Downloads and installations and bloatware - how did we get to this point?

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#1
So, I'm trying to find another keyboard remapper for my new computer (had one on my old computer, but need one again on my new computer) - and I say that to emphasize I'm not talking about something to do with porn, or an illegal download, or anything like that, just a normal program - and it really is absurd that downloading and installing programs is as bloated as it is.

I mean, first for the downloading, you have to make sure what you're clicking to download is actually what you want to download - usually a small, tucked-away link hidden amongst a whole bunch of bigger and more obvious download buttons which will get you all sorts of who-knows-what other junk. Alright, fine.

Then, trying to install it, it's no longer as simple as choosing a custom install and de-selecting all of the automatically-checked boxes for other stuff. Now there are series of windows where one will have to read over everything, choose the grayed-out Decline box, then choose Accept that you actually want to decline it, then go through that 4 more times for all sorts of other junk that wants to install itself along with what you're trying to install, and then tell it that, no, you don't want to change your default browser, change your default search engine, add a half dozen browser toolbars, and all sorts of junk that has nothing at all to do with what you're trying to install.

Now, yes, I know the obvious answer of how we got to this point - money. Every one of those extra little junk things is a portential way for someone to get money, and if they can trick/fool/disguise you into clicking on something other than what you actually wanted, they get money.

But, seriously, things are just reaching an absurd level at this point.
 
#3
There are children being born whose parents couldn't have downloaded a straight .exe from the internet. I can barely even remember that time, everything (even cnet) was always tucked away in a custom installer, behind a submission form or otherwise.
 
#5
Also, as a side note, my wife is one of those people who will just hit Next->Next->Next->Next during an installation process, so periodically, when her computer gets all sorts of messed up as a result of all the junk that gets installed, I have to go through and clean it out.
That's always a blast.
 
#7
Just today I installed CDisplayEX and it came with some fucking browser hijacking shit I had to revert to a previous restore point to get rid of. I was asking myself the same question as the OP - how did it come to this? It's getting ridiculous.
 
#11
When people complain about Store Apps not having certain permissions or closed gardens this is why. Applications should not be allowed to do whatever the fuck they want.
 
#13
Now, yes, I know the obvious answer of how we got to this point - money. Every one of those extra little junk things is a portential way for someone to get money, and if they can trick/fool/disguise you into clicking on something other than what you actually wanted, they get money.
Well not only that, but people want these programs for free. But the developer wants money for his work. So the compromise is having tons of promotional junk from other people that will pay the money for bloatware installs.

Otherwise we'd all have to pay for each piece of software we're installing lol.
 
#14
So, I'm trying to find another keyboard remapper for my new computer (had one on my old computer, but need one again on my new computer) - and I say that to emphasize I'm not talking about something to do with porn, or an illegal download, or anything like that, just a normal program - and it really is absurd that downloading and installing programs is as bloated as it is.

I mean, first for the downloading, you have to make sure what you're clicking to download is actually what you want to download - usually a small, tucked-away link hidden amongst a whole bunch of bigger and more obvious download buttons which will get you all sorts of who-knows-what other junk. Alright, fine.

Then, trying to install it, it's no longer as simple as choosing a custom install and de-selecting all of the automatically-checked boxes for other stuff. Now there are series of windows where one will have to read over everything, choose the grayed-out Decline box, then choose Accept that you actually want to decline it, then go through that 4 more times for all sorts of other junk that wants to install itself along with what you're trying to install, and then tell it that, no, you don't want to change your default browser, change your default search engine, add a half dozen browser toolbars, and all sorts of junk that has nothing at all to do with what you're trying to install.

Now, yes, I know the obvious answer of how we got to this point - money. Every one of those extra little junk things is a portential way for someone to get money, and if they can trick/fool/disguise you into clicking on something other than what you actually wanted, they get money.

But, seriously, things are just reaching an absurd level at this point.
Just today I installed CDisplayEX and it came with some fucking browser hijacking shit I had to revert to a previous restore point to get rid of. I was asking myself the same question as the OP - how did it come to this? It's getting ridiculous.
From what Ive heard, it's difficult for software developers to be paid for their work on PC so they include this BS in order to get a little kickback from those companies. Sucks but what are you gonna do?
Now Adobe pulling this with their programs updates is complete Bullshit.
 
#17
Well not only that, but people want these programs for free. But the developer wants money for his work. So the compromise is having tons of promotional junk from other people that will pay the money for bloatware installs.

Otherwise we'd all have to pay for each piece of software we're installing lol.
The thing is, I'm fine with paying for things that are worthwhile to me. Obviously within reason, but I'm certainly willing to.

 
#18
Well not only that, but people want these programs for free. But the developer wants money for his work. So the compromise is having tons of promotional junk from other people that will pay the money for bloatware installs.

Otherwise we'd all have to pay for each piece of software we're installing lol.
I'm fine with reasonable adware (read: in-app banners) and even optional tool bars. I'm not cool with installers (and even fucking uninstallers) that try to fool you into installing shit you don't want. What is worse is that the more hidden they are, the higher the chances they are being used to install some kind of browser hijacker that may go as far as to root your computer in order to make removal impossible or even download new, shitty apps that will fuck with your computer's performance and give you all sorts of headaches.

Izarc burned me pretty bad in this regard. As a consequence, I will no longer use it.
 
#19
I could understand pieces of shit scamming or fooling unknowing users, but otherwise legit companies tuck this garbage in their installations as well.
 
#21
most people will hit "Next" without reading so the motherfuckers take advantage of this. I hate it so much. This adobe case is atrocious.
 
#22
The fact that a big, resourceful and well known corporation such as Adobe continues to make its damn best to push McAfee's products down my throat makes me so god-damned fucking mad.



Really, Adobe? Really?
Yeah this is complete nonsense and it gets me angry every time.
 
#24
The thing is, I don't even see the Adobe/McAfee thing as that bad.

Should it be there? No. Is it annoying that it's there? Yes. Should they stop asking every single time you update? Of course.
But still, it's an obvious checkbox, which you uncheck to change.

Stuff hidden under menus, and where you have to figure out whether you need to hit Agree or Disagree, and all that other stuff, is far worse.
 
#27
Just today I installed CDisplayEX and it came with some fucking browser hijacking shit I had to revert to a previous restore point to get rid of. I was asking myself the same question as the OP - how did it come to this? It's getting ridiculous.
Basically, because people are too cheap to pay for shit.

Many developers realized the only way to get paid was to give it away and make the ad dollars.

It's one of the reasons why Dell can sell PCs so cheap. You think they put links to Amazon on the desktop out of the goodness of their heart?
 
#28
I hate this crap:



Make sure you click on cancel. If you click on next, the toolbar will be installed :\
Exactly. That's the kind of thing I mean. You uncheck the boxes, but hitting Next still installs junk - if you want to avoid it, you actually need to hit Cancel despite being in the middle of an installation process.
 
#30
This is why I prefer OSX for my productivity computer - there is just no market for small to medium sized paid applications on the Windows platform so developers have to generate revenue via other means.

Microsoft has finally tried to rectify it with the Apps For Windows 8 marketplace, but it's too little too late and filled with stipulations regarding Metro support.

It's also one of the main reasons I recommend Macs to tech-illiterate family and friends: should they need a particular piece of software, I can just direct them to the Mac App store and not worry about them downloading bullshit or clicking the wrong checkbox and having adware take over their computer.
 

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
#32
I just came across this a while ago!

I checked out CDisplayEx, a comic book reader, and it asked me three separate times to install some other crap.

I wish there were a program that helped install things without installing everything in the EXE. Like Ninite or something.
 
#33
Download.com used to be the shit. Cnet is okay, you can still generally get a direct download link to the exe. At least there you can read reviews to see if there is other shit bundled.
 

Vestal

Junior Member
#34
Lately I feel that everytime I successfully install something and just install that I am getting away with murder.

it has become that bad.
 
#36
The fact that a big, resourceful and well known corporation such as Adobe continues to make its damn best to push McAfee's products down my throat makes me so god-damned fucking mad.



Really, Adobe? Really?
But since Flash and Reader are often security vulnerability, it would seem irresponsible of them NOT to suggest protection. They'd get blasted from the other side saying it's irresponsible to keep pushing that exploitable software.
 

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
#38
Download.com used to be the shit. Cnet is okay, you can still generally get a direct download link to the exe. At least there you can read reviews to see if there is other shit bundled.
I think CNet started pairing some weird installer of their on onto some freeware applications. It's really weird.

emerge, mother fuckers!

or make && make install, if necessary.
 

Willy Wanka

my god this avatar owns
#39
I'm generally on the ball with this kind of thing but I got caught out with the AVG toolbar when installing Peazip on one occasion. It fucked up the settings on all my browsers and it wasn't exactly a quick process to get rid of it from my computer. All this from a supposed anti-virus/malware software specialist too. Despicable.
 
#41
And then there is Apple continuously trying to sneak in Safari and Bonjour.

I have now been getting a prompt asking me to install some icloud software. iTunes refuses to remember my selection.
 
#42
I just came across this a while ago!

I checked out CDisplayEx, a comic book reader, and it asked me three separate times to install some other crap.

I wish there were a program that helped install things without installing everything in the EXE. Like Ninite or something.
I find most my apps on PortableFreeware.com. It's a user-run site which curates portable apps, ie: apps that don't need an installer and don't write to the registry.

Here's their entry for CDisplayEx with portable install instructions. I run an older version portably and it works a treat.
 

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
#47
I find most my apps on PortableFreeware.com. It's a user-run site which curates portable apps, ie: apps that don't need an installer and don't write to the registry.

Here's their entry for CDisplayEx with portable install instructions. I run an older version portably and it works a treat.
I've actually extracted EXEs before; I don't know why I didn't think of that. Thanks. I'll try to remember that site for other programs, too.

...I have no idea what any of these things mean
They're command line installers for various Linux distribution packages (Debian-based, Fedora-based, and Gentoo). Different Linux packages offer a repository from where you can install (mostly free) programs. The alternative is to compile the program yourself.
 

hipbabboom

Huh? What did I say? Did I screw up again? :(
#48
Also, as a side note, my wife is one of those people who will just hit Next->Next->Next->Next during an installation process, so periodically, when her computer gets all sorts of messed up as a result of all the junk that gets installed, I have to go through and clean it out.
That's always a blast.
You should really impress up on her the importance of not doing that.
 
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