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Carmack responds to some guy's e-mail about 360/PS3 power

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eeyore the donkey

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Has this been posted? I did a search and first result was that VF5 thread
John Carmack at it again...my bad if it's old

Originally Posted by Reverend, to John Carmack via email,
Hi John,

I know you guys haven't made any announcements about your upcoming game but being a PS2 owner and will be upgrading to the PS3 (and ignoring the XB360), can you tell me (that can or cannot be posted; please tell me) the differences we'll see on these 3 consoles? Naturally, given my area of interest, I'm more interested in the graphics aspects but any stuff outside of graphics are also very much appreciated.
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Originally Posted by John Carmack, replying to Rev,
The graphics are going to be very similar on XB360 / PC / PS3. At launch time, the PC will have more powerful graphics cards available (at a premium price) than either console. The PS3 will be the biggest hassle to develop on, and the extra theoretical CPU power of the cells isn't going to translate into improved games
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I'm surprised he even answered this e-mail... and in such a definitive manner
 
Originally Posted by John Carmack, replying to Rev,
The graphics are going to be very similar on XB360 / PC / PS3. At launch time, the PC will have more powerful graphics cards available (at a premium price) than either console, but they won't be fully tapped by most games except one that we make. The PS3 will be the biggest hassle to develop on (Sony won't send us final kits), and the extra theoretical CPU power of the cells isn't going to translate into improved games (because multi-threading scares us)
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don't know why I bother, but...fixed
 
x360 fans: YOU SEE?!
PS3 fans: TEH BIAS!!
PC fans: we win
Nintendo fans: graphics don't matter in the blue ocean.

So just go ahead and lock the thread.
 
See: Quakecon keynote.

I think he meant "improved gameplay" as that was the thrust of his argument at Quakecon regarding all new-fangled uses of CPU power that other developers have been raising the bar with ;)
 
Draft said:
x360 fans: YOU SEE?!
PS3 fans: TEH BIAS!!
PC fans: we win
Nintendo fans: graphics don't matter in the blue ocean.

So just go ahead and lock the thread.
Click to expand...


You forgot the bit about Carmack not knowing anything about anything so his opininon doesn't matter.
 
Aren't Carmack and Itagaki the only two devs who bitch about Ps3's architecture and how hard it's to develop for?
 
Didn't we already know this anyway??? Only difference is 360 launched early and is suffering supply problems because of it. Sony is most likely having chip yield issues and has to postpone their launch, plus they have tons of new PS2 games coming out and probably don't want to shot themselves in the foot.
 
Doom_Bringer said:
The PS3 game will be a port of the X360 version. X360 is their primary console for development.
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Aren't they doing something like (3) 360 projects with a PS3 game planned later down the line? I thought I read that somewhere.
 
Well, iirc, they've anounced that 360 will be their primary console and all ps3 games will be ports of their 360 counterparts.
 
open_mouth_ said:
If the PS3 comes out a year after the 360 and is "comparable" in terms of power and graphical output.... uh oh.
Click to expand...

That's not what he's even saying (at least not here)...

Again, read the Quakecon keynote. It's very easy to pick him up wrongly on this, and in fact most people do whenever this is brought up. His position is a fairly reasonable one, but fairly misunderstood one too, from a number of angles.
 
Second said:
Aren't Carmack and Itagaki the only two devs who bitch about Ps3's architecture and how hard it's to develop for?
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IIRC Gabe Newell has said that he doesn't like multicore systems, but his opinion didn't matter because he's fat.
 
It's already all been said before.


http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=67616&highlight=CARMACK+PS3


G4 Interview summary:

Summary of the interview (I watched this a few hours ago so I may be forgetting some stuff):

- Talked about the Doom movie, showed some footage of it etc

- Talked about Raven and how they are close etc

- Reason for no flashlight/gun at the same time in Doom 3 was that earlier on it brang the frame rate down a lot cause of the dynamic lighting (or something like that). They also wanted to make it more scarier juggling a flashlight and a gun, but carmack said looking back that may not have been the best choice and Quake 4 now has the flashlight/gun combo.

- Thinks in next-next-gen (one coming up after this one, ie PS4/Xbox3) that it will be a lot harder to tell the difference between games and CG unless you closely examine it

- Seems really impressed with the 360, said that this is the first time a console has as good a development environment as PC (tools, documentation etc). PS3 has slightly more raw power, but 360 development is much nicer. 360 is the main console for iD development now.

- Skeptical about the Revolution/controller. Carmack said something about it being interesting, but that 90% of the ideas will probably be crap. Another iD guy said they will give it a chance, looking into all the consoles.

- Geoff asked about the drama at id (the founder being fired or whatever) but they kind of avoided the question saying that they are just concentrated on making great games.

- Will continue to make FPS's. Left the door open in the future for more genres, but said they are concentrated on FPS's.

- Wants to release the source code to Commander Keen, but they weren't as organized back then and they can only find bits and pieces of it.
 
I'll care about Carmack's opinion when he actualy makes a good console game and not just an average PC port of an overrated shooter.
 
Can anyone recall Carmack *ever* being excited over anything non-pc?

He has huge leverage over ATI and NVIDIA and the direction their API's and drivers go, I suppose Sony listen less (if at all) to him, which might be a mistake in its own right.
 
Angelus said:
Aren't they doing something like (3) 360 projects with a PS3 game planned later down the line? I thought I read that somewhere.
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no! Id is a small dev house. They are only working on one game for PS3/PC/Xbo360
 
gofreak said:
That's not what he's even saying (at least not here)...

Again, read the Quakecon keynote. It's very easy to pick him up wrongly on this, and in fact most people do whenever this is brought up. His position is a fairly reasonable one, but fairly misunderstood one too, from a number of angles.
Click to expand...

Correct. He says that the PS3 is in fact a stronger console but Microsoft's dev tools are really great. When a PC developer like Carmack actually goes out and claim that X360 dev tools makes the X360 as easy to develop for as the PC then it just shows that Microsoft has really done something good and I doubt that Sony (or Nintendo) will be able to counter Microsft on the software(tools) front.
 
Andokuky said:
I'll care about Carmack's opinion when he actualy makes a good console game and not just an average PC port of an overrated shooter.
Click to expand...

1. Carmack is the main programmer for id's graphic engines. He is not the director, designer, whatever.

2. id wasn't the one who ported Doom 3 or Quake 4.
 
Doom_Bringer said:
no! Id is a small dev house. They are only working on one game for PS3/PC/Xbo360
Click to expand...

Allright I'll go with that I guess. I could havesworn he mentioned something about 3 projects for the 360 though,I dunno maybe I read it wrong.
 
Is there a link back to Carmack's response that confirms its legit? Him referring to the "extra theoretical CPU power of the cells" is a technical gaffe I wouldn't expect him to make.
 
The "comical" thing is that the same people who brush off comments made by Carmack based on him supposedly not know what he's talking about would blindly lead their women and children through molten lava at the advice of console specific developers and/or engine salesmen.
 
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