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[Macam]

It seems Mrs. Sheehan has no luck, as her other son seems to have died

As for the arrest, it's not the first time she's been arrested I believe IIRC; there was a similar situation when she was in New York City, although she may have simply been escorted off the protest area because they lacked a permit in that case. In either case, the arrest may be legit, but so is her complaint with the government. I'm always amazed at how dense her detractors seem (hello, AB101), as they never seem to grasp the concept that it's not the fact that her son is dead that bothers her as much as it is that her son died on what she believes was a bullshit war based upon increasing amounts of reports following his death that the Bush administration was going to go into Iraq regardless of the reasons offered or the facts. Hence, her persistent desire to ask Bush "What was the noble cause Casey died for?"

You can disagree with the woman, but at least get the facts straight.

 

[DarienA]

This thread shows that Cindy getting arrested accomplished one of her goals(similar to most protestors who get arrest), get the subject out there and get people to talk about it.

Regardless of whether you disagree with her reasons, rights, motives, you are discussing the validity of the Iraq war... again... and that's what she wants.

 

[bob_arctor]

Regardless of whether you disagree with her reasons, rights, motives, you are discussing the validity of the Iraq war... again... and that's what she wants.

The Iraq war has no validity. We aren't even really discussing that here. What's going on here is what's going on anytime Sheehan gets on TV: People hate people that somehow are coming off as "Told you so". That's it. Truth hurts, all that jazz.

 

[bjork]

This thread shows that Cindy getting arrested accomplished one of her goals(similar to most protestors who get arrest), get the subject out there and get people to talk about it.

Regardless of whether you disagree with her reasons, rights, motives, you are discussing the validity of the Iraq war... again... and that's what she wants.

Doesn't her involvement kind of obscure the topic, though? Instead of getting in-depth stuff on what's actually going on over there, your news gives you "Sheehan/Bush 2: Electic Boogaloo." I'm all for icon-driven news, and it makes for easy hooks, but not when it is about such a dumb topic. "Dumb lady gets arrested" takes precedence over "such and such soldier died"... so isn't she taking away attention from the very issue she initially griped about?

It's all stupid. When I'm president, I'm having a hitsquad to take people out before they get out of hand.

 

[PotatoeMasher]

It seems Mrs. Sheehan has no luck, as her other son seems to have died

:lol :lol :lol

 

[bob_arctor]

Doesn't her involvement kind of obscure the topic, though? Instead of getting in-depth stuff on what's actually going on over there, your news gives you "Sheehan/Bush 2: Electic Boogaloo." I'm all for icon-driven news, and it makes for easy hooks, but not when it is about such a dumb topic. "Dumb lady gets arrested" takes precedence over "such and such soldier died"... so isn't she taking away attention from the very issue she initially griped about?

This would make sense if media coverage of Iraq was as intense, as say, coverage of what Paris Hilton did last night at that club (lemme tell ya, SCANDALOUS!), but alas, we is all igits when it comes to being informed.

 

[Macam]

Doesn't her involvement kind of obscure the topic, though? Instead of getting in-depth stuff on what's actually going on over there, your news gives you "Sheehan/Bush 2: Electic Boogaloo." I'm all for icon-driven news, and it makes for easy hooks, but not when it is about such a dumb topic. "Dumb lady gets arrested" takes precedence over "such and such soldier died"... so isn't she taking away attention from the very issue she initially griped about?

It's all stupid. When I'm president, I'm having a hitsquad to take people out before they get out of hand.

No, it's not. The problem with the media is that they've given up the very issue that Sheehan is attempting to address, which is the basis of the war. They may report soldiers' deaths, but it's an everyday statistic at this point; there's no contextual framing, no real coverage. It's old hat at this point to the media, while cashing in on the post-Katrina consequences and the hurricane craze is all the rage. You would never know we're currently fighting two wars. The simple fact of the matter is that "Dumb lady gets arrested" will be precisely what gets reported and nothing more. O'Reilly (as well as Hannity and co.) will simply use this as further justifcation that she's "a radical far left extremist" who no one should associate with, with not-so-veiled threats that anyone who does will not garner his support for office or otherwise.

 

[bjork]

So basically, all that protesting/emotion/etc, and it's all for nothing?

Hm, I could've told you that's how it would've ended up...

 

[Macam]

So basically, all that protesting/emotion/etc, and it's all for nothing?

Hm, I could've told you that's how it would've ended up...

Although it's unlikely Sheehan's protest alone is going to have a measurable direct impact on the nation's policy obviously, her protest has been wildly successful in visibly igniting the anti-war movement, reinvigorating critics, and creating very real pressure on the administration. It's hardly for nothing and, if anything, it's been one of the few successful attempts to crack the administration's armor.

 

[Matrix]

Atleast she looks like shes having fun

 

[Flynn]

One of the points of civil disobedience is based on the pretty obvious idea that nobody wants to get arrested.

By purposefully chosing to get arrested, for whatever reason, you inspire people to ask themselves, "what is it that this person believes in so strongly that they'd be willing to go jail."

It doesn't matter if they believe in this cause or not, so long as it registers within their brain that there are people that believe in this cause so much that they're willing to go to an certain, mostly harmless, extreme to make it known.

This technique is effective, otherwise we wouldn't be discussing it right now.

 

[bjork]

They should've dropped her.

 

[Beer Monkey]

Do all of these shitbags who were rallying in DC yesterday to 'support the war' (actually, just to bash anyone who dares to dissent) think that Pat Tillman was a traitor? He felt the Iraq war was illegal and unjustified.

"The group who spoke here the other day did not represent the American ideals of freedom, liberty and spreading that around the world," Sen. Jeff Sessions, R-Ala., told the crowd. "I frankly don't know what they represent, other than to blame America first."

One sign read, "Cindy Sheehan doesn't speak for me." Another said, "Arrest the traitors," with Sheehan's name listed first among several people who have spoken against the war.

That's right, we need to arrest people for dissent.

Fucking ignorant fascists.

 

[Flynn]

Do all of these shitbags who were rallying in DC yesterday to 'support the war' (actually, just to bash anyone who dares to dissent) think the Pat Tillman was a traitor? He felt the Iraq war was illegal and unjustified.




That's right, we need to arrest people for dissent.

Fucking ignorant fascists.

I'd like to see these people arrested for desecrating our nation's flag with crappy folk art.

Traitors!

 

[bob_arctor]

"Freedom isn't free"

:lol :lol What a load of crap.

 

[bob_arctor]

"Our troops are over there fighting for our rights, and if she was in one of those countries she would not be able to do that," Vigna said.

:lol Unreal.

 

[Ark-AMN]

"Freedom isn't free"

:lol :lol What a load of crap.

Wasn't that a promotional tagline for one of the commercials for Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell?

 

[Beer Monkey]

"Our troops are over there fighting for our rights, and if she was in one of those countries she would not be able to do that," Vigna said.

WTF, do these people know what irony is?

 

[bob_arctor]

WTF, do these people know what irony is?

You see, this is the disconnect. Reality/common sense versus these jackasses, who may very well be sweet, nice, decent people, but just don't/can't get it. People like Sheehan aren't "radical" deviants. Only in this fucked up country would they be considered so.

 

[909er]

It seems Mrs. Sheehan has no luck, as her other son seems to have died

As for the arrest, it's not the first time she's been arrested I believe IIRC; there was a similar situation when she was in New York City, although she may have simply been escorted off the protest area because they lacked a permit in that case. In either case, the arrest may be legit, but so is her complaint with the government. I'm always amazed at how dense her detractors seem (hello, AB101), as they never seem to grasp the concept that it's not the fact that her son is dead that bothers her as much as it is that her son died on what she believes was a bullshit war based upon increasing amounts of reports following his death that the Bush administration was going to go into Iraq regardless of the reasons offered or the facts. Hence, her persistent desire to ask Bush "What was the noble cause Casey died for?"

You can disagree with the woman, but at least get the facts straight.

Jesus Christ. That article makes it look like Bush has been out to fuck over the Sheehan family from day one.

 

[bob_arctor]

Jesus Christ. That article makes it look like Bush has been out to fuck over the Sheehan family from day one.

It's The Onion. Parody/Spoof/Satire. Not real. If it was real it would mention that Bush has been out to fuck over every family not in the top 1% from day one.

 

[909er]

It's The Onion. Parody/Spoof/Satire. Not real. If it was real it would mention that Bush has been out to fuck over every family not in the top 1% from day one.

Wow, I feel like an idiot.

 

[bob_arctor]

Wow, I feel like an idiot.

Don't. The sign of great parody is that it's often mistaken as authentic. Like Fox News.

 

[AB 101]

Seems like she is determined to never have closure over her sons death.

 

[Drinky Crow]

Despite the fact that I support Cindy Sheehan's cause, I gotta side with Squirrel Killer and whytemyke on this one: she's deliberately martyring herself -- although unlike Squirrel Killer's cynical take, I don't think it's gonna do her cause any favors, largely because Americans seem to have an aversion to being repeatedly told to "wake up".

 

[bob_arctor]

Despite the fact that I support Cindy Sheehan's cause, I gotta side with Squirrel Killer and whytemyke on this one: she's deliberately martyring herself -- although unlike Squirrel Killer's cynical take, I don't think it's gonna do her cause any favors, largely because Americans seem to have an aversion to being repeatedly told to "wake up".

DING! DING! DING! I'm telling you, this is the real reason Bush was re-elected imo.

 

[truffleshuffle83]

im sure shell blame bush for her son dying in LA too

 

[Macam]

Seems like she is determined to never have closure over her sons death.

The shit you come up with.... :: shakes head ::

 

[AB 101]

So you think this will give her closure?

 

[bob_arctor]

im sure shell blame bush for her son dying in LA too

Yes, she would. If The Onion ever followed up with another spoof story.

 

[truffleshuffle83]

my bad

 

[bob_arctor]

So you think this will give her closure?

Who the fuck knows? I don't call her at home. If it does or not, why does it matter?

 

[Vennt]

Despite the fact that I support Cindy Sheehan's cause, I gotta side with Squirrel Killer and whytemyke on this one: she's deliberately martyring herself -- although unlike Squirrel Killer's cynical take, I don't think it's gonna do her cause any favors, largely because Americans seem to have an aversion to being repeatedly told to "wake up".

What is scarier, from an outsiders perspective, is the bile and nastiness and yes, I hate to say it, sheer fascism behind negative reactions to protestation in general.

The US seems to want to present to the world, as a collective, the idea that freedom and democracy is a better way of life, a right, yet at the same time shoots itself in the foot daily with it's public reaction to dissent. Dissent and you're a traitor, Protest and you're "Unsupportive" - Yet the message this sends to the world outside is one of hypocricy, not unity, not a social "ideal" but an ideology of lies and deceit, this is what gives the 'other' fundamentalists ammunition in their recruitment drive.

Notice, before you all jump down my neck, that this isn't a view I necessarily agree with, I am NOT anti-American by a long, long stretch, but I can recognise the seeds of it, you'd be blind not to.

 

[teruterubozu]

I gotta hand it to her - she's the only American w/balls as the rest of us hide behind our cum-ridden keyboards and banter back and forth.

You'd think she was the only fucking American against the war these days. Bunch of pussies in this country (myself included).

 

[Macam]

So you think this will give her closure?

Allow me to answer your question with another question: How many times do you think I think of Mrs. Sheehan's sense of closure over the death of her son, particularly in light of her message and the context of her actions? Quit looking at the trees.

 

[sans_pants]

DING! DING! DING! I'm telling you, this is the real reason Bush was re-elected imo.

maybe because we dont agree with you. do people not understand that. Cindy I don't agree with your message, therefore shut the fuck up.

It's not like I don't think she should be able to have a voice, I just don't want to hear it.

 

[boredJonathan]

Cindy I don't agree with your message, therefore shut the fuck up.

It's not like I don't think she should be able to have a voice, I just don't want to hear it.

She should shut the fuck up but you think she should have a voice? HUH?

 

[Vennt]

maybe because we dont agree with you. do people not understand that. Cindy I don't agree with your message, therefore shut the fuck up.

It's not like I don't think she should be able to have a voice, I just don't want to hear it.

Read what you just wrote, you just told her to "shut the fuck up".

i.e. "Keep it to yourself"

In other words, you asked for her to supress her opinion.

Do you not see the sheer idiocy in that?

Heres the real answer, you can CHOOSE not to listen, to go on with your daily life, to IGNORE her protest, that's a right I'll agree you should have.

But to express the notion that she should "shut the fuck up" is perhaps one of the stupidist things I've read for a long time, and I read some pretty shitty stupid places online, you should feel ashamed.

 

[Boogie]

I gotta hand it to her - she's the only American w/balls as the rest of us hide behind our cum-ridden keyboards and banter back and forth.

eh? There are plenty of Americans with balls. There's several thousand of them patrolling around in a country called Iraq, in fact

 

[sans_pants]

yeah i fucked that all up but i was responding to whomever that said that americans dont want to hear the truth or that we were wrong or whatever bullshit and thats why bush was reelected.

its not that were afraid of what shes saying we just dont agree

 

[teruterubozu]

eh? There are plenty of Americans with balls. There's several thousand of them patrolling around in a country called Iraq, in fact

YES, SIR!
*goes back to being a zombie*

 

[Flynn]

eh? There are plenty of Americans with balls. There's several thousand of them patrolling around in a country called Iraq, in fact

Apparently the preferred way to have balls in this country is to take up arms.

 

[sans_pants]

YES, SIR!
*goes back to being a zombie*

yeah, all soldiers are zombies

 

[teruterubozu]

yeah, all soldiers are zombies

Really? Didn't know that. I was sure some of them had opinions. Oh yeah, not in this regime.

 

[sans_pants]

Really? Didn't know that. I was sure some of them had opinions. Oh yeah, not in this regime.

ok

 

[teruterubozu]

ok

i know

 

[littlewig]

I like the part where Bush could have saved himself a whole lot of trouble if he just didn't go to War.

Again, why are we there?

 

[Vennt]

I like the part where Bush could have saved himself a whole lot of trouble if he just didn't go to War.

Again, why are we there?

We are there so the Iraqis can have the freedom to suppress dissent, George & Tony told me so.

 

[Guileless]

People like Sheehan aren't "radical" deviants. Only in this fucked up country would they be considered so.

Cindy Sheehan, moveon.org, and anyone else who says they were opposed to the invasion of Afghanistan because they are "against all war" are radicals on the fringe of reality and common sense. She could have serious points to make, but she and that ilk lose the vast majority of us before they ever get around to it.

This "fucked up country" is going to be around longer than our enlightened friends in Europe who no longer have any credible military and are burdened with angry, unassimilated immigrant populations that are growing exponentially.

 

[xabre]

This "fucked up country" is going to be around longer than our enlightened friends in Europe

:lol