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[Twilight Gap]

And destructible parts, like the precious Scarab boss from Halo 3, are just clever ways to hide a health bar. You have to do enough damage to the right places for it to blow up. Enough of that done and you can finally kill it. Now add that instead of one player it's 3 or more players shooting it. Now you have to increase that invisibile health bar to account for that.

Not really.

Let's put the Scarab in Destiny.

Yes, 3 people shooting at its legs to knock it down will make it go down faster than one person.

So put a weapon on the map, or some other mechanic that shields the legs. Now players have to knock out the mechanic to take out the leg.

Or let the boss repair itself so that if you "cheese it" by staying in one spot, you'll lose all the damage you just did to it.

But should taking down the leg be the only way to defeat Scarb? No, you could climb on the Scarab, so let's put warpgates around the map that require a player to stand on to build before you can jump on it. Now you have another mechanic thrown into the mix.

But does the Scarab have to stay still? No, it can move around, it can take players to another area, it can try to shake them off, or the environment can change such so that the gates disappear halfway through and you can no longer board the Scarab. Or maybe the Scarab is ignoring you completely and is trying to reach a destination, and it's your job to knock parts of the environment down to stop it. So you have players getting its attention while another player is positioning a crane, planting a bomb, etc. All of that is done with a giant ass boss that people will surely remember because it's visually impressive and has multiple ways to take it down.

You know what makes these bosses hard for randoms? It's not mechanics, it's the waves of adds thrown in to mask the absence of mechanics and give players ammo. Mechanics don't kill people in strikes - adds do, and the fights with adds in these bosses aren't even meaningful or interesting. They spawn from monster closets, drop ships, or puffs of smoke and they're just as quickly dispatched. So why are they such a big part of boss encounter design?

One of my favorite things to do when I encounter a Devil Walker is knock its laser cannon off. The sad part is it was literally the only dynamic element to any AI battle in Destiny 1.

 

[Insaniac]

still early obviously, but I'm super wary about the more "limited" skill trees. Can't wait for even less ways to customize my Warlock

 

[NullPointer]

I don't think the game structure being the exact same complaints are valid. At least not with the level of information we have now. There seems to be a lot more to do in the zones from what they were describing and we haven't really seen any footage of how that all plays out.

Also lots of the media have been saying Bungie has been very tight lipped in regards to questions around certain elements of the game, so its entirely possible there is quite a bit of new stuff they are saving still for E3 / Sony stage.

People can only give impressions on what is shown. This is what Bungie decided to show and these are the mixed reactions they've garnered.

If there's big, positive reveals to come you can expect better reactions then.

They have not said. People seem divided on if we should ever see them back. I'm in the camp that I wouldn't mind them included as extras in either some of the expansions or as an expansion of their own or hell even for free over time.

Some though are in the camp that if they see them brought back as anything but free then Bungie are the devil.

Everybody likes to hold Destiny to MMO norms. Which MMOs reset their content like this and remove all the previous areas when they come out with a new expansion?

 

[Neuro]

Have you played since TTK? Strike bosses have gotten a lot better... the one they showed today was lackluster.... wouldn't be surprised if it was the PS4 exclusive strike.

I'd love to have a 'Soulsborne type boss challenge' outside of Raids... but we're the minority... It would yield a low completion/participation rate along with complaints.

Well if you played the original Skolas encounter at the end of PoE or the Black spindle mission, your wish would have been fulfilled

 

[Neolombax]

People defending the 'looks the same' comments are missing the point of what people are trying to say. There's plenty of ways for Destiny to keep its core loop but add impressive and interesting new gameplay elements. At least so far it doesn't appear they've done that. It looks like more of the same content but with minor tweaks and improvements here and there.

I also think after the first game people expected this to be the game which hit the targets and scale that Bungie originally set out to deliver in the first but couldn't due to development issues.

I for one am more interested on how the Patrol activities will carry out, and how the overworld will look like. We haven't got any footage of this, have we?

I'd imagine Strikes, Raids and Crucibles will remain largely the same, albeit with more varied scenarios?

 

[tait269]

Striker Titan Subclass Walkthrough:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaVjkSWDsBw

 

[Neuro]

still early obviously, but I'm super wary about the more "limited" skill trees. Can't wait for even less ways to customize my Warlock

Cause most of it didn't make sense to the majority, they ran with a fixed PvP/pve meta build and would rarely change beyond that.

 

[jimboton]

I was foolishly expecting Bungie to somewhat improve and expand on the PvP Destiny experience, instead they restrict it to 4v4. Still no servers. Still 30 fps.

As for PvE, only 4 regions, just like vanilla Destiny, only now moons instead of worlds, for some reason planets are off limits now (I don't care if the actual playgrounds are marginally bigger, it feels like a downgrade). Still no interstellar travel. Same classes. Same subclasses. Same enemies. More cutscenes!

I have near 2000 hours on Destiny and I will play Destiny 2 but I don't know how anyone can defend any of this.

 

[Mafro]

I wonder how much of this game is cut content from Destiny 1.

 

[Two Words]

If bosses having health bars is that awful to you, you should stop looking at Destiny to change that. Because what you call "Bullet Sponge" is health bars. No matter what they may add or change, the bosses will always have health bars. It's a core design choice.



Some of the examples in the post I quoted were literally genre changes. Witcher 1 to Witcher 2 is pretty much a different genre. Yes Geralt still technically hacks and slashes but the method, timing, and pacing of it is more like each fight is a mini-game in Witcher. It's quite different. Which is why many people have only played 2 and 3 significantly and hate the gameplay of 1.

Mass Effect 1 to 2 is comfortably a genre change. 1 is solidly an RPG with shooting elements. 2 is a shooter with minor RPG elements. 3 is a shooter completely.



The mini-gun shown today is an Exotic AR. It hasn't been said if it's just the one or if there is a mini-gun AR archetype.

I just explained how a bullet sponge boss isn't just having a lot of health. The bosses don't suck because they have a lot of health. They suck because they have shifty mechanics.

Have you played since TTK? Strike bosses have gotten a lot better... the one they showed today was lackluster.... wouldn't be surprised if it was the PS4 exclusive strike.

I'd love to have a 'Soulsborne type boss challenge' outside of Raids... but we're the minority... It would yield a low completion/participation rate along with complaints.

I have played Destiny a lot, even through ROI. The strike bosses past TTK were better, but many were still bullet sponges in the most boring kind of way. Bond Brothers was good. I kinda wish the whole encounter was them together though. The one with invincible Ogre is nice too. I mean, these aren't amazing bosses in my view. But they're much better than crap like Valus whatever on Mars.

 

[Neuro]

I wonder how much of this game is cut content from Destiny 1.

A lot from the looks of dubious volley...

 

[Insaniac]

Cause most of it didn't make sense to the majority, they ran with a fixed PvP/pve meta build and would rarely change beyond that.

So fix skills to make the more interesting and add variety, don't just remove them all

 

[IAmAnAgnostic]

So.. watched this Strike

https://youtu.be/d_PwEJom5YE

It says Destiny 2 in the title..

But If someone had told me this was a new strike set on Venus from Destiny 1 i would seriously have believed them (i have not played the latest addon packs to Destiny 1)

Imo it looks pretty much identical? Still more or less a corridor with the same enemies and weapons. I guess there are more particle effects and new powers..

Man those are some reused assets right there. Yeah no joke you could easily think this was one of the DLCs for Destiny 1.

 

[Twilight Gap]

Man those are some reused assets right there. Yeah no joke you could easily think this was one of the DLCs for Destiny 1.

To be fair, up until Advanced Warfare I could say the same thing about Call of Duty. But I guess those games were only two years in development and at least had full multiplayer suites?

 

[PnCIa]

The thing thats bothering me the most is that the AI looks dumb as bricks most of the time. We get mobs of dumb lemmings waiting to get taken down, at least with the ttk shown in the demos.

 

[nOoblet16]

To be fair, up until Advanced Warfare I could say the same thing about Call of Duty. But I guess those games were only two years in development and at least had full multiplayer suites?

Black Ops 2 was very different from previous games, it was a big overhaul in terms of the game's systems as well as looks. Plus it was the first time game went sci fi. Also COD games had 2 year cycles until Advanced Warfare when it became 3 years.

 

[jmartoine]

That's really what has disappointed me the most. From the little they have shown only Titan looks significantly different, the others look like they could just be existing areas from D1. Hopefully the areas are quite large and have a lot of variation in them.

 

[Twilight Gap]

Black Ops 2 was very different from previous games, it was a big overhaul in terms of the game's systems as well as looks. Plus it was the first time game went sci fi. Also COD games had 2 year cycles until Advanced Warfare when it became 3 years.

Ya I only played a few of the campaigns, but I did play the hell out of Extinction. At surface level however, the games were more or less the same to me as an outsider.

 

[The Driver]

I was foolishly expecting Bungie to somewhat improve and expand on the PvP Destiny experience, instead they restrict it to 4v4. Still no servers. Still 30 fps.

As for PvE, only 4 regions, just like vanilla Destiny, only now moons instead of worlds, for some reason planets are off limits now (I don't care if the actual playgrounds are marginally bigger, it feels like a downgrade). Still no interstellar travel. Same classes. Same subclasses. Same enemies. More cutscenes!

I have near 2000 hours on Destiny and I will play Destiny 2 but I don't know how anyone can defend any of this.

How I'm feeling right now. I think very little I had on my wishlist came through. I mean, shit, they are still using the SAME fucking reload/melee animations 4 years on. It's just small things that are indicative of the whole to me. This is D1 with some QoL improvements we should have gotten a while back and the usual new guns, armor, and planets shit.

 

[ZeoVGM]

So I see the "lol DLC" will be to go-to for people shitting on Destiny this time around?

 

[Jolkien]

I'm not too sure why it's still 30 FPS, graphically am I in the rare camp of finding the game really ordinary looking ? The art style is still on point and it the end that's what counts but when I heard it was 30 FPS and knowing previous gen support was dropped I was expecting a significant upgrade.

 

[hank_tree]

So I see the "lol DLC" will be to go-to for people shitting on Destiny this time around?

It's actually a pretty handy way to identify people to ignore.

 

[Bull_peeler]

Well, I liked what I saw. Not going to jump into any argument, as I am certainly biased when it comes to Destiny. It seems I'm getting what I want with a bigger, badder and better Destiny with D2. My gamer heart is pleased.

 

[IAmAnAgnostic]

So I see the "lol DLC" will be to go-to for people shitting on Destiny this time around?

This attitude right here is why I don't get too invested in fandom communities anymore. Criticism always dismissed with shitposts even though most of the time eventually the criticism ends up being addressed later. Like how people had a lot of criticism for Destiny 1 and a lot of it was addressed in DLCs. But criticizing the games numerous faults prior would have still gotten this response.

 

[Interficium]

This is D1 with some QoL improvements we should have gotten a while back and the usual new guns, armor, and planets shit.

Has this become a meme yet

 

[Jblanks]

They're not. I think the reason is that the entire back end development system needed to be changed.

Shinobi's original leak last year hinted that they'll eventually be added back in.

Oh man I'm getting bad flash backs of the first game, development changes a year from release and content being cut and then added in expansions.

 

[Trace]

This attitude right here is why I don't get too invested in fandom communities anymore. Criticism always dismissed with shitposts even though most of the time eventually the criticism ends up being addressed later. Like how people had a lot of criticism for Destiny 1 and a lot of it was addressed in DLCs. But criticizing the games numerous faults prior would have still gotten this response.

The "criticism" is just thinly-veiled shitposting most of the time. The people that Bungie are listening to for tweaking and changing things are the fans playing the game, not the people dropping hot takes and "was this all just cut content lol" and "lol dlc" that infests most Neogaf gaming side Destiny threads.

Has this become a meme yet

It's pretty exploitable but I don't think it's long enough to become a meme.

 

[IAmAnAgnostic]

The "criticism" is just thinly-veiled shitposting most of the time. The people that Bungie is listening to for tweaking and changing things are the fans playing the game, not the people dropping hot takes and "was this all just cut content lol" and "lol dlc" that infests most Neogaf gaming side Destiny threads.

Destiny 1 was criticized for a terrible loot system, terrible leveling system, terrible story and repetitive end game content among other things. All of these were addressed to some extent in the DLC. I know because I played trough it.

How do you think the Destiny community responded to people making these criticisms?

 

[nOoblet16]

Ya I only played a few of the campaigns, but I did play the hell out of Extinction. At surface level however, the games were more or less the same to me as an outsider.

Well honestly speaking most games in a franchise look the same at surface level really unless the prior game was shit and needed a massive overhaul, Black ops 2 had strike missions which was a very different thing and involved light RTS elements. It also had choice and consequences that was never done before in COD and it does it quite well. The pick 10 system completely changed the way loadouts worked in MP. The game also allowed you to customise your loadouts for SP missions along with you finding special hidden equipments in missions which was something new too. There was a lot more player interaction in the SP basically.

 

[Trickster]

Watching footage from the strike right now. Several things are standing out to me.

One of them is the ghost, litterally every line so far these first 12 minutes have been a bad joke :/

 

[Trace]

Destiny 1 was criticized for a terrible loot system, terrible leveling system, terrible story and repetitive end game content among other things. All of these were addressed to some extent in the DLC. I know because I played trough it.

How do you think the Destiny community responded to people making these criticisms?

There's a difference being someone playing the game and criticizing it, and people bandwagoning off said criticism for the sake of trolling and shitposting. There are plenty of legitimate flaws with Destiny, you just stated a bunch of them and it's true, most of them were addressed in some way of another. However dropping into every Destiny thread to drop the "lol DLC" "lol no content" "lol unfinished game see you in two years" hot takes aren't constructive criticism, that's just shitposting. And yes, I've seen this consistently on gaming side Destiny threads for years.

 

[The Driver]

The "criticism" is just thinly-veiled shitposting most of the time. The people that Bungie are listening to for tweaking and changing things are the fans playing the game, not the people dropping hot takes and "was this all just cut content lol" and "lol dlc" that infests most Neogaf gaming side Destiny threads.



It's pretty exploitable but I don't think it's long enough to become a meme.

I mean, maybe yeah a lot of people posting just 'lol dlc' and 'this is just D1' are doing it out of spite and have never given a fuck about Destiny because they are still hung up about Year One shit like no true campaign or not being able to raid or some shit but that ain't me. I got 1000+ hours on D1 and I played every expansion outside of ROI. I loved the game but it had problems.

It's that experience that let's me pick up stuff here like the same stupid bosses, or the same pulse rifle reloads, the same wonky add spawning, slightly tweaked abilities/supers, etc.

I have no doubt the networking and exploration features have been improved greatly and there is new sights to see and loot to acquire but Bungie didn't show shit from that. All they showed today was the exact same gameplay loop we've been playing for almost 4 years now.

 

[cripterion]

That's really what has disappointed me the most. From the little they have shown only Titan looks significantly different, the others look like they could just be existing areas from D1. Hopefully the areas are quite large and have a lot of variation in them.

I was hoping this game would run on a new engine that gave way to huge explorable areas where you find enemies and npc's alike. Doesn't sound like the game is going towards that direction.

I didn't believe all these bullshit leaks but I really thought the game would be a decent graphical upgrade or 60fps on consoles.

It's actually a pretty handy way to identify people to ignore.

Same could be said about people that defend every aspect of this game tooth and nail.
Once again, I haven't played Rise of Iron, if I'm shown footage from the dlc and see what was shown yesterday, and I find them virtually the same why the fuck can't I say it looks like that to me?
I was expecting pc footage too (I know it's coming later...)

 

[ZeoVGM]

This attitude right here is why I don't get too invested in fandom communities anymore. Criticism always dismissed with shitposts even though most of the time eventually the criticism ends up being addressed later. Like how people had a lot of criticism for Destiny 1 and a lot of it was addressed in DLCs. But criticizing the games numerous faults prior would have still gotten this response.

Not from me.

"It looks like DLC" is not valid criticism. There was and is plenty to criticize Destiny for but that's not what I'm discussing. I am specifically talking about the "it looks like DLC" stuff, which has been the backbone of the negativity in the threads today.

What we're seeing in this game is no different than what we see from other sequels to AAA games. And there have been people in this thread literally saying Destiny is nothing but "a couple new subclasses and grenade launchers."

As a fan, it's maddening because that type of stuff engulfs Destiny threads. Many of the people saying that nonsense either a) didn't bother to actually read up about the game before commenting or b) know that it's wrong and are just trolling.

What's funny is that if they had done a completely new UI that was unrecognizable from Destiny 1, pasted on top of the current footage, you would likely see less of that. The UI looking the same makes it an easy target. But it's a sequel. It's going to look and play similar to the last one, as most sequels do. But it is all a fully new game from the bottom up, just as most sequels are. They're not trying to reinvent the wheel. There's nothing wrong with that.

 

[Trace]

I mean, maybe yeah a lot of people posting just 'lol dlc' and 'this is just D1' are doing it out of spite and have never given a fuck about Destiny because they are still hung up about Year One shit like no true campaign or not being able to raid or some shit but that ain't me. I got 1000+ hours on D1 and I played every expansion outside of ROI. I loved the game but it had problems.

It's that experience that let's me pick up stuff here like the same stupid bosses, or the same pulse rifle reloads, the same wonky add spawning, slightly tweaked abilities/supers, etc.

I have no doubt the networking and exploration features have been improved greatly and there is new sights to see and loot to acquire but Bungie didn't show shit from that. All they showed today was the exact same gameplay loop we've been playing for almost 4 years now.

I definitely agree, it was the same gameplay that we've seen before. Personally this isn't an issue because all I've ever wanted from Destiny is two things, a fixed PvP mode and more content, which they're delivering both on with Destiny 2 so I'm happy. If someone didn't enjoy what Destiny 1 delivered, they probably won't be happy with D2 because it's definitely more of the same.

 

[Bollocks]

Is there a good summary somewhere? Had to leave the stream early during the gameplay demo.

 

[Midas]

I wonder how much of this game is cut content from Destiny 1.

All of it. They just had it on one of their servers for three years, and finally revealed it.

 

[Jest Chillin]

Is there a good summary somewhere? Had to leave the stream early during the gameplay demo.

This seems like the most comprehensive bulletpoint I've come across.

https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyThe...destiny_2_world_premier_hype_prep_megathread/

 

[cripterion]

Not from me.

"It looks like DLC" is not valid criticism. There was and is plenty to criticize Destiny for but that's not what I'm discussing. I am specifically talking about the "it looks like DLC" stuff, which has been the backbone of the negativity in the threads today.

What we're seeing in this game is no different than what we see from other sequels to AAA games. And there have been people in this thread literally saying Destiny is nothing but "a couple new subclasses and grenade launchers."

As a fan, it's maddening because that type of stuff engulfs Destiny threads. Many of the people saying that nonsense either a) didn't bother to actually read up about the game before commenting or b) know that it's wrong and are just trolling.

What's funny is that if they had done a completely new UI that was unrecognizable from Destiny 1, pasted on top of the current footage, you would likely see less of that. The UI looking the same makes it an easy target. But it's a sequel. It's going to look and play similar to the last one, as most sequels do. But it is all a fully new game from the bottom up, just as most sequels are. They're not trying to reinvent the wheel. There's nothing wrong with that.

I don't mind the UI looks but it's cumbersome to navigate with the slowass pointer, especially when they could have used the PS4 touchpad features. It's one of the things I expected to be corrected in the sequel. Thankfully it won't be a problem on pc.

 

[Sanpei]

Is this Destiny 2 or new expansion ?

 

[Noisepurge]

I have to be on the train that says it's not much, feels like a brutal way of just getting rid of all our previous achievements and gear.

Was hoping they would force us to make a new character and introduce new races and mostly all new classes and subclasses. Now just giving the warlock the hammer of sol and switching out the bladedancer for poledancer feels incremental. I do like the idea of two primaries and a special slot though.

4v4 Trials and Control sounds like a bad move though, will have to play to see. And find a fourth player to our Trials team...

And the game should be 60fps on PS4P. Please let us keep our emblems atleast Bungie to keep some legacy achievements visible.

 

[ElRenoRaven]

Is this Destiny 2 or new expansion ?

Prime example of the shitposting that goes on in every Destiny thread right here. Take it in. Destiny threads are full of this shit gaming side.

 

[Trace]

Is this Destiny 2 or new expansion ?

Halo 5.5, expansion to the Destiny Alpha. Requires you to have the E3 Alpha from 2014 installed though.

 

[ZeoVGM]

Is this Destiny 2 or new expansion ?

And there it is.

 

[The Driver]

I definitely agree, it was the same gameplay that we've seen before. Personally this isn't an issue because all I've ever wanted from Destiny is two things, a fixed PvP mode and more content, which they're delivering both on with Destiny 2 so I'm happy. If someone didn't enjoy what Destiny 1 delivered, they probably won't be happy with D2 because it's definitely more of the same.

I'm actually cool if the sequel was more of the same...within reason, I actually commend Bungie slightly for that because as Zoba said a page ago, each of their Halo sequels where substantially different and kinda destroyed whatever the last one had going on but this... I mean, all this time and for your big new strike reveal you are still reusing Atheon model for the final boss...which is actually the giant vex boss from the venus steps mission...who is really a giant Minotaur at the end of the day.

Or how about showing off your new exotic handcannon...that reloads the exact same way as every single hc has since day one of vanilla, something we've seen probably thousands of times. It's the little things that makes this feel lazy.

 

[ZeoVGM]

I don't mind the UI looks but it's cumbersome to navigate with the slowass pointer, especially when they could have used the PS4 touchpad features. It's one of the things I expected to be corrected in the sequel. Thankfully it won't be a problem on pc.

I love the Destiny UI but I do hope they speed up deleting bounties.

Like, okay, I get it for special bounties (weeklies, quest related). But deleting normal Vanguard or Crucible bounties? Way too long.

 

[ElRenoRaven]

I love the Destiny UI but I do hope they speed up deleting bounties.

Like, okay, I get it for special bounties (weeklies, quest related). But deleting normal Vanguard or Crucible bounties? Way too long.

Yup. They need to tweak that no doubt. IT takes like 10 years to delete those. If anything let you click to delete then give you a simple confirmation dialog asking if you're sure.

 

[Trace]

I love the Destiny UI but I do hope they speed up deleting bounties.

Like, okay, I get it for special bounties (weeklies, quest related). But deleting normal Vanguard or Crucible bounties? Way too long.

I could probably compile a 2 page list on "shit I hope they fix". Inventory management and bounty management would definitely be top of the list though, the fact that you can't just discard a whole bunch of items at the moment is ridiculous.

 

[ElRenoRaven]

I could probably compile a 2 page list on "shit I hope they fix". Inventory management and bounty management would definitely be top of the list though, the fact that you can't just discard a whole bunch of items at the moment is ridiculous.

I know. I tried deleting the stupid chroma shit I have cause I don't bother with those. Deletes 1 by 1. I'm not deleting hundreds of those 1 by 1.

 

[cripterion]

I love the Destiny UI but I do hope they speed up deleting bounties.

Like, okay, I get it for special bounties (weeklies, quest related). But deleting normal Vanguard or Crucible bounties? Way too long.

Yeah that's what I'm talking about, the UI is really neat and clean, it works perfectly for this kind of game, my only beef was navigating through it with the stick.
I'm watching the Jackfrags footage, looks to run at a higher res than Destiny 1, do we have official numbers? 1440p, checkerboard?