karasu
Member
The devil is also called the dragon, or the great dragon.
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Dracula was not inspired by Vlad the Impaler
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The devil is also called the dragon, or the great dragon.
I think you're right on. They're clearly overanalysing the name "Dracula". It's clear that it is simply a derivation of draco/drakon (dragon) -> draconian (severe) and taking on the quality of demon along the way.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
In this case though that is irrelevant. Vlad II was named Dracul because of his joining The Order of the Dragon. The naming of figures that were popularly courageous were called a Zmaj (Slavic for Dragon l has routes in Snake). In this case the two are seperate and both have no connection with the Devil. In fact The Order of the Dragon was a Christian organization. Why would they name their order and someone in their order the devil?
karasu
Member
I reckon for the same reason since dragons are seen as evil in the christian tradition. To sound big and scary.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
They just made hellsing non-canon, that sucks.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
It was be more prudent to say dragons are fearsome and a lot of folklore from Europe depicts them as an antagonist.
The Order of the Dragon was based on the earlier Order of St George. The order adopted St. George as its patron saint, who was known for slaying a dragon in Christian folklore. The dragon was used as a symbol for the military and religious ethos of the order. In a way it was imparting the strength of A Dragon and in another way the strength to destroy something of that caliber of strength.
Dracul in Romanian means dragon or devil. Same word for both. He could have seen the reference in the book and got Dracula = devil and never known about the Order of the Dragon or Vlad Tempes. This was the 1800s you know. People forget that there was no internet and no immediate way to cross check facts.
terrisus
Member
Yep. I read the article expecting to have my mind blown but it doesn't even try to confirm what the title proposes.
bonesmccoy
Banned
Whatever Stoker was thinking about or doing when he picked the name, this was playing in the background.
Wojciech Kilar
zorlaczerohero
Banned
This is crap, Stoker even mentions a Dracula who's brother betrayed his people to the turks.
"Woe was it that his own unworthy brother, when he had fallen, sold his people to the Turk and brought the shame of slavery on them!"
Vlad III's brother who like Vlad was ransomed to the Ottoman empire became Muslim and fought in the Turk armies that invaded. He was used as a figurehead as they thought the Wallachians would accept him easier than a Turk. So Stoker did know about Vlad III. My guess is Dracula was an amalgamation of a number of characters from that period. Which I think was sort of known already.
And Vlad III's exploits were quite well known in Eastern Europe and Germany. Anyone doing any research on that time period would have come across Vlad the Impaler.
"Woe was it that his own unworthy brother, when he had fallen, sold his people to the Turk and brought the shame of slavery on them!"
Vlad III's brother who like Vlad was ransomed to the Ottoman empire became Muslim and fought in the Turk armies that invaded. He was used as a figurehead as they thought the Wallachians would accept him easier than a Turk. So Stoker did know about Vlad III. My guess is Dracula was an amalgamation of a number of characters from that period. Which I think was sort of known already.
And Vlad III's exploits were quite well known in Eastern Europe and Germany. Anyone doing any research on that time period would have come across Vlad the Impaler.
He's a national hero in Romania, celebrated as a Defender of Christendom against the Ottomans who overran Constantinople, the seat of Orthodox Christianity and the Eastern Holy Roman empire. He was celebrated and mourned by princes and popes alike and vilified by his MANY political enemies. He sat the throne of Wallachia no less than three separate occasions, overthrown by rival families and even his own Ottoman-allied brother Radu.
Seriously, read up on it, the Impaler stuff is messed up but so were the times he lived in and the situation of the world around him.
CountAntonius
Member
As an expert this blows my mind.
Mermandala
Member
Unthawed by soaking them in a bowl of tepid Paul Masson wine.
lol I had the same thought. Castlevania reboot reboot!
This reminds me, I had a free copy of Bram Stoker's Dracula on my HTC Sensation, but my screen cracked before I finished it and my Experia Z only has some stupid "whatever" books on it D:
And no, Dracula was at least partially based on a guy impaling his foes, because that's just too good of an inspiration.
PS: Is Dracula Untold any good?
Well, and Faust, but as an educated German I read that already.
And no, Dracula was at least partially based on a guy impaling his foes, because that's just too good of an inspiration.
PS: Is Dracula Untold any good?
To be fair, the Order of the Dragon that Vlad II joined was named after the dragon from the story of St. George and the Dragon. It was modeled after a similar chivalric order called the Order of St. George. St. George was thus also the patron saint of the Order of the Dragon. The dragon that appears in that story was long associated with the devil, which can seen quite clearly in a lot of medieval artwork.
So, the Order's use of the name and imagery of the dragon is in part referencing the story of a dragonslaying saint. However, they still used an image of a dragon coiled into a circle with its tail wrapped around its neck as their badge, and sometimes called themselves the Draconists. So the imagery is a little mixed, but it does mostly make sense.
On a tangent, since you mentioned the root of Zmaj, the word 'dragon" itself comes from the Greek "drakon", which meant serpent or giant seafish. I think "drakon" literally means "fire-spitter", but that was actually a reference to the intense burning sensation caused by snake-venom rather than literal fire originally.
Actually, Vlad the Impaler was named Vlad III Dracula (also written as Drăculea). "Țepeș" (the Impaler) was a nickname used by either him or his enemies. Dracula was actually part of Vlad III's name. Dracula meant "son of the dragon", coming from the fact that Vlad III's father took on the name Vlad II Dracul (which just meant dragon).
The name Dracul actually led into what their entire branch of the ruling family of Wallachia was called: the House of Drăculești. Members of the House of Drăculești occasionally ruled Wallachia from 1436 to 1600, so the family name stuck around for a while. Of course, that entire period say a lot of violence, war, and assassination, with the House of Drăculești fighting for control against their rival family, the Dănești. As a piece of videogame trivia, one of the allies of Trevor Belmont was a member of the House of Dănești; they just butchered his name in translation and called him Grant DeNasty.
SwiftDeath
Member
I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO BELIEVE ANYMORE!
Gambit 1138
Banned
damn what a twist
Henchmen21
Banned
Worst part of the LOS games by far.
CadetMahoney
Member
good good. Destroying theories one by one.
Never liked that one anyway.
Never liked that one anyway.
And James Cameron with Terminator. So basically, get food poisoning to be inspired.
Krappadizzle
Member
Thank you.
Sinfamy
Member
He is viewed as a hero in the area, his methods, albeit barbaric were what scared off the invading Turks.
kurisu1974
Banned
I think you pinpointed his issue with Dracula, outside of taking certain books a little too serieus.
Sapiens
Member
A lot of people think that Alucard is just Dracula spelled backwards, but it's actually not.
I thought Dracula had reincarnated into a japanee high-school student and or an american exchange student in Japan
He did, only after his castle was sealed in an eclipse in what must have been the most epic battle ever not-told.
Yes, I'm still bitter about the Battle of 1999.
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