabals within the company getting pushback on their destructive shit, which is probably a rare occurrence nowadays based on most of the mundane crap we saw at last night's TGAs. It looks like these mentally ill people have their hooks in the majority of Western game studios now, and are leveraging the Activision debacle to gain even more influence. Never let a tragedy go to waste, right? Something kind of similar happened in the Cartoon Network world a while ago where some dude hugged a female at a party which started a big "hire feminists" movement. And that industry has never been the same ever since. All the buzz of the early 2010s cartoon renaissance has completely evaporated. I expect Western video games to probably follow the same path.

Oh and also, "inappropriate quips about Latin American gangs." Oh those poor fentanyl suppliers, how dare you offend them!
 
Meh.
Only read half but nothing sound remotely like the activision things. Also the source of most of the claims is "one" or "a couple" of people from a pool of 26 "current and former employees".... of a 800+ people company. I'm not saying nothing here is true, just that you can make any big company sound as good or bad as you want if you talk to a hand picked group of people that represent what must be 1 or 2% of the total number of "former and current" employees at the company.
 
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Punished Miku said:
"Another example of a time when the diverse members of the writing team were not listened to is in the instance of Devrim Kay, a scout players meet in the European Dead Zone location who provides missions and talks about his love of food and tea. At one point in Destiny 2's development, a member of the writing team added in a tiny piece of dialogue for Devrim referring to missing his "partner." It was a single, small line among many other lines intended to be said by both Devrim and many other characters, who would comment on similar circumstances about their relationships, thoughts, and feelings. The line passed multiple edits and checks and was put into a build of the game before someone high up at the studio noticed it and demanded it be taken out — or else they couldn't ship the game in Russia or China because of the mere implication of a gay romance."

Clown universe.
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So much effort over a quest giving NPCS that no one will ever give a fuck about. Clown universe indeed.
 
Wvrs said:
Bungie used to be so great. I was active on their forums as a young teen 15-odd years ago and it was such a tight community with tons of fan interaction.

Such a shame, the way they went.
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I was an exalted mythic member or something on their forums pre Destiny. Good times.
 
Punished Miku said:
"In all of these situations, the members of the writing team who fought for change would routinely be told they were difficult to work with, not supportive enough of their leaders, or were aggressive or abrasive and needed to be better at taking criticism. These criticisms were often used as feedback when the team pushed for promotions after each new challenging release period, with several being turned down time and again.

Hiponia specifically was told she couldn't get promoted because she "wasn't good enough at the game," despite the fact that her core narrative responsibilities were unrelated to gameplay design. But when she asked to be given time at work to play and improve, even offering to tie those hours into a specific work task, her request was denied.

She also said that her own stress levels skyrocketed during her time at Bungie, increasing her need for anti-anxiety medication and therapy, and ultimately resulting in stress-related gastrointestinal issues that required surgery."

Clown multiverse.
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There is a clear lack of willingness and ability to simply fire insubordinate woke mobsters, complete failure of leadership. Maybe like Blizzard they were simply doomed based on their physical location, maybe it's something in the water.
 
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Big American game developers seem to be doomed to fail thanks to all that modern woke crap. You need all your energy focused on creating quality products, not all that side nonsense. Same reason why Blizzard went to hell.
 
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I couldnt even read through all of the article. Way too many assholes over at Bungie for my liking. The way the writers were treated explains why the story sucked so much in Destiny. Last minute rewrites and cutscene animators ignoring writers is a recipe for disaster.

As someone who has worked in toxic workplaces with bosses yelling at everyone and berating their subordinates, this kinda shit simply doesnt happen anymore. At my company, glassdoor reviews and people quitting left and right pretty much sorted that out like 6-7 years ago. That kind of management has no place in today's society.
 
treemk said:
There is a clear lack of willingness and ability to simply fire insubordinate woke mobsters, complete failure of leadership. Maybe like Blizzard they were simply doomed based on their physical location, maybe it's something in the water.
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These companies have had their HR teams infiltrated with these people, so that's why you end up with these kinds of candidates because the HR people screen for them. And now you also have their worthless Diversity Equity Inclusion offices involved as well.

DEI is basically a modern-day protection racket. The mafia would be so jealous.

Coolwhhip said:
Big American game developers seem to be doomed to fail thanks to all that modern woke crap. You need all your energy focused on creating quality products, not all that side nonsense. Same reason why Blizzard went to hell.
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And of course Blizzard just doubles down on more woke DEI bullshit and hiring more of those people. So I expect them to self-destruct in one way or another at some point.
 
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I couldn't make it to the end of the article, too much Woke buzzword bingo and a conclusion that everything is CIS White mens fault, it was like a reading Resetera topic. Stop hiring with diversity and inclusion focus (But obviously don't exclude anyone on those grounds) and hire the best for the job because it's your diverse hires doing all the complaining.

Glassdoor has Bungie at 3.8 out of 5. So they can't be that bad.
 
Sounds like not an ideal place to work at, just about average. Pretty much like most jobs out there, the horror.
 
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Poplin said:
Fascinating to see this unfold and not surprised. The Activision stuff is bad, but lets not forget theyre not unique in this, just under the most scrutiny. Wonder when dirt around Luke Smith will come to light, or other Bungie OG's. Id be shocked if they're all bastions of morality and tolerance.
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Luke Smith a "Bungie OG"…

I feel old.
 
Another example of a time when the diverse members of the writing team were not listened to is in the instance of Devrim Kay, a scout players meet in the European Dead Zone location who provides missions and talks about his love of food and tea. At one point in Destiny 2's development, a member of the writing team added in a tiny piece of dialogue for Devrim referring to missing his "partner." It was a single, small line among many other lines intended to be said by both Devrim and many other characters, who would comment on similar circumstances about their relationships, thoughts, and feelings. The line passed multiple edits and checks and was put into a build of the game before someone high up at the studio noticed it and demanded it be taken out — or else they couldn't ship the game in Russia or China because of the mere implication of a gay romance.

The issue received attention across the studio when it was sent to a QA tester to fix as a "bug," causing an internal uproar. Eventually, the line was adjusted to have Devrim just talk about someone named "Marc" without any reference to who it was. This made it into the final game, and Bungie ended up being lauded for including a gay character, especially as Devrim's voice actor confirmed their relationship to media not long after, unaware of the stir it had caused within the studio. One source recalled being furious: Bungie's writers had tried to gently make their story more inclusive with Destiny's first canon gay relationship, Bungie leadership had tried to stop it, but then got to enjoy positive attention anyway.

In all of these situations, the members of the writing team who fought for change would routinely be told they were difficult to work with, not supportive enough of their leaders, or were aggressive or abrasive and needed to be better at taking criticism. These criticisms were often used as feedback when the team pushed for promotions after each new challenging release period, with several being turned down time and again.

Let me guess, you added a line to a charecter, which was not exhibiting this behavior, and you made your boss's job difficult, because you felt it was your rights to add your fantasy to the game.

This person should have been fired for tempering with the work, which he had no business in it. This is why there needs be a boundary between workers and managers. If you have been hired to do a job, do the damn job. Dont try to do the job, like you own the place.
 
kingfey said:
At one point in Destiny 2's development, a member of the writing team added in a tiny piece of dialogue for Devrim referring to missing his "partner." It was a single, small line among many other lines intended to be said by both Devrim and many other characters, who would comment on similar circumstances about their relationships, thoughts, and feelings.
Click to expand...

The diverse crew inserting themselves into media again. Making it sound like it was no big deal but leaving it in or taking it out they would have made a massive deal about it either way.
 
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