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[gamz]

The amount of planning done is incredible. The Hobbit vs LOTR is a perfect example of what years of planning can do for the quality. To film 4 films at once is incredibly ambitious.

LOTR was a complete mess of a production. Tons of re-shoots.

http://ew.com/article/2014/05/17/viggo-mortensen-lord-of-the-rings-interview/

Mortensen, who portrayed Aragorn in the trilogy, says Jackson and producers “were in a lot of trouble” before the first film proved to be a massive hit with both critics and moviegoers. “Officially, [Jackson] could say that he was finished in December 2000 — he’d shot all three films in the trilogy — but really the second and third ones were a mess,” Mortensen says. “It was very sloppy — it just wasn’t done at all. It needed massive reshoots, which we did, year after year. But he would have never been given the extra money to do those if the first one hadn’t been a huge success. The second and third ones would have been straight to video.”

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I think that Cameron's early work had passion. I just feel like a lot of that was missing in Avatar. It felt really safe. That's all.

Avatar was anything but safe. The revisionist history on the film is incredible.

3D version making up 75% of the release back then was a huge concern back then. It was a huge gamble. Everybody thought 3D was a gimmick back then and thought Cameron was crazy.

 

[Schlorgan]

Avatar was anything but safe. The revisionist history on the film is incredible.

3D version making up 75% of the release back then was a huge concern back then. It was a huge gamble. Everybody thought 3D was a gimmick back then and thought Cameron was crazy.

Everyone thinks that now.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Everyone thinks that now.

Not like back in 2009. Before Avatar it was only something that was in select theatres for select scenes. There would literally be a green light in IMAX theatres that would light up to let you know to put your glasses on for certain scenes.

And the 3D in Avatar was anything but gimmicky. Anything used without care can be a gimmick.

 

[Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!]

Save us from passionless disney shit James. You're our only hope.

If you want stories made with passion then maybe the $200 million dollar blockbuster range isn't for you.

 

[StudioTan]

I think that Cameron's early work had passion. I just feel like a lot of that was missing in Avatar. It felt really safe. That's all.

This is such revisionist nonsense. A 230 million dollar 3D movie about 9 foot tall cat people in 2009? MANY people expected it to bomb big time. It was anything but a safe movie.

 

[Catdaddy]

Ballsy move making four movies while not even knowing if it’ll payoff in the long run. I can see Avatar 2 doing well, but if it stumbles – he’s screwed with three more movies. Also, has the budget for the movies been revealed? With Cameron could be close to or over a billion dollars.

Personally, I didn’t like the movie – the 3D was nice but even days after I saw it couldn’t tell you any memorable scenes….. other than some of the movie reminded me of the Nagrand zone from WoW.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

If you want stories made with passion then maybe the $200 million dollar blockbuster range isn't for you.

Maybe he wants blockbusters with passion again, which is why he's appealing to Cameron.

Just maybe.

But there are other guys. George Miller. Nolan's been shaky, but I can't deny that his films are made with passion. Even bombas like Speed Racer or Verbinski's Lone Ranger film at least showcase directors that still have a pulse and control behind the camera. Brad Bird's Tomorrowland is another.

 

[Loxley]

Awesome, I'm pretty hyped to see more of the world Cameron created with the first movie.

LOTR was a complete mess of a production. Tons of re-shoots.

http://ew.com/article/2014/05/17/viggo-mortensen-lord-of-the-rings-interview/

I think Rtbeoh was referring more to the final quality of the films as a whole, not the production.

 

[gamz]

This is such revisionist nonsense. A 230 million dollar 3D movie about 9 foot tall cat people in 2009? MANY people expected it to bomb big time. It was anything but a safe movie.

Not to mention all the pro-environment message and anti military in 2009.

Far from safe.

 

[msdstc]

Not to mention all the pro-environment message and anti military in 2009.

Far from safe.

LOL what? Climate change and anti war were big already by then.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

This is such revisionist nonsense. A 230 million dollar 3D movie about 9 foot tall cat people in 2009? MANY people expected it to bomb big time. It was anything but a safe movie.

Not to mention a tentpole where the biggest name talent was Sigourney Weaver.

Zoe Saldana was even an unknown then.
A $230m blockbuster full of unknowns.

 

[Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!]

Not to mention all the pro-environment message and anti military in 2009.

Far from safe.

It was a pretty similar message to Aliens, down to having the evil corporate dude who looked like he could have been Paul Reiser's son.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

Avatar was so successful doing Dances with Wolves on an allegedly 500M dollar with marketing budget with 9 foot CG cats as the Indians is viewed as safe now.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I still love that everybody treats Dances With Wolves as the original incarnation of this trope. Golly I hope there are no fans of The New World in here. That Malick sure is one lazy sellout.

 

[jmdajr]

I still believe until I don't.

 

[Abelard]

Um, why did it take so long to get a sequel for this? And he wants a series?

 

[gamz]

LOL what? Climate change and anti war were big already by then.

And yet Fox told Cameron to take it out and he basically said fuck you and went to Disney who said they'd finance it. Only then did Fox come back and let him do what he wants.

 

[gamz]

Um, why did it take so long to get a sequel for this? And he wants a series?

tech had to catch up to his vision.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

And yet Fox told Cameron to take it out and he basically said fuck you and went to Disney who said they'd finance it. Only then did Fox come back and let him do what he wants.

Yup.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Um, why did it take so long to get a sequel for this? And he wants a series?

Not series. Multiple sequels. And it's taken him a long time because Cameron isn't content to shit out a movie to make a release date. He serves the movie first, release date second.

 

[JB1981]

I still love that everybody treats Dances With Wolves as the original incarnation of this trope. Golly I hope there are no fans of The New World in here. That Malick sure is one lazy sellout.

I'd say it has a lot more in common with John Carter or even Dune than it does with Dances with Wolves

 

[milanbaros]

Is there any reason why Avatar 2 can't push visual boundaries 10 years after the first one?

Will it be 4K and 48 fps? That's already a step up. Add years of improvement in cgi and this could be incredible.

 

[Schlorgan]

I'd say it has a lot more in common with John Carter or even Dune than it does with Dances with Wolves

I'd say more Fern Gully.

 

[gamz]

Is there any reason why Avatar 2 can't push visual boundaries 10 years after the first one?

Will it be 4K and 48 fps? That's already a step up. Add years of improvement in cgi and this could be incredible.

It's going to be nuts. Can't wait.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Is there any reason why Avatar 2 can't push visual boundaries 10 years after the first one?

Will it be 4K and 48 fps? That's already a step up. Add years of improvement in cgi and this could be incredible.

It will also be the film to finally push the large-scale adoption of laser projectors.

Think seeing Pandora in bright, IMAX HFR 3D.

 

[opricnik]

Its tickets gonna be bundled with Cardboard VR probably

 

[gamz]

Its tickets gonna be bundled with Cardboard VR probably

That goes against what Cameron stands for. He makes movie for the theater experience.

 

[opricnik]

That goes against what Cameron stands for. He makes movie for the theater experience.

You watch in VR at theater not in Cardboard itself.

Like 3D

Tech beyond imagination 😂

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Cameron has said he doesn't think VR is at the level it needs to be to interest him just yet.

 

[msdstc]

Cameron has said he doesn't think VR is at the level it needs to be to interest him just yet.

And yet he still thinks 3d is worth his time?

 

[gamz]

And yet he still thinks 3d is worth his time?

Since it's still the best 3D movie ever made and it made 2.8B....Can ya blame him?

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

And yet he still thinks 3d is worth his time?

The day glasses-less 3D graces cinema and TV screens, a portion of your thanks will be owed large in part to Cameron.

 

[SprachBrooks]

What film is big enough if not the biggest film of all time?

I just mean, yeah it was a phenomenon in that sense, but I'm not too sure they'll garner the same attention as the first.

Because it made so much money, Fox seem content on giving Cameron as much as freedom as he wants.

 

[Pluto]

Not series. Multiple sequels. And it's taken him a long time because Cameron isn't content to shit out a movie to make a release date.

But he was content to shit out a script as long as the effects were good.

 

[SuperEpicMan]

But he was content to shit out a script as long as the effects were good.

What about the script did you not like?

 

[nekkid]

I enjoyed the first one. Excited for where these will take us.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I just mean, yeah it was a phenomenon in that sense, but I'm not too sure they'll garner the same attention as the first.

Because it made so much money, Fox seem content on giving Cameron as much as freedom as he wants.

Well, Cameron had given them Avatar AFTER giving them Titanic. If there's any director that has earned carte blanche from a studio, it's Cameron.

Those two films from Cameron have made $5b worldwide combined. Two films.

 

[msdstc]

The day glasses-less 3D graces cinema and TV screens, a portion of your thanks will be owed large in part to Cameron.

And I won't give a shit, because 3d is useless.

 

[Pluto]

What about the script did you not like?

The white savior showing the Navi how to properly tame and ride a bird and being generally awesome at Navi stuff. The moustache twirling villains like general hardass and the corporate weasel. Generally completely forgettable characters and a story that is so thin and predictable that I knew how it was going to end 15 minutes into the movie.

Enough jokes have been made about this being Dances with Smurfs but it really feels like they took the most simple story possible, threw a script together in a month and then spend 5 years perfecting the look and creating an eco system. And the look was really great, that effort paid off, I just wish they had also told an engaging story with interesting characters.

Avatar is the definition of style over substance, take the effects away and you have nothing left except a barebones story that every editor would reject if you send it in because it's fucking nothing.

 

[jett]

I think that Cameron's early work had passion. I just feel like a lot of that was missing in Avatar. It felt really safe. That's all.

This is such revisionist nonsense. A 230 million dollar 3D movie about 9 foot tall cat people in 2009? MANY people expected it to bomb big time. It was anything but a safe movie.

Whatchu talking about, a 150 minute movie starring these things

Is the epitome of safeness.

 

[jett]

Um, why did it take so long to get a sequel for this? And he wants a series?

He's been working hard on the screenplays and on pre-production for several years now.

 

[strafer]

Would you ever direct a Star Wars or Marvel superhero film? I feel your fans would salivate over that possibility.

I’m not the slightest bit interested in laboring in someone else’s house.

But yet you did Aliens.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

But yet you did Aliens.

31 years ago

 

[WhiteRabbitEXE]

But yet you did Aliens.

That was his 3rd film, after two ultra low budget films, neither of which was exactly huge. Little different. Also 30 years ago.

 

[gamz]

Um, why did it take so long to get a sequel for this? And he wants a series?

He's writing 4 movies. Not to mention R&D and upgrading software and whatever else. He won't do a movie unless he feels it's right.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

He's writing 4 movies. Not to mention R&D and upgrading software and whatever else. He won't do a movie unless he feels it's right.

Which is why he waited like 16 or 17 years before Avatar was made and released. The technology wasn't up to par for what he wanted to do.

 

[gamz]

Which is why he waited like 16 or 17 years before Avatar was made and released. The technology wasn't up to par for what he wanted to do.

Yup.

 

[SuperEpicMan]

The white savior showing the Navi how to properly tame and ride a bird and being generally awesome at Navi stuff. The moustache twirling villains like general hardass and the corporate weasel. Generally completely forgettable characters and a story that is so thin and predictable that I knew how it was going to end 15 minutes into the movie.

Enough jokes have been made about this being Dances with Smurfs but it really feels like they took the most simple story possible, threw a script together in a month and then spend 5 years perfecting the look and creating an eco system. And the look was really great, that effort paid off, I just wish they had also told an engaging story with interesting characters.

Avatar is the definition of style over substance, take the effects away and you have nothing left except a barebones story that every editor would reject if you send it in because it's fucking nothing.

Thanks for elaborating, I can agree with you on the faults you mentioned. Though for me personally I feel they don't really detract from my enjoyment of it. To a certain degree I actually think the film benefitted from having a simpler story. The film already had to spend a lot of time establishing any relevant lore, the Navi, the planet, the mind linking machines (not sure what they were called), characters etc, which doesn't leave much time for anything more than what we got. I also think the basic plot we got is one which is universally understood, part of the reason I think it did so well at the box office. Since much has already been established in the original, they can hopefully spend more time during the sequels expanding on the world and coming up with more complex stories.

 

[gamz]

Thanks for elaborating, I can agree with you on the faults you mentioned. Though for me personally I feel they don't really detract from my enjoyment of it. To a certain degree I actually think the film benefitted from having a simpler story. The film already had to spend a lot of time establishing any relevant lore, the Navi, the planet, the mind linking machines (not sure what they were called), characters etc, which doesn't leave much time for anything more than what we got. I also think the basic plot we got is one which is universally understood, part of the reason I think it did so well at the box office. Since much has already been established in the original, they can hopefully spend more time during the sequels expanding on the world and coming up with more complex stories.

Agreed. It's world building and TFA had less of a plot and was less original, but it was important to build the world for it's sequels.