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[Amibguous Cad]

They did.

It was called "Smash Brothers"

No other developers seem to have paid attention.

 

[The Faceless Master]

they aren't really comparable. I mean, guns don't have ultras and specials, require multiple button presses, and they differ mainly in the attributes, not the controls. It's kind like how people are saying they want fighting games to be.

you have to decide what guns and other items you're going to use or pick up on the field of battle. you have to decide what gun to actively have in your hands, and what to have in your magic pouch or on your back, etc. you have to decide when to shoot and when to reload your gun, based on reload time, clip size, etc. if you see an enemy and what gun they have, then you have to decide when to attack, when to defend, when to hide and when to just run away. you can even decide when to stick out and draw back to make the opponents think you're running away, but you're just setting them up to fall into your trap. all because of guns.

how do people manage!?

 

[Torquill]

The learning curve is the single biggest problem imho. SF4 even tries with it's trials, but they don't give you enough information beyond a move list. Nothing about the timing or when you need to to crazy stuff like dash cancel stuff, etc...

 

[Ranger X]

Street Fighter IV seems to be doing well for itself. I don't think Soul Calibur flopped either. DoA4 topped a million sales.


The genre isn't dead, but those who find it too challenging are very bitter about that fact.

I did not play SF4 because I don't have that much of an interest in the genre lately but I don't think it really is difficulty that turns off many people. I really think it's "accessibility".
I don't know about SF4 but let's say we talk about the lastest Soul Caliber, Dead of Alive or Virtua Fighter. Hundreds of moves per characters. Fuckton of characters. Will never deeply learn more than a couple unless I play the game restless. And I think people generally don't like complex combos or moves. I would be curious to see a complex fighting game BUT with "one button moves". Imagine a match of Street Fighter but there BOTH player can't miss the move they want to make at the moment they want to make it. You know, a match where only reflex + strategy would prevail. I can envision such fighting game but the way I see it was never pulled off yet.

.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

SF WAS the "casual" game of its generation.

Actually, this is a pretty good point.

When these games were new nobody really cared about dozens of different subsystems or frame advantage or what have you. They just enjoyed beating the shit out of each other. Fighting games are generally just as good for that today as long as you're playing against someone of a comparable skill level. You don't have to be intimidated by the best of the best or anything. It's not like you have to play against only them.

.

STOP DOING THIS.

 

[rollingstart]

you have to decide what guns and other items you're going to use or pick up on the field of battle. you have to decide what gun to actively have in your hands, and what to have in your magic pouch or on your back, etc. you have to decide when to shoot and when to reload your gun, based on reload time, clip size, etc. if you see an enemy and what gun they have, then you have to decide when to attack, when to defend, when to hide and when to just run away. you can even decide when to stick out and draw back to make the opponents think you're running away, but you're just setting them up to fall into your trap. all because of guns.

how do people manage!?

Reaaally reaching there, buddy. You should have gone with racing games; the comparison of fighting games and racing games is actually very close.

 

[diffusionx]

Not really the games which are the problem, Its the hardcore crowd who have a vocal voice. They are that redneck conservative. They have too much of a voice and are out of date. Normally made in mind for Arcades and a technical one are the ones which are heavily favored by them but not so much by anyone else. The thing is, They need to start picking up what Blizzard does with their games. Simple to play, learn, etc but hard to master. This is something the hardcore crowd can't really give you.

What? How is SF not easy to pick up hard to master but StarCraft is? It's exactly the same fucking thing. You can learn the move set of an SF game in about 20 minutes (the first 2 rounds of trial mode, for SF4). I remember when I tried to play War3, one reason I was not as good as the "pros" was because I was 50%-100% slower on inputs per minute. That's pretty much the same as not being able to time shit properly in SF.

Of course, what did people say about War3? Too much fucking micromanagement. I can't do as many inputs per minute as Tournament Man so they should just take that shit out. Fuck that. Learn to play or play something else. I know hype is hype and hardcore gamers like to buy every "good game" but there's no rule that says you have to be good at everything.

This is what it comes down to. People don't want to learn the game but still want an outside chance of beating the guy that does. Anything that gets in the way of that - advanced combos, micromanagement, throws, proper braking and cornering technique, whatever, is deemed to be a "flaw".

 

[Tain]

But they sort of are. They're meant to be done on arcade sticks, and the arcade itself is largely irrelevant today.

We're talking about fighting games, though, which are still largely an arcade genre made (at least first) for people who play arcade games, not console games. And that simple fact explains a huge amount of this thread.

 

[Tain]

What? How is SF not easy to pick up hard to master but StarCraft is? It's exactly the same fucking thing. You can learn the move set of an SF game in about 20 minutes (the first 2 rounds of trial mode, for SF4). I remember when I tried to play War3, one reason I was not as good as the "pros" was because I was 50%-100% slower on inputs per minute. That's pretty much the same as not being able to time shit properly in SF.

Of course, what did people say about War3? Too much fucking micromanagement. I can't do as many inputs per minute as Tournament Man so they should just take that shit out. Fuck that. Learn to play or play something else. I know hype is hype and hardcore gamers like to buy every "good game" but there's no rule that says you have to be good at everything.

This is what it comes down to. People don't want to learn the game but still want an outside chance of beating the guy that does. Anything that gets in the way of that - advanced combos, micromanagement, throws, proper braking and cornering technique, whatever, is deemed to be a "flaw".

Yeah, that's a pretty good analogy. I get trounced whenever I play SC, and saying that there's any kind of instant pick-up element to it is absurd.

Of course, I learn what could help me by paying attention to why things go wrong and talking to the people that beat me rather than ask for a simplified RTS from Blizzard.

 

[Hilbert]

Reaaally reaching there, buddy. You should have gone with racing games; the comparison of fighting games and racing games is actually very close.

I don't know, I think he is pretty close, except that there is a lot more too fighting games, that's part of the reason I like them so much.

I don't know about SF4 but let's say we talk about the lastest Soul Caliber, Dead of Alive or Virtua Fighter. Hundreds of moves per characters. Fuckton of characters. Will never deeply learn more than a couple unless I play the game restless. And I think people generally don't like complex combos or moves.

Once again, no one uses every move a character has in virtua fighter. Don't even think that way. I can pick any character, and have fun beating the shit out of someone, or getting the shit beat out of me. Does it matter that I don't know Jeffry's set-ups or most damaging combos/throws? I don't really care.
Now the 2 characters that I focus on, I slowly learn their moveset, periodically going back to training. Just the other day, I learned that from ying yang stance I can press back and I will back up a little and have my back facing them. I played fine with her before, but now I try to incorporate it into my game. I eat a lot of back attacks, but I have found it working for me a few times. That's how you learn new moves and when to use them. Not all at once, for every character.
That is what everyone wants from a game, fun to play, ages to master, but it seems like no one thinks they can have fun until they master it, which is silly.

 

[The Faceless Master]

If by "shit together" you mean "is completely impenetrable to a significant amount of people" then yes, you are correct.

I have never, ever been able to consistently pull off moves in, say, Street Fighter. I spent a ton of time playing it as a kid, too.

Sucks 'cause I really want to like fighting games. I'm just totally terribad at anything not Smash. ):

Oh come on. The only shitty thing about Brawl is the tripping. That's it. One shitty thing does not completely fucking ruin a game.

You can turn off every other random element in the game.

And Smash has always been a party game first and foremost. If you think any different, you are wrong.

tripping is a huge deal. why play a game seriously when you can just randomly trip?

how many online shooters allow your gun to randomly get jammed?

how many online racers allow your car's tires randomly go flat or pop?

 

[Ryn]

I don't know about SF4 but let's say we talk about the latest Soul Caliber, Dead of Alive or Virtua Fighter. Hundreds of moves per characters. Fuckton of characters. Will never deeply learn more than a couple unless I play the game restless.

No one said you need to know the complete set list of any character to be good with them. Hundred's of moves per character? Nope. Fuckton of characters? Again, don't need to master every single character in the game to enjoy it here.

And I think people generally don't like complex combos or moves.

Not true again. Despite muttering curses when trying and failing to do a combo that would deal a lot of damage, I actually find it quite fun and satisfying once I actually do pull something pretty cool off.

I would be curious to see a complex fighting game BUT with "one button moves". Imagine a match of Street Fighter but there BOTH player can't miss the move they want to make at the moment they want to make it. You know, a match where only reflex + strategy would prevail. I can envision such fighting game but the way I see it was never pulled off yet.

Boring. Might as well play rock paper scissors.

 

[Gully State]

Fighting games don't need an overhaul from a mechanics standpoint. However, there does need to be more of an effort from developers in order to introduce the mechanics to the prospective gamer. Throwing a new player into a 1 on 1 situation and giving him/her a move list isn't going to make the learning experience for the majority fun at all. A more engaging and educational singleplayer experience would go a long way into drawing a new audience into fighting games.

 

[Core407]

I hate how someone hasn't come out with something that takes a modern approach to the whole genre. I've mulled around the some ideas for a modern 3d fighter that I think would be pretty bad ass.

 

[The Faceless Master]

I hate how someone hasn't come out with something that takes a modern approach to the whole genre. I've mulled around the some ideas for a modern 3d fighter that I think would be pretty bad ass.

you should get with some of the other like minded people and make a concept/tech demo of the ideas

no sarcasm, i'd really like to see a new approach, i just have no idea what it would be like or how it would work.

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

No, gamers need an overhaul. Nobody appreciates depth or practice or skill these days. Fighting games are fucking fine.

Eventually, this gets pounded into people's heads who are unskilled at Fighters, and this topic won't have to come up overandoverandoverandoveragain.

Also, this needed said, since its "lack of" got regurgitated fifty times in this thread alone: Kumite Mode.

 

[MarkMan]

it's the non-figting gamers that need an overhaul.

This is the truth.

Gamers need to step up, not fighting games.

 

[Tain]

No, gamers need an overhaul. Nobody appreciates depth or practice or skill these days. Fighting games are fucking fine.

but but i play games for FUN not WORK

the player should like NEVER STRUGGLE or BE CHALLENGED or its BAD ARCHAIC OBSOLETE DESIGN

 

[Ploid 3.0]

All fighting games brought to consoles should have a control scheme option for people that don't have a arcade stick. Maybe some feature that can detect the standard controller.

 

[Freshmaker]

I did not play SF4 because I don't have that much of an interest in the genre lately but I don't think it really is difficulty that turns off many people. I really think it's "accessibility".
I don't know about SF4 but let's say we talk about the lastest Soul Caliber, Dead of Alive or Virtua Fighter. Hundreds of moves per characters. Fuckton of characters. Will never deeply learn more than a couple unless I play the game restless. And I think people generally don't like complex combos or moves.

A lot of people bitch about them but then, they never bother to attempt them in the first place so they have no idea how hard or not a combo is to learn. (Usually doesn't take more than 30 mins in training mode to get some solid ones down.) Instead, they see a just frame flash and their mind melts. Then they start ranting about "having a life" etc.

I would be curious to see a complex fighting game BUT with "one button moves". Imagine a match of Street Fighter but there BOTH player can't miss the move they want to make at the moment they want to make it. You know, a match where only reflex + strategy would prevail. I can envision such fighting game but the way I see it was never pulled off yet.

I think the Shenmue fighting engine had a lot of untapped potential in that respect. Same with Powerstone. People are holding up Smash (urgh) as some kind of pinnacle of mushy brained evolution that all fighters should undergo, but I think it'd be far more productive (and actually entertaining) to look to games like Powerstone etc that actually retain quality mechanics rather than throwing them out for double jumping party games...

 

[Hilbert]

All fighting games brought to consoles should have a control scheme option for people that don't have a arcade stick. Maybe some feature that can detect the standard controller.

I think this is another attitude that needs to change. Every fighting game thread on gaf turns into a disscussion on arcade sticks.

You don't need a stick to get good at fighting games. I have never been able to use a stick, I am terrible at them, but I regularly beat people in virtua fighter and street fighter that use them.

You are as good in fighting games as the time you put into them. It's that simple, and thats why they are so good.

 

[Tain]

You know, a match where only reflex + strategy would prevail.

CVS2 EO then right

 

[Ikael]

Classic fighting formulas are there for a reason. "Realism" and "inmersion" are not necessarily the best ways to make a game fun, which is what in the end it boils to.

However, it is a shame that the paths that Bushido Blade and Power Stone opened were never explored again in the genre. Oh, and this is a genre with a dire need of tutorials, but that was already mentioned.

 

[blackadde]

All fighting games brought to consoles should have a control scheme option for people that don't have a arcade stick. Maybe some feature that can detect the standard controller.

cvs2:eo had that. suddenly geese's raging pretzel, which i can only get off about a tenth of the time on reaction with a stick, became just "down forward" or some garbage like that. same with geif's standing FAB etc. game changes, for the worst. the execution risk / reward curve is completely fucked up.

 

[60_gig_PS3]

I would add RPG elements. Make you train and earn your moves/weapons/armor then fight against other people online.

 

[SapientWolf]

Virtual Fighter isn't even hard. People are just intimidated by the high level play, but you can start with basic punch/kick/block, and work up to basic combos. It's no more complicated than Rock Band.

It's not so much that it's hard as it is that low level play is rather unexciting.

This topic came up a few times before and it usually ends up being a stalemate between people who feel that fighting games have never been better and those who want to start seeing more new ideas and experimentation.

 

[diffusionx]

I think this is another attitude that needs to change. Every fighting game thread on gaf turns into a disscussion on arcade sticks.

You don't need a stick to get good at fighting games. I have never been able to use a stick, I am terrible at them, but I regularly beat people in virtua fighter and street fighter that use them.

You are as good in fighting games as the time you put into them. It's that simple, and thats why they are so good.

The thing is, if a person feels they need a stick to become good at the game, then get a stick if you want to become good. If you don't get a stick, don't bitch about how you need it. Play a game you feel doesn't need custom equipment.

I mean, if I wanted to be in a bowling league, I wouldn't complain that everyone else has an advantage because everyone brings their own bowling balls and I am using scratched up alley balls. Come on. It's ridiculous.

 

[djtiesto]

Yes.

Fighting games doesn't need to be simplier, more realistic, more accesible or anything like that... we need something DIFFERENT! 3D fighters has stayed pretty much the same in 10 years, 2D fighters has stayed the same for over 15 years. It's about time we get something new.

But I bet FPS games (especially of the WWII variety) have been extremely innovative and every game that comes out in the genre is a bastion of innovation and artistic quality?

 

[The Faceless Master]

but but i play games for FUN not WORK

the player should like NEVER STRUGGLE or BE CHALLENGED or its BAD ARCHAIC OBSOLETE DESIGN

indeed.

 

[Mamesj]

I did not play SF4 because I don't have that much of an interest in the genre lately but I don't think it really is difficulty that turns off many people. I really think it's "accessibility".
I don't know about SF4 but let's say we talk about the lastest Soul Caliber, Dead of Alive or Virtua Fighter. Hundreds of moves per characters. Fuckton of characters. Will never deeply learn more than a couple unless I play the game restless. And I think people generally don't like complex combos or moves. I would be curious to see a complex fighting game BUT with "one button moves". Imagine a match of Street Fighter but there BOTH player can't miss the move they want to make at the moment they want to make it. You know, a match where only reflex + strategy would prevail. I can envision such fighting game but the way I see it was never pulled off yet.

.

Only reflex and strategy, eh? I think you mean just reflex. 'cause there's fucktons of strategy to be had in these games, but you don't want to learn any of them. Hell, you haven't even begun looking into it, 'cause here you have Dead or Alive on the same list as Soul Calibur and Virtua Fighter.

It's not my fucking problem if you don't want to learn how to play the game. I hear Mortal Kombat is shallower than a kiddie pool, go splash around in it for a bit.

Next up: what needs to change in FPS/JRPG?

1) Needs even more auto-aim
2) Needs less leveling up and complicated stats
3) physics
4) graphics

 

[Ploid 3.0]

cvs2:eo had that. suddenly geese's raging pretzel, which i can only get off about a tenth of the time on reaction with a stick, became just "down forward" or some garbage like that. same with geif's standing FAB etc. game changes, for the worst. the execution risk / reward curve is completely fucked up.

Well I wasn't talking that easy, more like SFHD. I was able to do everything fine in ps2 CvS2. I mean for SF4, all characters have at least one 3x P/K ability . Having every character with those 3 button commands make my fingers hurt thinking about it. I'm now wondering if I can map a 3punch button to the fp position and have it function as a fp normally. I need to do the ex specials, and focus attacks as well. I like having the full use of my characters, and the few times I played fighting games at the arcades I could barely perform simple specials. Not spending $60+ on those.

What harm is knocking off one p or k for the ex supers? Maybe you would do a normal ex special if you tyr to cancel into the ex special? Anyway practicing blanka's hop in classic mode was pretty miss, miss or hit for me (sixaxis). Maybe if I put the kicks on the face buttons, but 3x P would suffer.

Never thought I'd appreciate the simplicity in the control schemes of games like VF, GG, Soul Calibur/Edge, tekken, etc.

 

[Ikael]

But I bet FPS games (especially of the WWII variety) have been extremely innovative and every game that comes out in the genre is a bastion of innovation and artistic quality?

Even if I personally dont like FPS too much, I must admit that they have been able to prosper precisely because among the countless generic FPSes out there, they have been able to reinvent theirselves and mix with other genres. I have yet to see the fighting game equivalent of Portal or say, Halo.

 

[Hilbert]

Even if I personally dont like FPS too much, I must admit that they have been able to prosper precisely because among the countless generic FPSes out there, they have been able to reinvent theirselves and mix with other genres. I have yet to see the fighting game equivalent of Portal or say, Halo.

Isn't that the Bushido Blade, Smash Bros, and Powerstone examples that everyone keeps bringing up?

What harm is knocking off one p or k for the ex specials? Maybe you would do a normal ex special if you tyr to cancel into the ex special? Anyway practicing blanka's hop in classic mode was pretty miss, miss or hit for me (sixaxis). Maybe if I put the kicks on the face buttons, but 3x P would suffer.

I am not quite sure what you mean. Aren't the ex moves the normal special moves done with 2 of the buttons? Ex fireball would be QCF+hard punch + med punch. Removing one of those punches would make it a normal fireball.

How do you have the controller set up?

 

[diffusionx]

Even if I personally dont like FPS too much, I must admit that they have been able to prosper precisely because among the countless generic FPSes out there, they have been able to reinvent theirselves and mix with other genres. I have yet to see the fighting game equivalent of Portal or say, Halo.

What would the fighting game equivalent of Portal be, exactly?

 

[andymcc]

Even if I personally dont like FPS too much, I must admit that they have been able to prosper precisely because among the countless generic FPSes out there, they have been able to reinvent theirselves and mix with other genres. I have yet to see the fighting game equivalent of Portal or say, Halo.

does there need to be an equivalent to those titles?

 

[MightyHedgehog]

The main thing about fighting games, and most long-standing genres of mostly incremental advancement from older, barely changed designs, is that refinement at this point tends to be an excuse to eliminate real creativity in design. They simply tweak and pile on the features with every successive release, not wanting to try fundamentally new core gameplay. The net effect, IMO, is just heavy baggage being dragged forward for the sake of appealing to the hard core fan at the cost of pulling most games further away from what made them hits with the masses to begin with.

Essentially, it tends to take games from the 'easy to learn, hard to master' level to the 'harder to learn, even harder to master' zone. I guess you could look to nature for a possible way to break the cycle in overgrown design in the forest fire that comes from lightning strikes. Sometimes, it takes burning away most everything to start from the ground up with a fresh perspective to set things right for most people. IMO, fighting games have become far too focused on increased complexity that resembles added nuance and depth, but really isn't...at least, for most people. I guess it's more to do with relying too heavily on sequels and not taking a fresh look at the gameplay underneath. I dunno...I'm rambling now...

3D fighting games haven't changed too fundamentally since VF1 and 2D fighters haven't changed too much since SF. Though, the addition of player-controlled 3D movement added a lot, the core gameplay is still the same as the very first iteration. That's twenty years or so for each half of one-on-one fighting that has not started from a vastly different base for the gameplay.

I'm still partial to the core pacing and gameplay of Karate Champ (arguably the first mainstream 2D one-on-one fighter...Bilestoad comes first for first-ever fighter probably), where defense was at parity with offense since both required the exact kind of timing and choice.

 

[Twig]

does there need to be an equivalent to those titles?

Yeah.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

Isn't that the Bushido Blade, Smash Bros, and Powerstone examples that everyone keeps bringing up?



I am not quite sure what you mean. Aren't the ex moves the normal special moves done with 2 of the buttons? Ex fireball would be QCF+hard punch + med punch. Removing one of those punches would make it a normal fireball.

How do you have the controller set up?

I mean those supers my bad. For SFHD I have default setup. For SF4 I'll have to improvise (i.e. replacing whichever attack is dominant in the mapped 3x K/P with a 3x P/K)

 

[OokieSpookie]

This is the truth.

Gamers need to step up, not fighting games.

People want the games that they buy to play themselves these days, it is rather sad.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

This topic came up a few times before and it usually ends up being a stalemate between people who feel that fighting games have never been better and those who want to start seeing more new ideas and experimentation.

These views aren't really mutually exclusive.

 

[Mamesj]

There has been a lot of experimentation in the genre. Now it's about refinement.

of course, gamers need it to be STREET FIGHTER 6000: OMG EVERYTHING'S FUCKING DIFFERENT EDITION to pay a lick of attention.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

I would add RPG elements. Make you train and earn your moves/weapons/armor then fight against other people online.

Street Fighter Alpha 3's world tour mode was my favorite fighting game sp experience. Earning exp and obtaining abilities to customize your character. Good times.

 

[Kintaro]

If I stated my true thoughts on this matter, I would probably be banned. So, I'll just say that if any company is for "overhauling" fighting games, they're welcome to it. A lot of people stated Smash Brothers, but it's kind of obvious it wasn't the overhaul the genre so desperately needed. So, they are welcome to try.

That's all I'll say on it.

 

[Hilbert]

I mean those supers my bad. For SFHD I have default setup. For SF4 I'll have to improvise (i.e. replacing whichever attack is dominant in the mapped 3x K/P with a 3x P/K)

I get some crap some times because I prefer a controller for my fighting games, but here is how I set up my controller for street fighter with tips for street fighter 4.

L1                Y             R1
L2           X                  R2  
                     B
                A

Hope this is clear, the L and Rs are the triggers, and the others are the face buttons.

X = Light Punch
Y = Heavy Punch
A = Light Kick
B = Hard Kick

L2 = Med Kick
R2 = Med Punch
L1 = Light Kick + Med Kick + Hard Kick
L2 = Light Punch + Med Punch + Hard Punch

To throw, pressing X + A together on the face isn't hard.
To taunt, pressing the Y + B on the face is easy.
To do the ex moves you have 2 punches and 2 kicks on the face that are easy to press together.
Focus moves are the 2 shoulder buttons together.
The ultra specials that need the 3x punchs or 3x kicks are on the other shoulder buttons(also work for the ex moves)

I am not sure what the default setup is for sstfhd is, but that is how I would play. Does that make sense?
I do think some of street fighters imputs are a bit too based on an arcade setup, but they are all very doable on a controller, so it's no big deal. Try virtua fighter, I think it's a better game, and the inputs make more sense.

 

[Twig]

These views aren't really mutually exclusive.

Shame most people don't realize this. ):

 

[gutter_trash]

Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution style training/practice mode tutorials should be in every fighting game

SF4 dropped the ball in Challenge Trial. It does not explain cancels, it does not explain links, it does not explain super cancels, it does not explain EX Focus Attacks, it does not explain Focus Attack canceling.

If I was not already versed in Super Turbo and 3rd Strike, I wouldn't know what the hell Trial was supposed to be accomplised by average/casial players.

Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution... that is they best training tutorial in a fighting game ever

 

[Ploid 3.0]

I get some crap some times because I prefer a controller for my fighting games, but here is how I set up my controller for street fighter with tips for street fighter 4.

L1                Y             R1
L2           X                  R2  
                     B
                A

Hope this is clear, the L and Rs are the triggers, and the others are the face buttons.

X = Light Punch
Y = Heavy Punch
A = Light Kick
B = Hard Kick

L2 = Med Kick
R2 = Med Punch
L1 = Light Kick + Med Kick + Hard Kick
L2 = Light Punch + Med Punch + Hard Punch

To throw, pressing X + A together on the face isn't hard.
To taunt, pressing the Y + B on the face is easy.
To do the ex moves you have 2 punches and 2 kicks on the face that are easy to press together.
Focus moves are the 2 shoulder buttons together.
The ultra specials that need the 3x punchs or 3x kicks are on the other shoulder buttons(also work for the ex moves)

I am not sure what the default setup is for sstfhd is, but that is how I would play. Does that make sense?
I do think some of street fighters imputs are a bit too based on an arcade setup, but they are all very doable on a controller, so it's no big deal. Try virtua fighter, I think it's a better game, and the inputs make more sense.

I will try this when my sf4 arrive. That looks good, thanks.

Default for sfhd is
x=light punch
y=medium punch
R1=hard punch
a=light kick
b=medium kick
R2=hard kick

 

[The Faceless Master]

If I stated my true thoughts on this matter, I would probably be banned. So, I'll just say that if any company is for "overhauling" fighting games, they're welcome to it. A lot of people stated Smash Brothers, but it's kind of obvious it wasn't the overhaul the genre so desperately needed. So, they are welcome to try.

That's all I'll say on it.

why would your true opinion get you banned?

 

[KingJ2002]

why do they use this argument against fighting games? is the learning curve still too high? maybe... but i think that it's just people bitter about the fact that they just cant jump in like a shooter... it takes time to develop skills and a strategy in a fighting game.

so my answer to the question is no... games like street fighter should play like street fighter, king of fighters should play like kof, etc, etc, etc.

but there should be more bring more variations in the fighting genre... more powerstone / smash bros like titles... or easily accessible fighting games with chain combo's and a 4 button layout.

the variations were there in the early psx days but with the emergence of fps games... the industry just forgot... but hopefully with the success of titles like street fighter 4, soul calibur IV and smash bros. brawl... companies can start experimenting again.

 

[The Faceless Master]

why do they use this argument against fighting games? is the learning curve still too high? maybe... but i think that it's just people bitter about the fact that they just cant jump in like a shooter... it takes time to develop skills and a strategy in a fighting game.

so my answer to the question is no... games like street fighter should play like street fighter, king of fighters should play like kof, etc, etc, etc.

but there should be more bring more variations in the fighting genre... more powerstone / smash bros like titles... or easily accessible fighting games with chain combo's and a 4 button layout.

the variations were there in the early psx days but with the emergence of fps games... the industry just forgot... but hopefully with the success of titles like street fighter 4, soul calibur IV and smash bros. brawl... companies can start experimenting again.

the industry didn't forget.

people didn't buy or like any of them very much, except smash bros.