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[SolidSnakex]

Those two games are remasters, so that bundle isn't quite as compelling as new game bundles would be.

And yet that remaster has done this

Already a better seller on Xbox One in the UK than Forza Horizon 2 and Halo MCC and already doing better on PS4 than DriveClub and Last of Us

Some seriously underestimate just how big GTA is even in a remastered form.

 

[Xando]

It's been at least a couple of days since one of these threads, I was starting to wonder if something was wrong.

Won't end before january

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Seriously doubt it.

How could they not be losing money unless you think production costs are sub-$300 all ready.

 

[Amir0x]

You don't think the OP sounds a bit like that? The whole OP is about worry. Why is it so bad (for Sony only) that 3 games out of SO many were delayed? 2 of those games are on Xbox too.

Sony is already market leader by a looooooong way. What's to worry about?

Not even remotely. In fact there is not even one mention of the Xbox in the OP. You guys need to really step back, not everything is system wars.

Let me put it another way.

Let's say I'm the world's biggest Xbox fan. I love my Xbox One, nobody can tell me otherwise, I'm never getting a PS4.

Now let's say we have a topic that is discussing the strategic ups and downs of any given companies plans. In this topic we can step into the shoes of a company and decide whether their choices have been good or bad for the companies business strategy or whether things that have already occurred have messed with the outlook.

So, even being the biggest Xbox One fan, I would say something like "the fact that X, Y and Z game were delayed out of the holidays really screwed Sony's plan."

That has literally zero associated meaning to a preference for the platform, no associated meaning to some fanboy wish, no associated meaning related to thinking it was bad its competitor was doing well or not. it's an evaluation of the plans Sony put into action and whether or not what happened in the past year worked out for them.

 

[Gamerloid]

I definitely find the PS4 to be lacking with the exclusives, badly at that. It does however have the best versions of most multi-platform games, and boasts a strong lineup in 2015. So the currently price is fine for them. They will have a strong holiday, and those new console owners will have quite a lot to look forward to next year.

Delays just hurt us who already owns the console. For them, it's actually better. The thing will still sale and then they have more games filling the calendar to entice sales next year, because the holidays will sell out regardless most likely.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Even if that's true, I feel like all the excitement is temporary and as soon as all the GTA5 diehards re-buy the game to play on their new consoles, sales will start dying down. It's not going to see half the effect that it did last year.

Maybe so, but COD is probably the only other game with as much staying power.

 

[RoKKeR]

Strawman. Who is arguing in this thread that MS making in-roads is a disasterzone or that there is something wrong with MS being aggressive in this market?

You got me on my wording. But don't pretend that the school of thought about Sony's seemingly complacent holiday strategy and lack of exclusives being detrimental to Playstation or 'concerning' is nonexistent. Hell you found empty space's thread referencing that topic compelling enough, and he mentions seeing numerous posts and podcasts about the subject.

 

[slavesnyder]

Even if that's true, I feel like all the excitement is temporary and as soon as all the GTA5 diehards re-buy the game to play on their new consoles, sales will start dying down. It's not going to see half the effect that it did last year.

Even if it only has a third of the effect that would be more than enough...

 

[Gestault]

The first-party output for the PS4 is fewer and lower quality than Sony had planned for 2014. That's not ideal for Sony (or audiences), but it's not like it's a situation they wanted. On the other hand, it may make next year's output feel stronger for buyers, because there's several more major releases on the table.

 

[Quixz]

First party games mean very little to me and many other people. COD, Assassins Creed, GTA V any day!

 

[Loudninja]

Even if that's true, I feel like all the excitement is temporary and as soon as all the GTA5 diehards re-buy the game to play on their new consoles, sales will start dying down. It's not going to see half the effect that it did last year.

You an say that about pretty much any game.

The fact is GTA 5 was still selling well after the launch on the PS3 and 360.

 

[Amir0x]

You got me on my wording. But don't pretend that the school of thought about Sony's seemingly complacent holiday strategy and lack of exclusives being detrimental to Playstation is nonexistent. Hell you found empty space's thread referencing that topic compelling enough, and he mentions seeing numerous posts and podcasts about the subject.

The 'school of thought' you're talking about has nothing to do with anything related to a preference or a fanboy or wishing MS wasn't doing well or being aggressive.

It's simply an evaluation of whether the company's strategy is working or not. It is actually you who are attaching your own emotional preferences to perverting what an otherwise innocuous strategy assessment means, even without realizing it.

 

[Pathfinder]

You an say that about pretty much any game.

The fact is GTA 5 was still selling well after the launch on the PS3 and 360.

Then the question is how many of those people would be willing to double dip.

As soon as the dust settles, I think a poll could be in order.

 

[redcrayon]

It's good, but it's like a "best of last gen" bundle. Lots of people have already played those games extensively albeit with lesser visual fidelity and performance. People want that new new

By 'lots of people', you're talking a tiny fraction of the PS3's install base when you compare the sales of those games (even GTA across all platforms) to the numbers of console owners. Those games are awesome, and I imagine the crossover between gamers who played them, neogaf posters and early adopters of the PS4 is fairly high, but the vast majority of the wider base of people who own a PS360 but not a PS4 yet probably don't own them.

I mean, did The Last of Us even sell to 10% of PS3 owners yet? It hit 7m worldwide earlier this year. Even that is still fantastic numbers.

Also, both have a great reputation- that counts for a lot with gamers who might have fallen out of the hobby in the last couple of years and are looking to get back in due to a new machine.

 

[FinalStageBoss]

Better to delay than to release a broken piece of crap. We've had enough of those.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

Not even remotely. In fact there is not even one mention of the Xbox in the OP. You guys need to really step back, not everything is system wars.

Let me put it another way.

Let's say I'm the world's biggest Xbox fan. I love my Xbox One, nobody can tell me otherwise, I'm never getting a PS4.

Now let's say we have a topic that is discussing the strategic ups and downs of any given companies plans. In this topic we can step into the shoes of a company and decide whether their choices have been good or bad for the companies business strategy or whether things that have already occurred have messed with the outlook.

So, even being the biggest Xbox One fan, I would say something like "the fact that X, Y and Z game were delayed out of the holidays really screwed Sony's plan."

That has literally zero associated meaning to a preference for the platform, no associated meaning to some fanboy wish, no associated meaning related to thinking it was bad its competitor was doing well or not. it's an evaluation of the plans Sony put into action and whether or not what happened in the past year worked out for them.

I probably misunderstood your post and semi ignored the one you were quoting. As I said in my post, I was saying the OP sounded more worried than anything. As in worried for Sony. I'm aware he didn't mention Xbox. Neither did I really.

Although I could see how one would infer that.

 

[Chobel]

The devs of The Order and Bloodborne must be feeling the pressure right now. Lots and lots of people have very high hopes for these games to help lead Sony through the first half of 2015.

Those two games need to be on time and not broken.

LOL! Sony can afford to delay these games to H2 2015, since they don't have to worry about MS in H1 2015.

 

[CyclopsRock]

Seriously doubt it.

You reckon? I dunno, I have no sources or anything. But they've cut a whole lot off the price (I know they booted the Kinnect too) - if they're still making money per unit now, they must have been making a TON of money per unit before.

 

[megalowho]

Delays we should be ok with, there's enough busted and undercooked stuff coming to retail as it is. Respect to devs and publishers that delay their games when there's probably lots of pressure to just cut and run with the holiday cash.

I do think the perception of Sony as a first party juggernaut has taken a hit since the release of the PS4, I know it was one of the factors in my initial purchase that has yet to bear much fruit and it comes up in conversation with folks who are still undecided. Microsoft has some desirable exclusives this fall, no question about it. Sony's reputation would take an even bigger hit if games were rushed out the door to meet an imaginary quota though, so it still feels like the best course of action for a slightly disappointing situation. System sellers will still be system sellers when they're ready to ship, and I don't believe anyone at Sony believed Fall '14 was going to be the killing blow against the competition considering what they're offering, Xbox price cut or not.

 

[slavesnyder]

(...)
So, even being the biggest Xbox One fan, I would say something like "the fact that X, Y and Z game were delayed out of the holidays really screwed Sony's plan."(...)

But how could anyone not agree on that?
They were counting on The Order and a well-working Driveclub and other stuff. That would have been better than the situation that is now. And I guess Microsoft would have more problems to get a little spotlight.
But things get delayed in game development, that's normal. And so, for the moment they are still doing quite well. And the games are not lost forever. and i prefer a late game to a hushed and broken one.

 

[Amir0x]

But how could anyone not agree on that?
They were counting on The Order and a well-working Driveclub and other stuff. That would have been better than the situation that is now. And I guess Microsoft would have more problems to get a little spotlight.
But things get delayed in game development, that's normal. And so, for the moment they are still doing quite well. And the games are not lost forever. and i prefer a late game to a hushed and broken one.

I don't know how anyone can disagree with that, but it's the discussion we're having. Whether the actual opinion is strongly valid or not is independent of the point I personally was making.

My point was merely to emphasize that this has nothing to do with wishing MS did poorly or was less aggressive, nothing to do with preferring Sony's output or wishing they were dominant. It's a subjective assessment over how Sony's strategy has worked out for them.

 

[bishoptl]

How can I hold all this concern?

Sony certainly would have preferred to field a stronger 1st party lineup in 2014, but the strength in multiplatform and positive WOM have done the job for them. Strapping in two GOTY titles in GTA V and Last of Us means selling out at the price that they want to, and that's the bottom line. Apparently giving money away is the new hotness in these streets? I dunno.

tl;dr - Dropping the price of the PS4 now would be stupid.

Sony can afford to delay these games to H2 2015, since they don't have to worry about MS in H1 2015.

I'd be unhappy if they did, but your sentiment is correct. Sony could coast for early 2015 with no threat from MS.

Better late games than dealing with the issues we've seen with AC Unity, DriveClub and MCC, however.

 

[RoKKeR]

The 'school of thought' you're talking about has nothing to do with anything related to a preference or a fanboy or wishing MS wasn't doing well or being aggressive.

It's simply an evaluation of whether the company's strategy is working or not. It is actually you who are attaching your own emotional preferences to perverting what an otherwise innocuous strategy assessment means, even without realizing it.

Spare me the psychoanalysis. I apologize for mentioning 'the other console' but it tends to happen when the market and this board is laser focused on these two products. "Strategy assessment" means nothing to many within a vacuum, something I'm sure you can see by strolling into any thread about a holiday promotion and seeing posts about how one company "should respond".

I chose my words poorly in my initial post.

 

[EASTC0AST_GH05T]

what is with all the Sony doom gloom articles on gaf lately?

 

[Harp]

Microsoft cut the price because they had too. It shows even more that didn't work because they reduce the price even further for Black Friday.

When a company has to basically liquidate stock to get sales it's never a good time

 

[thelastcrusader]

Nah. The fact that Sony can afford to delay games and get away with it does not suggest they're screwed at all. The PS4 has a shit ton of third-party support to fall back on this holiday season, and GTA V in particular will see the system fly off shelves. Delaying something like The Order to early next year is a good move for the game's prospects and also because the early months of next year will be a bit more sparse in comparison and Sony need to fill them out.

Agreed. My wallet needs a break. They can delay the Order and Bloodborne another month. I'd prefer it.

 

[Pathfinder]

what is with all the Sony doom gloom articles on gaf lately?

It's not really about doom and gloom as much as it's about some people feeling Sony needs to watch their back.

 

[Amir0x]

Spare me the psychoanalysis. I apologize for mentioning 'the other console' but it tends to happen when the market and this board is laser focused on these two products. "Strategy assessment" means nothing to many within a vacuum, something I'm sure you can see by strolling into any thread about a holiday promotion and seeing posts about how one company "should respond".

I chose my words poorly in my initial post.

It's not a psychoanalysis. In fact, you're still doing it in this post. I honestly don't even think you realize it.

Again you're trying to attribute value to statements that have no such inherent value. Saying a company "should respond" a certain way strategically is an innocuous strategic assessment that does not inherently have any weighted associated implication about someone's personal preferences. Someone who wants Sony to win could be saying that, but there's absolutely no reason whatsoever to assume that. Because the statement itself does not imply it.

 

[FinalStageBoss]

It's not really about doom and gloom as much as it's about some people feeling Sony needs to watch their back.

Why? Neither MS or Nintendo are close to them WW.

 

[RoKKeR]

It's not a psychoanalysis. In fact, you're still doing it in this post. I honestly don't even think you realize it.

Again you're trying to attribute value to statements that have no such inherent value. Saying a company "should respond" a certain way strategically is an innocuous strategic assessment that does not inherently have any weighted associated implication about someone's personal preferences. Someone who wants Sony to win could be saying that, but there's absolutely no reason whatsoever to assume that. Because the statement itself does not imply it.

Well said, I agree. However I personally find no reason to assume that any such post or sentiment (which again, we have seen much of recently) is strictly "a strategic assessment". We are all not market analysts and I have no reason to believe a majority of people taking place in these discussions are.

So you're right, I and many others are most likely attaching personal preference to the discussion. You got me. But I think ignoring that, especially on a board of enthusiasts, not analysts is disingenuous.

Feel free to PM me Ami as I appreciate the discussion, I've gotten too far off course from the original thread here.

 

[Late Flag]

If that means more polished games,then so be it. If this season has teach us anything, is that delaying a game should be preferable than to ship it broken/with an excessive amount of bugs.

Yep. Way too many broken or semi-broken games this year. Delays are fine if they pay off on release day.

 

[Pathfinder]

Why? Neither MS or Nintendo are close to them WW.

I don't think Sony has much to worry about WW, but they should at least be paying attention to Microsoft in the states.

 

[Harmen]

Who knows what the December event can do to build hype for 2015. I agree the One has more going for it now (regarding software), but I fully expect Sony to go full force again sooner or later (which is also why it is good that MS is doing well too).

 

[Captain Tuttle]

Presumably MS are losing money on each console sale at the moment, right? I'm not sure there's all that much virtue to selling more than your opponent if each one is costing you money. I know, razors and blades and all that, but it's a risky form of "success".

I keep seeing people write that MS is losing money on the Xbone but I've seen no proof, is there any?

 

[krypt0nian]

Yes, MUCH better to release it like MCC and meet a ad-driven deadline!

 

[DustyVonEric]

People, by and large, don't get Sony systems for their exclusives anymore.

They'll be fine.

Sony 1st party is overblown here in terms of pushing systems.

They're great. No discussing that, but they're not system sellers.

I don't agree. Hawk and Animal by themselves might not be system sellers. But together, they're the damn Road Warriors! A must see attraction.

Michael Hayes, Terry Gordy, and Buddy Jack might not be system sellers by themselves. But the together, they're the f'n Freebirds! A must-see attraction.

Tully and Arn by themselves might not be system sellers. But together and rubbing shoulders with a Barry Windham (UC2) and a Ric Flair (GT), they form the dreaded Four Horseman! THE must-see attraction back in the day.

Sony's stable is a lot like that. Great in their own right. But when taken as a whole complementing each other, the whole damn wrestling territory becomes white-hot and must-see viewing.

I believe Sony's variety and quality of its exclusives are Playstation's greatest strengths.

 

[Amir0x]

Yes, MUCH better to release it like MCC and meet a ad-driven deadline!

you mean like they did with Driveclub

>

 

[FinalStageBoss]

I don't think Sony has much to worry about WW, but they should at least be paying attention to Microsoft in the states.

And they've dominated the states all year long. Losing one month isn't going to make a dent.

There is no need to be concerned.

 

[Iacobellis]

The only real "delay" out of those is Hardline. I don't recall The Order ever being confirmed for 2014 and Arkham Knight was only said to be 2014 for like a week before they changed to 2015 if I'm correct.

The Order was supposed to be out in October for the longest. My poster I got on launch day for the console said October 2014.

 

[krypt0nian]

you mean like they did with Driveclub

>

EXACTLY

 

[Poimandres]

what is with all the Sony doom gloom articles on gaf lately?

You know you could say this about any manufacturer right?

Each week there are multiple doom/praise threads for the Wii U/PS4/Xbone. And so it will be until the end of time!

 

[groshkar]

...Marketing deals with all 3 of these along with GTA V, Far Cry 4 and LBP 3 would have made Playstation an unstoppable force this fall. This makes their decision to stay at $399 even wierder. Thoughts GaF?

Given the overall state of their corporate affairs I think Sony is appropriately focused on overall long term profitability and stability of their platform.

 

[krypt0nian]

Marketing deals with all 3 of these along with GTA V, Far Cry 4 and LBP 3 would have made Playstation an unstoppable force this fall. This makes their decision to stay at $399 even wierder. Thoughts GaF?

Worldwide they ARE an unstoppable force. GAF just loves it's NPDs in place of literally everything else. It's cute.

 

[Xando]

Given the overall state of their corporate affairs I think Sony is appropriately focused on overall long term profitability and stability of their platform.

Yeah, it makes no sense for them to drop the price.
PS4 is still selling gangbusters and lowering the price would be money thrown away.

 

[krypt0nian]

Yeah, it makes no sense for them to drop the price.
PS4 is still selling gangbusters and lowering the price would be money thrown away.

The very last thing they want to do is to prematurely screw the brand's value the way quick price cuts would. When sales slow THEN you drop prices.

 

[muyricosuave]

Looking back at the delay of Watch Dogs they got lucky with it landing in May, allowing them to maintain a media presence throughout Q3 with TLOU and Destiny.

I can't help but feel Sony got screwed by the delays of Arkham Knight, Battlefield Hardline and The Order 1886. Marketing deals with all 3 of these along with GTA V, Far Cry 4 and LBP 3 would have made Playstation an unstoppable force this fall. This makes their decision to stay at $399 even wierder. Thoughts GaF?

System still selling like crazy I'd say no plans messed up. imo

 

[Dyson Industries]

what is with all the Sony doom gloom articles on gaf lately?

People putting that work in before Black Friday sales?

 

[Portugeezer]

Looking back at the delay of Watch Dogs they got lucky with it landing in May, allowing them to maintain a media presence throughout Q3 with TLOU and Destiny.

I can't help but feel Sony got screwed by the delays of Arkham Knight, Battlefield Hardline and The Order 1886. Marketing deals with all 3 of these along with GTA V, Far Cry 4 and LBP 3 would have made Playstation an unstoppable force this fall. This makes their decision to stay at $399 even wierder. Thoughts GaF?

So when Bloodborne and the Order come out in Q1, along with big third parties, they should raise the price, is that how it works?

$450 PS4 incoming?

 

[bishoptl]

Sony's stable is a lot like that. Great in their own right. But when taken as a whole complementing each other, the whole damn wrestling territory becomes white-hot and must-see viewing.

Hilarious analogy, especially taking your username into account.

 

[Darksol]

It's already been said, but I don't see Sony as having anything to worry about this holiday season. They still possess a commanding lead, made smart third party partnerships, and now have several games carried over to 2015, allowing them a much stronger than usual Q1, especially when compared to their competition.

It may not be the same plan, but it'll work just the same.