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Diablo 3 : most disappointing game of the year?

OK, honestly, are you trolling us?

D3 is the ultimate example of your character being solely defined by weapon. Weapon is everything. Weapon is the character.

Class doesn't matter, damage comes from weapon. Weapon DPS is god.
Wizard spells damage? Weapon.
Witch doctor summoned pets damage? Weapon.
Barbarian whirlwind farts damage? Weapon.

What type of weapon? Doesn't matter!

Wizard with bow casting spells that derive damage from bow? Check.
Monk throwing punches with long spear? Check.

DPS is all that matters. Different types of damage, such as ice to slow, lightning to stun, holy to heal? Nah, took it out during beta, it was too confusing. Just DPS.

It's so ridiculous that even when I take off my normal gear and put on MF gear it doesn't even make a huge difference because all that matters is my fucking spear with 1k DPS, 80% crit+100% crit from gem. Yeah baby, DPS ! My spells are so much more powerful with that spear! Awesome!

Are you playing a different game?

Haha, damn i remember when i first saw this shit with no weapon categorization. Couldn't believe it. Same i thought something is wrong with game.

What is more funny they still don't allow monk to use bow. Shit is hilarious. Like that would change something.

Second one was that there is no normal attack after you learn skill.
I can't unsee they gone with DA2 Press A for something awesome.

Can't understand who though that is a good idea, neither can't see how they talked about it.

"So here is 2H Hammer and now Wizard does more damage with his laser."
 
Haha, damn i remember when i first saw this shit with no weapon categorization. Couldn't believe it. Same i thought something is wrong with game.

What is more funny they still don't allow monk to use bow. Shit is hilarious. Like that would change something.

Second one was that there is no normal attack after you learn skill.
I can't unsee they gone with DA2 Press A for something awesome.

Can't understand who though that is a good idea, neither can't see how they talked about it.

"So here is 2H Hammer and now Wizard does more damage with his laser."

I remember actually worrying that DHs would be allowed to shoot arrows through an axe. I was relieved when I saw a bow was required, I still hadn't realized that this would be the least of the game's illogical choices and problems.
But I agree, it makes no sense since wizards shoot spells with their hammers and monks punch with their shields and spears.
 
I am almost done with PvE and thus the entire content of D3 as both my barb and monk have the best possible gear. Now I wait for new content through patches and offcourse the PvP patch. Looking forward to that.
 
Actually yes, much clearer.

I agree with some of what you say, but still:

1. How can you say weapon mattered above everything in D2 when you also say that there was a specific gear set for each proposed build? Yes, gear mattered a lot. But not weapons only, gear in general.

Which, in a loot game, is pretty perfect design.

Every class and build wanted something different, not the same high DPS weapon.

Just that these character builds worked backwards. You googled up (or dogpiled/yahood lol) the perfect weapon/shield combo, and worked backwards to design your character around those items, and specifically that weapon. As a gameplay design this is fine, but as acknowledged by Blizz, it made for a clusterfuck backed to balance any future changes to the game.

2. As you agree with me, all damage in D3 revolves around weapon DPS. Spells, skills, everything.
So even if items with varied abilities, such as freeze, or even teleport etc. do come out, weapon will still be extremely important and there is no way to circumvent that without changing one of D3's most core design choices: to have everything base off weapon DPS.

So while I do agree that obviously items with more to offer than stats+all resist+crit. chance would greatly add to variety, different builds, different people wanting different items and not all the same, I can't see how it is specifically D3's design that helps in that.

That would be true for any game (and was so for D2), and would also be true for D3, but it would still be less so, not more so, because of complete reliance of all classes on main weapon for damage.

It only helps in that adding items and making changes like that shouldn't (and that's a tentative shouldn't - Blizz aren't beyond ballsing it up) break the game.

I fail to see the awesome and revolutionary change in ARPG game design that D3 went with because of the rune system. D2 didn't have 'runes', it had 'skill trees', Titan Quest didn't have 'runes', it had 2 templates to combine and skills to choose... what's so different here?

Runes certainly are not the be all and end all, for sure. But basing your character on skills rather than your weapon is. Runes are just the support act to that. And yes, there is much work needed here to make them not just interesting, but viable. The diversity in builds just isn't there, Blizz were certainly caught with their pants down here. The WD's Giant Frog for example, could be much, much more awesome than it is :(

Why is that a bad thing? That sounds pretty cool that you could find items and build characters around it. Maybe it should be more like Path of Exile and you find ability gems, set passive skills in the tech tree, and use/create weapons with the sockets/affixes needed to improve the effectiveness of your builds.

It's not necessarily a bad thing, at all. That was never my contention, rather I think that a lot of people's complaints stem from this mismatch you highlighted. And that's fair - there is nothing unreasonable with that intrinsically in the loot-driven ARPG genre.

Thankfully, PoE and (from the little I've looked at, I'm trying to keep the surprises at a high) Torchlight 2 should both provide this game mechanic (let's call it, 'loot-based character design'), in some shape or form. I've enjoyed the short beta time I spent in PoE and the sometimes stark contrast it provides to D3;looking forward to the proper open beta soon!

In D3 it don't seem like you have much that make your builds unique. Crit chance and change runes, it's kinda boring.

And here is a legitimate complaint for sure at this early stage (compounded I think by the lack of real diversity between the classes themselves, which I think is the most egregious error in launch D3) This is where a huge portion of improvement can be made, both in item affix diversity and the way it ties in with skills, and the skills themselves.

Time will tell.
 
Diablo 2 was my longest running game; I probably put over a thousand hours into that beautiful sombich. I finished normal and nightmare on diablo 3 and I'd had enough. So yes, not only was it the most disappointing game for me this year, it was probably the biggest game related disappointment of my life.
 
Wasn't disappointing to me. It's a shame the loot table is such crap.

That said, I put 270 hours into the game. That's fucking value for money if I ever heard it.

It's a good thing the combat is so much fun.
 
Diablo 2 was my longest running game; I probably put over a thousand hours into that beautiful sombich. I finished normal and nightmare on diablo 3 and I'd had enough. So yes, not only was it the most disappointing game for me this year, it was probably the biggest game related disappointment of my life.
I feel like this is a point that a lot of podcasts I've listened to miss when trying to understand why people are dissapointed in a game they mostly enjoyed for 80-100hrs. A lot of people expected to be playing this game for years on end like they did D2 and so, despite the significant time sink compared to other games, it still falls short of expectations.
 
Wasn't disappointing to me. It's a shame the loot table is such crap.

That said, I put 270 hours into the game. That's fucking value for money if I ever heard it.

It's a good thing the combat is so much fun.

If time is the only thing you value, sure you got your money's worth. When one only considers time to be the only true gauge of value and fun I guess World of Warcraft is the best game ever made.
 
Wasn't disappointing to me. It's a shame the loot table is such crap.

That said, I put 270 hours into the game. That's fucking value for money if I ever heard it.

It's a good thing the combat is so much fun.

Yes, all of that pointing and clicking really makes up for the abundance of failures D3 has.

If time is the only thing you value, sure you got your money's worth. When one only considers time to be the only true gauge of value and fun I guess World of Warcraft is the best game ever made.


Hah.
 
I don't want to mention how much time I spent on Final Fantasy 11, the hour to cost ratio puts it at the best game I'll ever play. I might as well give up gaming seeing as though I'll never get tricked into investing so much time in MMORPGs and their time sink tricks.

Diablo 3 has time sinks too. Normal mode for example.
 
A poll involving 22,000 answers on PC gamer on "which franchises are getting worse or better" has Diablo pretty awfully low:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/08/01/w...-are-getting-worse-the-pc-gamer-poll-results/

Diablo is 3rd place of 'most votes getting worse', after CoD and Dragon Age.

Along with WoW, Dragon Age (damn, had to remind me) and Mass Effect, Blizzard and Bioware are receiving a huge amount of negativity.

Now could it be because they were bought out by blood sucking, exploiting companies that only want short term share holder appeasement and couldn't give a fuck about quality and legacy of franchises? Just saying.
 
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ha
 
And here is a legitimate complaint for sure at this early stage (compounded I think by the lack of real diversity between the classes themselves, which I think is the most egregious error in launch D3) This is where a huge portion of improvement can be made, both in item affix diversity and the way it ties in with skills, and the skills themselves.

Time will tell.


Torchlight 2, Borderlands 2, Path of Exile, Dark Souls... There's really no reason to wait around for Blizzard to un-fuck their game.


PoE is the only one comparable, and it's just exactly what D2 was but worse.

I'm not personally interested in Path of Exile, but I imagine a lot of people who felt burned by Diablo 3's dumbing down of the Diablo 2 formula will be. Borderlands takes Diablo's loot system and attaches it to an fps, which adds an element of skill that Diablo 3 is completely lacking. I'll give you that Dark Souls isn't much like Diablo, but it is an action rpg with loot that I'm going to spend a million hours playing instead of waiting for some magic patch from Blizzard. And it's just ridiculous of you to say that Torchlight isn't comparable to Diablo when it's a straight Diablo clone created by some of the developers of the original Diablo games. It's even the same guy doing the music.
 
I didn't know there was a chance to get a refund on D3. When was this? During the error 33 I bet, when people didn't know much about how the game and loot really was.
 
Torchlight 2, Borderlands 2, Path of Exile, Dark Souls... There's really no reason to wait around for Blizzard to un-fuck their game.

That's right, I even said as much earlier. I've got, played or have pre ordered all of those titles listed. It's great! By the time I'm done with Borderlands 2 D3 will feel fresh and new again.
 
I didn't know there was a chance to get a refund on D3. When was this? During the error 33 I bet, when people didn't know much about how the game and loot really was.

I think in certain countries in Asia, the Govt stepped in because it was illegal to sell a game and not provide 100% playability, and the server queues that were rampant was enough. But I'm not sure the specifics and which country.
 
That's right, I even said as much earlier. I've got, played or have pre ordered all of those titles listed. It's great! By the time I'm done with Borderlands 2 D3 will feel fresh and new again.

I find that part of your post pretty funny as the last thing you said before that was "time will tell". I just don't understand this optimism that you have when Jay has stated how much he dislikes what made D2 so great.

So what is left, for Diablo 3 to build on it's own strength? I don't see it having any that would make propel to being above mediocre with the game mechanics. The problem isn't that these are oversights or bugs, but 100% intentional.

Plus you have a really strange way of skewing things.

When I see a Character in D3 whipping through enemies, I don't wonder what weapon they're using, instead I just want to know what skill it is and what rune it is. I can't even see what weapon you're using, and it doesn't matter most of the time.

For starters, for any skill to be useful you need X amount of DPS/Crit hit/chance before it becomes useful. This is a fact that can't be ignored at any stage of the game and if you if it isn't the first thing you think about then you don't have a good understanding of the game.

Let me push this further, go out to inferno, remove your weapon and see how many mobs you can kill and how long it takes you. Then equip your weapon, and tell me if you saw a difference. At this point is clear that D3 has little to do with skill and rune. I already posted earlier how D2 HC Ironman challenge was beat by a bunch of naked toons. This shows that D2 is more skill base.

When poisonelf said the weapon doesn't matter, he was clearly referring to the weapon type. Meaning how a Sorc could be as effective with a bow than with a staff. Since spells receive the most benefit from the DPS rather then stats or even synergy from previous spells.

I must say most of what you have said to this point lack the most basic understand of an ARPG.
 
Weapons are very important, I guess it's ok because they are all not that different from each other, much like the gear in the game, or the loot that bosses drops. Everything has a chance to drop anything, of those drops the stats on the stuff has a chance to be anything, of those stats they are just basic stuff nothing interesting. In Diablo 3 everything is special (trophy).
 
Sorry for the bump, but there are enough Diablo 3 threads and I think that's the most appropriate one for this.

So, another friend of mine got hacked, that's the second, the first was in the first huge hack wave that Blizzard blamed on customers not buying authenticators (tm).

He was away for vacations, and I suddenly see him online, creating and leaving games in Act 1 every minute. I tried talking to him, of course no reply. I tried to reach him by phone (he's a real life friend) but he had it turned off for vacations.

He's been online 24 hours/day for 2 days now, they turned his account into a farming bot.

So he just got back, and what's even 'funnier' is that they used an authenticator on his account. He can't log in, and he now has to go through the hell that Blizzard 'customer support' has become, where they'll berate him for not having bought an authenticator (tm) from start.

He won't even try actually, it's not worth it anymore.

What a fucking joke of a company they've become. I truly wish they'll get what they deserve for their incompetence, arrogance, and complete disregard for their customers.
 

OMG I love it.

And as for D3, considering my anticipation for it after pouring 1000's of hours into D2 from 2000-2002/3 it is probably the biggest disappointment of a game yet. I've played worse games, don't get me wrong, but this one was the ultimate buzzkill.

The only saving grace this game has was the fact that I've been able to make money off of it and continue to do so. I know it's hypocritical for me to do so given my disdain for the AH systems, but I might as well make some $$$ while people continue to play this pile.

As was said there are so many fundamental problems with the game. Having them fix legendary and set items is only a band-aid. It is still an extremely boring system, not too mention low level items are completely worthless in D3 except for leveling characters! And look at how many people are leveling compared to D2. People are complaining about level 52 items in Inferno, but in D2 you had Gull Dagger for instance dropping from Hell Baal. I don't even want to think about it anymore (it has sadly taken up a good portion of my thoughts this summer). If anything this is another nail in the coffin for games not being as good as the used to be.
 
I'm the luckiest man alive. No authenticator and been playing WoW and now Diablo 3 for years.

(Or I'm just smart and don't fall for phishing.)
 
There's been a lot of talk about Diablo 3 since its release two months ago. Some people liked it, but a majority of gamers seem to agree that it's only a shadow of what it could have been. Unfortunately I think it pales in comparison to Diablo 2 and, at least for me, it is (so far) the most disappointing game of 2012. Here's why :

- Game was designed around the real money auction house (RMAH)
- Game misses a lot of key features that were either canned or delayed (PVP, skill runes, etc.)
- Game feels too much like World of Warcraft
- The loot is pretty much crap all around
- Inferno is unbalanced and NOT fun past Act 1 unless you have good friends with solid builds
- Characters aren't memorable, bosses neither.

I could go on and on but you get the idea. I had fun with Diablo 3, but as a Blizzard game and a sequel to one of my favorites series it really sucks. Then you had all these sites who reviewed it like it was a perfect videogame, hilarious. On a sidenote, the number of players dropped like a rock in public games for the last week, and community managers @ blizz official forums have been VERY quiet for a long time, like they don't care anymore. I doubt patch 1.04 is going to bring back the massive amount of players who have already left to play Path of Exile (beta) or waiting for Torchlight 2 / Grim Dawn

Thank you. Goddamn it, thank you; to be honest I felt alone on this one, well at least with those who I'd play with. "No dude, the game gets good once you level up and go to Inferno" Fuck that, what is this, the FFXIII excuse now? Each game should still have that "feel" and Diablo 3 decided to utlize that WoW'ness that Blizzard became popular with. Dropped 150 dollars for this game, and it would have been wasted had that USB not contain DII.
 
I'm the luckiest man alive. No authenticator and been playing WoW and now Diablo 3 for years.

(Or I'm just smart and don't fall for phishing.)

I can't be sure about that second hack I just described, though I really, really doubt it since he was away from civilization for a few days and didn't log in during the hack, but the first one, during the mega hack-wave, I know 100% that it had nothing to do with phishing.
His account was simply stolen, along with many others, from Blizzard databases.

Sorry, it has nothing to do with extra intelligence, it's all luck :)
 
The hacking makes D3 even more of a joke. They say the AH is to protect gamers from black market scams yet they did nothing to protect gamers from crap like this. They should have had a software authenticator or something for your computer, included a physical authenticator for the boxed copies, and more. One of my friends got hacked early, right when he spent a ton of gold to get inferno version of pony land to try to get us better loot.
 
Most disappointing sequel ever for me. I stopped playing after a week and will never bother to play it again meanwhile I played D2 for thousands of hours.

Atleast BF3 and Skyrim lived up to the hype.
 
8.8 million sold beg to differ

The game was a "disappointment" due to fans massively overhyping the game without taking an objective look back at Diablo 2. It was a fairly mediocre game but still better than most
 
8.8 million sold beg to differ

The game was a "disappointment" due to fans massively overhyping the game without taking an objective look back at Diablo 2. It was a fairly mediocre game but still better than most

The game sold that amount based on IP and Company name alone. Short-term gain for long-term turmoil. Book it.
 
8.8 million sold beg to differ

The game was a "disappointment" due to fans massively overhyping the game without taking an objective look back at Diablo 2. It was a fairly mediocre game but still better than most

Honestly, do you, and all the people who use the "it sold millions-therefore not bad or disappointing" argument, really fail to see the logic gap in this reasoning, or do you just use it because it's catchy and easy to reproduce?
 
8.8 million sold beg to differ

The game was a "disappointment" due to fans massively overhyping the game without taking an objective look back at Diablo 2. It was a fairly mediocre game but still better than most

The game sold 8.8 mil because of Diablo 2, fans hyping it, and blizzard having a good enough history with supporting it's games or something. If it was called Raven the Undead, and branded just by Activision not being said to be developed by Blizzard anywhere it would be called a poor attempt at making a spin off Diablo franchise. Fewer people would have bought it, and no one would care.

Since it's a main Diablo game the people that had high hopes for the next after enjoying Diablo 2 so much have to now look elsewhere after lifting up the franchise so much, calling other games like it clones. I'm not a person that played Diablo before III, nor praised it, it does sound like Diablo 2 was an impressive game with creativity in building classes (though people found optimal ways to make certain builds).
 
Must say, I've played it for a month and I effin hate it now. I'll still play it with friends, but it really does get boring now.
 
I can't be sure about that second hack I just described, though I really, really doubt it since he was away from civilization for a few days and didn't log in during the hack, but the first one, during the mega hack-wave, I know 100% that it had nothing to do with phishing.
His account was simply stolen, along with many others, from Blizzard databases.

Sorry, it has nothing to do with extra intelligence, it's all luck :)

That is a claim that you cant back up. So it is a baseless, pointless assumption that goes against the Blizzard statement that their databases have NOT been compromised. So....

The hacking makes D3 even more of a joke. They say the AH is to protect gamers from black market scams yet they did nothing to protect gamers from crap like this. They should have had a software authenticator or something for your computer, included a physical authenticator for the boxed copies, and more. One of my friends got hacked early, right when he spent a ton of gold to get inferno version of pony land to try to get us better loot.

But they do. It is a free mobile authenticator. If it is on your pc, if your pc is compromised already, no point in generating something on it that can be stolen as well. Sometimes on the fly. (Which is still a possibility if you are hacked realtime, but it is a tricky one, and need a little more than bad luck - it is also not something that can be avoided easily.)
 
Honestly, do you, and all the people who use the "it sold millions-therefore not bad or disappointing" argument, really fail to see the logic gap in this reasoning, or do you just use it because it's catchy and easy to reproduce?

As opposed to what? The argument that 8.8 million people all bought it because of it's name and now each and every single one of them is disappointed with the purchase and consider it the worst game ever created by humanity?

A game doesn't sell 10 million copies if people don't enjoy it.
 
As opposed to what? The argument that 8.8 million people all bought it because of it's name and now each and every single one of them is disappointed with the purchase and consider it the worst game ever created by humanity?

A game doesn't sell 10 million copies if people don't enjoy it.

It sold 7 on launch day.
 
That is a claim that you cant back up. So it is a baseless, pointless assumption that goes against the Blizzard statement that their databases have NOT been compromised. So....

Sure, I have no super-concrete evidence that could stand in court or something, but if you follow what happened during the release hack-storm you can pretty much draw conclusions of your own. Just google it and see the threads in the official forums during the first days.
Add to that the fact that the first hack happened to a friend who is a network admin, and who during that time played from a PC with 'deep freeze' on (going back to a clean state after each restart), I'm pretty sure it was no worm or phishing.

Yeah, I can't 'prove it', but why should I give them the benefit of the doubt on this, after the many network failings, including the AH returning errors every few days and constantly being taken off-line to fix it, items being lost, accounts being locked due to 'changes in access pattern' and not unlocked for days, etc.

Believe what you prefer.

As opposed to what? The argument that 8.8 million people all bought it because of it's name and now each and every single one of them is disappointed with the purchase and consider it the worst game ever created by humanity?

A game doesn't sell 10 million copies if people don't enjoy it.

Yeah, I'm sure the lines outside stores during midnight launches had nothing to do with Diablo 2, and the Diablo franchise legacy in general, NOTHING. Of those 8.8, almost 7 were during launch day, and I guess the rest not long after.

The shit storm started more than a month later when people hit the (absolute lack of) end game.

You really have no idea what this game meant to millions of gamers and how anticipated it was. They could have published a pong game with 'Diablo 3' on it and it would sell the same.
 
Yeah but how many of those were pre orders or purchases made without prior knowledge of the game's quality? And how many of those are still playing the game? I think 7 million launch day sales and currently 100k people play the game at peak hours according to blizzards own stats.

Game sold off the back of d2 and blizzard pedigree not because the game itself is that outstanding. If d3 was that good then d4 is sure to sell at least much. Blizzard is going to lose a good amount of mind share after this if they already haven't done so.
 
well apparently we're going so far as to say that Blizzard making a Diablo 3 game that is actually a pong game would still sell 8.8 million

brilliant people, brilliant.
 
As opposed to what? The argument that 8.8 million people all bought it because of it's name and now each and every single one of them is disappointed with the purchase and consider it the worst game ever created by humanity?

A game doesn't sell 10 million copies if people don't enjoy it.

It sold most of that in the first day or preordered. How can you tell how good a game is without playing it or getting past act 1? All the Diablo people talked about normal mode is a tutorial, and hell mode for D2 was when the game started (or something like that). Anyway in D3 beating normal was pretty much all the game had to offer. Outside of that you gained more runes different gear, monsters were buffed, and your runes and skills might have got nerfed to make the latter difficulties more difficult (a cheap way to make things difficult).
 
well apparently we're going so far as to say that Blizzard making a Diablo 3 game that is actually a pong game would still sell 8.8 million

brilliant people, brilliant.

When people say 'good morning' to you do you start a discussion of why they said it's good and how a morning can't be good or bad since it's a neutral period of the night-day cycle?

Yeah, maybe, maybe I say, I didn't mean that -literally-. But I think you know what I meant.

Perhaps I should have used the example I used in the other thread, that they could have put 'Diablo 3' on cans with shit in them and people would still buy them. Would you still take that literally or are you starting to see what I'm trying to say through greatly exaggerated analogies and sarcasm?
 
well apparently we're going so far as to say that Blizzard making a Diablo 3 game that is actually a pong game would still sell 8.8 million

brilliant people, brilliant.

No one said if it was a pong game it would have sold. But if it was front loaded with actual D3 as it is, then you end up playing pong in inferno, no one would know until it was too late. There were no reviews, people saw acts for the first time as they played the game. No one knew that things weren't actually randomly generated, that sidequests would be useless unless you needed the exp (a health potion? Thanks dude, make sure your brother is ok, glad I could help...).


Game is definitely missing something, but it's by no means a bad game.

Is it a sub par Diablo game? Diablo games are praised so much. I expected it to at least be as interesting as Titan Quest. I'd recommend Titan Quest before D3.
 
Why are people so desperate to believe and prove that everyone must hate Diablo 3 if they do? Do you need validation of your opinion so badly? Is it absolutely impossible for you to even consider that there might actually be people who enjoyed the game and thought it was worth it?
 
I think the only way we will really know if Blizzard screwed up the Diablo franchise is how well an expansion pack sells. Or we could just keep making stupid analogies to somehow validate our opinions that Diablo 3 was a shit game and that we should all be ashamed for buying into the hype. God forbid some people actually liked the game and didn't expect 2000 hours out of it.
 
Hey a few side quests drop decent loot with 5 stacks like the jar of souls....

Also how many copies of d3 expansion will be sold to consider d3 as the culprit? I would say something like much less that 60% would be indicative.
 
Why are people so desperate to believe and prove that everyone must hate Diablo 3 if they do? Do you need validation of your opinion so badly? Is it absolutely impossible for you to even consider that there might actually be people who enjoyed the game and thought it was worth it?

Who is trying to prove that everyone hates D3? Not even everyone hates Postal games (not comparing D3 to Postal games, just to be clear).


Hey a few side quests drop decent loot with 5 stacks like the jar of souls....

Also how many copies of d3 expansion will be sold to consider d3 as the culprit? I would say something like much less that 60% would be indicative.

Yeah, and the lady's husband quest that you have to touch 3 altars or whatever. I did that when I would farm too. Also Festering Woods spawn monster group ended with a champion that counted towards NV, not the monument one. I got mad at a friend for wasting our time spawning that once. He said he never done the fight after it and mentioned he'd never spawn it again. I guess he could tell that I was a bit upset. I felt bad after lol.
 
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