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Deus Ex: Mankind Divided | SPOILER Thread | "I never asked for this"
- Thread starter Simo
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Rockin' Ranger
Member
It's possible, if you knock down a structural weakness with someone on the other side it knocks them out. I don't think there's many opportunities to do it though, I only discovered it worked near the end of the London mission.
Crazymoogle
Member
There is a setup in the Smiley mission, for sure
Springfoot
Member
The only two I found were in the final London mission (mentioned above) and one in the Dvali theater right before that mission. The theater one is (standing inside the main foyer just inside the front door) off to the right in a room beneath the curving stairs. Although to actually access the breakable wall and knock the guy out, you have to go to the roof of the theater and hop into a vent situated above the camera. That lets you drop down and either enter the room to the left of the one with the breakable wall or punch through the wall and knock out a guy leaning against it.
That said, the theater wall actually seems to alert everyone (including cameras?) who see it. I tried reloading a number of times and very carefully hiding the knocked out body, but apparently the busted wall itself (visible through the windows in the room even when the door is closed) causes people to get suspicious and run inside the room.
The wall busting in general seemed a little hit or miss with how the AI reacted to it as well. Several times I'd break a wall and nobody seemed to give a shit, but there's one breakable wall in Prague (upper half I believe) that puts the population into a panic as soon as it's broken. Meanwhile smashing into the concrete walls everywhere else in city fails to generate a reaction.
Ok, I don't think he's a clone anymore, but he's definitely a sleeper agent. The psychiatrist tells Debeers that despite suffering massive trauma he's remarkably stable and still following the program. A clone wouldn't have gone through any trauma.
Not sure why they replaced all of his Sarif augs though.
Edit: Scratch that. There's even more foreshadowing if you manage to talk Allison out of joining the machine god. Adam tells her she can't escape her suffering because all her memories will carry over.
Not sure why they replaced all of his Sarif augs though.
Edit: Scratch that. There's even more foreshadowing if you manage to talk Allison out of joining the machine god. Adam tells her she can't escape her suffering because all her memories will carry over.
EastOfEden
Member
I really liked the main allies in this game - Vega, Miller, Delara, Elias & Koller (although yes two of them turn out to not be your allies at all). I do wish we spent more time getting to know them. Even though I didn't like the allies in HR as much, their relationships with Adam were more fleshed out.
The villains on the other hand, don't even compare to Zhao Yun Ru and the Tyrants from HR. The only two main ones you really face in this game were Viktor and Allison... Bleh. Viktor was boring and generic from the start all the way through (and also his design is ridiculous). "Mother" seemed pretty cool and the cult was interesting, but she was a let down when you are able to talk her into giving up. She never thought that her anger and pain would carry on with her after the ascension, really? That being said, if they make the ascension canon I think the result could be pretty interesting.
Also, Megan is working for Page Industries now? I must have missed that. But that makes total sense.
The villains on the other hand, don't even compare to Zhao Yun Ru and the Tyrants from HR. The only two main ones you really face in this game were Viktor and Allison... Bleh. Viktor was boring and generic from the start all the way through (and also his design is ridiculous). "Mother" seemed pretty cool and the cult was interesting, but she was a let down when you are able to talk her into giving up. She never thought that her anger and pain would carry on with her after the ascension, really? That being said, if they make the ascension canon I think the result could be pretty interesting.
Also, Megan is working for Page Industries now? I must have missed that. But that makes total sense.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
Moff
Member
page talks to her in the outro of HR, so that wasn't really surprising
AHA-Lambda
Member
hold on, what's this about a fake Eliza??
Vic_Viper
Member
Did the Madam Photographe stuff ever lead to anything or was it just an in game story to say Jensen was being followed around Prague?
I found the locker and her apartment with Jensen's confidential medical file. It went into the story item folder but by the end if the game it had never been brought up. Possible DLC story?
I found the locker and her apartment with Jensen's confidential medical file. It went into the story item folder but by the end if the game it had never been brought up. Possible DLC story?
There was an Eliza Cassan mission?!
Look out for glitchy electronic billboards.
Regginator
Member
Who's this guy by the way, not someone from OG Deus Ex, right? I thought maybe Stanton, but then I saw DeBeers talking to Stanton (whom we never see the face of), and he looks the other way, not to this bald guy.
EmCeeGramr
Member
There's a quest in Prague nighttime where the real Eliza from Human Revolution will contact you and reveal that the one on TV in Mankind Divided is a replacement version.
His name is Volkard Rand, and yeah, he's not from the original Deus Ex.
Ordinaryundone
Member
The "real" Eliza got fracked up when Panchea was destroyed, causing her personality to splinter. "Helle", the part that we rescue in Mankind Divided, seems to be the free will portion of Eliza's personality while the Eliza we still see on the news is just a straight up Illuminati stooge now. I'm not sure if it's an entirely new Eliza AI with different programming or if it's just what the Illuminati managed to recover after the incident but the point is that there are two Elizas now.
Regginator
Member
What, didn't even know there was an Eliza quest... But regardless, I already knew the current Eliza isn't the real one, I think I found the proof for it in the Picus vaults in that bank.
EmCeeGramr
Member
I missed it the first time around as well, and there's some neat little things:
A) She keeps talking about "versions" of herself, just like Daria does, and how the important thing is to coexist with other versions of herself. She even says that her memories of Adam are somehow at odds with the Adam in front of her, and when Adam asks what that means, she says she's unsure what the discrepancy is.
B) When you enter the Red Light District during the curfew, she'll cause a distraction by setting off an explosion and allowing you to sneak past.
I was a bit disappointed that she doesn't cause any kind of interruption or secret message in the Fallout ending slides at the end if you met her.
A) She keeps talking about "versions" of herself, just like Daria does, and how the important thing is to coexist with other versions of herself. She even says that her memories of Adam are somehow at odds with the Adam in front of her, and when Adam asks what that means, she says she's unsure what the discrepancy is.
B) When you enter the Red Light District during the curfew, she'll cause a distraction by setting off an explosion and allowing you to sneak past.
I was a bit disappointed that she doesn't cause any kind of interruption or secret message in the Fallout ending slides at the end if you met her.
KyanMehwulfe
Member
Yeah, specifically at this timestamp in the scene, looks like waist down is all machine.
She speaks differently now, too. Far more blatant in her propaganda. She was actually pretty neutral and subtle in HR but now in MD it's almost shameless how biased she is. And I love the little wink every time she says "live" from Picus.
Not yet... I'm explored quite a lot so I'm not sure if there is one. But yeah, there were a few in HR... think he was a DR Baller, the weapons dealer in Detroit apartment, behind the gas station, and also if you come from the 'left' to sneak into the actual DR Baller territory where you climb that fire escape across from Jensen's apartment. So there's a few in HR, and I can clearly remember 2 off the top of my head in Detroit.
In the Dvali complex, I managed to do it to one guy.
It was the only time in the whole game where I did a takedown through the wall.
Yeah, that was one of my favorites. I felt like her tv personality was a little off at the beginning of the game and I'm glad they went in depth on to why that was.
Also, Picus means business. Sending a hit squad on ya. That was pretty cool when Cassan showed you the outside of your apartment and bam!
EastOfEden
Member
Oh, cool - I forgot about that.
Actually you can confront her about it. She kind of shrugs it off by saying she joined after Manderley arrived so they didn't have a connection beforehand (which they probably did, but hard to prove).
I thought that the whole traitor angle was pretty good actually. I thought it was Delara at first like everybody because the game made her so over the top-ly suspicious. Then as the game progressed I became convinced she was just a red herring, so by the end credits I was actually surprised when she turned out to be the traitor. lol
I think my favorite is either that or the harvester quests. It kind of came out of nowhere and I loved how it ended.
It was a great and very Deus Ex-esque boss fight that I wasn't expecting at all. When she pulled the gun on me I was like "lawl okay that explains a lot." Then all the laser traps and smoke popped up, and she activates a fucking TITAN aug and I'm like, "....okay, you really did youy homework" and was forced to take her seriously.
Speaking of the Harvester, is there a way to deal with Radko Perry? Not the part about the Harvester quest because
it's pretty clear cut that he didn't kill anyone,
Basileus777
Member
The All in the Family quest could have been the best if the body dragging mechanics weren't so goddamn clunky.
I hate the body dragging in this game. There were a bunch of points where I would cause panic because I was dragging a body and people somehow heard/saw it through walls. And that's not even taking into account the stupid hold button crap.
This was REALLY annoying in the
London
Rockin' Ranger
Member
I know I absolutely loved all the times when I went to read a pocket secretary I picked up off a body by holding E only to be dragging a body around when I returned to gameplay.
I don't think the main story is as "bad" as people are insinuating- is it sequel bait? Sure, but if the main plot is about finding the guy responsible for the terrorist attacks, surely you can't surprised when the resolution involves confronting said person? I know its Deus Ex and there are supposed to be twists and turns, and that the final play should not reflect the initial objective- but the story told here is on a smaller scale than that of Human Revolution.
One that that bugs me though is the whole "prequel" nature of these games. Why not just reboot the series? When Human Revolution came out, I could hardly believe this game existed in the same universe as the original, and I was okay with that even though the first was my favorite game of all time. But now... we are teased with these villains and plot points that our dear Adam Jensen won't even deal with or confront, like we won't even get to the top guys like Page or Manderly with Jensen. Its almost aggravating knowing that your actions will ultimately, in the end still lead to the bleak future as presented in the first game. I feel like rebooting the franchise would honestly be easier while also allowing the game to drop all the references that will only grow more cumbersome.
As for the characters, I thought they were decent. I really liked Miller, hated that pilot but I guess that was the intended emotion they were trying to evoke because of who he really is. Vega I thought was okay, Koller as well though I wish we could have seen more of these two characters. I enjoyed the gang-war side story, especially the different outcomes that were possible. Overall though, the cast of characters is not as good as the previous game. Pritchard, Malik and Sarif has this aura of "realism" to them that made them feel a natural part of this lived in world. I loved that about Human Revolution, especially when I thought back in 2011 that it was a somewhat plausible future- the whole world felt "real", everything from you essentially being a guy with a job as opposed to the promised hero, to the emails you would read on a computer. Not that Mankind Divided lacks that, but the characters seem a lot more distant and alien this time around as opposed to chummy co-workers in the predecessor.
Speaking of characters, the villain, Marchenko- I find it interesting how heavily advertised he was considering the game wants you to wonder if he was the terrorist or not.... yet he is featured in the first CGI trailer as an adversary and on the damn cover! Despite his "big dumb brute" design which personally I am not a fan of, I thought he was a decent villain. As if he was better than the Human Revolution villains... it depends on who you thought held the moniker in that game. He is definitely superior to the Tyrants who felt like token "your princess is in another castle" bosses, and Zhu as well. If you think its Darrow and Taggart though, then Marchenko does fall flat. Still, I appreciate how he was actually given screentime unlike most video game villains who have like one appearance in the beginning/mid-game before the endgame.
Lastly, I know that the whole "mechanical apartheid" thing has come under fire for being so on the nose and force din its racial analogy, a point I mostly agree with- but despite that, there are a few moments of brilliance. All of Golem City for example, was a fucking tragedy. Reading some of the emails really gives you insight into how badly these people are forced to live, and the overall atmosphere is extremely oppressive and effectively conveys the somberness of it all. I think I remember one room with like five dead bodies, and the story, if I am piecing this right is that a couple is expecting a baby that they are not sure if they want to raise-the brother of the husband drops off some stuff that would be classified as "illegal" but the police find out and proceed to murder the entire family. Maybe I am falling right into Eidos' trap of extremely deliberate attempts at pathos but fuck, it worked.
One that that bugs me though is the whole "prequel" nature of these games. Why not just reboot the series? When Human Revolution came out, I could hardly believe this game existed in the same universe as the original, and I was okay with that even though the first was my favorite game of all time. But now... we are teased with these villains and plot points that our dear Adam Jensen won't even deal with or confront, like we won't even get to the top guys like Page or Manderly with Jensen. Its almost aggravating knowing that your actions will ultimately, in the end still lead to the bleak future as presented in the first game. I feel like rebooting the franchise would honestly be easier while also allowing the game to drop all the references that will only grow more cumbersome.
As for the characters, I thought they were decent. I really liked Miller, hated that pilot but I guess that was the intended emotion they were trying to evoke because of who he really is. Vega I thought was okay, Koller as well though I wish we could have seen more of these two characters. I enjoyed the gang-war side story, especially the different outcomes that were possible. Overall though, the cast of characters is not as good as the previous game. Pritchard, Malik and Sarif has this aura of "realism" to them that made them feel a natural part of this lived in world. I loved that about Human Revolution, especially when I thought back in 2011 that it was a somewhat plausible future- the whole world felt "real", everything from you essentially being a guy with a job as opposed to the promised hero, to the emails you would read on a computer. Not that Mankind Divided lacks that, but the characters seem a lot more distant and alien this time around as opposed to chummy co-workers in the predecessor.
Speaking of characters, the villain, Marchenko- I find it interesting how heavily advertised he was considering the game wants you to wonder if he was the terrorist or not.... yet he is featured in the first CGI trailer as an adversary and on the damn cover! Despite his "big dumb brute" design which personally I am not a fan of, I thought he was a decent villain. As if he was better than the Human Revolution villains... it depends on who you thought held the moniker in that game. He is definitely superior to the Tyrants who felt like token "your princess is in another castle" bosses, and Zhu as well. If you think its Darrow and Taggart though, then Marchenko does fall flat. Still, I appreciate how he was actually given screentime unlike most video game villains who have like one appearance in the beginning/mid-game before the endgame.
Lastly, I know that the whole "mechanical apartheid" thing has come under fire for being so on the nose and force din its racial analogy, a point I mostly agree with- but despite that, there are a few moments of brilliance. All of Golem City for example, was a fucking tragedy. Reading some of the emails really gives you insight into how badly these people are forced to live, and the overall atmosphere is extremely oppressive and effectively conveys the somberness of it all. I think I remember one room with like five dead bodies, and the story, if I am piecing this right is that a couple is expecting a baby that they are not sure if they want to raise-the brother of the husband drops off some stuff that would be classified as "illegal" but the police find out and proceed to murder the entire family. Maybe I am falling right into Eidos' trap of extremely deliberate attempts at pathos but fuck, it worked.
Springfoot
Member
Others have mentioned it, but to be more specific the quest is activated by checking one of the digital poster/map kiosks just outside Adam's apartment complex during Prague 2. It will be visibly and audibly glitching out and interacting with it kicks off the quest.
The current Eliza on TV is just an older build of the Eliza Adam met in HR and saved during the mission mentioned above in MD. The Picus vault in the bank contains a computer with an email mentioning how they stepped back a number of versions to an older build, and while it's less refined they figure the public won't notice or catch on. They're using that old build as a branch point or a bit like a system restore of the last stable version.
Yeah I'm really hoping MD Adam isn't just a clone since it would break too much of the core story involving both his and the Denton brothers' importance. Being able to pop out adult clones breaks things as does having a number of backup Adams they could have been using from day 1. Neither scenario plays out well with the past and future story beats they need to work with.
I'm currently reading the DX Black Light book that connects HR to MD, and the first chapter contains this passage:
I haven't finished the book, so I don't know if anything else of significance is revealed on the subject. It appears to confirm that this is in fact the same Adam we played as in HR, although the memory loss aspect leaves some wiggle room for the writers if they want to do the clone thing.
Additionally, in support of this being the same Adam (not a clone) remember how Koller describes the new augs as being more sloppily retrofitted over and around the clean and precise Serif parts. I don't recall the exact phrasing, but it was clear the experimental stuff was done by other people after the fact (plus you later find the blueprints for those upgrades in the TYM vault). While we later learn the Serif stuff is lacking its identifying serial numbers, it seems bizarre that the Illuminati would go to such great lengths to give a clone Adam scars and battle damage to fake him out while simultaneously making the new augs such obvious retrofits.
Nico_D
Member
Yeah, that part kind of sucked. Luckily it goes by rather quickly. Just push through, so did I. The rest is better.
I'm playing New Game + with Deus Ex difficulty. Breezing/stealthing through the levels with almost all the augs, trying to find new routes which I didn't find the first time around. Not much of a challenge. Still surpsingly fun and relaxing.
Now I only need to remember to do that Eliza mission mentioned on this page, thanks for that! Missed it previously.
Johan Liebert
Member
When does this preorder mission take place? Is it during the 30 hours between the bombing and Jensen waking up at his apartment?
His Majesty
Banned
During the main game itself I think. I actually see no reason why this couldn't have been a quest in the main game instead of a separate campaign.
SkylineRKR
Member
I think its after mission 5. Its a decent mission and there is no reason it was cut.
Exactly, because just as I thought they would like fucking clockwork; they did this.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=214458678&postcount=210
Sure, it's no missing link but there was no reason for it to be there when the outcome was already known. They talk about things that have already transpired and concluded.
But like missing link, it seems it was there for sales purposes; pre-order and get free DLC!
They've done it twice now, for fuck sake
They didn't even try hard either.Also let's talk about the ending, how it just....ends abruptly when it was obvious it wasn't supposed to, if you loot quick enough there's a praxis kit but you get like 2 seconds to do that before the credits automatically roll. There's no save option past that so I'm not sure how they will link your decisions to the next game.
Ah well, I really enjoyed it though but I'm glad I listened to people saying do all the side stuff/explore because the main story is short!
Piku_Ringo
Banned
Top is the pic of Janus, bottom is the guy seen in the cutscenes who looks just like him
What's this about ?
The only confidential file on Jense that I remember is the one in that Orlov's apartment.
Iirc she has 3 appearances. One in the bombing cutscene. She really stands out in the background when you are talking to Vega, then you find her heel at orlov's and I forget the 3rd
did you do anything to the leader of that group? i knocked him out in the shop and he was complaining about being knocked out when he was walking around my flat lol. it was hilarious. im guessing itll just be nameless goons if you kill him.
no you cant do anything to radko perry really because hes innocent even if he is a scumbag.
i loved the harvester mission too. i solved it with her shutdown phrase, avoiding a fight completely. i did reload after just to see what happens without it and holy shit i saw her titan aug and icarus dash and gtfo lol.
and about the clone idea, i dont think adam is. it seems way too silly to me. and like someone said it doesnt match up with what was established in the original and the dev team seem very respective of that.
i think they replaced some of his augs so they can track him and his memory loss is partly a side effect of basically drowning in sub zero ocean and perhaps a little tampering from the illumanti docs.
SkylineRKR
Member
Yeah he's not a clone. Eliza speaks about being sort of reset to an older self, and she hints at Jensen being in such a situation as well.
He might have been found and then revived by the Illuminati, then tweaked with hidden stuff and made a sleeper agent doing their job. But I think he's still the same person.
He might have been found and then revived by the Illuminati, then tweaked with hidden stuff and made a sleeper agent doing their job. But I think he's still the same person.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
third was the LIMB clinic with Vega during lockdown night.
Speaking of which. Jensen should of logically spent the entire night walking those empty tunnels city to city with the slow ass pace he was going.
Don't believe he is a clone. It was mentioned (either in this or the other thread) that you can find augmentation blueprints in GARM that unlock more dialogue with Sarif. I've also found a Nanoblade Blueprint in the TYM, but don't know if that unlocks dialogue. But since you can find the TYM Vault Keycard on Orlov's body, I'm thinking that it does unlock dialogue.
I'm close to GARM again, so I'll know soon.
Turns out only GARM unlocks the conversation option. Kinda lame, since TYM is part of that side quest with finding out what happened to you...
I'm close to GARM again, so I'll know soon.
Turns out only GARM unlocks the conversation option. Kinda lame, since TYM is part of that side quest with finding out what happened to you...
KyanMehwulfe
Member
I suppose because those schematics are already sort of tied to Olav, and the Tai Yong Medical vault key was from Olav... So in a way, finding that schematic just sort of confirms what Sarif already knew -- that Olav was working on those augs and also that he had worked with Tai Yong Medical. Whereas the one you find in GARM is different, not because of the schematic or Olav per se, but specifically that it ties Olav and his augs to that specific location. His TYM association was known but being associated with GARM was new info.
I guess at least... I mean, could be an oversight too because even a small comment about it ("Oh, it looked like Olav may have been doing some of that aug work for TYM too") would have been nice but I could see reasoning for why just the GARM one was emphasized. Anyways, yeah, same thing happened to me. First playthrough, I had the TYM schematic but not the GARM one and no extra dialogue with Sarif; second time, I had both and just that new GARM dialogue was added.
I guess at least... I mean, could be an oversight too because even a small comment about it ("Oh, it looked like Olav may have been doing some of that aug work for TYM too") would have been nice but I could see reasoning for why just the GARM one was emphasized. Anyways, yeah, same thing happened to me. First playthrough, I had the TYM schematic but not the GARM one and no extra dialogue with Sarif; second time, I had both and just that new GARM dialogue was added.
Springfoot
Member
In addition to the material I posted above regarding the clone possibility, here's another quote from DX Black Light during a private conversation between two of the five Illuminati heads Elizabeth DuClare and Lucius DeBeers:
For me this is the final nail in the coffin for the clone theory. This conversation is completely private between two Illuminati heads and only happens after Jensen unexpectedly appears after having escaped a facility under DuClare's purview. It's not the kind of thing she would say if they left the original Adam to sink to the Arctic floor while they reintroduced a new clone into the world.
Also for those who aren't aware all the supplemental Deus Ex novels have been written by James Swallow, who has apparently worked on Human Revolution, The Missing Link, The Fall and Mankind Divided. So the material in the books isn't coming from an outsider who may be inadvertently creating plot holes without understanding where the games are headed.
For me this is the final nail in the coffin for the clone theory. This conversation is completely private between two Illuminati heads and only happens after Jensen unexpectedly appears after having escaped a facility under DuClare's purview. It's not the kind of thing she would say if they left the original Adam to sink to the Arctic floor while they reintroduced a new clone into the world.
Also for those who aren't aware all the supplemental Deus Ex novels have been written by James Swallow, who has apparently worked on Human Revolution, The Missing Link, The Fall and Mankind Divided. So the material in the books isn't coming from an outsider who may be inadvertently creating plot holes without understanding where the games are headed.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
"I sell these things."
"Yeah, I got that."
"Buy something."
Is this how people do business?
"Yeah, I got that."
"Buy something."
Is this how people do business?
It would have been nice, since there is a decent amount of missions that unlock these conversation options or optional investigations. But I guess you are right. The connection is already there, so the only important connection was GARM.
Yeah, that seals the deal for me, too. Thanks for posting that.
I'm more annoyed that the conversations are repeated every single time. Doesn't matter what they sell, you are having the same initial conversation on each visit. I know what you sell, so don't tell me again.
Not sure if you also wanted to post this in the Spoiler thread.
