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Destiny's PvP doesn't feel fun anymore
- Thread starter El Sloth
- Start date
TheCanisDirus
Member
Pretty sure he/she wasn't. Regular old D1 Crucible is just a spam of grenades, supers, melee-charges and secondary weapons. Always has been. Every mode.
Bungie has changed what they want PvP to be for D2. Those who dont enjoy it know what those of us who didnt enjoy D1 feel like now. Sucked. I understand and feel for you all.
This all is pretty much exactly how I felt about it.
With the D1 beta I played every mode for every minute that I could while it was available, and went on to play the full game for more time than I've put into any other game.
The D2 beta I played a handful of times and moved on by Saturday morning. I didn't play a single match where I felt like I had a fun time playing, I'd play the next match just to see if it would feel any better than the ones before it.
I got about 1000 hours in D1, most of that spent as a lone wolf in PVP.
While I enjoyed the PVP in D1, it was all becoming too much with the constant OP abilities, grenades and shottt/snipers 1 hit killing too often.
I didn't initially like D2 PVP but after spending some time with it this weekend I have done a complete 180 and really like the changes and slower pace in D2.
It makes for more skillful exchanges requiring aiming rather than heavily modded weapons and gear to get a kill. Things feel much more approachable too.
While I enjoyed the PVP in D1, it was all becoming too much with the constant OP abilities, grenades and shottt/snipers 1 hit killing too often.
I didn't initially like D2 PVP but after spending some time with it this weekend I have done a complete 180 and really like the changes and slower pace in D2.
It makes for more skillful exchanges requiring aiming rather than heavily modded weapons and gear to get a kill. Things feel much more approachable too.
gutter_trash
Banned
E-Sports crowd ruined Street Fighter V, now they are killing Destiny 2 by turning into a neutered shooter.
bravo
I want my Sub-Class to mean something.
D1 Sub-Class builds >>>>>>>>> whatever they are trying to force on us in D2
bravo
I want my Sub-Class to mean something.
D1 Sub-Class builds >>>>>>>>> whatever they are trying to force on us in D2
First post nails it.
But here are my thoughts...
I hated Destiny 1 PvP for a lot of reasons. A lot of which Bungie has fixed in Destiny 2 pvp.
-Less one shot kill abilities and weapons available on spawn. Spawning with snipers and shotgun sliding was bullshit
-Less players mindlessly running around
-Less reliance on your super constantly. Felt like in 6 v 6 D1 there was a super popping off every minute.
-General aim assist and netcode being very generous.
Now, it still has issues. I like lower super availability but its a bit too low. You should be getting a super around mid game. Good players may be able to squeeze one out at the end too. Grenades and melee could use a SLIGHT increase as well. Could be that armor pieces will allow us to tailor those cooldowns to our liking.
The game is similar to Halo now that its less lone wolf trying to use your special weapons to mow down the enemy team and more about positioning and team shooting. I like this. I don't think D2 PvP is that great, but its better than D1.
That being said, I completley understand the frustrations from the players who enjoyed how mindlessly chaotic Destiny 1 PvP was. It definitely had a more casual feel where they gave everyone so much power anyone could at least feel like a god every now and then. The players that liked that were the ones who still played D1 PvP for fun. Unlike me who would only touch it if there was a decent PvE weapon drop to get. I would slog through it for loot and hate every moment.
They decided to tailor PvP in D2 to people who didn't like it in D1 instead of supporting the people who did like it in D1. I felt the same way when 343 turned Halo more into a random CoD clusterfuck with Halo 4.
Exploratory
Banned
I wouldn't go that far but it's lost it's magic. The space magic I mean. I guess Titanfall will be the only game going forward that combines high lethality and high movement speed.
I had a blast with PvP.
I think people are having problems seeing the forest through the trees with this beta. Unfortunately, it was an old build and is very limited. With such a vertical slice, it's hard to see how things will play out with adjusted tuning, loot drops, armor with recharge perks, more weapons, more mods, etc.
We get this very small, contained version of the game and everyone just kneejerk calls it a bust. I'm personally very excited to see more.
I think people are having problems seeing the forest through the trees with this beta. Unfortunately, it was an old build and is very limited. With such a vertical slice, it's hard to see how things will play out with adjusted tuning, loot drops, armor with recharge perks, more weapons, more mods, etc.
We get this very small, contained version of the game and everyone just kneejerk calls it a bust. I'm personally very excited to see more.
ethomaz
Banned
The best evidence is playing... you take 3 shots to kill with a HC in D1 while you need 4 shots to kill with a HC in D2.
All guns increase 1-2 shots to kill (even more if we count Auto Rifles or other high shooting guns).
Stabbing Robot
Member
I will miss 6 player teams and bigger maps, because playing with more friends was fun. Hopefully supers get a bump with some mods or patches down the road, or at least a different mode with faster recharges, like maybe a more modest form of mayhem. Call it classic mode or something.
Two modes actually. And all my criticism will be relevant no matter how many maps or modes, seeing as how ability recharges are universal and Bungie themselves said they'll all be 4v4.
Personally, I wouldn't want to be pigeonholed into a playlist that will almost assuredly have a smaller population, but I would at least appreciate that as an option sure. Since Bungie hasn't talked about anything like that, then I'm going to give my impressions with the information available to me. Am I not allowed now to talk about how I'm worried the game I spent way too much time on is changing in a way I'm not vibing with? I can't speak on the state of the game as the Beta presents it?
And maybe attack my opinions without being a jerk about it next time? Please? Or this too much to ask in an online forum about video games?
I think the biggest difference between D1 and D2's multiplayer is the feeling of power.
In Destiny 1, I felt like a cross between a space wizard and a fucking Spartan, you just felt powerful. You had access to ton's of powerful weapons and abilities. Yes being on the receiving end of a super/shotgun/sniper/rocket/lmg was frustrating but it was equally if not more elating to be on the supply side of that equation.
In Destiny 2, I feel like an ODST. Weapons still have some kick, but I no longer feel like the walking elder god I was in the first Destiny. Engagements are no long about who's got the biggest space dick, but who can handle their regular sized space dick the best.
In Destiny 1, I felt like a cross between a space wizard and a fucking Spartan, you just felt powerful. You had access to ton's of powerful weapons and abilities. Yes being on the receiving end of a super/shotgun/sniper/rocket/lmg was frustrating but it was equally if not more elating to be on the supply side of that equation.
In Destiny 2, I feel like an ODST. Weapons still have some kick, but I no longer feel like the walking elder god I was in the first Destiny. Engagements are no long about who's got the biggest space dick, but who can handle their regular sized space dick the best.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
You just seem bad at the game. Supers weren't an never ending assault.
Destiny 2 being 4v4 only is lame as shit. As is the grenade and super cool downs. The only thing I like was the removal of special. The game just feels slower overall.
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
No, he's right. Destiny PvP was filled with 1hk weapons, supers, and grenades (with crazy radius range and tracked explosions). Why even make the kill times high when everyone is using a shotgun/sniper/fusion weapon? You could look at any individual one of those and say they weren't that bad, but combine them and it tips the scale into COD level randomness. And I'm not saying you can't be good at Destiny, I'm saying that the ratio of skill to reward is always shitty when it's filled with 1hk weapons/abilities, especially when a lot of them require no skill to use.
The Destiny 2 Beta smokes the original in this regard. It feels like I'm actually testing my skill in this game, almost into Halo territory. And keep in mind, super and grenade cooldowns will get faster with gear.
TetraGenesis
Member
I haven't been playing crucible but just in the PvE I can't stand how long Grenades and other abilities take to cooldown. I'd much prefer vastly weaker grenades that cooldown far more often by default. As of now, I feel like the gameplay has even less variety than before and I'm constantly wishing I had ways to mix it up.
What bothers me the most is that it feels like they are ruining the game they had just to appeal to an audience that is going to turn their noses up at Destiny anyway. The people who want CoD and Counterstrike are just going to keep playing those games anyway. I don't see the point in shunning the audience you have for the mere hope that some new audience will come along.
Bungie had such pride in having built a massively popular, balanced shooter with Halo. They seem to want that throne back, but it's a fool's errand to try and reclaim it by sacrificing all of Destiny's distinctive features.
Bungie had such pride in having built a massively popular, balanced shooter with Halo. They seem to want that throne back, but it's a fool's errand to try and reclaim it by sacrificing all of Destiny's distinctive features.
For the most part, I agree with you. I only felt this way after playing the Destiny 2 Beta and then going back to Destiny 1. I didn't feel like I had a super all the time, I felt like there were supers all of the time. Maybe it's the extra players in 6v6. I don't know. Maybe it's just the small difference in cooldown that makes a big difference.
I, personally, only got a couple supers each match. So, I didn't have supers all of the time. When it comes to grenades, I am part of the problem. I use grenades a lot. I run Shinobu's Vow on my hunter and Armaterium on my titan. Shinobu's Vow feels like too good of an exotic not to use. I start almost every match up with a health advantage and I can use the damage numbers to track an enemies location through walls. I mostly use the Armaterium for PvE, Twilight Garrison is better for PvP imo.
As an aside, I felt like this was worth quoting:
I'm out then. In Destiny a good player could really make a big difference for its team I'm not feeling it here.
Premade groups will have to much advantage for my liking.
People do weird things..
I honestly don't think it's that different from the first game. If you're competent on your own, going up against a group doesn't always mean you'll be bashing your head against a brick wall.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
Yes it does when team shotting is so deadly in D2.
SmoothRunningGun
Member
I don't get why people think this is a good thing. If you want halo you can go play halo. How about letting destiny be its own thing?
Bring back the space magic.
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
It's still there, it just isn't gushing out in the form of COD-like killstreaks. It's a good thing because Destiny already played like Halo, but the original's PvP wasn't even a shadow of Halo's design brilliance in regards to balance.
I don't want to play Halo (well I do, just not when I play Destiny), I want to play Destiny with better PvP.
gutter_trash
Banned
no it does not "feel just right"
Titan Magnetic Sticky Grenade in D2: Stick, Explosion 1 + Explosion 2... mother fucker is still alive
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
Not sure if this is even a response to what you quoted of mine.
Destiny 2 |OT| Fun Not Allowed
I'm intrigued to see how much is going to be changed besides the aforementioned from the devs with how little time is left until release. The beta really didn't click with me and I'm very close to waiting for final post-launch impressions or a complete edition like when Taken King released.
I'm intrigued to see how much is going to be changed besides the aforementioned from the devs with how little time is left until release. The beta really didn't click with me and I'm very close to waiting for final post-launch impressions or a complete edition like when Taken King released.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
That's actually a good thing. Nades should be less powerful but the cool downs should remain the same.
I think it's just as fun, but less frustrating.
scoobs
Member
Oh ok I'm just bad then, my mistake.
professor_t
Member
My preferences are precisely the exact opposite of those expressed by the OP. I feel like the fucking supers are a win button for people who love shiny objects and can't aim for shit.
Granted, I know this isn't true, but that's how I feel.
Granted, I know this isn't true, but that's how I feel.
Allnamestakenlol
Member
I agree with you completely, OP. D1's over-the-top matches were what really defined the game's mp for me. Pare that back too much and you're left with a generic sci-fi fps.
Edit: All the reported changes have actually totally killed my interest. Beh.
Edit: All the reported changes have actually totally killed my interest. Beh.
TheCanisDirus
Member
I'm with you. Some people do not enjoy skill-based gameplay it seems. It's like the COD crowd where every encounter is like pulling the handle of a slot machine at a casino. D1 was in some ways like this where it was just "wait for your recharges and hit the magic buttons". Now heaven forbid you have to communicate with your team to take down the other team lol. Wasn't Destiny always designed to be a social experience?
So much this.
Allnamestakenlol
Member
Feels like it's: skill-based vs those who don't care
Like Lord Shaxx says "That's why we have fire teams" or some such.
Yo where that 12 player free-for-all mode at.
Yup, back when I played it in Year 1, I considered uninstalling it every single time I got Panic Fisted. Nothing was more frustrating than rolling through some helpless team then suddenly taking instant death, unavoidable supers to the face 3 or 4 times in a row.
All the instant activation 1 hit kill bullshit that's the foundation of D1 PvP can go straight to hell. Look at Overwatch, there's ways to do supers without them feeling like cheap bullshit.
YUP
Not only the supers, but the sticky (MAGNETIC) grenades were instakill. Some melee abilities weren't an insta kill but were bullshit. (warlocks getting a shield on HIT, not kill) Basically winning all CQC.
Not to mention spawning with ammo to one shot weapons.
Yup, just the goddamn worst. You'd roll through some team 20-0 then die half a dozen times in seconds to super, super, heavy, heavy, super, and a sticky grenade without taking a single step after spawning. It was just bad. It's less bad now, in my opinion, but a lot of the Mario Kart charm of it is gone too.
katsubento
Member
Do we know what PvP modes will be in the final? Countdown is like a less sweatier Trials, Control feels radically different with less people.
Game will still load you into a match just 5 secs before Shaxx screams "Enough" if you solo. What the heck...can they not see the match is practically over already when searching?
Game will still load you into a match just 5 secs before Shaxx screams "Enough" if you solo. What the heck...can they not see the match is practically over already when searching?
Strangelove77
Member
I'm not sure if this is the right way to put it, but when it comes to Destiny, Bungie never feel like they're wrong. They won't change things no matter how many players might complain about it. Even if 99% of players hate something they'll still keep it because they think they're always right.
The way the "balanced" the first game was a clusterfuck. Their ideas for balancing was to just make things that were popular worse. They just lazily nerfed everything and called it a day.
All the real bigger changes only happened when a new expansion dropped.
It's embarrassing for them to not keep up when other companies are constantly adding and improving their game for free nowadays.
The only time it really was "fun" was back in the first few months of D1 and even then that wasn't fun just chaotic shit. It's fun the same way MW2 is fun in the sense that the shit is so stupidly unbalanced in this system that its not worth even caring about. It is pretty obviously crucible was always the last thing they created after finishing the PvE stuff.
They got back a little closer to halo with this on tho it needs some small changes like special charging faster etc. I would still love a mode with 6v6.
List is actually disrespectful as hell wow what am I reading
They got back a little closer to halo with this on tho it needs some small changes like special charging faster etc. I would still love a mode with 6v6.
List is actually disrespectful as hell wow what am I reading
This may genuinely be the most horrifying thing I've seen on GAF specifically relating to videogames.
This is a joke list right
This is actually the best way of describing Destiny 1 PvP.
I had fun on both initially at first. And then a month in I'm dreading finishing crucible bounties,. Then I dread grinding Iron banner. Then I finally realized "Why am I doing this, this isn't fun" and it was PvE from that point on, for the most part.
TheCanisDirus
Member
It's got to be backwards... or something. I mean it has to right? Or is this the most incorrect list ever created?
The original Destiny's PVP was such an unbalanced mess. Most of the time, even if I was on the winning side, I didn't have as much fun as I could have because I knew it was mostly because my weapons/supers were straight-up superior to the ones my opponents were using.
Any changes to that are positive in my book.
Wow. Just, wow.
Any changes to that are positive in my book.
Wow. Just, wow.