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[robotzombie]

How is it the exact same thing? Please explain to me. Do you fight greek mythology creatures? Are you Kratos? I mean I see what you mean, I can indeed "comprehend" the issue (thanks for the personal attack btw) but why is it this game is causing the biggest stink about games that copy other games? I mean I'm a huge HUGE fan of the GOW series. Though I'm still happy to pluck my 60 dollars down for Dante because I played the demo, I played the comic con demo, and various levels. I liked what I played.

I mean if a game copies another game but adds in oneor two new things, how does it give it the free pass? Is that all it takes? Some additions? I mean for all intents and purposes Dead Space IS RE4 in space. Sure the setting is different, but look at the core mechanics, its the same damn game. Over shoulder shooting (with the ability to move granted), ammo drops, shops, bosses, etc. Again it added the Anti Grav stuff which was neat, but again... these are simple additions? Does this give Dead Space the pass to not be called a blantant RE4 clone?

I just don't see how these other games get away with it and people are cool about it. Yet this game comes out and people just leap on it like nothing I've seen before. Its silly. So Dantes maybe takes the inspiration thing one step further. Does that mean I should hate it automatically. I mean should something deep down in my 20+ years of gaming experince be slapping me in the head telling me to have a hatred for this thing called Dantes Inferno?

I guess I should have corrected myself so that you can't cop out of the argument by taking something all to literally: I was talking about the game, not the story. Of course the story is different and you control and fight different characters. If you didn't this game would be called GoW 3 or 4. So please don't avoid the issue by nitpicking something obvious.

And if you continuously argue a different point than the one I'm making, then you obviously cannot comprehend the issue I'm speaking about. If you take that as a personal attack, I apologize, but that comment was not meant as an insult.

For your Deadspace argument (and your other copied games arguments), why are you pretending like it WASN'T ever brought up about those games? The reason why you are picking said games is precisely because there have been conversations such as this one about those games, whether they had merit or not. It isn't just this game, its probably just that you like this game, so these types of comments jump out at you more and you remember them easier.

I also never said nor expected you to hate the game, or to even not buy it or not have fun with it. But to pretend like this game isn't a complete carbon copy, probably the closest copy of a gamestyle not from the same developer ever, is just silly.

 

[thetrin]

Sigh.

Dante's Inferno is MUCH MUCH closer to GoW then Torchlight is to Diablo 2. MUCH.

Will you people stop using this arguement?

Not to mention the very simple fact: The Torchlight team is made up of ex-Diablo team members that were at Flagship working on Mythic.

 

[Dacvak]

You know, what really pushed it over the edge was when I discovered they went so far as to put in the roll-cancel "glitch" from GoW in the game. :lol :lol :lol

How many ninjas do you think EA had to hire to sneak into the Santa Monica offices and steal the GoW source code?

Seriously, though. It's shameful how similar exactly-the-damn-same that game is. In all facets.

 

[itsinmyveins]

I haven't played dead space or RE4, do they have the same hud? Do they do something like open chests the same way? Does the deadspace guy heal by mixing green and red space herbs? It would be pretty shitty if that was the case!

Games are a collection of different mechanics and ideas. What I saw of DI was GOW's exact mechanics, ideas, and things.

It's very similar, yes. But Dead Space does some interesting things there too, like displaying messages and map arrows in "real time" infront of the character, as a sort of hologram. It's a sci-fi after all, so it fits really well and looks good. It doesn't use green or red herbs, but as far as gameplay goes it's essentially the same structure right through.

But I guess that Dante's Inferno might be even closer to GoW than DS is to RE4. I don't know, I just tried the demo.

 

[StuBurns]

Not to mention the very simple fact: The Torchlight team is made up of ex-Diablo team members that were at Flagship working on Mythic.

I don't know this for a fact, but I've heard people saying it, but isn't a fair few ex-Santa Monica guys at Visceral?

 

[Einbroch]

Sigh.

Dante's Inferno is MUCH MUCH closer to GoW then Torchlight is to Diablo 2. MUCH.

Will you people stop using this arguement?

Have you played Dante's Inferno? I only ask this because when you play the game there are differences.

- You have accesories that level up as you use them. 31, in fact. Combinations of accessories that have a lot of synergy can make you stronger in some areas, but worse in others.
- The range attack in DI is actually good, and weaving cross attacks with regular attacks can be great.
- Choosing how you want to level. You can tell you're getting stronger, and not just "oh look now I can do XXYXX instead of just XXY". Do you want more life? A spell that makes you take less damage? Do you want more combos? Do you want an attack that draws enemies into you? There are more choices than GoW.

Just the first point by itself sets it apart. Is it better than GoW? In my opinion, no. Doesn't mean it's bad. Doesn't mean it's ripping it off. Just because there are GTEs (up the ass) and the combat flows similarly doesn't mean it's a ripoff.

And I think the Torchlight/Diablo 2 comparison is just as relevant as the GoW/DI one.

 

[badcrumble]

EA's releasing, which is part of why I find the situation somewhat worrying. They made more than a few attempts at putting new IPs/game quality ahead of straight-up profit in their 'new EA' phase. It backfired. Dante's Inferno really seems like a reaction to that. Cut down on design costs by borrowing the entire game from another, existing success. Use a public domain IP so that basic conceptual ownership is free, then have your game feed that through the style of the game you're ripping off. Take saved money and launch massive marketing blitz.

If this pays off for them, we'll be likely to see it happen more and more often. Big-budget shovelware, in a way, and probably the death of 'new' EA. From a business perspective, it totally makes sense. It's just not a path I personally want to see things head down.

Agreed.

FWIW I would have enjoyed God of War if it were called Hesiod's Theogony.

 

[KaYotiX]

long story short: if this was called "God of War 3", you´d be all over it.

Pretty much......alot of reviewers say DI is nothing new becasue we have seen it with GoW 1 and 2, BUT will they say the same when GoW 3 is out?? My $$ is they give it a 9.5 and say its the same GREAT GoW style of play we have seen before.

I love the GoW games but if 3 doesnt do anything new besides some new graphics does it really deserve high praise??

 

[itsinmyveins]

That said, I cannot imagine ANYONE reading The Divine Comedy, and thinking the game is worth condoning.

I read Watchmen long before I saw the movie, and I was kinda hyped for it. Then it turned out to be not so good, but it doesn't really affect my liking of the original.

 

[Bad_Boy]

People screaming there are ripoffs all the time don't get it. This isnt just a borrowing of ideas, it's the exact fucking game. If you want to borrow, do what every game made does. And if you really want to borrow, do what Darksiders did. But don't fucking copy everything verbatim like Dante's Inferno.

 

[StuBurns]

I read Watchmen long before I saw the movie, and I was kinda hyped for it. Then it turned out to be not so good, but it doesn't really affect my liking of the original.

The difference between the Watchmen book and the film is nothing compared to the first third of the Divine Comedy compared to this game.

 

[SlasherJPC]

I also never said nor expected you to hate the game, or to even not buy it or not have fun with it. But to pretend like this game isn't a complete carbon copy, probably the closest copy of a gamestyle not from the same developer ever, is just silly.

I never once said it wasn't a complete copy. I fully admit the game is a copy of GOW. I still had fun with it. I just don't see the problem. Yet I'm the sorta guy that enjoys what could be dubbed smart games, dumb games, action, etc. I mean it seems some peoples posts in this thread seem to insinuate that people that play this are "dumb gamers" or people that just love the immature type or aimed at a younger crowd type of people. I personally play a little bit of everything. From rpgs, and shooters, to old school point n' click games. I like variety in my games and games that make me think. (Hoping Heavy Rain is filled with some good stuff) yet I can still sit back and enjoy a game for what is is, or copies, etc even if it is a copy or blantant rip off. I just want to have fun. I'm not trying to step on peoples toes but to say there isn't a full hate hard on for this game (which started shortly after its announcement even), when many games come very close to copying others. I just feel is unfair. Though at the end of the day, whoever wants to play it or not, thats fine. I don't care nor do I judge other peoples gaming preference because of what else they play ( not saying you, just in general.) If people hate me because I plan on buying a game that copies another series I happen to really enjoy, so be it. Though I won't be passing on other inovative games because I picked up Dante, I'll continue onward like I always do supporting the industry simple by purchasing what I had fun with. Simple as that.

 

[-tetsuo-]

Soon this thread will be longer than the official one :lol

 

[Gravijah]

Soon this thread will be longer than the official one :lol

PS3 exclusive [X]
Sony fanboy sense of entitlement [X]


Let's boogie!

 

[thetrin]

I read Watchmen long before I saw the movie, and I was kinda hyped for it. Then it turned out to be not so good, but it doesn't really affect my liking of the original.

I just try to pretend the movie doesn't exist, and THOSE changes are hardly insulting.

 

[itsinmyveins]

The difference between the Watchmen book and the film is nothing compared to the first third of the Divine Comedy compared to this game.

Yeah, there's a huge difference alright. The movie would probably have benefitted from not going so frame-by-frame and instead tried to make a different interpretation of the comic.

On a similar note; I'm not offended that S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Shadow of Chernobyl clearly took inspiration (and the name, to an extent) from a classic movie either.

I just try to pretend the movie doesn't exist, and THOSE changes are hardly insulting.

Well, I think there weren't enough changes. If they had taken an entirely different perspective on the comic then it would have been far more interesting since I don't think the movie, as it turned out to be, really works that well (as a movie).

Had they just turned it into some mindless action movie I would probably have liked it even less, though.

 

[Gravijah]

Yeah, there's a huge difference alright. The movie would probably have benefitted from not going so frame-by-frame and instead tried to make a different interpretation of the comic.

On a similar note; I'm not offended that S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Shadow of Chernobyl clearly took inspiration (and the name, to an extent) from a classic movie either.

That reminds me that I need to see that movie!

For the record, I hated my PS2 and never played GoW until the collection. =P

I can definitely see how people could assume that, but me, personally? I'm probably the furthest away from a Sony fanboy.

Spoiler

Grew up on the Big N, baby!

I'm only pointing theoretical fingers, don't worry.

 

[Dacvak]

PS3 exclusive [X]
Sony fanboy sense of entitlement [X]


Let's boogie!

For the record, I hated my PS2 and never played GoW until the collection. =P

I can definitely see how people could assume that, but me, personally? I'm probably the furthest away from a Sony fanboy.

Spoiler

Grew up on the Big N, baby!

 

[Buckethead]

Dacvak's thread is the most shitty thread ever made.

Dante's is well made, deep, and very polished. This is a quality game. Quit complaining.
And don't blame EA for tapping an untapped market.

"There's nothing new under the sun". Especially in an industry that shares so much with one another.

 

[ConcealedBlaze]

You know what insults me? You devote paragraphs upon paragraphs to how it rips off God of War: a fun game, but fairly lacking in storytelling depth. Yet you only briefly mention how it shits all over a classic work of literature so far beyond God of War it's not even funny.

This game is exactly why non-gamers don't take the medium seriously. There's something to be contributed to art by video games, and if we keep producing hilariously bad shlock like this than no one will ever see it.

 

[Bad_Boy]

PS3 exclusive [X]
Sony fanboy sense of entitlement [X]


Let's boogie!

 

[Madman]

Whatever you do, DON'T download the Conan demo. Unless you want to play yet another near-direct copy of God of War.

 

[Flachmatuch]

First, this has nothing to do with the people who worked on the game. They're average wage workers who might or might not delude themselves into thinking themselves artists, good for them if they do, as deluding yourself will indeed make your life better. They're doing what they're told just like any wage labourer, that's all.

Second, the OP is right, but what makes this game particularly disgusting is leeching off the Divine Comedy. The PR *did* say it was "based on the book" and that it wanted to make the poem more accessible to more people etc etc, while all it ever wanted to do is make money off other people's work and the name of the book. And no, neither the DMC nor the GoW games' PR did anything like that.

Third, this is what EA does with loads of games. Dead Space, for example, is a pretty awesome game, but it's also a RE4 ripoff with an Event Horizon basis. It's much less offensive than DI for multiple obvious reasons though. They seem to be trying to create replacement franchises for everything that's successful. This is the "good" EA people like now, Dante's Inferno is just one (the worst) example. I mean, the details of how close to a copied game is to its successful "original" vary, but that this is what EA is trying to do is quite straightforward.

Also, being fun and technically a good game doesn't mean shit, I guess people might have a kind fun with shooting other people they can hardly see from gunships...but that doesn't mean what's behind it is better than shit. People did their work well, noone's talking about the programmer and "artist" minions.

Overall, this is just another disgusting manifestation of the shitty corporate focus-group based management approach. I can easily picture the "brainstorming" meeting in which people came up with this idea :-/

The nipples etc stuff...well, it's just cheap sensationalism. It's only disgusting if you understand it as just another PR trick to make the game more "edgy". It's cynical but of course it works. Just like the "torches of freedom" were cynical, but which also worked.

Also, I love all the allegations that if someone thinks this game is disgusting, they must be GoW (or whatever) fanboys. First, because these people have no idea how revered the poem is and how much it's worth for a lot of people, and second, because these people can only interpret other people's behaviour through a perspective of brand loyalty.

On the other hand, Dante's Inferno is not the most insulting game ever made. That has to be either MW or MW2 (I haven't played the latter).

 

[itsinmyveins]

This game is exactly why non-gamers don't take the medium seriously. There's something to be contributed to art by video games, and if we keep producing hilariously bad shlock like this than no one will ever see it.

Somehow I doubt that the problem with the medium being accepted as "art" is that a game used the Divine Comedy as inspiration for the setting and main character.

 

[StuBurns]

You know what insults me? You devote paragraphs upon paragraphs to how it rips off God of War: a fun game, but fairly lacking in storytelling depth. Yet you only briefly mention how it shits all over a classic work of literature so far beyond God of War it's not even funny.

This game is exactly why non-gamers don't take the medium seriously. There's something to be contributed to art by video games, and if we keep producing hilariously bad shlock like this than no one will ever see it.

Awesome post.

GoW wasn't the most original thing ever itself, originality in a medium best on iteration isn't such a big deal to me personally. The literary rape on the other hand is disgusting.

 

[Struct09]

That said, I cannot imagine ANYONE reading The Divine Comedy, and thinking the game is worth condoning.

I've read and studied the Divine Comedy, and I plan on playing Dante's Inferno someday. Even if Visceral's "interpretation" of the story completely sucks, who cares? The original work is strong enough to stand its ground, it's not suddenly going to lower in quality.

 

[spandexmonkey]

This game is exactly why non-gamers don't take the medium seriously. There's something to be contributed to art by video games, and if we keep producing hilariously bad shlock like this than no one will ever see it.

Because real art, like film and books, have never produced hilariously bad schlock?

 

[Keavy_Rain]

:lol You think 'calling them out' on a video game message board dwarfs the massive sales these games get? You have no power, sorry.

You have the power to NOT BUY these games or just buy them used.

Me, I have no room to talk. I tried to boycott Modern Warfare 2, but three days post-release I ran down to GameStop, money in hand, and said "I'd like a copy of Modern Warfare 2." Then I spent that evening and my weekend playing the game online and having fun.

I feel so dirty...

 

[KaYotiX]

You know what makes me sad? More people are angry this is a ripoff of GoW than a complete raping of the epic poem.

Becasue 99% of the people here didnt know it was a poem before EA announced the game........

 

[Canova]

First, this has nothing to do with the people who worked on the game. They're average wage workers who might or might not delude themselves into thinking themselves artists, good for them if they do, as deluding yourself will indeed make your life better. They're doing what they're told just like any wage labourer, that's all.

Second, the OP is right, but what makes this game particularly disgusting is leeching off the Divine Comedy. The PR *did* say it was "based on the book" and that it wanted to make the poem more accessible to more people etc etc, while all it ever wanted to do is make money off other people's work and the name of the book. And no, neither the DMC nor the GoW games' PR did anything like that.

Third, this is what EA does with loads of games. Dead Space, for example, is a pretty awesome game, but it's also a RE4 ripoff with an Event Horizon basis. It's much less offensive than DI for multiple obvious reasons though. They seem to be trying to create replacement franchises for everything that's successful. This is the "good" EA people like now, Dante's Inferno is just one (the worst) example. Being fun and technically a good game doesn't mean shit. Also, I guess people might have a kind fun with shooting other people they can hardly see from gunships.

Overall, this is just another disgusting manifestation of the shitty corporate focus-group based management approach. I can easily picture the "brainstorming" meeting in which people came up with this idea :-/

The nipples etc stuff...well, it's just cheap sensationalism. It's only disgusting if you understand it as just another PR trick to make the game more "edgy". It's cynical but of course it works. Just like the "torches of freedom" were cynical, but which also worked.

Also, I love all the allegations that if someone thinks this game is disgusting, they must be GoW (or whatever) fanboys. First, because these people have no idea how revered the poem is and how much it's worth for a lot of people, and second, because these people can only interpret other people's behaviour through a perspective of brand loyalty.

On the other hand, Dante's Inferno is not the most insulting game ever made. That has to be either MW or MW2 (I haven't played the latter).

bolded for truth. Basically this game offers zero creativity, zero originality, zero new idea

 

[Deku]

next up, EA's Candide with downloadable chapters and gameplay ripped from Final Fantasy XIII.

 

[Johnny Utah]

So Killzone 2 plays exactly like COD MW2? That is a ridiculously stupid statement.

Yeah. In both games you control the character with the same buttons, the perspective is the same, you can only carry 2 to 3 guns at a time, you play along with a team of characters, weapons largely do the same thing even if they look sound different. They are even military games.

Yes, COD MW2 and Killzone 2 probably share more in common than Dante's Inferno and God of War do. The only reason you don't see it that way, is that we are used to seeing 20 fps games coming out every other month, while a game that plays like a dmc only comes out every so often.

 

[FLEABttn]

This game is exactly why non-gamers don't take the medium seriously. There's something to be contributed to art by video games, and if we keep producing hilariously bad shlock like this than no one will ever see it.

The existence of Goosebumps doesn't negate the contribution The Great Gatsby made to art. The existence of Transformers 2 doesn't negate the contribution The Godfather made to art. So let's not use this argument, because it's easily dismantled.

 

[Flachmatuch]

Somehow I doubt that the problem with the medium being accepted as "art" is that a game used the Divine Comedy as inspiration for the setting and main character.

Errr...it didn't use it for "inspiration", because a fucking brainstorming session can't be "inspired". It ripped it off (and GoW) in a mechanical way. Seriously, it's a strategy, not something random

EA wants to focus on big franchises in proven high-volume genres and compete based on production values. That's it. DI is just the most obvious manifestation of that strategy.

 

[Dacvak]

You know what insults me? You devote paragraphs upon paragraphs to how it rips off God of War: a fun game, but fairly lacking in storytelling depth. Yet you only briefly mention how it shits all over a classic work of literature so far beyond God of War it's not even funny.

This game is exactly why non-gamers don't take the medium seriously. There's something to be contributed to art by video games, and if we keep producing hilariously bad shlock like this than no one will ever see it.

While you're worried what other people, who aren't involved in our industry, think about you, I'll stay worried about how this game could spiral into an industry-wide lack of creativity and innovation.

And I think it's pretty obvious that God of War's main focus was not the storyline. If you want a game that's all about the storyline, go play something from Working Design or old-school Atlus.

Spoiler

<3 Lunar

 

[REV 09]

i really enjoyed the Dante's demo. it can exist for all i care.

And i disagree with the combat being the same. The Cross attack is a seemless addition to the combat system in DI...God of War has no ranged attack that flows as freely with the combat system as Dante's cross attack.

 

[thetrin]

Dacvak's thread is the most shitty thread ever made.

Dante's is well made, deep, and very polished. This is a quality game. Quit complaining.
And don't blame EA for tapping an untapped market.

"There's nothing new under the sun". Especially in an industry that shares so much with one another.

It's deep? Since when? If you mean combat wise, it takes the system directly from a series that prides itself on its simplicity and lack of depth.

 

[Crash Station]

I'm still interested. I guess not caring much for the Divine Comedy is a plus in this situation. I know what I'm expecting and the poem is not it.

And frankly, I don't care if games ripoff one another. This could be an exact copy of God of War in every way other than the actual adventure and I'd still be interested.

 

[SlasherJPC]

Well what will happen is people will diss this game and refuse to get it. Then once the dlc comes out that lets you create your own user levels and play co-op with your buddies... will see people posting how "awesome" said DLC is and turn a few heads with its innovative co-op in this sorta game. You watch. Has nothing to do with the game being a copy of GOW but still.

 

[Dacvak]

The existence of Goosebumps doesn't negate the contribution The Great Gatsby made to art. The existence of Transformers 2 doesn't negate the contribution The Godfather made to art. So let's not use this argument, because it's easily dismantled.

Hey, what the shit? I liked Goosebumps. Especially those "choose your own ending" ones. :lol :lol :lol :lol

Spoiler

God, what awful books.

 

[spandexmonkey]

While you're worried what other people, who aren't involved in our industry, think about you, I'll stay worried about how this game could spiral into an industry-wide lack of creativity and innovation.

I think if the industry can survive the Guitar Hero flood, this one won't even be a blip on the creativity radar.

 

[wizword]

When did games emulating other games become bad? I don't understand this argument. Guitar Hero was a total rip off, Call of duty was a complete rip off of medal of honor. Anno series/Caesar series/etc basically a complete rip off of sim city. Is the total war series emulating about 95% of civilization turn based strategy make it suddenly an insult for a game. Dante Inferno art is completely different, puzzles are unique, enemy design is different, and story is utterly stupid but unique. I don't care for the game (the demo sucked) and think that the name of the game is insulting (because it has virtually nothing to do with the book) but beyond that no one should care that there is any aspect of god of war in the game. Seeing how god of war most likely had multiple roots in other games as well.

 

[Haunted]

Yeah, it's pretty fucking atrocious.

I've lost a lot of respect for the part of Visceral responsible for the game.

 

[thetrin]

Becasue 99% of the people here didnt know it was a poem before EA announced the game........

Don't make me cry.

 

[Hugbot]

It's deep? Since when?

It's about 9 circles deep, yeah.

 

[thetrin]

It's about 9 circles deep, yeah.

:lol

 

[Dacvak]

I think if the industry can survive the Guitar Hero flood, this one won't even be a blip on the creativity radar.

That's a little different because that team was created to produce shitty Guitar Hero games. When there's a dedicated group specifically built for one genre, that's what you're going to constantly see from them.

The issue I have is that Visceral Games consists of some truly talented developers, but because of this unfortunate trend of copy-cat developing, we may never see what they truly have to offer us as far as original concepts and innovations go. You look at Dante's Inferno as another shitty game to be ignored, whereas I look at it as wasted talent that could have been something awesome.

 

[Neuromancer]

Dante's Inferno is a blatant shitty ripoff of both a well-established game series and classic work of literature that it will forever stain.

This is the only part that bothers me. People have been copying other people's games since the beginning of time. And sometimes the clone ends up being better than the source material. But to have such a flagrent disregard for a great work of literature as Visceral does, well that I can't let go.

 

[The Faceless Master]

the only thing that bothers me is the gameplay isn't as good as even GOW1

 

[Tiduz]

i hope it sells well and becomes a franchise so i can see more manbabies cry.